Hercules Strength

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#51 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

Marvel's Strongest

  1. Hulk - Marvel's official Strongest One there is.  Gets stronger as he angers.  Baseline strength below Hercules.
  2. HERCULES - Baseline strength higher than everyone.  Though not official; should be able to increase strength to any level he desires... He's the God of Strength.
  3. Gladiator - Marvel's Mon-el.  Physically  Rips planets apart.  Strength tied to confidence a weakness.
  4. Thor - In terms of total power Thor would top this list, but in pure physical strength he's lower than Herc yet still near the top. 
  5. Hyperion - Marvel's Superman.  He's never been given  the credit he deserves.  If powered-up like King Hyperion he'd easily rank above Gladiator
  6. Sentry - The power of a billion exploding suns.  Good line.  Lots of strength.  Still, he's just another Superman rip-off. 
  7. Gilgamesh - Mightiest of the Eternals.  Has matched-up well with both Hercules and Thor.
  8. Silver Surfer - Using every iota of his power cosmic to enhance his strength would put him at the lower end of  this utmost  echelon of strength.
#52 Posted by seekquaze (617 posts) - - Show Bio
@PowerHerc said:
"

Marvel's Strongest

  1. Hulk - Marvel's official Strongest One there is.  Gets stronger as he angers.  Baseline strength below Hercules.
  2. HERCULES - Baseline strength higher than everyone.  Though not official; should be able to increase strength to any level he desires... He's the God of Strength.
  3. Gladiator - Marvel's Mon-el.  Physically  Rips planets apart.  Strength tied to confidence a weakness.
  4. Thor - In terms of total power Thor would top this list, but in pure physical strength he's lower than Herc yet still near the top. 
  5. Hyperion - Marvel's Superman.  He's never been given  the credit he deserves.  If powered-up like King Hyperion he'd easily rank above Gladiator
  6. Sentry - The power of a billion exploding suns.  Good line.  Lots of strength.  Still, he's just another Superman rip-off. 
  7. Gilgamesh - Mightiest of the Eternals.  Has matched-up well with both Hercules and Thor.
  8. Silver Surfer - Using every iota of his power cosmic to enhance his strength would put him at the lower end of  this utmost  echelon of strength.
"
Just a few thoughts on your list...
 
1. Hulk's strength is debatable as to whether or not it it truly limitless.  99/100 he tops off at Hercules's level with occassional bursts of strength above that.  Joe Fixit even one time admitted the demon lord Mephisto had a strength level even the Savage Hulk could never reach if given months.   Even WWH did not display a huge strength level above past Hulks.  About the only Hulks that have constantly shown something huge above that are ones augmented by an outside energy source.
 
2.  I don't know where this thought of Hercules as the "god of strength" got started.  As far as I know in neither myth or comics has he been called that.   It is true that he is most famous for his strength, but it has never been his title because his strength while not measured is limited.
 
3.  Gladiator at his peak is as strong as Hercules, but suffers Jobber Syndrome at times.
 
4.  Thor is as strong as Hercules.  Every contest between the two even in arm wrestling has been dead even.  Some fans like to claim Hercules is a "tad" stronger, but nothing in the comics indicates this.  The only thing Hercules is better at is in pure unarmed combat he is a tiny bit better due to being the greatest wrestler ever.
 
6.  Your right about Sentry.  His powers fluctuate too much.  On average or even on some of his higher showings it is something Herc could match.
 
9.  Gilgamesh is usually thought of as strong as Hercules or at least very close.
 
8.  Silver Surfer relies on so many other powers he usually has to be desperate to resort to brute strength.
#53 Posted by kore (373 posts) - - Show Bio
@seekquaze said:
" @PowerHerc said:
"

