Goku is faster than light

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#51 Edited by DeviousBastard (145 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm: So you're saying you legs move massively slower when you run?

#52 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4766 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm: So you're saying you legs move massively slower when you run?

Top kicking speed is 70mph by Frank Dux.

That's nowhere near the top sprint by Usain Bolt.

#53 Posted by DeviousBastard (145 posts) - - Show Bio
#54 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4766 posts) - - Show Bio


Travel speed does not correlate to combat speed in any way shape or form.

Also travel in the DBZverse is used purely as a plot device.

#55 Edited by DeviousBastard (145 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium: You're seriously trying to tell me someone's leg movement becomes millions times slower when they run?

#56 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4766 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium: You're seriously trying to tell me someone's leg movement becomes millions times slower when they run?


Just pointing out that a) travel speed in DBZ is literally a plot device and b) DBZ chars fly.

#57 Posted by alcoholbob (1208 posts) - - Show Bio

Goku is FTL after he gets the SSJG power up. He couldn't keep up with Bills--who travelled FTL+ across space--even with Instant Transmission before the powerup, but afterwards kept up with Bills just fine.

#58 Posted by PapiNacho (3358 posts) - - Show Bio

The truth if this match ever happened it would be too close to tell, but of course nobody wants to admit it. This is a comic forum, geez.

#59 Posted by houseshm (496 posts) - - Show Bio

Goku is FTL after he gets the SSJG power up. He couldn't keep up with Bills--who travelled FTL+ across space--even with Instant Transmission before the powerup, but afterwards kept up with Bills just fine.

agreed now goku can travel FTL as well. I always think there combat speed is higher though.

#61 Edited by Pope052 (3434 posts) - - Show Bio

Goku's Travel Speed is difficult to deduce but with a rough guess i'd put him at light-speed or a tad below. Basing my assumption from travelling the entirety of Namek in an instant, his feat of swimming across the Earth as a Kid and perhaps a couple of more feats.

His Combat Speed however, is infinitely faster:

Goku from Dragon-Ball was ranging from Super-Sonic, to Massively Hyper-Sonic Speeds at the end of the the series. In Z, after dying and training with King Kai in the Saiyan Saga he was approaching the speed of light.

Namek Saga (Ginyu-Force Battle) Goku was at minimum, light-speed. After being healed to battle Frieza he was FTL and turning Super Saiyan is beyond that. Along with the rest of his training/fighting increases in power, Super Saiyan 2 and Super Saiyan 3. It is indeed difficult to keep up with Goku in a fight to say the absolute least.

But, for the heck of it i'm going to super lowball Goku and ignore Super Saiyan Transformations completely (some people tend to go by that route). Therefore, putting Goku at only several times faster than light at the End of DBZ.

#62 Posted by Lengendary_samuelsike666 (1 posts) - - Show Bio

@thatguywithheadphones: spiderman was moving his BODY WHICH IS AIM DODGING,dodging is when you move part of your body just like its shown when radiz dodged goku's kame wave

#63 Posted by Yukiiiii (8 posts) - - Show Bio

I should have read Goku's feats here rather than OBD, OBD says Goku is only at sub-relativistic+ speed......

#64 Posted by linsanel_Doctor (1349 posts) - - Show Bio


#65 Posted by supermatt5546 (3 posts) - - Show Bio

Goku never used instant transmission when he fought Bills the 1st time,instant transmission is instant,infinite speed. But yes,Bills and Whis flew so fast they went from their dimension to Earth in 3 minutes.Their combat speed is higher than their travel speed by the way.

#66 Posted by Buu2020 (31 posts) - - Show Bio

@frogdog: Spiderman actually is faster than light i think. In a comic he took a guys gun out of his hand without the guy even noticing

#67 Edited by Bofthree (1 posts) - - Show Bio

@houseshm: I don't believe that Kid Goku can move faster than light when he fought Tien or when he faced the Red Ribbon Army. Hell, I don't believe he's FTL by the end of Dragon Ball. These "speed feats" of Goku's are not accurately analyzed and I will make my own today.

Kakarot88 claims that kid Goku is FTL since he can dodge lasers. Unfortunately for him, Staff Officer Black's Battle Jacket does not fire lasers. It fires energy beams from its blasters, which at this point in time, is MUCH slower than lasers until further down the storyline. It fires lasers in the movie Dragon Ball: The Path to Power, but since the movie changes a few things from the main storyline as well as unnecessarily adding some new features and designs to the Battle Jacket, it's actually non-canon. If the Battle Jacket does indeed shoot lasers and Goku was FTL, then what was the point of training under Popo to react faster than lightning?

Tien's execution of his Solar Flare is relative to how fast his reactions are and the speed at which he gathers his Ki. Goku wearing the sunglasses is due to him being faster than Tien's thought process, which is greatly slower than light speed. How fast does information travel to the brain you ask? Well approximately 300 mph. So if Goku moves just slightly faster than neurons can send information, then he moves at least about half the speed of sound and can definitely avoid being seen by the naked eye of a normal human.





This is also why we can't see bullets flying through the air because it's several times faster than our minds can process the image.


Looking at Roshi's position, it's clear that he is the closest to the ring compared to the rest of the audience (and the fact that he's conveniently wearing sunglasses) so it's reasonable for Goku to run to Roshi with that type of speed before Tien can gather his Ki to execute the Solar Flare move.

Taking into consideration that Master Roshi can catch bullets with his bare hands...

...and the fact that Tien has a third eye...


