Rumor: Storm and Wolverine breaking up??

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poisonfleur

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Umm... Why?? They really didn't explore the relationship with the two together..
Like everything in Marvel NOW! everything is so short-lived, axed, killed, or cancelled before it ever gets a chance to spread it's wings. *sigh*

AND BEFORE ANYONE COMES IN HERE BASHING ON ORORO X LOGAN--
Watching One Man's Worth Part 1 & 2 of X-men the Animated series. Storm and Wolverine make a beautiful couple... the only issues and that it's ALWAYS short-lived... Even in the animated series. This'll be the 4th (ultimate universe included) time where they break up after a less than a year long period together.

Apparently, Logan will be dating a new chick in his new series... who without introduction is already a downgrade from Ororo. FAIL Speaking of downgrades.. I hope Storm and Nightcrawler don't get together.. Now that's a couple that doesn't work with me... but it seems Marvel is setting it up that. Please Lord, don't let Storm be the X-village whore.

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Eeshaan1685

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Wolverine gonna get with Adult Jean when she comes back, it seems...

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devilsgrin81

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Umm... Why?? They really didn't explore the relationship with the two together..

Like everything in Marvel NOW! everything is so short-lived, axed, killed, or cancelled before it ever gets a chance to spread it's wings. *sigh*

AND BEFORE ANYONE COMES IN HERE BASHING ON ORORO X LOGAN--

Watching One Man's Worth Part 1 & 2 of X-men the Animated series. Storm and Wolverine make a beautiful couple... the only issues and that it's ALWAYS short-lived... Even in the animated series. This'll be the 4th (ultimate universe included) time where they break up after a less than a year long period together.

Apparently, Logan will be dating a new chick in his new series... who without introduction is already a downgrade from Ororo. FAIL Speaking of downgrades.. I hope Storm and Nightcrawler don't get together.. Now that's a couple that doesn't work with me... but it seems Marvel is setting it up that. Please Lord, don't let Storm be the X-village whore.

Um they really weren't together in any romantic sense. Theirs was a "relationship" of convenience... little more than friends with benefits - those benefits being rebound Sex... with an element of revenge sex, since T'Challa specifically asked her not to date the troll...

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Fallschirmjager

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Wolverine is a slut. I don't really see why he would settle down with anyone.

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HAWK2916

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Wolverine and Storm should have been done earlier. Along with Jean and Scott and Polaris and Havok, their relationship could have been a big deal back then but Marvel missed the boat on that one and that time has passed. Now it just feels forced

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cattlebattle

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Just stop.

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RustyRoy

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#7  Edited By RustyRoy

They were a couple?

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oldnightcrawler

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Um they really weren't together in any romantic sense. Theirs was a "relationship" of convenience... little more than friends with benefits - those benefits being rebound Sex... with an element of revenge sex, since T'Challa specifically asked her not to date the troll...

yeah, this is basically the relationship they've had on and off since the 80's. They've always had chemistry, but never been exclusive.

. Please Lord, don't let Storm be the X-village whore.

not subscribing to traditional ideas of sexual exclusivity hardly makes Storm (or anyone) a whore.

One of Storm's most inspiring character traits is that she's a free spirit who refuses to live by other people's standards of what is normal or expected; it's a disservice to the strength of her character to shame her for that.

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Sovereign91001

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@rustyroy said:

They were a couple?

This. I only thought they hooked up a couple of times.

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PhoenixoftheTides

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They weren't dating.

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poisonfleur

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They weren't dating.

Yet they got together in the issue 'Date Night'

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poisonfleur

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@oldnightcrawler: As much as I get that, Storm has established herself as one who rarely dates and to have her get be with 3 guys in less than a year is Degrading. Especially since she doesn't need a guy! Heck I am still cheering for Storm and Yukio to be a thing together again!

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McKlayn

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Umm... Why?? They really didn't explore the relationship with the two together..

Like everything in Marvel NOW! everything is so short-lived, axed, killed, or cancelled before it ever gets a chance to spread it's wings. *sigh*

AND BEFORE ANYONE COMES IN HERE BASHING ON ORORO X LOGAN--

Watching One Man's Worth Part 1 & 2 of X-men the Animated series. Storm and Wolverine make a beautiful couple... the only issues and that it's ALWAYS short-lived... Even in the animated series. This'll be the 4th (ultimate universe included) time where they break up after a less than a year long period together.

