Jeph Loeb: Good or Bad?

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#1 Posted by Sketchtor (1396 posts) - - Show Bio

He's capable of some awesome stuff, but his recent run on Wolverine was definitely not my favourite. The Lupines were just plain weird, and the guy killed Sbretooth. It's all riding on ultimates 3 for me...

#2 Posted by Sling Shot (3560 posts) - - Show Bio

I am in agreement.

#3 Posted by Sketchtor (1396 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't think Superman/Batman was too bad either, but it wasn't much more to me than a bit of fun (if not sometimes confusing). Catwoman: When in Rome wasn't bad. I want to read the Long Halloween, because that looks good.

#4 Edited by War Killer (19867 posts) - - Show Bio

I liked Fallen Son, Ultimates 3, and Ultimatum, I don't read Hulk so don't know about that, but I like his writing

Online
#5 Posted by danhimself (22216 posts) - - Show Bio

Ultmates 3 was horrible and Ultimatutm has been even worse....the guy is ruining the Ultimate Universe

#6 Posted by Doctor Damn (740 posts) - - Show Bio

Ultimates 3, especially in comparison to Millar's Ultimates 1 and 2 was complete and utter garbage. Ultimatum sucks. Hulk is a outrage that I continue to read for reasons I have yet to understand.

On the other hand, Spider-Man: Blue, Hulk: Gray and Daredevil: Yellow are masterpieces. He's not a bad writer, I just think his writing style and story concepts don't fit the titles he's put on. Especially at Marvel.

#7 Posted by TruePwnge (2764 posts) - - Show Bio

Rulk can smash Watcher

as for big D
Jeph Loeb is the reason he became Jobberseid

#8 Posted by John Valentine (16270 posts) - - Show Bio

Long Halloween, Dark Victory and Hush are all good.

#9 Posted by Shanana (52810 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't like him when he writes for super girl BLAH

#10 Posted by xerox_kitty (15761 posts) - - Show Bio
@John Valentine said:
"Long Halloween, Dark Victory and Hush are all good."
Agreed.  I generally like his work.  I think it's daft to blame him for killing off the Ultimate universe (that would be an editorial decidion, not a writer's fault)... but to be honest, I couldn't give a f*%^ about the Ultimate universe.  It was just another Marvel money spinner to tell non-canon stories which had outlived it's purpose... but about 9 and a half years.  
Moderator
#11 Posted by the Vica (1967 posts) - - Show Bio

His work USED to be good.


But if Ultimatum and the (utter-crap-writing-saved-only-by-the-awesome-art) Hulk are anything to go by... His recent work sucks ass.
#12 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio

Awful.

Wolverine was pure crap.  Superman/Batman was pure crap.  Long Halloween was crap with a lot of pretty decorations and flashing lights and everybody thought it was awesome....and then if you really looked at it, you noticed it was a murder mystery with no clues and no resolution, ie crap.

He can make Batman seem interesting but overall, he can't write a mystery that makes sense to save his life.

#13 Posted by the Vica (1967 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom said:
" He can make Batman seem interesting but overall, he can't write a mystery that makes sense to save his life. "
Eg: Rulk.
#14 Posted by John Valentine (16270 posts) - - Show Bio

In honnesty, if you're expecting a Hulk title, not done by David or Pak, to be well-written.... well... that's as stupid as the title.

#15 Posted by the Vica (1967 posts) - - Show Bio
@John Valentine said:
" In honnesty, if you're expecting a Hulk title, not done by David or Pak, to be well-written.... well... that's as stupid as the title. "
So the mere fact that it's a Hulk title excuses the fact that the writing is non-existant?

Riiiiight.
#16 Posted by John Valentine (16270 posts) - - Show Bio
@the Vica said:
"
@John Valentine said:
" In honnesty, if you're expecting a Hulk title, not done by David or Pak, to be well-written.... well... that's as stupid as the title. "
So the mere fact that it's a Hulk title excuses the fact that the writing is non-existant?