Marvel's Strongest

  1. Hulk - Marvel's official Strongest One there is.  Gets stronger as he angers.  Baseline strength below Hercules.
  2. HERCULES - Baseline strength higher than everyone.  Though not official; should be able to increase strength to any level he desires... He's the God of Strength.
  3. Gladiator - Marvel's Mon-el.  Physically  Rips planets apart.  Strength tied to confidence a weakness.
  4. Thor - In terms of total power Thor would top this list, but in pure physical strength he's lower than Herc yet still near the top. 
  5. Hyperion - Marvel's Superman.  He's never been given  the credit he deserves.  If powered-up like King Hyperion he'd easily rank above Gladiator
  6. Sentry - The power of a billion exploding suns.  Good line.  Lots of strength.  Still, he's just another Superman rip-off. 
  7. Gilgamesh - Mightiest of the Eternals.  Has matched-up well with both Hercules and Thor.
  8. Silver Surfer - Using every iota of his power cosmic to enhance his strength would put him at the lower end of  this utmost  echelon of strength.
"
Just a few thoughts on your list...  1. Hulk's strength is debatable as to whether or not it it truly limitless.  99/100 he tops off at Hercules's level with occassional bursts of strength above that.  Joe Fixit even one time admitted the demon lord Mephisto had a strength level even the Savage Hulk could never reach if given months.   Even WWH did not display a huge strength level above past Hulks.  About the only Hulks that have constantly shown something huge above that are ones augmented by an outside energy source.  2.  I don't know where this thought of Hercules as the "god of strength" got started.  As far as I know in neither myth or comics has he been called that.   It is true that he is most famous for his strength, but it has never been his title because his strength while not measured is limited.   3.  Gladiator at his peak is as strong as Hercules, but suffers Jobber Syndrome at times.  4.  Thor is as strong as Hercules.  Every contest between the two even in arm wrestling has been dead even.  Some fans like to claim Hercules is a "tad" stronger, but nothing in the comics indicates this.  The only thing Hercules is better at is in pure unarmed combat he is a tiny bit better due to being the greatest wrestler ever.  6.  Your right about Sentry.  His powers fluctuate too much.  On average or even on some of his higher showings it is something Herc could match.  9.  Gilgamesh is usually thought of as strong as Hercules or at least very close.  8.  Silver Surfer relies on so many other powers he usually has to be desperate to resort to brute strength. "
As seen in Guardians of the Galaxy during Rancor's origin, Gladiator can snap adamntium.
#54 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio
@seekquaze:
Hercules was considered the God of Strength and Labor by the Romans before they embraced Christianity.  This information can be found in several books about classical mythology.  Marvel has listed " God of Strength" as one of  Hercules's occupations in the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe: Avengers 2005, the current hardcover edtion Vol. #5 and as part of Herc's official bio entry at Marvel .com. 
 
Marvel has also stated Herc's strength was greater than Thor's in the very first OHOTMU in 1983 which stated Hercules could lift 100 tons and  Thor could lift 95.  The later (1990 or 1991) Master Edition 
OHOTMU rated Herc's strength as "Incalcuable - able to lift over 100 tons"  (the highest class) and rated Thor as being "Class 100 - able to lift between 90 and 100 tons (the second highest class). 
 
The Marvel Superheroes - Avengers Roster Book TSR 1998 listed the strength of Hercules as 19B and Thor as 19B with his belt of strength and 17B without it. 
 
The Deluxe Edition OHOTMU '85-'87, The latest handbooks (comic and hardcover), the official website, the new Thor/Hercules Encyclopedia Mythologica, the 1993 Skybox trading cards and the Marvel Universe RPG (2005) all place Herc and Thor in the same strength class, giving neither the advantage. 
 
