@TheCannon said:

@sethysquare said:

@TheCannon said:

@sethysquare said:

@TheCannon said:

@sethysquare said:

@Superdork said:

@TheCannon: @TheCannon said:

@Superdork said:

And if you think that the Martian Manhunter is Black, you're crazy.

He can make himself black.

And Asian. And Middle Eastern, so he's not really a Black person. He can only assume the appearance of one. There's a difference.

In his earliest incarnations he was White.

With all of his shapeshifting, I can't consider him truly Black. He's Martian.

@Imagine_Man15 said:

I would absolutely love to have Black Lightning or Mr. Terrific in the current lineup instead of Cyborg...

I was all for John Stewart in the cartoon, but I just don't think Cyborg belongs in the Justice League.

QFT

Well, Black Lightning and Mr Terrific aren't as popular as Cyborg. Cyborg is perhaps DC's most recognisable african american character with 5 seasons of Teen Titans and even appearances on The Super Powers Team: Galactic Guardians, Smallville and etc.

Firestorm (Jason) is probably even more popular than Mr Terrific and Black Lightning.

DC made the right choice with Cyborg.

Not to me. To me it's an insult that Martian Manhunter was replaced with Cyborg.

What do you mean not to you? Did you meant that to you its not the right choice or Black Lightning and Mr Terrific are even more popular than Cyborg?

Also, please, Martian Manhunter can't even support his own title. He has been used as a plot line and in the comics and on TV, he has never been an important character, JLU even have him leave the Justice League.

Also, were you upset when they made Hawkgirl a founding member instead of Aquaman? Or perhaps you prefer an all white team?

Manunter is much better than Cyborg. I don't care what anyone says, Martian Manhunter is one of DC's greatest creations.

Also, yes, I was incredibly upset Hawkgirl was a founding member. If they want another female besides Wonder woman, what's wrong with Power Girl or Huntress?

He served much better in Stormwatch because of the nature of his abilities and origins.

Also, Power girl and Huntress are both related to Superman and Batman. Thats like adding a Supergirl into the league, not that its not right, but putting a variety of character would help build up the other franchise as well.

My point is the founding members have been revised several times and Cyborg serves a real purpose here being an actual tech guy.

the League I want to see is:

Wonder Woman

Power Girl

Batman

Huntress

Green Lantern

Aquaman

Martian Manhunter

Is that too much to ask?

Why the removal of Superman for someone with the same exact move set. No Superman is a crime and I dislike him. Huntress on the league is cool but is Dick Grayson Batman? Her on the team before him is another crime. Why not replace Manhunter for Miss Martian. It seems like you removed Superman simply because he is Superman.He is overrated but good writing can fix that. WW is already a heavy hitter female. We do not need two.

I would pick:

Superman

Batman

Wonder Woman

Zatanna

Green Lantern

Aquaman

Flash

The problem I also see with adding minorities to the rosters is that these heroes were created during a time where segregation was at its peek. Most of the more interesting minority characters are second or third generation and like Cyborg would have to have their entire history screwed up. Black lightning should be a front runner as he is in the same age bracket as the big guys and he has a powerset that none of the others have. Batman was already the "tech guy". Cyborg being there was like him saying "yea well I'm part robot and has teh lasers and stuff". Meanwhile batman is saying to himself somewhere ,"I could do that if i wanted to". Black lightning is also a scientists in his own right. If comics ever let Super heroes get old i would love to see the Titans replace their predecessors.The only problem I see is deciding which former robin gets to be on the league's top spots and do they become batman? I would also like to see blue beetle join the team as well as Jackson Hyde. They both have unique abilities compared to their predecessors as well. A team of the younger generations would be quite interesting to read as they are all diverse and are distinct from their mentors.

Wow. I'm going to exit this conversation because of the horrible attitude of plenty of posters in here with regards to the insensitive of racism and even lots of covert and modern racism with plenty of posters here.

I feel disgusted.

I have no problem with Cyborg being a founding member, but I was never a big fan of the Teen Titans. Vixen should be a founder, I like her character alot. I think they should deffinetly give Black Lightning a push, electrical super powers are awesome.

@sethysquare said:

Superman isn't overrated. Batman is. Superman is the world's greatest Superhero.

Yes. He is. There's no debating that. But if you still feel the need to disagree with me, then let's just agree to disagree.

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 What's your opinion on Emma Frost?

Neither underrated nor overrated. Receiving the right amount of attention and respect.

@majestic99 We're in agreement, again. What about the Question?

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 We're in agreement, again. What about the Question?

Don't know(or what) that is.

@Adnan:

Superman receives enough attention. And Superman fanboys are annoying.

@Adnan said:

@majestic99: I feel fanboys/girls should be judged seperately from 'fans'. Fanboys of any fandom are annoying, imo.