Yes.
#17 Posted by TruePwnge (2764 posts) - - Show Bio

Rulk failed


#18 Posted by the Vica (1967 posts) - - Show Bio
@John Valentine said:
"
@the Vica said:
"
@John Valentine said:
" In honnesty, if you're expecting a Hulk title, not done by David or Pak, to be well-written.... well... that's as stupid as the title. "
So the mere fact that it's a Hulk title excuses the fact that the writing is non-existant?
Yes. "
That's just stupid.
#19 Posted by Psychotime (623 posts) - - Show Bio

To me, the Long Halloween started to drag halfway through, and I couldn't even read past the first half of Hush.

Not a fan.

#20 Posted by John Valentine (16270 posts) - - Show Bio
@the Vica said:
"
@John Valentine said:
"
@the Vica said:
"
@John Valentine said:
" In honnesty, if you're expecting a Hulk title, not done by David or Pak, to be well-written.... well... that's as stupid as the title. "
So the mere fact that it's a Hulk title excuses the fact that the writing is non-existant?
Yes. "
That's just stupid.
"
You're reading the Hulk and expecting it to be well-written. It is stupid.
#21 Posted by the Vica (1967 posts) - - Show Bio
@John Valentine said:
"
@the Vica said:
"
@John Valentine said:
"
@the Vica said:
"
@John Valentine said:
" In honnesty, if you're expecting a Hulk title, not done by David or Pak, to be well-written.... well... that's as stupid as the title. "
So the mere fact that it's a Hulk title excuses the fact that the writing is non-existant?
Yes. "
That's just stupid.
"
You're reading the Hulk and expecting it to be well-written. It is stupid. "
Correction: I am not reading Hulk.

I did read Hulk, as after reading PH and WWH I thought I should at least give it a chance. And while the pretty pictures were enough to keep me entertained for a while, after #10 my brain just started hurting too much from the horrible writing.
#22 Posted by Hibiscus (32 posts) - - Show Bio

BAD.
always has been, always will be.
Ultimates 3 was the icing on the cake for me. And no, i didnt like hush either.

#23 Posted by TruePwnge (2764 posts) - - Show Bio

He did some Jobbering with Darkseid until there was nothing left to save

flight of stairs

:

caption
caption

#24 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@TruePwnge said:
" He did some Jobbering with Darkseid until there was nothing left to save

flight of stairs

:
caption
caption
"
He was depowered of his Omega force at the time.  Wiktionary: context You might wanna memorize that word.

But yeah, I have seen death cults devoted to his demise over what he did to Darkseid.
#25 Posted by the human Juggernaut (7224 posts) - - Show Bio
@danhimself said:
" Ultmates 3 was horrible and Ultimatutm has been even worse....the guy is ruining the Ultimate Universe "
good, the ultimate universe is a joke anyway, the sooner it dies, the better.
#26 Posted by Dane (10586 posts) - - Show Bio

He's up with Bendis on my least favorite and most extremely overused writers ever.

#27 Edited by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio

My personal enmity towards him for the decline of my favorite character aside, I like Loeb's books for the fact that stuff happens in them. Important stuff. Compare his books to current Justice league, where, for the last 20 issues, I get the feeling that the League is a group of extraordinary people gathered around for the purpose of just hanging around.  Nothing important happened since Meltzer left. In Jeph's books at least we get development.

Apart from that, his books are stupid, full of plot holes, completely disrespectful of anyone other than the main characters, and generally illogical.

I loved his bat books despite the flaws zoom pointed out, but other than that.......

#28 Posted by Vance Astro (91067 posts) - - Show Bio

Loeb is all jumbled.It's like he pulls his storylines out of a hat.

Moderator
#29 Posted by Extant (112 posts) - - Show Bio

rofl @ stairmaster darkseid.