It has indeed been stated officially  that Hercules is stronger than Thor  several times.  The only time I've ever seen where Thor rated higher than Herc was at classicmarvel.com and that was only using his belt of strength.  Every other definition/categorization of their strength places them at the same level.   
#55 Posted by seekquaze (617 posts) - - Show Bio
@PowerHerc: @PowerHerc said:
" @seekquaze: Hercules was considered the God of Strength and Labor by the Romans before they embraced Christianity.  This information can be found in several books about classical mythology.  Marvel has listed " God of Strength" as one of  Hercules's occupations in the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe: Avengers 2005, the current hardcover edtion Vol. #5 and as part of Herc's official bio entry at Marvel .com.  Marvel has also stated Herc's strength was greater than Thor's in the very first OHOTMU in 1983 which stated Hercules could lift 100 tons and  Thor could lift 95.  The later (1990 or 1991) Master Edition OHOTMU rated Herc's strength as "Incalcuable - able to lift over 100 tons"  (the highest class) and rated Thor as being "Class 100 - able to lift between 90 and 100 tons (the second highest class).  The Marvel Superheroes - Avengers Roster Book TSR 1998 listed the strength of Hercules as 19B and Thor as 19B with his belt of strength and 17B without it.  The Deluxe Edition OHOTMU '85-'87, The latest handbooks (comic and hardcover), the official website, the new Thor/Hercules Encyclopedia Mythologica, the 1993 Skybox trading cards and the Marvel Universe RPG (2005) all place Herc and Thor in the same strength class, giving neither the advantage.  It has indeed been stated officially  that Hercules is stronger than Thor  several times.  The only time I've ever seen where Thor rated higher than Herc was at classicmarvel.com and that was only using his belt of strength.  Every other definition/categorization of their strength places them at the same level.    "

I've read several mythologial books and not all of them talk about Hercules as a god of strength, but considering the Romans worshipped Herules as several things that is easy to see and not something I see worth quibbling about.  Herc was seen as someone who would help the common man and was praye to in things such that.
 
What is shown in the comics overrides the handbooks.  And the handbooks have been known to be widely inaccurate at times.  In the past some of them have listed Hyperion as only Class 75 when in the comics time and again he has shown top-tier strength.  The official Marvel website I have found to be highly inaccurate on many things.  Every time the two have clashed in the comics it has been equal.  They even had an arm wrestling contest where it was equal. Thor even matched an enraged Hulk in a test of strength for an hour.  There is really nothing to indicated in the comics that Thor should be below Hercules,  Hulk, Gladiator, or any others like that.  Using the belt of strength should place his strength as higher than Herc's sense they start out even or at least so close there is no noticable difference.  Based on what you have said the more recent sources are correct in rating them equal in strength.  
 
I was never questioning that Hercules was a strong as Thor.  I was answering the claim that Hercules was stronger when based on what I've read in the comics is not true.  Even you have stated in several official sources the two are quoted as being equal.
#56 Posted by why so serious (1388 posts) - - Show Bio

Didn't hercules hold up the sky or something?

#57 Edited by Bor (734 posts) - - Show Bio
@Theracles said:

" POHOCOM said:

"

In Marvel, characters generally do not often defy the rules of physics like DC characters do, so strength is displayed in other ways. Herc is probably among the top four strongest beings currently walking the Earth in Marvel. Only Juggernaut, Hulk, Thor and Sentry have a chance of possibly surpassing him in strength.

"
Not really, Juggernaut can't surpass him, Juggernaut can lift 90 tons. "
Are you joking ? 
Normal level of power Jugg is easily physicaly stronger than Thor and is at least as strong as extremely enraged Hulk - atm extremely enraged WWH.
 
90 tons - good joke ^^
#58 Posted by the darknessss (2750 posts) - - Show Bio

wtf doesnt marvel just fight all these bozos at once and end it!!!,,,,,heck of a comic if they got round to it!! :-)
#59 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio
@the darknessss:
Yeah, that would be one bad-ass free-for-all.  Getting all these bricks together for a last man standing cage match would be the best all-out battle of the bricks since Marvel-Two-In -One Annual # 7 back in the early '80s.  Ironically, this still would'nt prove which hero is strictly the physically strongest.  To do that the story might have to have the bricks compete in  an amped to the max version of a strongman competition similar to the ones on ESPN where athletes from all over the world come together and compete in multiple strength/power events to determine who the World's Strongest Man is.  Hmm, a contest to determine who the strongest superhero in the MU is . . . . . I wonder if it would sell?  HAH ! ! !   Of course it would sell!  All of us fans who've been trying to figure out and debate who the strongest hero in the MU is would eat that shit up!   Hey Marvel, make it happen!
#60 Edited by thestarguy (353 posts) - - Show Bio
@PowerHerc said:

