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    Hope Summers

    Character » Hope Summers appears in 1423 issues.

    The first mutant born after M-Day, Hope Summers is believed to either be the mutant messiah or the harbinger of death for humanity. She is an Omega-level mutant power manipulator and possesses a connection to the Phoenix Force.

    Hope's Relationship to Wolverine?

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    Amegashita

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    #1  Edited By Amegashita

      Okay, just finished reading Wolverine Origins #50 and if you've read it then you know that at the end there is a dialogue between Logan and Hope.  Now you could go and take a lot from it but I would like to hear what other people think about that dialogue.   How does it add light to these two's relationship, a relationship that before I don't remember having that much of a reason to elaborate before now.
     
      Is it like a mentor kind of thing?  Or maybe something different. 

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    Rosebunse

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    #2  Edited By Rosebunse

    How many girls does Wolverine have to be a mentor to? Like, there's Laura, Armor, Kitty, Rogue, Rachel Summers, and Jubilee. I mean, I'm not going to go into the "Logan's a horrible father" rant, because I think we can all agree that Daken is beyound help at this point and Laura...well, ok, but let's just leave the relatioship alone.
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    Joeybagad0nutz

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    #4  Edited By Joeybagad0nutz

    What happened? Last thing I remember Wolverine seemed to hate her because Nightcrawler died.
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    Amegashita

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    #5  Edited By Amegashita
    @JoeRiccadonna:  At the end of Wolverine Orgins 50 they have a sort of "Moment" and Hope brings up the thought that she believed he could understand what she was going through and they end up having a conversation about the future and being afraid of it or not being afraid of it.  Won't go into details but it made me think a little.   I'd say they came to some sort of understanding of each other.
     
    @Rosebunse:  I doubt he'll be a mentor to Hope, it's possible.  I think he'll be more of a person to talk to when the going gets tough.  For Hope, it's obviously Cyclops that's going to be her mentor and father figure.
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    iLLituracy

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    #6  Edited By iLLituracy
    @Rosebunse said:
    " How many girls does Wolverine have to be a mentor to? Like, there's Laura, Armor, Kitty, Rogue, Rachel Summers, and Jubilee. I mean, I'm not going to go into the "Logan's a horrible father" rant, because I think we can all agree that Daken is beyound help at this point and Laura...well, ok, but let's just leave the relatioship alone. "
    You missed Amiko, the daughter he's constantly neglecting who lives in Japan and Erista, the son that he had in the Savage Land that I'm not even sure he knows about. 
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    Amegashita

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    #7  Edited By Amegashita
    @iLLituracy:  Let's not start this whole "Wolverine is a horrible father" discussion.
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    iLLituracy

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    #8  Edited By iLLituracy
    @Amegashita said:
    " @iLLituracy:  Let's not start this whole "Wolverine is a horrible father" discussion. "
    There is no discussion, Wolverine is a horrible father. What's there to discuss?  
     
    Being a mentor to another kid isn't a direction that should be taken when he hasn't cared for his own and seems too busy to keep track of those he was previously close with. The only ones that I can honestly excuse and/or understand is Rogue, Kitty and Rachel. Jubilee herself was upset that Wolverine seemed to drop her, he pushed Laura away from Utopia before even really rectifying where they stood and what he and Cyclops put her through with X-Force after using her as a weapon at their disposal. Armor he doesn't seem all that close to or much of a mentor to, they have a relationship, more of one than I think anyone else on the Astonishing squad has with her, but I don't think they're all that close. 
     
    I rather their relationship stay at whatever they're at now, I liked how he resented her for Nightcrawler's death and I don't mind if he's over it, but I don't think they should really get any closer. 
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    Amegashita

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    #9  Edited By Amegashita
    @iLLituracy:  Like I said its a discussion.  A discussion I, for one, have no intention of joining in.  You're allowed to believe Wolverine is a horrible father and you're allowed to see things in that light, but it's a discussion none the less.  One that me and you are not going to have, and one I'd rather avoid.  Not because I rebuke debates but because me and you see things totally differently and because of that we probably won't budge no matter what we were to show each other.  
     
      I made this topic because I wanted to get some outside insight on how other people saw the dialogue at the end of Wolverine Origins 50.  Have you read it, if so, let's discuss that, =P.
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    iLLituracy

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    #10  Edited By iLLituracy
    @Amegashita said:
    " @iLLituracy:  Like I said its a discussion.  A discussion I, for one, have no intention of joining in.  You're allowed to believe Wolverine is a horrible father and you're allowed to see things in that light, but it's a discussion none the less.  One that me and you are not going to have, and one I'd rather avoid.  Not because I rebuke debates but because me and you see things totally differently and because of that we probably won't budge no matter what we were to show each other.      I made this topic because I wanted to get some outside insight on how other people saw the dialogue at the end of Wolverine Origins 50.  Have you read it, if so, let's discuss that, =P. "
    That's cool, I could be wrong and I respect that you don't want to get into whatever discussion, I wasn't pressing any sort of discussion, I just believe based on what's shown or lack thereof that there wouldn't need to be one.
     