#30 Posted by TruePwnge (2764 posts) - - Show Bio

Loeb is the AIDS virus of the comic book industry

#31 Edited by Icarusflies (12407 posts) - - Show Bio

Jeph Loeb is a horrible, and horribly overrated, writer. He only has one story idea, and he uses it over, and over, and over. At least when writing Batman.

Moderator
#32 Posted by Ninja Lad (68 posts) - - Show Bio
@Icarusflies said:
" Jeph Loeb is a horrible, and horribly overrated, writer. He only has one story idea, and he uses it over, and over, and over. "
What story idea would that be?
#33 Posted by Chaos Agent (2150 posts) - - Show Bio

Depends on the character he writes

#34 Posted by Icarusflies (12407 posts) - - Show Bio
@Ninja Lad said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
" Jeph Loeb is a horrible, and horribly overrated, writer. He only has one story idea, and he uses it over, and over, and over. "
What story idea would that be? "
The idea (for Batman): Gang boss teams up with other super-villains. Super-hero seduced by Poison Ivy and Catwoman. Big fight with villains. Conclusion drawn from evidence not in story. Lots of flashbacks to parents deaths. Another big fight with same villains (namely Solomon Grundy, Joker, Mad Hatter, sometimes Poison Ivy). Gang leader discovered, defeated, someone killed.

The Long Halloween, Dark Victory, and Hush all have this plot.
Moderator
#35 Posted by John Valentine (16270 posts) - - Show Bio
@Icarusflies said:
"
@Ninja Lad said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
" Jeph Loeb is a horrible, and horribly overrated, writer. He only has one story idea, and he uses it over, and over, and over. "
What story idea would that be? "
The idea (for Batman): Gang boss teams up with other super-villains. Super-hero seduced by Poison Ivy and Catwoman. Big fight with villains. Conclusion drawn from evidence not in story. Lots of flashbacks to parents deaths. Another big fight with same villains (namely Solomon Grundy, Joker, Mad Hatter, sometimes Poison Ivy). Gang leader discovered, defeated, someone killed.

The Long Halloween, Dark Victory, and Hush all have this plot.
"
Hush has this plot, LH and DR do not have the same plot.

Stop bullsh!ting because you dislike him.
#36 Posted by Ninja Lad (68 posts) - - Show Bio
@John Valentine said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
"
@Ninja Lad said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
" Jeph Loeb is a horrible, and horribly overrated, writer. He only has one story idea, and he uses it over, and over, and over. "
What story idea would that be? "
The idea (for Batman): Gang boss teams up with other super-villains. Super-hero seduced by Poison Ivy and Catwoman. Big fight with villains. Conclusion drawn from evidence not in story. Lots of flashbacks to parents deaths. Another big fight with same villains (namely Solomon Grundy, Joker, Mad Hatter, sometimes Poison Ivy). Gang leader discovered, defeated, someone killed.

The Long Halloween, Dark Victory, and Hush all have this plot.
"
Hush has this plot, LH and DR do not have the same plot.Stop bullsh!ting because you dislike him. "
I wouldn't know, I've only read Hush, so it's not my place to say. But even so, that's three out of the many plots he did. It wasn't the plot for his Marvel colors line,  DD: Yellow, Hulk: Gray, Spider-Man Blue and CA: White, it's definitely not the plot for Hulk, it's not the plot for Ultimatum and wasn't the plot for Ultimates 3.
#37 Edited by Icarusflies (12407 posts) - - Show Bio
@Ninja Lad said:
"
@John Valentine said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
"
@Ninja Lad said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
" Jeph Loeb is a horrible, and horribly overrated, writer. He only has one story idea, and he uses it over, and over, and over. "
What story idea would that be? "
The idea (for Batman): Gang boss teams up with other super-villains. Super-hero seduced by Poison Ivy and Catwoman. Big fight with villains. Conclusion drawn from evidence not in story. Lots of flashbacks to parents deaths. Another big fight with same villains (namely Solomon Grundy, Joker, Mad Hatter, sometimes Poison Ivy). Gang leader discovered, defeated, someone killed.

