And To The Surprise of No One, She Returns

Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

So this is happening, officially this time, Jean Grey is returning to the X-Men.

Marvel Relaunch 2012

The idea of bringing back Jean Gray has been contentious. Even the first time they did it, there were those who hated the decision because it cheapened her heroic sacrifice. There are those who see her as the embodiment of the "death is broken" nature of comics (or just dislike the character) and want to see her stay dead, and there are her fans, who have long suffered under tease after tease of her return (e.g., Endsong, Warsong, Messiah Complex, Second Coming, Avengers vs. X-Men), but it hasn't happened for a good long while (seven years or so). So, how is she returning, how long will this last, and what can they do with her going forward? And, ultimately, is this a good thing?

How is she returning?

Time-travel. Along with the rest of the original X-Men, Jean is leaping forward and having a good look at the crap-sack world of the modern X-Men. I like the idea of a kind of "return to roots" for the X-Men after the upheaval of AvX—sort of what Logan's school was supposed to be—but I'm not sure I like the idea of Jean being, well, old Jean. That almost every story we've had with her is basically wiped out from the "returned" Jean's continuity. Can that really be considered the same Jean? Can we really call this a "return?" I don't see how this is any better from trying to make Ben Reilly the "real" Peter Parker and wiping out years of Spider-Man's memories. Plus, she'll have to constantly deal with the "man out of time" baggage as long as she stays, which is going to be a big change to the character. Then again, the problem with Jean has always been the rest of her baggage, so maybe that's okay by comparison. This Jean would be pre-Phoenix, pre-Logan/Scott triangle, pre-death-cycle, pre-a lotta crap that's been dogging the character for years, even after her death(s). But it does raise the question...

How long will this last?

We have to assume that the originals will go back in time at some point, will she go as well? If the originals don't go back in time, can they really be considered the "originals"? My understanding is that the Marvel Multiverse works where once a timeline branches off, it's considered its own universe. We don't need another "fake" Jean running around. We already have Rachel, Hope, the Goblin Queen, and a bunch of brand new clones by Sinister. And then there's all the other character's that have picked up Jean's roles and props over the years: Emma Frost, The Stepford Cuckoos, Cable, Nate Grey, Korvus, and now the Phoenix Five (and I guess an Iron Fist in there too). If they're going to call this a return, they'll need to figure out a way to explain:

  • Why she's not going back with the team,
  • Why she would want to stay in the modern era,
  • How that won't shatter the timeline, and
  • How she'll still count as "our" Jean instead of another alt-U Jean.

Personally, I think they'll just say "screw it" and effectively make her an alt-U Jean but won't call it that. Basically, that when the old team traveled forward, their timeline split into another universe—one without Jean in it. Depending on how well the new Jean is developed, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but it still won't feel like getting the "real" Jean back.

What can they do with her going forward?

Well, for one thing they can ditch the whole Phoenix bit, once and for all. And thank Odin for that. Jean has stagnated for far too long as "the Phoenix chick" and as the bauble to be fought over in the Scott/Logan love triangle. Despite the loss of her continuity the time-travel aspect of her return entails, this will at least provide a good excuse to tear the character down to its bedrock and then build it up into something new. They could also take her powers in a new direction if they wished—considering that the X-Men and Avengers have newer challenges, training methods, and technology to present her with, I wouldn't be surprised at all if she developed new techniques or even a "secondary" ability that was so successful in updating characters like Beast and Emma Frost. And while I like seeing the old X-Men duds, I'd hope that if she decides to stick around permanently (which may not happen) then she'll update to a new costume. They just need to avoid retreading old ground. If they bring her back just to pair her with Scott or Logan or fill her with Phoneix energy then a lot of fans will be wondering what the point was.

So what can they do? She'll be appearing on the Uncanny Avengers team, which is interesting. It's not like Jean was totally cut off from the Avengers at that age considering her friendship with Wanda. I think that's a good idea, but I'd also want to see her interacting with younger characters since she's technically a peer for them now. She should be girl talking with Hope, Jubilee, and X-23. She should be showing up Quentin Quire. And if they don't have her attend a school named after a future-dead version of herself, run by a man who had a super-creepy crush on her for decades, and with a dystopian-future daughter of hers on the staff, they will seriously be missing an opportunity for fun storytelling.

Is this a good thing?

