The reason why the Justice League Movie might not work

#1 Posted by Smart_Dork_Dude (2518 posts) - - Show Bio

Before I start listing the reasons I think it wouldn't work, let me say that I REALLY hope this movie does good and is every bit as good as Avengers. That being said, the reason why I don't think it will work is because DC Characters are separated from each other

Let me explain. In the comics, how often do you really get the sense that these people are in the same universe? I don't mean books like Justice League or Teen Titans, or any of the team books, I'm talking solo series. Superman is fully capable of dealing with just about anything without other heroes. Batman has his own corner of the DCU that is practically a universe in itself. The Green Lantern Corps could exist in a universe without other heroes in it and it wouldn't really change anything. Wonder Woman could do the same, and so could Flash. Now to me, doing a shared Marvel Movie Universe will always make more sense that doing a shared DC Movie Universe. The reason is because Marvel was made that way and DC wasn't. Stan Lee really was the first person to really give the sense of a comic book UNIVERSE. He had characters meet each other, outside team books, and slowly all those interactions formed the Marvel Universe we know today. Even with the early team books of DC, they weren't really connected. JSA didn't have Superman or Batman, or even really reference them. Not until the Silver Age did DC start trying to make a shared universe for their heroes to be in. However, that feeling of isolation is still there even to this day. Don't get me wrong, I love DC Comics, but I can also see this as a very real issue. Now, if DC simply wanted to make a few more movies and THEN have a Justice League movie, then fine. The reason is that it's not like the Avengers where most if not all the characters are unknown. The reason they needed to build that movie up is because of the fact that over half of the average movie going public who had never read a comic or watched a cartoon about these characters had no idea who they are aside from the Hulk because of his previous 2003 movie and Bill Bixby/Lou Ferrigno TV show. People know who Superman is, they know who Batman is, they know Wonder Woman, and even Green Lantern at this point(Sure the movie bombed, but it's still in the public knowledge). I want the movie to be good, I'm excited that it's being made, I'm just very skeptical as to the how DC is handling this.

#2 Posted by danhimself (21898 posts) - - Show Bio

the new 52 books reference each other all the time...Suicide Squad had a plot where Harley went rogue and ran back to Gotham to steal back the Joker's face after it was removed in a Batman book....Atrocitus just fought Stormwatch in Red Lanterns...Martian Manhunter appeared in Green Lantern Corps...Superman was in Swamp Thing...Swamp Thing and Animal Man have an upcoming crossover...Superboy, Teen Titans, and Legion Lost just had a crossover...Batman and Robin just referenced events in that crossover...Flash and Superman were both in Batman: The Dark Knight....Suicide Squad and Resurrection Man just had a crossover...and I'm sure there are tons more that I'm forgetting about

#3 Posted by Smart_Dork_Dude (2518 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself said:

the new 52 books reference each other all the time...Suicide Squad had a plot where Harley went rogue and ran back to Gotham to steal back the Joker's face after it was removed in a Batman book....Atrocitus just fought Stormwatch in Red Lanterns...Martian Manhunter appeared in Green Lantern Corps...Superman was in Swamp Thing...Swamp Thing and Animal Man have an upcoming crossover...Superboy, Teen Titans, and Legion Lost just had a crossover...Batman and Robin just referenced events in that crossover...Flash and Superman were both in Batman: The Dark Knight....Suicide Squad and Resurrection Man just had a crossover...and I'm sure there are tons more that I'm forgetting about

I'm fully aware of that. However, you can't deny that this is a VERY recent development. I'm skeptical as to how this could work in movie form. Marvel has YEARS of stories and moments with their characters interacting and playing off each other. That's why Fox having X-Men is sort of messing up the Marvel Movie Universe, because they have ties to other Marvel characters. Sony is even willing to allow future Marvel Studios movies to reference The Amazing Spider-Man in the future, with the slight possibility of Spider-Man actually appearing in a future Marvel Studios film.

#4 Posted by War Killer (19475 posts) - - Show Bio

Go back tens years ago and people would be saying an Avengers movie was impossible, yet here we are in 2012 and The Avengers is the number one superhero in the world.
 
Point is, people say it could never work but that doesn't mean it actually can't. Give it a few years, the Justice League will have their day in the spotlight sooner or later. :)

#5 Posted by Smart_Dork_Dude (2518 posts) - - Show Bio

@War Killer said:

Go back tens years ago and people would be saying an Avengers movie was impossible, yet here we are in 2012 and The Avengers is the number one superhero in the world. Point is, people say it could never work but that doesn't mean it actually can't. Give it a few years, the Justice League will have their day in the spotlight sooner or later. :)

It's just that DC has been saying this movie is coming for YEARS!!! Marvel said it was coming the second Sam Jackson said Avengers! DC has been talking about this movie longer than it took Marvel to set up the Avengers and make it!! Sorry, just not expecting much from this news. The way DC is going about this, it makes me think it's just a rushed attempt to compete with Avengers. They're not even planning on having Wonder Woman or Flash first! Just Man of Steel and oddly enough a Lobo movie that they say will be in the DC Movie Universe, but have NOTHING to do with any of the other characters or Justice League.

