JUDD WINNICK=FAIL

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#1 Edited by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio

I just recently read red hood the lost days what started as a masterpiece turned in to a joke.There were so many continuity flaws in that scene where talia and jason 'made love' that i dont even know where to start.um why was talia crying over ra's al ghul HELLO he was alive,talia was lexcorp ceo at that time and she abandoned ra's after the events of tower of babel,she even kissed batman and called him my love twice(hush),and shortly later she sold lexcorp property to bruce later doesnt seem like someone who wants to punish bruce.then there was that interaction with hush ,i dont even know whether to laugh or cry basically hush meets jason  and says "is he bruce wayne" jason "yeah" hush "okay lets kill him"  did hush seriously expect  jason to know his identity ,if that is so then he gave pretty much every villian he worked with batmans identity.funnily judd even ignored his own established continuity in "under the hood" jason was being chased by deathstroke and society,here it is implied that talia knew about jasons actions ,so um why were they chasing him? basically it was a fan service scene generated towards the jason todd fanbase,there are tons of other wrongs here as well ,at the start of this series judd claimed that talia's relationship with jason represents her time with damian, i guess these are the mans views on a relationship between a mother and her son

#2 Posted by batman_is_god (1185 posts) - - Show Bio

True, the Talia and Jason thing makes absolutely no sense, but I still enjoy all of his Red Hood work so far except that part.
#3 Posted by longbowhunter (7093 posts) - - Show Bio

Didnt read Lost Days. I loved Under the Hood and the movie though. Over all I'm a Winick fan. His work on JL: Generation Lost has been the cat's meow.
#4 Posted by Primmaster64 (21138 posts) - - Show Bio

I think someone else explained the scene where Talia was telling Jason she lost her father.

#5 Posted by primepower53 (5686 posts) - - Show Bio
@Primmaster64 said:
"I think someone else explained the scene where Talia was telling Jason she lost her father."
#6 Posted by Primmaster64 (21138 posts) - - Show Bio
#7 Posted by allman (1 posts) - - Show Bio

I also could not understand how jason could have gotten back into shape so fast after his death, i mean did he go here to build muscle fast - LOL
 
Even so - it would take him years (using rah's pools or not) to build up strength (muscle) and those skills

#8 Posted by Avenging-X-Bolt (13157 posts) - - Show Bio

maybe she was just horny. people do have random sex in real life
#9 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@Primmaster64:
Ra's wasnt dead ,period he died in "death and maidens" but at the hands of nyssa not batman,but i would have given judd the benefit of the doubt if the scene had happened after jasons conversation with hush but since it didnt so ,FAIL.
#10 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis:
Your kinda of late on this bro
#11 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134:
Its a continuity error, winnick is known for ignoring continuity but this is the last straw.
#12 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis said:
"@daredevil21134: Its a continuity error, winnick is known for ignoring continuity but this is the last straw. "

last straw?Seriously dude what are you gonna do about it.Lots of writer ignore continuity,i'm sure winick won't be the last
#13 Posted by Primmaster64 (21138 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134: or the first
#14 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@Primmaster64 said:
" @daredevil21134: or the first"

exactly
#15 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134:
Ignore continuity to do what? that is the question.and no ofcourse i am not in a position to do anything but neither are jason todd fanboys who rant on the red hair,the most i can do is hope that judd becomes jeph loeb version 2.0.
#16 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm just don't understand why would you come on Jason Todd fourm just to screw with his fanboys  not to msny prople are gonna care maybe if you put on the Batman page it would be irrent but Judd Winick is like god to Jason Todd fans so I don't think your gonna find to many supporters here brother.Like I said before Judd is not the only writer not to follow continuity nor will he be the last.
#17 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134 said:
"I'm just don't understand why would you come on Jason Todd fourm just to screw with his fanboys  not to msny prople are gonna care maybe if you put on the Batman page it would be irrent but Judd Winick is like god to Jason Todd fans so I don't think your gonna find to many supporters here brother.Like I said before Judd is not the only writer not to follow continuity nor will he be the last. "

maybe because i want to prevent jason todd fans from running of with the wrong idea,thankyou for the advice i will keep it in mind next time grant morrison or the red hair is mentioned.
#18 Posted by Emperor Gonzo Noir (19714 posts) - - Show Bio

Grant Morrison doesn't give two sh*ts about continuity, doesn't stop his stories from being any good

#19 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@Emperor Gonzo Noir said:
"Grant Morrison doesn't give two sh*ts about continuity, doesn't stop his stories from being any good "

Damn Right
#20 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis said:
"@daredevil21134 said:
"I'm just don't understand why would you come on Jason Todd fourm just to screw with his fanboys  not to msny prople are gonna care maybe if you put on the Batman page it would be irrent but Judd Winick is like god to Jason Todd fans so I don't think your gonna find to many supporters here brother.Like I said before Judd is not the only writer not to follow continuity nor will he be the last. "
maybe because i want to prevent jason todd fans from running of with the wrong idea,thankyou for the advice i will keep it in mind next time grant morrison or the red hair is mentioned. "

Its no secret we hate the red hair dude but if Jason stays like that  I would still be a huge Jason Todd fan because I know no matter what writers will always screw something up
#21 Posted by RedHoodJT (527 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis:  You do know that The Lost Days is what was leading up to under the hood. It was the prequel. As in what happened to him before under the hood. "The  Lost Days" between him coming back and ending up in Gotham.
#22 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio

Lol
#23 Posted by RedHoodJT (527 posts) - - Show Bio

And kudos to you daredevil21134 man I thought I was the only one that would still be a fan of Jason even if he had red hair again. I don't care what color hair he has as long as he is still a badass I'm good. I mean he could have friggin' rainbow  hair and I would still like him.