" @Push:        Here are Marvel's Strongest Characters                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             Hulk - he is Marvel's premiere strongman.  Potential unlimited.  Base strength lower than Hercules. 
 HERCULES  - God of Strength.  Though it's not official, he should be able to achieve any level of strength he desires as he desires.  God of Strength!  
Gladiator - Marvel's Mon-el.  Rips planets apart.  
Thor - Slightly below Hercules in baseline strength;  he lifts part of the midgard serpent - Herc lifts the entirety of the heavens themselves (and for a much longer time). 
Hyperion - Created as a Superman rip-off enemy of Thor but has never really been given his due (except maybe the King Hyperion version). Should be right behind Herc. 
Sentry - Power of a billion exploding suns.  Impressive.  Still, he's just another Superman rip-off and not even a very good one. 
Gilgamesh - Lame character overall but is the strongest by far of the Eternals and has shown strength nearly equal to Thor but still below Herc. 
Silver Surfer - By using every iota of his Power Cosmic to augment his strength he could bring himself up to the bottom of the upper echelon of  Marvel's strongest.        "

Unofficially, I pretty much agree with this assessment!  I'm comfortable with Gladiator's power level mainly because 98% of the time he is off-Earth, so he is a non-factor in the strength debates.  At some point in the future Herc needs to face Champion, also just to solidify his standings.
#61 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio
@thestarguy:
I agree 100%.  If written correctly, it could be a really good and highly entertaining old-school comic book slug-fest!  Just pure fighting action.  I, of course, would like to see a close battle with Herc winning.  I think Hercules winning would definately solidify his standing as one of Marvel's top of the upper echelon strength characters as well as add to his recently recognized fighting skill.  Also, this would give the Champion a good showing (even though he would be humbled by the mightiest of all) which he is in dire need of since what happened to him in a relatively recent She-Hulk story-arc (it was truly awful considering how the Champion had previously been depicted in battle against Marvel's heavy-hitters). 
#62 Posted by Detroit101 (150 posts) - - Show Bio

Hercules, being the the god of strength, should have the best feats in my opinion............

#63 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@Detroit101 said:

Hercules, being the the god of strength, should have the best feats in my opinion............

This is sound logic.^

#64 Edited by Goji64 (41 posts) - - Show Bio
#65 Posted by seekquaze (617 posts) - - Show Bio

@Goji64:

That video does not prove Hercules to be stronger than Thor. I am familiar with the maker of those videos and while some are fair many are highly biased with at times selective editing.

In the fight in question Hercules got a bit of an advantage over Thor. Given how close it was in the same circumstances it could have gone the other way. In the straight strength comparisons between the two they have always been equal.

#66 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@Goji64: I wouldn't necessarily say the video proves Hercules is stronger than Thor but I do agree that he is.

#67 Posted by seekquaze (617 posts) - - Show Bio

@PowerHerc said:

@Goji64: I wouldn't necessarily say the video proves Hercules is stronger than Thor but I do agree that he is.

As much as I like Hercules that is one thing I cannot agree with. They have always been shown as equals. I don't have a problem with Hercules being considered slightly better in h2h, but to me nothing indicates Hercules is stronger. IIRC, you stated the only real evidence of that is in one handbook Hercules was rated stronger, but in most or all others they have been rated as equals.

#68 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@seekquaze said:

@PowerHerc said:

@Goji64: I wouldn't necessarily say the video proves Hercules is stronger than Thor but I do agree that he is.

As much as I like Hercules that is one thing I cannot agree with. They have always been shown as equals. I don't have a problem with Hercules being considered slightly better in h2h, but to me nothing indicates Hercules is stronger. IIRC, you stated the only real evidence of that is in one handbook Hercules was rated stronger, but in most or all others they have been rated as equals.

I remember having this discussion before and I know how you feel. Still, guess I'll say it again, it is in two separate editions of the "Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe" (1983 and 1991) where the strength of Hercules is rated higher than the strength of Thor. Hercules and Thor are rated the same in all the other Handbooks.