...would require Goku to move even faster than the speed of a bullet due to Tien being the only one left that can still see Goku's movement and not Roshi. The fastest bullet in the world is the .223 Winchester Super Short Magnum that's fired at 3,136 mph so we will use this speed to ensure that Goku is definitely faster than guns. This is proven since Goku traveled around the world to train and was shown to have easily blocked bullets with his narrow power pole after the 22nd World Martial Arts Tournament ended.

As his assault on the Red Ribbon Army takes place before his training with Popo, this means that Goku is in no way faster than light because light speed >>>>>> lightning speed. Even then, it's not guaranteed that Goku's movement is lightning fast. He's dodging lightning, not actually running away from it. To give an example, let's say that I'm a pitcher and I'm throwing a baseball at you at 90 mph. Obviously you can not move 90 mph to outrun a baseball, however, your mind can process the fact that a baseball is flying towards your face since, again, neurons transmit information to your brain at 300 mph. You collect this information and you're told to...

Piccolo: DODGE!!!

...which you do by sidestepping or ducking. See? The lightning training from Popo is to work on Goku's reflex and improve his speed in thought processing. It does not actually mean that Goku can move faster than lightning, but rather he can react to the speed faster than lightning. I'm getting ahead of myself, since I haven't even talked about the fact that Goku required another boost to keep up with his fight against Piccolo Daimao. Goku was beaten effortlessly by the old Piccolo Daimao, then came back to beat the younger and stronger Piccolo Daimao after drinking the Ultra Divine Water.

As Goku tapped into the power of the Oozaru after drinking the Ultra Divine Water, this might cause a 10x boost in Goku's overall abilities, making him 10x faster than he originally was (Bullet speed of 3,136 mph * 10 = 31,360 mph), or Mach 41.2. Still much slower than lightning so this is a reasonable progress for Goku as lightning is 224,000 mph on average. By the end of Dragon Ball, Goku has learned to react to lightning so his speed must have increased somewhat. Not only that, we must take into account that Goku's wearing weighted clothing too.

Goku's weight as an adult is 137 pounds. His training gear is approximately 250 pounds. So not only is Goku carrying his own body weight, but his training gear as well, making it seem like Goku is under 3x normal gravity.

Body weight of 137 + 250 = 387 lbs.

387 total pounds / 137 lbs. body weight = Goku feels like being under 2.82x normal gravity (or about 3x to make it easier)

Therefore, Goku's actual speed at the end of the 23rd World Martial Arts tournament (The end of the Dragon Ball anime) is about (31,360 mph x 3 = 94,080 mph!) Mach 123.6! Just 42% the speed of lightning and that's him in base form during Dragon Ball! Even Kami can not see Goku or Piccolo moving.

The reason being that unlike Goku's training where lightning comes straight from the clouds where you anticipate it, Goku and Piccolo are moving around within the arena in random directions. At best, Kami can maybe catch a glimpe of them or perhaps he's aged enough to where he can't process the speed at which Goku is moving, still, it doesn't necessarily mean that they are faster than lightning.

Now we're at DBZ and here is where it is inconsistent. As Piccolo is a decent rival, Goku will not get lazy with his training so he'll probably improve within the five years that occurred after the last World Martial Arts tournament. It was stated that Snake Way is about 1,000,000 kilometers. Using Goku's speed when it was the end of the 23rd Budokai, he runs at approximately 42,057 meters per second. Converting Snake Way's distance to meters and dividing it by Goku's speed and changing the seconds to hours [(1,000,000,000 / 42,057) /(60s *60min *24h)], this would mean that Goku should take about 6.6 hours to reach King Kai's planet, but the thing is, Goku actually took 6 months and it clearly shows in the manga that he even sleeps (Idk why, but apparently a dead Goku can get sleepy and hungry), therefore, we have to remove the average of 8 hours of sleep per day during Goku's 6 months to find out how fast he actually is at the start of DBZ.

Take 6 months, multiply it with the average of 30 days and multiply that with the 8 hours to find out how much time we need to remove from that 6 months (1440 hours). Total hours - sleeping hours = 4320 - 1440 = 2880 total running hours = 10,368,000 seconds

1,000,000,000 meters / 10,368,000 seconds = 96.45 m/s or 215.75 mph

Due to this inconsistency, Goku's speed drops tremendously from 94,080 mph to 215.75 mph. So Goku has gotten weaker and slower during his 5 years of peace? Wut? So DBZ Goku in the beginning is slower than guns now? Wut? No wonder he can't solo Raditz.

Okay, let's say that Goku didn't lose his stats from the end of Dragon Ball or that Toriyama actually pays attention to details. Then using the Death Battle multiplier (586 x 50 x 2 x 4 x 42,057 = 9,858,160,800 m/s) Goku moves around 35,489,378,880 km/hr. Goku at the end of DBZ would be 35x faster than light. Assuming that Goku's base form is equal to this speed at the start of DBGT, then we put Goku through the Gravity formula again, only this time, we include the SSJ4 multiplier. (50 x 2 x 4 x 10 x 35,489,378,880 = 141,957,515,520,000 km/hr.)

By the end of GT, Goku should be about 142,000 times faster than light, but due to inconsistency (Looking at you Snake Way...), this number will not happen. Thanks Toriyama....

There were major issues with kakarot88's analysis, especially in the assumptions that Goku is FTL during the events of Dragon Ball, the fact that Namek is Earth size and using the wrong speed for Krillin to measure Namek (He's close to lightning speed). However, biased or not, most people would agree that Goku is exponentially faster than light by the end of GT. The little details that were missed by ScrewAttack (and Toriyama...) actually favors Goku strongly in terms of speed, if only they had realize it.

That ends my rant.

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