Pym - cocky!

#1 Posted by thatlad (594 posts) - - Show Bio

Just read latest hulk and I'm pissed off, who the hell if Pym? Bouncing round shouting out "i'm scientist supreme!!" like that means something in marvel continuity?!? Next week he could end up being ant-supreme for all I care. Seriously what has he done (in comparison to the the intelligensia's top 8) to qualify him as top dog?  
 
If it wasn't for some gamma radiation banner would wipe his arse with him, if it wasn't for constant doom/galactus attacks reed would blow his nose with him.  
 
In my opinion Pym doesn't deserve to be scientist supreme and is getting was too cocky. 
 
Discuss!

#2 Posted by War Killer (20257 posts) - - Show Bio

Have you read Mighty Avengers by chance?

#3 Posted by rein (1330 posts) - - Show Bio

I believe eternity gave Pym the title of scientist supreme. which is why it would be a big deal (not sure about this, I read it on the site somewhere)

#4 Posted by KingLoki (390 posts) - - Show Bio

Pym=Awesome

#5 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio
@rein said:
" I believe eternity gave Pym the title of scientist supreme. which is why it would be a big deal (not sure about this, I read it on the site somewhere) "
correct
 
@thatlad said:
Seriously what has he done (in comparison to the the intelligensia's top 8) to qualify him as top dog?

As much as both fans and writers prefer to ignore it for the title of "Wifebeater".....Ancient history? he was a founding avenger, he discovered Pym particles and through his inventions made it possible to change his size, something that according to the basic laws of physics is impossible, he created artificial intelligence and is considered the world's greatest biologists.
 
New history? He outsmarted Reed Richards, he has created micro universes, Amadeus Cho who is stated as the seventh smartest man on the planet accepts that Pym is smarter than him, he has created portals to everywhere in the world, he is the leader of the real avengers, most importantly he was named the Scientist supreme by Eternity. When Strange was the sorcerer supreme did anyone question his position as one if not the greatest sorcerer in the marvel universe? same applies here
#6 Posted by lostlantern13 (860 posts) - - Show Bio

Not only did he receive the title "Scientist Supreme," but it's good characterization. Intelligence breeds arrogance...the brains compete...of course he's gonna tell all of these other geniuses that he's the SS. I thought it was great.

#7 Posted by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio
@lostlantern13 said:
"

Not only did he receive the title "Scientist Supreme," but it's good characterization. Intelligence breeds arrogance...the brains compete...of course he's gonna tell all of these other geniuses that he's the SS. I thought it was great.

"
this answers my favorite. he is absolutely cocky, and  he does in fact have the showings to back that up.
 
@thatlad said:
" Seriously what has he done (in comparison to the the intelligensia's top 8) to qualify him as top dog? "
well, aside from being one of the top 8 smartest men on Earth , and one of the Intelligencia's prime targets
(because they deduced that theyre plans would not go through if they didnt get him out of the way, which is points
to his credit) invented the Avengers Infinite Mansion, took down an Elder God using pure mental acumen, revived
the good name of the Avengers, as well as the Unspoken, and of course was given the title of Scientist Supreme
by Eternity....and became aware of it because he invented a way to actually grow past the entire Marvel 616 universes
reality and speak to Eternity in person while remaining connected to his regular 616 world at the same time of his
own accord. this was something he invented over the course of a day or two. id say thats a pretty good start right
there.
#8 Posted by brc2000 (1679 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm a big fan of new Pym personally. He's one of the main reasons I look forward to Mighty Avengers. I hope he isn't going to be pushed into the background during the Heroic Age, once MA is cancelled.

#9 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio
@brc2000 said:
" I'm a big fan of new Pym personally. He's one of the main reasons I look forward to Mighty Avengers. I hope he isn't going to be pushed into the background during the Heroic Age, once MA is cancelled. "
agreed
#10 Posted by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio
@brc2000 said:
" I'm a big fan of new Pym personally. He's one of the main reasons I look forward to Mighty Avengers. I hope he isn't going to be pushed into the background during the Heroic Age, once MA is cancelled. "
so in the front of my mind. i looked through the full solicits and dont see his place in there.
i hope the talent is just taking a break and plans to reboot MA in the fashion the rest of the titles
are getting. that would be sad to lose that book to give Bendis's book more spotlight.
#11 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio

Its been said that Hank will be a major player in the Heroic age so we know that he ain't getting away, only question is where will he show up.
 