So, Hercules is officially rated/ranked higher than Thor twice but Thor is never rated/ranked higher than Hercules. Both have comparable strength feats and it has been stated that they are equal in strength, but I give Hercules an edge due to what I consider greater feats and to the fact that Marvel (the publisher who owns and publishes both characters) has officially stated Hercules is stronger two times. I don't expect everyone to agree but i consider my position is reasonable.

#69 Posted by SandMan_ (4528 posts) - - Show Bio
@PowerHerc: Just as strong as Supes? After all, Supes is a clone of Hercules...
#70 Posted by seekquaze (617 posts) - - Show Bio

@SandMan_: Which version of Supes? IIRC, DC Hercules in one story was shown about as strong a modern Superman, but not as strong as hte Kingdom Come Superman due to the latter spending years not using his powers, but soaking up solar rays. Assuming Marvel Hercules to be about as strong as DC Hercules it could easily vary. Even placing Marvel Hercules as stronger the implication in some stories is Superman's strenght is potentially infinite depending on how long he has to store up solar energy.

#71 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@SandMan_:

Superman's (a character partially based on Hercules from classical mythology) strength has arguably varied due to reboots but generally speaking it's my opinion that Superman is the strongest of all superheroes, thus he's stronger than Marvel's Hercules.

#72 Posted by majestic99 (8637 posts) - - Show Bio

@why so serious said:

Didn't hercules hold up the sky or something?

Heavens.

#73 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

Hercules' strength is Awesome!

Hercules pulling Manhattan
Hercules lifts & throws Godzilla
Hercules holding Manhattan together
Hercules - Lifting Manhattan
#74 Posted by SpectroRaphael (160 posts) - - Show Bio

And that's where the problem of writers choosing whom they see fit to be strongest comes in. Based on strength, Hercules should be the obvious choice for Marvel's strongest. They never actually shown him beating Thor because Thor is more popular, and don't get me started on the problem of choosing a monster from a science experiment gone wrong as being stronger than gods.

#75 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@SpectroRaphael said:

And that's where the problem of writers choosing whom they see fit to be strongest comes in. Based on strength, Hercules should be the obvious choice for Marvel's strongest. They never actually shown him beating Thor because Thor is more popular, and don't get me started on the problem of choosing a monster from a science experiment gone wrong as being stronger than gods.

I agree on all points.

#76 Posted by Wolfrazer (7196 posts) - - Show Bio

Thats another thing that bothers me. Hercules is a GOD, so his strength should be beyond mortals and isn't he the strongest of all the gods except for Zeus? I mean I know Marvel has Hulk as their strength poster boy.....but they overlook the evidence right infront of them. 
 
Besides, what is the point in being the GOD of STRENGTH if you can be rivaled by mortals?

Online
#77 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@Wolfrazer said:

Thats another thing that bothers me. Hercules is a GOD, so his strength should be beyond mortals and isn't he the strongest of all the gods except for Zeus? I mean I know Marvel has Hulk as their strength poster boy.....but they overlook the evidence right infront of them. Besides, what is the point in being the GOD of STRENGTH if you can be rivaled by mortals?

I agree but I think it would be okay for Hercules' strength to be rivaled/approached by a select few characters (Hulk, Thor, Hyperion, Juggernaut, Gladiator, Sentry) as long as it's never equaled or surpassed.

#78 Posted by Wolfrazer (7196 posts) - - Show Bio
@PowerHerc said:

@Wolfrazer said:

Thats another thing that bothers me. Hercules is a GOD, so his strength should be beyond mortals and isn't he the strongest of all the gods except for Zeus? I mean I know Marvel has Hulk as their strength poster boy.....but they overlook the evidence right infront of them. Besides, what is the point in being the GOD of STRENGTH if you can be rivaled by mortals?

I agree but I think it would be okay for Hercules' strength to be rivaled/approached by a select few characters (Hulk, Thor, Hyperion, Juggernaut, Gladiator, Sentry) as long as it's never equaled or surpassed.