True. You would think I'm lying when I say I've heard superman fanboys(or "supertards" as I call them, like thor fanboys are "thortards") say Superman could curbstomp, Galactus, or destroy PRE RETCON Beyonder with one punch, or easily defeat the Spectre and Darkseid with no problem, and that without kryptonite or magic, nobody could stop him.

I don't know if anyone is saying that their can't be a black founding member or even founder of the Justice League (and if they are that's pretty stupid) but what I think most people complain about is the fact it was Cyborg and not someone like Mister Terrific.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 We're in agreement, again. What about the Question?

Don't know(or what) that is.

mister terrififc wouldn't fit because he's an atheist and a tech guy. i don't think the world would be ready for an atheist superhero. besides what would separate him from batman ? so in a way black lighting would fit.

@TheCannon:

Haven't read it but it looks....interesting.

Anyone else?

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

Haven't read it but it looks....interesting.

Anyone else?

Power Girl?

@TheCannon said:

Power Girl?

Definitely underrated. Stands too much in the shadow of Supergirl.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

Power Girl?

Definitely underrated. Stands too much in the shadow of Supergirl.

Okay. Once again, in agreement.

@TheCannon:

The fact that you and I agree on just about everything so far has got to be more than coincidence.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

The fact that you and I agree on just about everything so far has got to be more than coincidence.

Maybe. How about Aquaman?

The man won't let us have anything.

@TheCannon said:

Maybe. How about Aquaman?

Depends.

• On his own, he's pretty even(neither under nor over rated).
• When in battles, however, he's overrated.

@Adnan said:

...Superman curbstomping Darkseid, huh?

It's called trolling. I've decided to merely create battles and not debate anymore-b/c of elitism, fanboyism, and trolling.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

Maybe. How about Aquaman?

Depends.

• On his own, he's pretty even(neither under nor over rated).
• When in battles, however, he's overrated.

See, I think he's even in both battles and his own.

@TheCannon said:

See, I think he's even in both battles and his own.

I know we had to disagree on something!!!

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

See, I think he's even in both battles and his own.

I know we had to disagree on something!!!

you were right. What about She-Hulk?

@TheCannon:

Underrated. Too much in the shadow of Hulk.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

Underrated. Too much in the shadow of Hulk.

I've always like She-Hulk. I've always thought she could be a more major character (not like Spider-man or the X-men, but maybe Silver Surfer). But you're right, she's too much in the shadow of the Hulk.

@TheCannon said:

I've always like She-Hulk. I've always thought she could be a more major character (not like Spider-man or the X-men, but maybe Silver Surfer). But you're right, she's too much in the shadow of the Hulk.

We are in agreement.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

I've always like She-Hulk. I've always thought she could be a more major character (not like Spider-man or the X-men, but maybe Silver Surfer). But you're right, she's too much in the shadow of the Hulk.

We are in agreement.

How about Fire and Ice?

Fire yes, Ice, No.

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

I like Fire and Ice.

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

I like Fire and Ice.

I loved Fire, but I'm not sure Ice has the potential to be a bigger player than she already is. Of course, my opinion, its possible that she can.

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

I like Fire and Ice.

I loved Fire, but I'm not sure Ice has the potential to be a bigger player than she already is. Of course, my opinion, its possible that she can.

I like them both. I think they have a lot of potential, but DC needs to have them be more than two women just thrown into a random JLA team.

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

I like Fire and Ice.

I loved Fire, but I'm not sure Ice has the potential to be a bigger player than she already is. Of course, my opinion, its possible that she can.

I like them both. I think they have a lot of potential, but DC needs to have them be more than two women just thrown into a random JLA team.

I think Fire acheived her maximum potential as a character during Checkmate, if you're familiar with the series.

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

I like Fire and Ice.

I loved Fire, but I'm not sure Ice has the potential to be a bigger player than she already is. Of course, my opinion, its possible that she can.

I like them both. I think they have a lot of potential, but DC needs to have them be more than two women just thrown into a random JLA team.

I think Fire acheived her maximum potential as a character during Checkmate, if you're familiar with the series.

I think she and Ice could be ranked among people like Captain Atom and Power Girl. All they need is a monthly series, a good writer, a good artist, and good villains. DC has that.

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

I like Fire and Ice.

I loved Fire, but I'm not sure Ice has the potential to be a bigger player than she already is. Of course, my opinion, its possible that she can.

I like them both. I think they have a lot of potential, but DC needs to have them be more than two women just thrown into a random JLA team.

I think Fire acheived her maximum potential as a character during Checkmate, if you're familiar with the series.

I think she and Ice could be ranked among people like Captain Atom and Power Girl. All they need is a monthly series, a good writer, a good artist, and good villains. DC has that.

Would it be popular though? That's the thing. I'm not sure I'd read it.

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon:

This:

@ReVamp said:

Fire yes, Ice, No.

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

I don't think Ice can be a more major character.

I like Fire and Ice.

I loved Fire, but I'm not sure Ice has the potential to be a bigger player than she already is. Of course, my opinion, its possible that she can.