I would argue that it is. There's a clear downside, of course: those who dislike Jean have to deal with her again and fans of Jean aren't even getting "their" Jean back (and even this Jean might only be a temporary fixture). However, as someone who was mostly in the former group, I will be releived that her return will at least mean they can finally shut up about the Phoenix, and her death, and all that crap that they've been referencing for decades because they can't think of what to do with the character. I firmly believe that Jean has been just as annoying dead as she ever was alive. Now that she's back and being scalped down to the nub of what her character is, well, they can finally progress forward. And I hope that Jean's fans can recognize the potential in that, and that the writers can deliver a new, better Jean for fans and non-fans alike.

#1 Posted by EnSabahNurX (2310 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm ok with it because I want Jean back

It's like resurrecting her and the phoenix having moved on

The time-travel thing is the messy part

Also she could essentially psychically collect the memories from her "future friends" and see where her future life went wrong and try to prevent the same mistakes

Rachel would probably be her best friend now that they are closer in age and should train her to use her powers, heck hope can train her in combat/weapons

No love triangle anymore since she's too young to be with either scott or wolverine, though scott might have a tough time with her since she's truly his first love untainted by future events

She just needs a better costume lol I'll ignore the rest if she doesn't get sucked into the phoenix again(AVX better resolve the phoenix problem)

#2 Posted by Gambit1024 (9890 posts) - - Show Bio

So are the other original X-Men staying too, or is it just Jean?

#3 Posted by Hareil0079 (429 posts) - - Show Bio

@Gambit1024 said:

So are the other original X-Men staying too, or is it just Jean?

Good Question, They said the O5 where coming to Post AvX time so it can be only temporary! she'll meet new and future counterparts and possible fuel the UA to do even better and everyone getting along

#4 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@EnSabahNurX said:

Also she could essentially psychically collect the memories from her "future friends" and see where her future life went wrong and try to prevent the same mistakes

Rachel would probably be her best friend now that they are closer in age and should train her to use her powers, heck hope can train her in combat/weapons

I hadn't considered that actually. She could pretty easily gain some knowledge of the events she's missing second hand from a variety of viewpoints. That would be a really interesting arc actually, her going from person to person to collect memories of dead Jean.

And I think Rachel as a mentor would be a nice reversal of roles. I think that'd be a sweet pairing for them.

@Hareil0079 said:

@Gambit1024 said:

So are the other original X-Men staying too, or is it just Jean?

Good Question, They said the O5 where coming to Post AvX time so it can be only temporary! she'll meet new and future counterparts and possible fuel the UA to do even better and everyone getting along

Agreed, it's a key question. We don't know what's happening with the long-term status of the original five coming forward. It could be they come forward and they all die, so their timeline branches off. It could be they all go home and it's some sort of "transporter error" that results in a duplicate jean staying here. Or it could just be they all go home and it was temporary all along.

#5 Posted by HopesummersFORtheFUTURE (2487 posts) - - Show Bio

WELCOME BACK JEAN!!!

EVEN IF ITS TEMPORARY!!!!!

#6 Posted by TAneT62 (1054 posts) - - Show Bio

I love Jean Grey so much, anyone who disagree's with her coming back well then to bad, get over it. I'm happy she's back, reading Marvel has been empty to me with no Jean.

#7 Posted by EnSabahNurX (2310 posts) - - Show Bio

@TAneT62 said:

I love Jean Grey so much, anyone who disagree's with her coming back well then to bad, get over it. I'm happy she's back, reading Marvel has been empty to me with no Jean.

I agree, X-men just seems weird since jeans been gone. She's been away far too long

#8 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4140 posts) - - Show Bio

Someone had to put Scott in his place.

#9 Posted by BatWatch (2332 posts) - - Show Bio

I have to admit, I'm getting really frustrated with all the continuity rewrites and multiple characters. I can accept that nobody truly dies in comics, but can we at least let a character be dead for awhile without introducing some jacked up version. I'm not really a follower of Marvel comics; I've become much more invested in DC through the Bat Family, but just hearing about Jean's history described makes me want to punch some writers in the nose...or at least put itching powder in their underwear.

#10 Posted by TAneT62 (1054 posts) - - Show Bio

@EnSabahNurX: At least someone agrees. :)

#11 Posted by ARMIV2 (7715 posts) - - Show Bio

Jean is back for the umpteenth time once more?

Give me some room, folks. My mind has been BLOWN.