    As for your question; yes, I did read Wolverine Origins #50, and like I said in the main topic of my previous post, I would rather their relationship stay where it's at. 
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    Amegashita

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    #11  Edited By Amegashita
    @iLLituracy:  I just don't like debating character's personalities.  It's so up for debate, it's easier debating powers than personality cause it comes off differently for different people.  There is no one true answer so I try to avoid those debates.
     
      Back on topic though, isn't it strange for the Messiah of mutants to be hated by one of her mutants?  Ignore that whole religious undertone that you could so easily answer with.
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    iLLituracy

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    #12  Edited By iLLituracy
    @Amegashita said:
    " @iLLituracy:  I just don't like debating character's personalities.  It's so up for debate, it's easier debating powers than personality cause it comes off differently for different people.  There is no one true answer so I try to avoid those debates.    Back on topic though, isn't it strange for the Messiah of mutants to be hated by one of her mutants?  Ignore that whole religious undertone that you could so easily answer with. "
    There's a good amount of mutants that don't favor Hope for a number of reasons. Whether it be out of expectation, the death of someone close to them due to her arrival or out of personal affliction suffered. It's one of the reasons why Hope is uncomfortable on Utopia, I think it wasn't until recent that that resentment toward her is starting to be dispelled.
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    Amegashita

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    #13  Edited By Amegashita
    @iLLituracy:  Yeah but those are a bunch of no name mutants.  In pure terms of gaining trust, she can just have the trust of the more experienced X-Men on Utopia and the others will fall.  Wolverine is one of them, and there aren't a lot of those no name mutants that would dare stand up to someone like Wolverine.  I did like the whole conversation because it gave insight on the similarities between the two of them though the art did suck quite badly.  Also since this is a different Wolverine than in the past, this is a Wolverine who, suppossedly, is no longer running.  Isn't that the perfect person to help Hope along the way, not mentor, just help.
     
      I mean she's been running all her life.  Wolverine has too, but he let go of that thought processing and now he's a new man... I hope...
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    iLLituracy

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    #14  Edited By iLLituracy
    @Amegashita said:
    " @iLLituracy:  Yeah but those are a bunch of no name mutants.  In pure terms of gaining trust, she can just have the trust of the more experienced X-Men on Utopia and the others will fall.  Wolverine is one of them, and there aren't a lot of those no name mutants that would dare stand up to someone like Wolverine.  I did like the whole conversation because it gave insight on the similarities between the two of them though the art did suck quite badly.  Also since this is a different Wolverine than in the past, this is a Wolverine who, suppossedly, is no longer running.  Isn't that the perfect person to help Hope along the way, not mentor, just help.
     
      I mean she's been running all her life.  Wolverine has too, but he let go of that thought processing and now he's a new man... I hope... "
    I think there's a dozen of X-Men or more that she could identify with before Wolverine. While, yes, they have similarities that were clearly drawn between one another in issue 50, I think there's a point where you just have to cut back on your usage of Wolverine. 
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    Amegashita

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    #15  Edited By Amegashita
    @iLLituracy:  Yeah it can seem superficial when Wolverine is all over the place but it is an interesting dynamic at the very least.
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    iLLituracy

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    #16  Edited By iLLituracy
    @Amegashita said:
    " @iLLituracy:  Yeah it can seem superficial when Wolverine is all over the place but it is an interesting dynamic at the very least. "
    Granted, but it's not just Wolverine being everywhere that becomes a problem, it's Wolverine being everyone's friend at the same time. Wolverine isn't a nurturing person by nature, IMO. He's not someone that should come off pleasing or accommodating, I think. 
     
    I think it was Joss Whedon who said it best, the less dialog that Wolverine has, the less presence he has [though he has his presence that is clear], the more the character pops. Primarily, that's why I hope their relationship progresses no further than what it is right now. 
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    Amegashita

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    #17  Edited By Amegashita
    @iLLituracy:  That's true too, but with how popular Wolverine is he probably won't be getting that role he once had so long ago anytime soon.
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    lorex

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    #18  Edited By lorex

    I for one am hopeful that for once Wolverine will not play mentor to the poor little girl the X-Men now have in their midst. As for her relationship with Logan, I think it should be no different than the other 
    younger X-Men. She should listen to what they have to say , try to learn from their experience but don't pattern herself after him. I am fairly certain she will pattern herself after Cable more than anyone else.

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