#24 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@RedHoodJT said:
"And kudos to you daredevil21134 man I thought I was the only one that would still be a fan of Jason even if he had red hair again. I don't care what color hair he has as long as he is still a badass I'm good. I mean he could have friggin' rainbow  hair and I would still like him. "

Me too bro.I'm a loyal fan.And its really not that hard to be loyal to such a great charcter
#25 Posted by JonesDeini (3620 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis:  
Tabernacle preach, man. Honestly, Jason Todd having a fan base will NEVER make sense to me. I really feel that brining him back was one of THE WORST ideas in comics. We killed the bastard for a reason...
#26 Posted by ComicCrazy (1537 posts) - - Show Bio

Judd Winnick is in no way a fail !!
#27 Posted by FadeToBlackBolt (23334 posts) - - Show Bio

The Talia/Jason relationship is the worst thing to happen in a DC comic book in a long, long time. Other than that, I like Jason, but that story is just awful.

#28 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@RedHoodJT said:

" @entropy_aegis:  You do know that The Lost Days is what was leading up to under the hood. It was the prequel. As in what happened to him before under the hood. "The  Lost Days" between him coming back and ending up in Gotham. "


yes i know thank you very much,but the last issue takes place around the same time as under the hood(kord industries) talia was a member of the society by then ,so why were they hunting him.
@JonesDeini:
Speak for yourself,i have no problem with jason at all.    
#29 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@JonesDeini said:
" @entropy_aegis:  Tabernacle preach, man. Honestly, Jason Todd having a fan base will NEVER make sense to me. I really feel that brining him back was one of THE WORST ideas in comics. We killed the bastard for a reason... "

Get over it its been over 20 years
#30 Edited by RedHoodJT (527 posts) - - Show Bio
@JonesDeini: Like my bro daredevil21134 said it was 20 years ago get over it. And if you are seriously a John Stewart fan you just need not say any more. That guy is such a joke. They should do with him what they did to Jason way back when and have people call in to kill that guy off. He is such a lame ass character.
 
 
@entropy_aegis:  Because he was becoming a loose end. They obviously didn't want batman to find out he had ties to them so if they could get him first then they wouldn't have to worry about it. But we all know that obviously didn't happen.
#31 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@RedHoodJT:
You just made that one up didnt you ?
#32 Edited by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@RedHoodJT said:

" @JonesDeini: Like my bro daredevil21134 said it was 20 years ago get over it. And if you are seriously a John Stewart fan you just need not say any more. That guy is such a joke. They should do with him what they did to Jason way back when and have people call in to kill that guy off. He is such a lame ass character.
 
 
@entropy_aegis:  Because he was becoming a loose end. They obviously didn't want batman to find out he had ties to them so if they could get him first then they wouldn't have to worry about it. But we all know that obviously didn't happen. "


preach it brother
#33 Posted by Theodore (3445 posts) - - Show Bio
@RedHoodJT said:
" @JonesDeini: Like my bro daredevil21134 said it was 20 years ago get over it. And if you are seriously a John Stewart fan you just need not say any more. That guy is such a joke. They should do with him what they did to Jason way back when and have people call in to kill that guy off. He is such a lame ass character.
 
 
@entropy_aegis:  Because he was becoming a loose end. They obviously didn't want batman to find out he had ties to them so if they could get him first then they wouldn't have to worry about it. But we all know that obviously didn't happen. "
I just lost respect for you.
#34 Posted by RedHoodJT (527 posts) - - Show Bio

Dude how have you lost respect for me? I like John Stewart I just think that for all the writing talent DC has he gets the shit end of the stick. It makes me not like his character like I used to.
 
@entropy_aegis: And no I didn't make that up. Re-read it and you will see what I'm talking about.

#35 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@Theodore said:
" @RedHoodJT said:
" @JonesDeini: Like my bro daredevil21134 said it was 20 years ago get over it. And if you are seriously a John Stewart fan you just need not say any more. That guy is such a joke. They should do with him what they did to Jason way back when and have people call in to kill that guy off. He is such a lame ass character.
 
 
@entropy_aegis:  Because he was becoming a loose end. They obviously didn't want batman to find out he had ties to them so if they could get him first then they wouldn't have to worry about it. But we all know that obviously didn't happen. "
I just lost respect for you. "
Why? Are you a John Stewart fan
#36 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@RedHoodJT said:
"Dude how have you lost respect for me? I like John Stewart I just think that for all the writing talent DC has he gets the shit end of the stick. It makes me not like his character like I used to.
 