#12 Edited by BlackArmor (6121 posts) - - Show Bio

I'd probably be annoyed or mad or disappointed about this if it wasn't so gosh darned obvious that it was going to happen, seriously is there any point in complaining about the inevitable? Since I was born there were certain unavoidable facts of life, 2 of them were that I was gonna die and Jean Grey was going to come back and I was gonna die regretting that Jean came back

#13 Posted by Yasiiii4 (149 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm happy she's back, but I'm not sure if I like how they're bringing her back....

#14 Posted by Crimsonlord53 (1214 posts) - - Show Bio

@Yasiiii4:

Agreed it's like there throwing out not only jean's history but the phoenix as well. Yes the phoenix was a plot devices used to often.

#15 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@PsychoKnights said:

I have to admit, I'm getting really frustrated with all the continuity rewrites and multiple characters. I can accept that nobody truly dies in comics, but can we at least let a character be dead for awhile without introducing some jacked up version. I'm not really a follower of Marvel comics; I've become much more invested in DC through the Bat Family, but just hearing about Jean's history described makes me want to punch some writers in the nose...or at least put itching powder in their underwear.

Well, to be fair, I think this is an attempt by Marvel to wipe out some of her "jacked up" continuity. And she has been dead longer than most. In the time since her latest death, other characters have died and returned (e.g., Colossus, Ariel).

@BlackArmor said:

I'd probably be annoyed or mad or disappointed about this if it wasn't so gosh darned obvious that it was going to happen, seriously is there any point in complaining about the inevitable? Since I was born there were certain unavoidable facts of life, 2 of them were that I was gonna die and Jean Grey was going to come back and I was gonna die regretting that Jean came back

Even the characters seemed to accept this. I seem to remember Psylocke saying as much to Emma Frost.

#16 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

No matter what, if they come to the future and return to the past they will have new knowledge which should create a new timeline so I think Marvel are just ignoring the logical time travel reasons. My problem with bringing them to the future is that they will be inexperienced and underpowered (Bobby is only now tapping into his omega level powers, Jean was a weak telekinetic and had subpar telepathic skill, No Archangel etc). They won't belong on any team, they aren't on the same level as Captain America, Present day X-men or any other famous hero for that matter. Sure there might be some drama but what will their purpose be?

O5: This future is unacceptable!

Present O5: You don't know about anything we've faced you don't have the right to judge us!

O5: It's still unacceptable!

Present O5: Well what are you going to do about it?

O5: Oh...uh....there isn't anything we can do is there?

Present O5: Not really, unless you go back in time and change the future which will result in an alternate timeline making everything that has happened so far completely pointless.

#17 Posted by AweSam (7121 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm facepalming. You hear me Marvel? This news made me facepalm. I'm facepalming at you!

#18 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

Some more quotes on Jean from the new Brevoort Newsarama interview:

Nrama: It's funny because you had previously ruled out Jean Grey coming back duringAvX and it turns out she is coming back, just directly after AvX, and not in the way people would have likely expected.
Brevoort: I've been kind of chuckling a little bit as the Jean Grey fans have been getting more and more outraged at the fact that I told them, "Jean is not coming back in AvX. She's not a part of it." Because from day one, I've known we're going to do this story. So there will in fact be a Jean Grey. It is the earliest Jean Grey. So the fans who have really come out in support of that character will get the thing they wished for, in a sense. And hopefully they'll like it, and probably there will be more campaigning — "How dare you do this?" And that's fine, too.
So, yes, there will be a Jean, and there will be a Warren Worthington — an Angel who remembers who he is, and didn't go crazy to try and go all Apocalypse and destroy the world, and hasn't sort of died and been reborn. And there will be a young Iceman who hasn't quite grown into his powers and himself yet, and there will be a non-furry Beast. It's definitely going to be an interesting story.
#19 Posted by ReVamp (22860 posts) - - Show Bio

@Gambit1024 said:

So are the other original X-Men staying too, or is it just Jean?

All 5.

#20 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@Gambit1024 said:

So are the other original X-Men staying too, or is it just Jean?

All 5.

Well, all five are returning, but we don't know if any of them are "staying". We don't know how long these characters will appear, although the Newsarama interview sure seems to imply at least six issues worth.

Brevoort: I don't want to say too much, but the stuff that comes out of it, the fact that the X-Men come here, and see the world, and go, "This is pretty weird;" that's not a six-issue story. The choices they make, the decisions they come to, what they decided that has to be done, that's the kickoff point, that's going to propel the X-Men titles as a whole for a good, long while. Without getting into the specifics, it's not a, "we have a little adventure with them and we're done." In the same way that "Avengers Disassembled" changed and informed every Avengers story that Brian wrote, this opening arc of All-New X-Men is going to have that same effect on probably years worth of X-Men stories.