Personally I would have loved it if Slott would have had Bendis' team and included Hank in it

#12 Posted by AngelFrost (2833 posts) - - Show Bio

 I want Wasp back.   :'(   

#13 Posted by lostlantern13 (860 posts) - - Show Bio
@CATMANEXE said:
" @brc2000 said:
" I'm a big fan of new Pym personally. He's one of the main reasons I look forward to Mighty Avengers. I hope he isn't going to be pushed into the background during the Heroic Age, once MA is cancelled. "
so in the front of my mind. i looked through the full solicits and dont see his place in there. i hope the talent is just taking a break and plans to reboot MA in the fashion the rest of the titles are getting. that would be sad to lose that book to give Bendis's book more spotlight. "

I am hoping that he's in charge of the Secret Avengers. I mean it would make sense with Infinite Avengers Mansion as headquarters. I just know that MA has really made me a Pym-fan.
#14 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio

I think that the leader will turn out to be Steve, considering that its Brubaker's book that would be a no brainer. Wasp would be a good fit for an espionage team and we've seen Brubaker playing with him a little in Reborn but really, I want him to be written by Slott. Even if I'm a way bigger fan of Brubaker's work

#15 Posted by War Killer (20257 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:

"Its been said that Hank will be a major player in the Heroic age so we know that he ain't getting away, only question is where will he show up.  Personally I would have loved it if Slott would have had Bendis' team and included Hank in it "

I was thinking maybe Hank would be involved in that Avengers Academy, seeing as how Eternity told Pym that he would he would have a big role in the "Age of Heroes" which I'm guessing will be the Heroic Age, I also agree with the Slott's over Bendis comment.
@Nighthunter said:

"I think that the leader will turn out to be Steve, considering that its Brubaker's book that would be a no brainer. Wasp would be a good fit for an espionage team and we've seen Brubaker playing with him a little in Reborn but really, I want him to be written by Slott. Even if I'm a way bigger fan of Brubaker's work "

I keep forgetting Brubaker's writing Secret Avengers, he came to me as a Avengers writer, but I agree after seeing his work with the Avengers in Reborn, his boo kwill be interesting to read.
#16 Posted by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
" I think that the leader will turn out to be Steve, considering that its Brubaker's book that would be a no brainer. Wasp would be a good fit for an espionage team and we've seen Brubaker playing with him a little in Reborn but really, I want him to be written by Slott. Even if I'm a way bigger fan of Brubaker's work "
same here. and im not comfortable having Bendis write him personally.
i also dont want him on a team where he gets overshadowed.
#17 Posted by StrongestOneThereIs (6490 posts) - - Show Bio

Him and Banner are full of themselves these days

#18 Posted by danhimself (22586 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think they're full of themselves at all...I think the writers are finally starting to focus on just how smart these guys are...for years they've been overshadowed by Richards and Stark and it's about time they got the credit that they deserve and they're letting the rest of the MU know it to

#19 Edited by lostlantern13 (860 posts) - - Show Bio
@StrongestOneThereIs said:

"Him and Banner are full of themselves these days "


Smart people usually have some element of arrogance/ego. Look at high schoolers, what's the competition amongst the honors kids? To get the higher GPA. Ivy League schools? To be known as the smartest university. Even in general, how often does anyone like to admit that another person is smarter than them? I think it just fits that these great minds would be the same. 
 
I think it's a good bit of characterization to see that they all think they're the smartest one in the room. Tony Stark, Reed Richards, Bruce Banner, Hank Pym, Doctor Doom, The Leader......it just makes sense to me.
#20 Posted by StrongestOneThereIs (6490 posts) - - Show Bio
@danhimself said:
" I don't think they're full of themselves at all...I think the writers are finally starting to focus on just how smart these guys are...for years they've been overshadowed by Richards and Stark and it's about time they got the credit that they deserve and they're letting the rest of the MU know it to "
They have always been respected 
And the brightest in their fields like McCoy and Stark
But overall intellect in all areas
They fall short compared to Reed, Doom and the Black Panther
#21 Posted by thatlad (594 posts) - - Show Bio
@StrongestOneThereIs said:
" Him and Banner are full of themselves these days "
Hear hear! 
Although to be fair I think Banner deserves a bit of time to enjoy his hulk-less freedom. It's been good seeing Banner show off his brains lately, really putting some focus on how samrt he really is. 
 