@entropy_aegis: And no I didn't make that up. Re-read it and you will see what I'm talking about. "

What story are you talking about bro
#37 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@RedHoodJT:
The society were brought in by black mask,so that renders your argument invalid.
#38 Posted by RedHoodJT (527 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134:  I was talking about Red Hood The Lost Days.
#39 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio

oh
#40 Posted by JonesDeini (3620 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134:  
LMAO. John Stewart>>>Jason Todd, though I admit that he's a better character in the DCAU than in comics. This is due to writers generally shafting him (and just about any other lantern) to focus on good ol' Hal. That being said, not even good writers can make Jason Todd worth a damn, he was an idiot when he became Robin and should've died sooner. As Bruce said, he treated it like a game and that's what got him killed. Jason isn't even worthy to lick the boots of Dick or Tim, shoot, I'd even rank Damien above him. His life was meaningless and his only value was in his death, because it gave Bats his edge back and opened the gates to the wonderful Tim Drake era. When he returned it was as a bitter, HOEmotional, lil' boy with daddy issues. And frakin' Squirrel Girl would make a better Robin than him, but hey, at least he's no Stephanie Brown.
#41 Edited by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@JonesDeini said:

" @daredevil21134:  LMAO. John Stewart>>>Jason Todd, though I admit that he's a better character in the DCAU than in comics. This is due to writers generally shafting him (and just about any other lantern) to focus on good ol' Hal. That being said, not even good writers can make Jason Todd worth a damn, he was an idiot when he became Robin and should've died sooner. As Bruce said, he treated it like a game and that's what got him killed. Jason isn't even worthy to lick the boots of Dick or Tim, shoot, I'd even rank Damien above him. His life was meaningless and his only value was in his death, because it gave Bats his edge back and opened the gates to the wonderful Tim Drake era. When he returned it was as a bitter, HOEmotional, lil' boy with daddy issues. And frakin' Squirrel Girl would make a better Robin than him, but hey, at least he's no Stephanie Brown. "


Well thats your opinion I don't get why haters like you even  bother coming around here.Besides no one would give a damn about John Stewart or know who he is if it wasn't for the Justice League cartoon and John Stewart couldn't lick the boots of Hal Jordan or Alan Scott. Kyle Rayner is way more interesting than John Stewart so slow your role buddy and stop drinking the Jason Todd hatarade because Under The Hood was a sell out story and when he gets his own series  by Judd Winick which is something John Stewart will probally never get again he'll show 40 year old haters like you that still hold grudges against something that happen over 20 years ago what he can do when written correctly.So lay off pal,but at least John Stewart is more intersting than Guy Gardner........wait a minute Guy Gardner has own series now
#42 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio


 
#43 Posted by Jor-el Zod (136 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134:
i think you really can't compare the two. john is smart and serius while guy is impulsive and fearless. i like them both.
#44 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@Jor-el Zod said:
" @daredevil21134: i think you really can't compare the two. john is smart and serius while guy is impulsive and fearless. i like them both. "

i do too but its not fair for him to diss Jason Todd like that in his own fourm when John Stewart isn't exactly Superman among Green Lanterns
#45 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134:
EPIC OWNAGE
#46 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis said:
"@daredevil21134: EPIC OWNAGE "

Thanks Brother
#47 Posted by saiyan_earthling (5445 posts) - - Show Bio
@daredevil21134 said:
" @entropy_aegis said:
"@daredevil21134: EPIC OWNAGE "
Thanks Brother "
#48 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio

lol
#49 Posted by entropy_aegis (15319 posts) - - Show Bio

So i just made my own take on the lost days and how the last issue should have been written.well here goes,jason kills all those russians and goes after joker(he doesnt need some idiot to tell him to) jason thinks he has learned all he has to learn and goes to gotham without telling talia,he finds batman beating the $hit out of joker( same scene where bruce thinks joker kills tommy) ,jason becomes excited thinking bruce will finally do it only to be disappointed,he notices an assailant(two-face) and follows him,and meets hush ,jason then offers him his help and hush accepts it(dialouge would be different i'll come up with it later).after the graveyard scene jason leaves gotham again,talia would know nothing regarding the events that happened(this is to prevent contradiction afterall talia kissed bruce there and would later sell lexcorp property to him ,makes no sense as to why she would help hush and jason meet together)jason later meets talia and she tells him that batman killed ra's al ghul,jason asks how and why,talia replies that her sister nyssa raatko told her(nyssa manipulated talia in death and maidens ,ra's al ghul did actually die there but by nyssas hands not bruces but we could easily believe that nyssa tricked talia in to thinking like that) ,then we all know what happens.later talia gives jason a weapons company(there is no reason to throw in kord industries,jason uses guns and grenades any company could have given him that) after that jason thanks talia,but tells her to stay away from him as he wants to become his own man ,talia agrees(this is to prevent the secret society contradiction and also tells us why they are no longer in contact) so what do you guys think?
#50 Posted by daredevil21134 (11828 posts) - - Show Bio

interesting

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