I read the above as "it's not [just] six-issues", meaning it's six issues but then who knows what happens with those characters. It could set up "years" of X-Men stories with or without them staying in the future.

#21 Posted by ReVamp (22860 posts) - - Show Bio

@fodigg: That's definitely a fair point to make, but I think that if they were going to be here for just a short time (at least in plan, like you're implying) then Marvel would be making this a mini or a maxi series. Since its an ongoing, I think its safe to assume that they'll be here for a while, unless of course it gets cancelled -- but really that's irrelevant to the topic.

#22 Posted by BatWatch (2332 posts) - - Show Bio

@fodigg said:

@PsychoKnights said:

I have to admit, I'm getting really frustrated with all the continuity rewrites and multiple characters. I can accept that nobody truly dies in comics, but can we at least let a character be dead for awhile without introducing some jacked up version. I'm not really a follower of Marvel comics; I've become much more invested in DC through the Bat Family, but just hearing about Jean's history described makes me want to punch some writers in the nose...or at least put itching powder in their underwear.

Well, to be fair, I think this is an attempt by Marvel to wipe out some of her "jacked up" continuity. And she has been dead longer than most. In the time since her latest death, other characters have died and returned (e.g., Colossus, Ariel).

@BlackArmor said:

I'd probably be annoyed or mad or disappointed about this if it wasn't so gosh darned obvious that it was going to happen, seriously is there any point in complaining about the inevitable? Since I was born there were certain unavoidable facts of life, 2 of them were that I was gonna die and Jean Grey was going to come back and I was gonna die regretting that Jean came back

Even the characters seemed to accept this. I seem to remember Psylocke saying as much to Emma Frost.

Fair points, but it still annoys me.

#23 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@fodigg: That's definitely a fair point to make, but I think that if they were going to be here for just a short time (at least in plan, like you're implying) then Marvel would be making this a mini or a maxi series. Since its an ongoing, I think its safe to assume that they'll be here for a while, unless of course it gets cancelled -- but really that's irrelevant to the topic.

Well, my point was simply that it's up in the air. We don't know how this is all happening. For all we know the original five are jumping forward and replacing their modern counterparts, and that'll be permanent going forward (i.e., a complete reboot of those X-Men). Or they all vanish after the initial 6 (or however many) issues but the title continues without them. It could really go any direction at this point.

#24 Posted by pwnda (59 posts) - - Show Bio

this is so dumb, Jean without all of her memories is not going to be Jean Grey, they are cancelling uncanny x men so i am pretty sure they are doing something with cyclops, either killing him off at the end of avx or sending him to the white hot room to be with Jean. I just want an x men team back with xavier, cable, jean and cyclops ( not the teenage versions) and anyone with those core

#25 Posted by moywar700 (2775 posts) - - Show Bio

@HopesummersFORtheFUTURE said:

WELCOME BACK JEAN!!!

EVEN IF ITS TEMPORARY!!!!!

she looks sultry in half of those pictures.

#26 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@moywar700: Greg Land, right?

#27 Posted by Mercy_ (92097 posts) - - Show Bio
@fodigg: Yep. 
Moderator
#28 Posted by Iamlovewithin500 (1028 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nova`Prime` said:

Someone had to put Scott in his place.

#29 Posted by Iamlovewithin500 (1028 posts) - - Show Bio

New Costume 
 

#30 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@Iamlovewithin500 said:

New Costume

Where's that from?

#31 Edited by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio
#32 Posted by Iamlovewithin500 (1028 posts) - - Show Bio
@fodigg:  Oh srry lol
#33 Posted by Dafyd (9 posts) - - Show Bio

This should make for fun conversation.

60s Hank to present Hank: "...Why have I turned into a blue pussy?"

60s Warren to present Warren: "You don't remember where my money is? What do you mean, you don't remember where my money is?"

60s Scott to present Scott: "...Jerk."

60s Bobby to present Bobby: "Dude. I am so cool."

60s Jean to Present Jean ... Oh, wait.

#34 Posted by xtremexfan (38 posts) - - Show Bio

Bring original Jean Grey back or don't bother at all. This Jean Grey's time in the 616 future will be completely pointless. They'll probably end up erasing the Original Five's minds, so it doesn't affect the X-men's current time line. This just isn't fair man...