The Long Halloween, Dark Victory, and Hush all have this plot.
"
Hush has this plot, LH and DR do not have the same plot.Stop bullsh!ting because you dislike him. "
I wouldn't know, I've only read Hush, so it's not my place to say. But even so, that's three out of the many plots he did. It wasn't the plot for his Marvel colors line,  DD: Yellow, Hulk: Gray, Spider-Man Blue and CA: White, it's definitely not the plot for Hulk, it's not the plot for Ultimatum and wasn't the plot for Ultimates 3. "
1). I really don't read anything Marvel, except Deadpool, which I started reading last issue. 2) I actually did find all the books very similar. They did have many of the same elements. While I will admit that Long Halloween is probably among the best retellings of Two-Face's origin, Dark Victory was just a continuation. Also not that Two-Face teamed up with the same villains as both Falconi and Hush.

However, I would be willing to believe that he is a fine writer of other series, having never read them.
Moderator
#38 Posted by Mr. Wilson (6322 posts) - - Show Bio

Loebs got great stuff.   All his Batman stuff, Spider-Man Blue, Hulk Grey, Daredevil Yellow, Superman For All Seasons, Captain America Fallen Son are awesome.  Hulk is great if you don't if you don't go in with Ed Brubaker in mind.  Sure some stuff like Wolverine and Superman/Batman weren't the greatest but he is good more than not.  Give the guy a break. He also lost his son a few years ago.

#39 Posted by Ninja Lad (68 posts) - - Show Bio
@Mr. Wilson said:
" Loebs got great stuff.   All his Batman stuff, Spider-Man Blue, Hulk Grey, Daredevil Yellow, Superman For All Seasons, Captain America Fallen Son are awesome.  Hulk is great if you don't if you don't go in with Ed Brubaker in mind.  Sure some stuff like Wolverine and Superman/Batman weren't the greatest but he is good more than not.  Give the guy a break. He also lost his son a few years ago. "
I know people who enjoy Ultimatum [though I personally do not], but he's got this crazy style he's writing with nowadays that is not reminiscent of what he did in all of those mini-series like Fallen Son and Blue which was actually enjoyable. He's writing with this style that is much too surreal and while not campy, it's definitely more comedic than most people want out of a comic. It's full of plot devices and plot induced craziness to try and make Red Hulk look like serious business. He's literally turning Red Hulk into some bad Chuck Norris joke with all of the feats he's stuffing into the character. The way he writes it is just downright awful, every aspect is just really bad.

And losing a son is no excuse for bad writing. Not to sound cold or apathetic, but if you're producing such unsatisfactory material, you need to take more downtime and find your footing before stepping back into the game, IMO.

@Icarusflies said:
"
@Ninja Lad said:
"
@John Valentine said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
"
@Ninja Lad said:
"
@Icarusflies said:
" Jeph Loeb is a horrible, and horribly overrated, writer. He only has one story idea, and he uses it over, and over, and over. "
What story idea would that be? "
The idea (for Batman): Gang boss teams up with other super-villains. Super-hero seduced by Poison Ivy and Catwoman. Big fight with villains. Conclusion drawn from evidence not in story. Lots of flashbacks to parents deaths. Another big fight with same villains (namely Solomon Grundy, Joker, Mad Hatter, sometimes Poison Ivy). Gang leader discovered, defeated, someone killed.