#6 Edited by cosmo111687 (1488 posts) - - Show Bio

I understand your point, and I completely agree that Marvel has more synergy than DC, but I think that if they've found a way to make the Justice League entertaining in comic books and television, it can work as a movie as well. My only concerns are with the creative team Warner Bros. might put behind their film (they don't have the best record for that and with Christopher Nolan stepping away from superheroes, that basically just leaves Zack Snyder), the public's familiarity with DC Superheroes (most people know who Wonder Woman is, but few know about her connection to Greek Myth or even that she can fly), and how Batman will translate from the Nolan-verse to a wider, more fantastic DC Universe.

#7 Edited by The Stegman (20722 posts) - - Show Bio

Honestly, I don't mind that the characters are separated in their own titles, if I'm reading a Batman title, even though I love the guy, I don't really want Superman popping in to say "hi'' each one of the JLA members are big time heroes, dealing with they're own problems, I mean Wonder Woman is currently in Hades, she doesn't really have time to visit Metropolis, it's kinda of the reason why I don't like all the big Marvel events,I get it, it's a shared universe, but I don't need a special guest appearance by Spider-Man in my Uncanny X Men issue. As long as the DC heroes meet with each other every once in a while,(i.e in team books) it's good enough for me

#8 Posted by sethysquare (3843 posts) - - Show Bio

@Smart_Dork_Dude said:

Before I start listing the reasons I think it wouldn't work, let me say that I REALLY hope this movie does good and is every bit as good as Avengers. That being said, the reason why I don't think it will work is because DC Characters are separated from each other

Let me explain. In the comics, how often do you really get the sense that these people are in the same universe? I don't mean books like Justice League or Teen Titans, or any of the team books, I'm talking solo series. Superman is fully capable of dealing with just about anything without other heroes. Batman has his own corner of the DCU that is practically a universe in itself. The Green Lantern Corps could exist in a universe without other heroes in it and it wouldn't really change anything. Wonder Woman could do the same, and so could Flash. Now to me, doing a shared Marvel Movie Universe will always make more sense that doing a shared DC Movie Universe. The reason is because Marvel was made that way and DC wasn't. Stan Lee really was the first person to really give the sense of a comic book UNIVERSE. He had characters meet each other, outside team books, and slowly all those interactions formed the Marvel Universe we know today. Even with the early team books of DC, they weren't really connected. JSA didn't have Superman or Batman, or even really reference them. Not until the Silver Age did DC start trying to make a shared universe for their heroes to be in. However, that feeling of isolation is still there even to this day. Don't get me wrong, I love DC Comics, but I can also see this as a very real issue. Now, if DC simply wanted to make a few more movies and THEN have a Justice League movie, then fine. The reason is that it's not like the Avengers where most if not all the characters are unknown. The reason they needed to build that movie up is because of the fact that over half of the average movie going public who had never read a comic or watched a cartoon about these characters had no idea who they are aside from the Hulk because of his previous 2003 movie and Bill Bixby/Lou Ferrigno TV show. People know who Superman is, they know who Batman is, they know Wonder Woman, and even Green Lantern at this point(Sure the movie bombed, but it's still in the public knowledge). I want the movie to be good, I'm excited that it's being made, I'm just very skeptical as to the how DC is handling this.

Except you are terribly wrong.

Superfriends has been around since 70s and have been extremely popular the concept that it has gotten so many sequels for 10 years.

Justice League was then spawned from Super friends

After Justice League was set up, Stan Lee said that DC has this really popular concept of putting all the popular characters together.

Then they created Avengers and Fantastic Four.

So yes, subsequently they did focus alot on the shared universe and on team books, thats because their solo books don't sell.

Captain America, Iron man, Hulk and Thor.

When was the last time any of these books was in the top 10 that didn't include a #1.

Thats why its important for them to focus on their team books. Spiderman is the only exception of a solo book that sells at marvel.

So yeah the sense of a comic book universe didn't start of with Stan Lee.

Lastly, didn't we have several threads like these already?

#9 Posted by DeathpooltheT1000 (9503 posts) - - Show Bio

The main problem is that DC characters dont share the same logic, thing that Marvel did, even then have to destroy magic and make it science so the Avenger movie could work.

DC has the problem that don follow a same logic or fantasy, for the same Batman, Flash, Superman and the rest dont feel the same, it would need to work into making them mroe the same so it could work.