I know a lot of people are going to be defensive of Pym given it's in a Pym forum but I'm still not sold on him. Really though I'm not sold on the whole 'scientist supreme' tag either
#22 Posted by Son_of_Magnus (15258 posts) - - Show Bio

Pym is better than Hulk

#23 Posted by thatlad (594 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
 he was a founding avenger,   
 
Does that really matter anymore? There's been that many avenger's teams (and another due to launch) that most characters have been founding members. Yes I know you're going to say it was the first team but I'm still not impressed
#24 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio
@StrongestOneThereIs said:
" @danhimself said:
" I don't think they're full of themselves at all...I think the writers are finally starting to focus on just how smart these guys are...for years they've been overshadowed by Richards and Stark and it's about time they got the credit that they deserve and they're letting the rest of the MU know it to "
They have always been respected  And the brightest in their fields like McCoy and StarkBut overall intellect in all areas They fall short compared to Reed, Doom and the Black Panther "
in what area is Mccoy the best? just curious
 
@thatlad said:
" @StrongestOneThereIs said:
" Him and Banner are full of themselves these days "
Hear hear! Although to be fair I think Banner deserves a bit of time to enjoy his hulk-less freedom. It's been good seeing Banner show off his brains lately, really putting some focus on how samrt he really is.  I know a lot of people are going to be defensive of Pym given it's in a Pym forum but I'm still not sold on him. Really though I'm not sold on the whole 'scientist supreme' tag either "

I buy the justification that Slott gave to Pym getting the title, but since you said that you haven't read Slott's Mighty Avengers run then I guess you may not appreciate it.
 
@thatlad said:
" @Nighthunter said:
 he was a founding avenger,   
 Does that really matter anymore? There's been that many avenger's teams (and another due to launch) that most characters have been founding members. Yes I know you're going to say it was the first team but I'm still not impressed "
Maybe not for you, but for me being one of the founding members of the world's mightiest heroes means something
#25 Posted by thatlad (594 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
in what area is Mccoy the best? just curious
   
I suppose it's in the area of mutant genetics or something 
 
Have they revealed the full list of 8 smartest? It could end up being pretty controversial. Banner already remarked how Amadeus Cho isn't in the list, although he did state it's according to the intelligensia. Maybe that's the point though, they could overlook someone like Cho thinking he's not smart enough but then their arrogance gets the better of them as he (or someone else they overlook) come up with the solution to beat them. 
  
So far there's Doom, T'Challa, Richards, Beast, Pym & Banner. Have I missed anyone out or are they yet to be announced?
#26 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio
@thatlad said:
" @Nighthunter said:
in what area is Mccoy the best? just curious
   
I suppose it's in the area of mutant genetics or something  Have they revealed the full list of 8 smartest? It could end up being pretty controversial. Banner already remarked how Amadeus Cho isn't in the list, although he did state it's according to the intelligensia. Maybe that's the point though, they could overlook someone like Cho thinking he's not smart enough but then their arrogance gets the better of them as he (or someone else they overlook) come up with the solution to beat them.   So far there's Doom, T'Challa, Richards, Beast, Pym & Banner. Have I missed anyone out or are they yet to be announced? "
that would be Sinister, not Mccoy. Or did I miss something?
 
Amadeus CHo has always been stated as #7 so he is there, if I had to make a wild guess I would say.
 
Reed Richards
Doom
Tony Stark
Hank Pym
Bruce Banner
T'challa
Amadeus Cho 
The Leader
#27 Posted by danhimself (22586 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
" @thatlad said:
" @Nighthunter said:
in what area is Mccoy the best? just curious
   
I suppose it's in the area of mutant genetics or something  Have they revealed the full list of 8 smartest? It could end up being pretty controversial. Banner already remarked how Amadeus Cho isn't in the list, although he did state it's according to the intelligensia. Maybe that's the point though, they could overlook someone like Cho thinking he's not smart enough but then their arrogance gets the better of them as he (or someone else they overlook) come up with the solution to beat them.   So far there's Doom, T'Challa, Richards, Beast, Pym & Banner. Have I missed anyone out or are they yet to be announced? "
that would be Sinister, not Mccoy. Or did I miss something?  Amadeus CHo has always been stated as #7 so he is there, if I had to make a wild guess I would say. Reed Richards Doom Tony Stark Hank Pym Bruce Banner T'challa Amadeus Cho  The Leader "
i think they moved Amadeus down to 10
#28 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio

What has Pym done?  Why create a bunch of insane robots of course.
#29 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio
@danhimself said:
" @Nighthunter said:
" @thatlad said:
" @Nighthunter said:
in what area is Mccoy the best? just curious
   