The Long Halloween, Dark Victory, and Hush all have this plot.
"
Hush has this plot, LH and DR do not have the same plot.Stop bullsh!ting because you dislike him. "
I wouldn't know, I've only read Hush, so it's not my place to say. But even so, that's three out of the many plots he did. It wasn't the plot for his Marvel colors line,  DD: Yellow, Hulk: Gray, Spider-Man Blue and CA: White, it's definitely not the plot for Hulk, it's not the plot for Ultimatum and wasn't the plot for Ultimates 3. "
1). I really don't read anything Marvel, except Deadpool, which I started reading last issue. 2) I actually did find all the books very similar. They did have many of the same elements. While I will admit that Long Halloween is probably among the best retellings of Two-Face's origin, Dark Victory was just a continuation. Also not that Two-Face teamed up with the same villains as both Falconi and Hush.

However, I would be willing to believe that he is a fine writer of other series, having never read them.
"
Well, I don't know why you'd suggest that he uses the same plots over and over [note: villain team-ups are not rare to begin with, neither is Batman getting some cutty from a villain of the female persuasion] if it's only three out of the many series that he's written and it's really arguable, honestly. Batman's Rogue Gallery--especially the popular ones, is only so big. Of course you're going to run into the same suckers over and over.

#40 Posted by War Killer (19867 posts) - - Show Bio

IF YOU DON'T LIKE HIS WRITING STOP READING THE BOOK!!! - THE END

Online
#41 Posted by Nighthunter (28578 posts) - - Show Bio
@Ninja Lad said:
"
And losing a son is no excuse for bad writing. Not to sound cold or apathetic, but if you're producing such unsatisfactory material, you need to take more downtime and find your footing before stepping back into the game, IMO.

I think you crossed the line with that
#42 Posted by Ninja Lad (68 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
"
@Ninja Lad said:
"
And losing a son is no excuse for bad writing. Not to sound cold or apathetic, but if you're producing such unsatisfactory material, you need to take more downtime and find your footing before stepping back into the game, IMO.

I think you crossed the line with that "
I didn't mean it how it sounded now that I'm reading it again. Clearly losing someone that close to you would prompt for you to fall into a slump, especially losing a child. But all I'm saying is IF--IF meaning that IF HE personally feels that it was the loss of his son a while back that's the reasoning behind the bad things he's produced, then maybe it's not time for him to be doing what he does. But, I don't think that's the case, because he wrote Captain America: White not that long ago along with Fallen Son and those was remarkable work to the point where I felt during the last issue of Fallen Son.

@War Killer said:
" IF YOU DON'T LIKE HIS WRITING STOP READING THE BOOK!!! - THE END "
Also a option.
#43 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio
@Icarusflies said:
"However, I would be willing to believe that he is a fine writer of other series, having never read them."
Nah.  His Batman is as good as it gets.  Everything else that he writes is even worse.
#44 Posted by TruePwnge (2764 posts) - - Show Bio

When was the last time you bought a Loeb comic?
 for me it was many, many years ago

#45 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
@TruePwnge said:
" When was the last time you bought a Loeb comic? for me it was many, many years ago "
You didn;t even know Loeb was bad unitl you saw this thread.
#46 Posted by Vance Astro (91067 posts) - - Show Bio
@AtPhantom said:
"
@TruePwnge said:
" When was the last time you bought a Loeb comic? for me it was many, many years ago "
You didn;t even know Loeb was bad unitl you saw this thread. "
That's obvious.
Moderator
#47 Posted by Dane (10586 posts) - - Show Bio
@TruePwnge said:
" When was the last time you bought a Loeb comic? for me it was many, many years ago "
Dude I don't think you've ever read a comic.
#48 Posted by inferiorego (21112 posts) - - Show Bio

Loeb=Genius

Proof... The movie Commando

Staff
#49 Posted by AtPhantom (14521 posts) - - Show Bio
inferiorego said:
Loeb=GeniusProof... The movie Commando
The one with Arnold Shwarcenegger?
#50 Posted by inferiorego (21112 posts) - - Show Bio
AtPhantom said:
inferiorego said: Loeb=GeniusProof... The movie Commando The one with Arnold Shwarcenegger? [more]
yes, he wrote that.
Staff

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