Well now that I would be ok with.
Online
#79 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@Wolfrazer said:

@PowerHerc said:

@Wolfrazer said:

Thats another thing that bothers me. Hercules is a GOD, so his strength should be beyond mortals and isn't he the strongest of all the gods except for Zeus? I mean I know Marvel has Hulk as their strength poster boy.....but they overlook the evidence right infront of them. Besides, what is the point in being the GOD of STRENGTH if you can be rivaled by mortals?

I agree but I think it would be okay for Hercules' strength to be rivaled/approached by a select few characters (Hulk, Thor, Hyperion, Juggernaut, Gladiator, Sentry) as long as it's never equaled or surpassed.

Well now that I would be ok with.

Cool. I'm glad we agree.

#80 Edited by LeeSensei (385 posts) - - Show Bio

Poweraherc... Was Hercules depowered. In the classic stories he seemed to have strength on a planetary level. In iHerc he didn't. Also, is marvel hercules agod or a demigod? Because in the myths he became a full God, but in the stories he's often called a demigod.

#81 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@LeeSensei:

Interpretations of the many different versions, some closely based & some very loosely based on Hercules from classical mythology, vary. Marvel's version of Hercules was shown, during the "Incredible Hercules" series to be somewhat closely based on the mythological character and has been shown supporting the weight of the heavens/world. This demonstrates that Marvel's Hercules has super-strength on at least a planetary scale. That said, Hercules has, on occasion, been de-powered or had his strength reduced to a level far below that. He was almost completely de-powered during the recent "Herc" series.

Except for these periods of de-powerment Marvel Hercules is a full-fledged god. Full-fledged godhood is his normal/default state of being. Like the Hercules from mythology Marvel Hercules was born a demigod and later made into an actual god by Zeus. Despite this there has been a fair amount of inconsistency when it comes to calling him a god (which is accurate) or a demigod (which is not accurate) in the comics. This is most likely due to writer error and/or editorial oversight.

I hope this answers your questions.

#82 Posted by thestarguy (353 posts) - - Show Bio

@PowerHerc said:

@Wolfrazer said:

@PowerHerc said:

@Wolfrazer said:

Thats another thing that bothers me. Hercules is a GOD, so his strength should be beyond mortals and isn't he the strongest of all the gods except for Zeus? I mean I know Marvel has Hulk as their strength poster boy.....but they overlook the evidence right infront of them. Besides, what is the point in being the GOD of STRENGTH if you can be rivaled by mortals?

I agree but I think it would be okay for Hercules' strength to be rivaled/approached by a select few characters (Hulk, Thor, Hyperion, Juggernaut, Gladiator, Sentry) as long as it's never equaled or surpassed.

Well now that I would be ok with.

Cool. I'm glad we agree.

I'm in full agreement here as well. Herc still needs challenges to overcome. And he still really needs an epic clash against Champion, as it would be great press for both characters

#83 Posted by PowerHerc (85105 posts) - - Show Bio

@thestarguy said:

@PowerHerc said:

@Wolfrazer said:

@PowerHerc said:

@Wolfrazer said:

Thats another thing that bothers me. Hercules is a GOD, so his strength should be beyond mortals and isn't he the strongest of all the gods except for Zeus? I mean I know Marvel has Hulk as their strength poster boy.....but they overlook the evidence right infront of them. Besides, what is the point in being the GOD of STRENGTH if you can be rivaled by mortals?

I agree but I think it would be okay for Hercules' strength to be rivaled/approached by a select few characters (Hulk, Thor, Hyperion, Juggernaut, Gladiator, Sentry) as long as it's never equaled or surpassed.

Well now that I would be ok with.

Cool. I'm glad we agree.

I'm in full agreement here as well. Herc still needs challenges to overcome. And he still really needs an epic clash against Champion, as it would be great press for both characters

Yes!!!

Marvel should capitalize on the exploding MMA popularity and have a tournament where their heroes and villains fight until it comes down to the only two beings in the Marvel Universe who have both mastered hand-to-hand combat and have incalculable super-strength: Hercules vs the Champion!

That would be such a fun fight to see!

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