#35 Posted by HopesummersFORtheFUTURE (2487 posts) - - Show Bio

@xtremexfan: right on!!!!!

#36 Posted by jgrainer (3 posts) - - Show Bio

not much of a surprise, if everyone already knows what is happening : (

Anyway, for a longtime "fan" like me, this is no different than when they said she was in suspended animation and returned to find the original survivors acting as "mutant catchers' in X-Factor. It also looks like they continue to retcon Morrison's work out of existence. Yeah, everything except the sexiness: Keep sexy Emma and her jailbait clone Cuckoos, 86 interesting characters like Beak and Ernst (too ugly, gidoudahere!). Make Kid Omega an annoying jerk who apparently forgot the epiphany he learned before his "death" at the hands of Xorneto. X-Men has been pure exploitative crap for years now. Returning Jeanie isn't going to help a thing

#37 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@jgrainer: I prefer what they're doing with Quire now to what they did in the Endsong/Warsong crap.

#38 Posted by CellphoneGirl (18684 posts) - - Show Bio

I want the real Jean back lol

Marvel for the past few years has been constantly hinting at her return, and now they pull this to mess with us even more thinking she's finally back but it turns out to be a displaced time traveling Jean Grey. I'm not amused, however i'll still read it :P

#39 Posted by oviouslyjeangrey (400 posts) - - Show Bio

I hope its permanent

#40 Posted by Madame_Mist (1325 posts) - - Show Bio

@oviouslyjeangrey said:

I hope its permanent

Marvel has basically confirmed it is.

#41 Posted by oviouslyjeangrey (400 posts) - - Show Bio

@Madame_Mist: :D omg that makes me so happy thank you :D

#42 Posted by Madame_Mist (1325 posts) - - Show Bio

@oviouslyjeangrey said:

@Madame_Mist: :D omg that makes me so happy thank you :D

Don't worry about her not being a permanent fixture. Quaseda, Brevoort and Bendis etc have confirmed they aren't going to cop out on this. Jean's here to stay:)

#43 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@Madame_Mist said:

@oviouslyjeangrey said:

@Madame_Mist: :D omg that makes me so happy thank you :D

Don't worry about her not being a permanent fixture. Quaseda, Brevoort and Bendis etc have confirmed they aren't going to cop out on this. Jean's here to stay:)

Interesting. Did these quotes come from the SDCC? Unfortunately I've been traveling for work and unable to keep up with the news.

#44 Posted by Trixie (119 posts) - - Show Bio

So happy to have her back! I hope it turns out well.

#45 Posted by Teerack (4554 posts) - - Show Bio

Why do people act like this is really Jean Grey? She didn't live the life of the jean I followed in comics all these years. She's just another alternate version of jean to me and nothing more. Just like how the Nightcrawler on X-Force doesn't mean Nightcrawler is back.

#46 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@Teerack said:

Why do people act like this is really Jean Grey? She didn't live the life of the jean I followed in comics all these years. She's just another alternate version of jean to me and nothing more. Just like how the Nightcrawler on X-Force doesn't mean Nightcrawler is back.

Yup. I wonder if people felt this way when the "real" Jean returned and it was revealed that the Dark Phoenix Jean was a copy. Although I guess they side-stepped that by saying the memories of the fake jean floated on over to the real Jean (and a big to the Goblin Queen, but hey, comics everybody!).

#47 Edited by PhoenixoftheTides (3275 posts) - - Show Bio

I like Jean, but I hate time travel. Also, she wasn't always the "Phoenix Chick". She had a broad stretch of years in the original series, with the original X-Factor and with the X-Men where she was a telepath/telekinetic. In many cases, the retcon they used to absolve her of the crimes committed during the Dark Phoenix Saga worked. Unfortunately, many characters like bringing this story back ad nauseum because it was the only thing they thought made her interesting. It also involves the Scott/Logan relationship "mess" so it tends to be a lose lose. I'd really prefer an adult Jean returning because I don't see anything of value having teenaged X-Men around could achieve besides making continuity even more of a mess. Might as well bring in every alternate reality version of characters we think are boring.

@Teerack said:

Why do people act like this is really Jean Grey? She didn't live the life of the jean I followed in comics all these years. She's just another alternate version of jean to me and nothing more. Just like how the Nightcrawler on X-Force doesn't mean Nightcrawler is back.

Exactly. Experiences make each person different. This is just another alternate reality character whose name, genetic structure and early childhood memories mirror that of 616 Jeans'.

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