Also, since pretty much Nolan is in control of the DC movie universe, he will try to get into the human side of heroes, and lest face it, si for the best, the best comic deals with the human side of them, the worst with his super side.

#10 Posted by AweSam (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

It's not the Justice League movie they should be worried about, it's the individual character ones. If they don't work, then there is no JLA movie. If they come out popular, then it doesn't matter how the JLA movie's like, everyone will still watch it and enjoy their favorite heroes fighting alongside each other. It's exactly how the Avengers worked.

#11 Posted by WildStyle (331 posts) - - Show Bio

@Smart_Dork_Dude said:

@War Killer said:

Go back tens years ago and people would be saying an Avengers movie was impossible, yet here we are in 2012 and The Avengers is the number one superhero in the world. Point is, people say it could never work but that doesn't mean it actually can't. Give it a few years, the Justice League will have their day in the spotlight sooner or later. :)

It's just that DC has been saying this movie is coming for YEARS!!! Marvel said it was coming the second Sam Jackson said Avengers! DC has been talking about this movie longer than it took Marvel to set up the Avengers and make it!! Sorry, just not expecting much from this news. The way DC is going about this, it makes me think it's just a rushed attempt to compete with Avengers. They're not even planning on having Wonder Woman or Flash first! Just Man of Steel and oddly enough a Lobo movie that they say will be in the DC Movie Universe, but have NOTHING to do with any of the other characters or Justice League.

Yep. Does anyone remember Justice League Mortal? DC has been saying a Justice League (along with the Flash) is coming for a long ass time now. People are going to have to take the wait and see approach with the news.

#12 Posted by The_Amazing_Spider_Man (22 posts) - - Show Bio

Apparently the Justice League script is "Dark" and "Gritty" like Batman - I just hope they don't go too far with that, because I think a JLA film should be an all ages film like Avengers, because I mean, you got Superman in there - If I'm not mistaken, the kids LOVE Superman, so if they decide to throw in a sex scene then bad luck bros. They need to make the film like the upcoming Spidey reboot - even though Sony is making the film dark and gritty as well, from what I've seen in sneak peeks, they've also managed to keep the film very balanced too, which I like because if they made Spidey too dark and gritty - next thing you know, Peter will be cutting his wrists...

#13 Posted by RedheadedAtrocitus (6885 posts) - - Show Bio

After the success of Avengers I just have to believe that Justice League could be done into a film as well. Avengers' greatest success lies in the fact that it finally has proven to Hollywood that you CAN make a successful and thriving movie about a superhero team. I just have to have faith that DC can do the same.

#14 Posted by AweSam (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@RedheadedAtrocitus said:

After the success of Avengers I just have to believe that Justice League could be done into a film as well. Avengers' greatest success lies in the fact that it finally has proven to Hollywood that you CAN make a successful and thriving movie about a superhero team. I just have to have faith that DC can do the same.

That's different though. Marvel's been having successful movies since the first Iron Man. DC failed every attempt. Superman Returns failed. They wanted a new start with Green Lantern, but that also failed. The only success they've been having was Batman, but with Nolan wrapping it up, they'll have to reboot that as well. I don't see a Justice League movie happening for the next ten years or so.

#15 Posted by SoA (4592 posts) - - Show Bio

@War Killer: fifteen years ago , people where wondering when iron man was ever gnna be made(first heard marvel wanted to do a iron man movie in 1992) helluva wait but worth it lol

#16 Posted by Zeeguy91 (1074 posts) - - Show Bio

@sethysquare said:

Superfriends has been around since 70s and have been extremely popular the concept that it has gotten so many sequels for 10 years.

Justice League was then spawned from Super friends

After Justice League was set up, Stan Lee said that DC has this really popular concept of putting all the popular characters together.

Then they created Avengers and Fantastic Four.

This is essentially the truth. However, I have to say that Superfriends was actually spawned from Justice League, which first appeared in 1960. And even before then, Justice Society was really the first inklings of a shared comic book universe.

Either way, the DC solo titles may feel isolated sometimes, but that's because they are in fact the SOLO titles. Also, I think it has to do with the fact that DC characters are based in different cities across the country (and sometimes out of the country). Batman in Gotham, Superman in Metropolis, Green Lantern in Coast City, Flash in Central City, Wonder Woman in London, etc. In the Marvel Universe, on the other hand, basically every major superhero lives in New York City. Spider-Man, the Fantastic Four, the Avengers, Daredevil, etc. All of them, in New York. Its easy for Spider-Man to bump into Daredevil when they live right down the block from each other.

#17 Posted by sethysquare (3843 posts) - - Show Bio

You're right. Justice League and Justice Society predates Superfriends. Also I believe the reason why DC does better in their solo titles is because every character has their own history and background. But its not impossible to do a Justice League movie, because its been proven since the 70s that the concept works.

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