I like them both. I think they have a lot of potential, but DC needs to have them be more than two women just thrown into a random JLA team.

I think Fire acheived her maximum potential as a character during Checkmate, if you're familiar with the series.

I think she and Ice could be ranked among people like Captain Atom and Power Girl. All they need is a monthly series, a good writer, a good artist, and good villains. DC has that.

Would it be popular though? That's the thing. I'm not sure I'd read it.

All you need is for one person to read it and like it. Then they'll tell two friends and they'll tell two friends. And that's like ten people right there. :)

Seriously, I think any series can be popular. I never thought the Justice League Dark series would be any good, but it's not half bad. I originally only bought it for Zatanna, but it's not bad.

@TheCannon: That's a fair point. I think that any series can be good too, I'm just not sure that good and popular are both directly proportional.

@ReVamp said:

@TheCannon: That's a fair point. I think that any series can be good too, I'm just not sure that good and popular are both directly proportional.

Good point. Just because something is good, doesn't mean it's popular. I have an idea. Have them fight a popular villain (someone like the Joker, but not that popular). That will draw readers in, because they would want to see the villain. After that, they realize how good the book is, people buy it, and it becomes popular. It's like I said above, I only bought Justice League Dark for Zatanna.

I don't think its that people are complaining that they are black but because they just aren't the originals. I didn't like having Hawkgirl in the cartoon as an original and that wasn't because I'm sexist. It's just because she or Hawkman were never an original on any version of the team besides some versions that existed afterwards. I was okay with John Stewart because Wally West was there and they were on the same team. Could have taken either Kyle or John there. Wanted Aquaman more than Hawkgirl though. I felt it really should have been off of the mid-90's JLA. As for Cyborg, I really didn't like it, not because he was black, but because he is a Teen Titan, not a Justice League member. With what they wanted to do with Martian Manhunter, I was okay with a replacement, and I would have been okay with Black Lightning. Not Steel because he is too similar to Superman in character.

@TheCannon said:

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

First one underrated, second one not underrated.

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

Yes, overrated, or yes, underrated.

First one underrated, second one not underrated.

I think they're both underrated. I like the duo, and I think they could be very popular.

I have no problem with it.

But there original founders, just naming the big 3, are the most well known.

Superman - batman - wonder woman

@Adnan said:

@sethysquare said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

Superman is overrated.

BIG TIME.

Superman isn't overrated. Batman is. Superman is the world's greatest Superhero.

I think Superman is pretty underrated, atleast these days. These days dark and gritty is what's cool, which is fine and all, but Superman often just gets dismissed and ignored by fans as a result.

Exactly. Everyone is all like, oh Batman is so cool cos he is dark and gritty, X-men is cool cos they're badass, Superman is a lame boyscout with underpants.

I've been hearing that for YEARS and to my surprised, people said that Superman is overrated.

@sethysquare said:

@Adnan said:

@sethysquare said:

@majestic99 said:

@TheCannon said:

Superman is overrated.

BIG TIME.

Superman isn't overrated. Batman is. Superman is the world's greatest Superhero.

I think Superman is pretty underrated, atleast these days. These days dark and gritty is what's cool, which is fine and all, but Superman often just gets dismissed and ignored by fans as a result.

Exactly. Everyone is all like, oh Batman is so cool cos he is dark and gritty, X-men is cool cos they're badass, Superman is a lame boyscout with underpants.

I've been hearing that for YEARS and to my surprised, people said that Superman is overrated.

A boyscout in RED underpants.

@TheCannon: Which is why he is underrated because he is so much more than that.

@sethysquare said:

@TheCannon: Which is why he is underrated because he is so much more than that.

He's an overgrown boyscout with a faggy looking costume. He's suppose to be this big powerful guy when a green rock can kill him. He's to big of a goody two shoes to be a real hero. She has one of the worst love interest in comics, when he could have Wonder Woman.

@TheCannon said:

@sethysquare said:

@TheCannon: Which is why he is underrated because he is so much more than that.

He's an overgrown boyscout with a faggy looking costume. He's suppose to be this big powerful guy when a green rock can kill him. He's to big of a goody two shoes to be a real hero. She has one of the worst love interest in comics, when he could have Wonder Woman.

Whatever. Haters gonna hate.

@sethysquare said:

@TheCannon said:

@sethysquare said:

@TheCannon: Which is why he is underrated because he is so much more than that.

He's an overgrown boyscout with a faggy looking costume. He's suppose to be this big powerful guy when a green rock can kill him. He's to big of a goody two shoes to be a real hero. She has one of the worst love interest in comics, when he could have Wonder Woman.

Whatever. Haters gonna hate.

I don't hate superman. I love Superman: the Animated Series. I'm just saying he's overrated when guys like Question, Huntress, and Fire and Ice are extremely underrated. I would rather read a Fire and Ice monthly series than Superman.