I suppose it's in the area of mutant genetics or something  Have they revealed the full list of 8 smartest? It could end up being pretty controversial. Banner already remarked how Amadeus Cho isn't in the list, although he did state it's according to the intelligensia. Maybe that's the point though, they could overlook someone like Cho thinking he's not smart enough but then their arrogance gets the better of them as he (or someone else they overlook) come up with the solution to beat them.   So far there's Doom, T'Challa, Richards, Beast, Pym & Banner. Have I missed anyone out or are they yet to be announced? "
that would be Sinister, not Mccoy. Or did I miss something?  Amadeus CHo has always been stated as #7 so he is there, if I had to make a wild guess I would say. Reed Richards Doom Tony Stark Hank Pym Bruce Banner T'challa Amadeus Cho  The Leader "
i think they moved Amadeus down to 10 "
When?
#30 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio

which reminds me:
 
Valeria Richards is now smarter than her dad so yup

#31 Posted by danhimself (22586 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
" @danhimself said:
" @Nighthunter said:
" @thatlad said:
" @Nighthunter said:
in what area is Mccoy the best? just curious
   
I suppose it's in the area of mutant genetics or something  Have they revealed the full list of 8 smartest? It could end up being pretty controversial. Banner already remarked how Amadeus Cho isn't in the list, although he did state it's according to the intelligensia. Maybe that's the point though, they could overlook someone like Cho thinking he's not smart enough but then their arrogance gets the better of them as he (or someone else they overlook) come up with the solution to beat them.   So far there's Doom, T'Challa, Richards, Beast, Pym & Banner. Have I missed anyone out or are they yet to be announced? "
that would be Sinister, not Mccoy. Or did I miss something?  Amadeus CHo has always been stated as #7 so he is there, if I had to make a wild guess I would say. Reed Richards Doom Tony Stark Hank Pym Bruce Banner T'challa Amadeus Cho  The Leader "
i think they moved Amadeus down to 10 "
When? "

 Incredible Hulk #607
#32 Posted by Nighthunter (28582 posts) - - Show Bio

Now I'm torn, Pak both plays the cho is the seventh smartest card on Hercules and the 10th smartest on hulk

#33 Posted by iLLituracy (13537 posts) - - Show Bio

Is there an official list as to who the eight smartest people on Earth are?

#34 Edited by danhimself (22586 posts) - - Show Bio
@iLLituracy:  so far it's (in no specific order)
 
Beast
T'Challa
Hank Pym
Dr. Doom
Reed Richards
Bruce Banner
Tony Stark
 
I'm not sure if the last has been revealed
#35 Posted by lostlantern13 (860 posts) - - Show Bio
@danhimself:  
The last one hasn't been revealed yet. It's kinda interesting that there's no female on the list.
#36 Edited by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio

personally i take those lists with a big grain of salt, and i mean big.
like obviously MODOK and Leader are in there. also theyve had Charles Xavier
in that list from time to time. also in X:Men Endangered Species, Beast tries to find
a solution to the M-Day problem by asking for the help of " the top nine supervillian
geniuses " being  Pandemic, M.O.D.O.K., Spiral and Mojo, Sugar Man, Mister Sinister,
the High Evolutionary, Arnim Zola, and Doctor Doom. this still leaves out X-Club, Forge,
Dark Beast, who is considered at least equal to or above Beasts own intelligence,
Mad Thinker, Doctor Octopus, Norman Osborn (who is rated somewhere below Stark)
Curt Conners, Mandarin, Zemo, ect, ect.
 
the 8 smartest people refers to a list of men (specifically) that generally either work together or
at least off of each other to influence the world, not really the 8 smartest. ( 8 Smartest Men should
be made into a team page actually because theres so many references). notably they are all mortal
and male, which seems to be a requirement for this " clubs " roster...
 
in Hulk #20 Leader confirms in no order:

Reed Richards
Victor Von Doom
Tony Stark
 
in Incredible Hulk 601 in no order:

Bruce Banner
Hank Pym
Amadeus Cho
T'Challa
Hank McCoy
 
so the 8 Smartest Men are in no order, except Cho of course

Reed Richards
Victor Von Doom
Tony Stark   
Bruce Banner
Hank Pym
T'Challa
Hank McCoy   
Amadeus Cho
 
-
Incredible Hulk 607:
in referring to Cho being the tenth, Banner is adding MODOK and Leader to the list,
but doing so technically, not officially. 
 
@Nighthunter said:

" Now I'm torn, Pak both plays the cho is the seventh smartest card on Hercules and the 10th smartest on hulk "


Incredible Hercules 137:
actually he was stated as the sixth, having surpassed Master Mind Excello and Pythagoras Dupree.
this was determined false by the end of the issue. That Master Mind Excello in play was a work of fiction.
Pythagoras Dupree as stated not only didnt exist, because he technically made himself non-existent, also
while being a hypermind wasnt near even the 8 smartest people on Earth. he was just lead to believe he was
as was Cho as was a test that had been long put into motion by Athena to push Cho into becoming the new
Prince Of Power in place of Hercules. So Cho still stood as the 8th in that case.
#37 Posted by thatlad (594 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
" @danhimself said: 
i think they moved Amadeus down to 10 "
When? "
I think they're putting it across as the list is according to the intelligensia, so it's who they think are the top 8. As I said earlier that's probably going to be the point, they get undone by someone like Cho as they underestimate him. Typical arrogant villains haha 
 
 
Should be interesting 
 
PS even though I'm not a major fan of Pym, I'd say get Incredible Hulk 607 if you are a fan. He get's plenty of time in it and the art is boss (aside from JRJR's cover)
#38 Posted by DEGRAAF (7887 posts) - - Show Bio
@CATMANEXE:
not disagreeing with you on who the 8 smartest are but there is no proof that Banner is adding Leader and MODOK to the list is there?
#39 Posted by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio
@DEGRAAF: 
true to that. its more of an assumption or maybe on m part basing it on who the 
other " geniuses " in play in the book in question where. with what i said earlier,
it could be a number of people since really the " 8 " or " 10 " doesnt represent the
actual smartest people persay, its just a grouping that has relation to each other 
and particular events. i wouldnt for example say Tony Stark is actually smarter
than Mr.Sinister or the High Evolutionary...
#40 Posted by DEGRAAF (7887 posts) - - Show Bio
@CATMANEXE:
yea i think they need to create a 10 smartest heroes and 10 smartest villains page. 
You know everyone will take this list the intelligencia has made and use it as the official 8 smartest people in Marvel
#41 Posted by Zoom (14668 posts) - - Show Bio

Lol at Banner telling Cho that he's really the 10th smartest person. 
 
I like punny Banner so much more than Hulk.
#42 Posted by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio
@Zoom: 
lol. this right here...

#43 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4165 posts) - - Show Bio

I actually have a new found respect for Pym. After flipping through the newest Mighty Avengers when he fooled Osborn to believe he already used the cosmic cube.. that was great. Its about time they use his insanity against him.

#44 Posted by Walker696 (984 posts) - - Show Bio
@DEGRAAF: on the 616 earth not marvel in general though. I mainly think this list is for all around intelligence because in some aspects they each are better then the other and at the same time there are people who surpass them in varies ways, my main point keep in mind that Dr. Doom is the only well known magic user on this list and you have to remember magic is an ex factor, a person can learn everything it took you years to learn in a matter of seconds. So I feel this not only applies to just basic smarts, there is book smarts, common sense smarts, and street smarts adding to the equation as well. I think they are the top 8 because they have proven themselves in a number of ways. Anyway when it comes down to it it doesn't matter how smart you are, its whether you're smart enough to know how to use it right.
#45 Posted by DEGRAAF (7887 posts) - - Show Bio
@Walker696 said:
" @DEGRAAF: on the 616 earth not marvel in general though. I mainly think this list is for all around intelligence because in some aspects they each are better then the other and at the same time there are people who surpass them in varies ways, my main point keep in mind that Dr. Doom is the only well known magic user on this list and you have to remember magic is an ex factor, a person can learn everything it took you years to learn in a matter of seconds. So I feel this not only applies to just basic smarts, there is book smarts, common sense smarts, and street smarts adding to the equation as well. I think they are the top 8 because they have proven themselves in a number of ways. Anyway when it comes down to it it doesn't matter how smart you are, its whether you're smart enough to know how to use it right. "
i definitely agree with that. i would have to say that this is all about the 8 smartest heroes
#46 Posted by jesterofmaddness (1 posts) - - Show Bio

Just to throw it out there, Banner did say to the Leader in Incredible Hulk 610 that Cho was one of the eight smartest people.

#47 Posted by Abeonis_ (6 posts) - - Show Bio

Hank Pym has the privilege to be cocky. He is a super-genius and has created the most advanced A.I. in Marvel Earth, as far as I know. He has discovered Pym Particles (which, as stated before, defies physics), outsmarted Reed, and was named scientist supreme. Yeah...I think he has the right to be cocky.

#48 Posted by Comicdude360 (1503 posts) - - Show Bio

I love him with cho

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