Apparently, Logan will be dating a new chick in his new series... who without introduction is already a downgrade from Ororo. FAIL Speaking of downgrades.. I hope Storm and Nightcrawler don't get together.. Now that's a couple that doesn't work with me... but it seems Marvel is setting it up that. Please Lord, don't let Storm be the X-village whore.

STORM AND NIGHTCRAWLER!!! GO GO GO GO, sorry but i love them together cant help but cheer for the fuzzy elf

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devilsgrin81

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@mcklayn said:

@poisonfleur said:

Umm... Why?? They really didn't explore the relationship with the two together..

Like everything in Marvel NOW! everything is so short-lived, axed, killed, or cancelled before it ever gets a chance to spread it's wings. *sigh*

AND BEFORE ANYONE COMES IN HERE BASHING ON ORORO X LOGAN--

Watching One Man's Worth Part 1 & 2 of X-men the Animated series. Storm and Wolverine make a beautiful couple... the only issues and that it's ALWAYS short-lived... Even in the animated series. This'll be the 4th (ultimate universe included) time where they break up after a less than a year long period together.

Apparently, Logan will be dating a new chick in his new series... who without introduction is already a downgrade from Ororo. FAIL Speaking of downgrades.. I hope Storm and Nightcrawler don't get together.. Now that's a couple that doesn't work with me... but it seems Marvel is setting it up that. Please Lord, don't let Storm be the X-village whore.

STORM AND NIGHTCRAWLER!!! GO GO GO GO, sorry but i love them together cant help but cheer for the fuzzy elf

i agree. I love Ororo/Kurt (Kuroro? Orurt?).

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Koays

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Where was this relationship being shown any way...all I've seen is them stand next to each other a lot.....which they actually always have.

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Cloakx14

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storm is ho. i bet bp is very upset.

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THUNDERBOLT30

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oldnightcrawler

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@oldnightcrawler: As much as I get that, Storm has established herself as one who rarely dates and to have her get be with 3 guys in less than a year is Degrading. Especially since she doesn't need a guy! Heck I am still cheering for Storm and Yukio to be a thing together again!

to whom? if she's not ashamed of who she's been with, why should you be?

danke.

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kidchipotle

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#19  Edited By kidchipotle

They were together for like 3 issues max, including a Deadpool issue of him catching them in bed. They were hardly a couple, more like rebound friends with benefits.

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BR_Havoc

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I thought they where just friends with benefits

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PhoenixoftheTides

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@phoenixofthetides said:

They weren't dating.

Yet they got together in the issue 'Date Night'

You don't need to be in a monogamous relationship to resume a casual arrangement after ceasing to see each other for a while.

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oldnightcrawler

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@poisonfleur said:

@phoenixofthetides said:

They weren't dating.

Yet they got together in the issue 'Date Night'

You don't need to be in a monogamous relationship to resume a casual arrangement after ceasing to see each other for a while.

well said.

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poisonfleur

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@arturocalakayvee: @oldnightcrawler: @phoenixofthetides: Ugh.. It's not like Kitty's and Bobby's relationship started any differently. It started with a random kiss and some cute dialouge and low and behold they were a couple.

They were a kissed and possibly hooked up in: Wolverine & the X-men

They hooked up in: Deadpool

They had a romantic time together when Logan was couping with being Killable in a couple issues of : Wolverine

They had another romantic time during karaoke & on the rooftops together and publicly showed the team they were together in: Astonishing X-men

They had a cute quarrel talked about foreplay in: Amazing X-men

Not relevant, but they have also had a cute Headmaster & Headmistress moments together throughout all the x-books.
Also not promising, but it did seem like the new Wolverine and the X-men series was going to focus on them and the X-students.

Seriously, Storm and Nightcrawler had their cute moments, but when has Storm ever expressed interest in Kurt? Hasn't she made it clear she that she has put him in the friendzone? lol

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poisonfleur

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#24  Edited By poisonfleur

@poisonfleur said:

@oldnightcrawler: As much as I get that, Storm has established herself as one who rarely dates and to have her get be with 3 guys in less than a year is Degrading. Especially since she doesn't need a guy! Heck I am still cheering for Storm and Yukio to be a thing together again!

to whom? if she's not ashamed of who she's been with, why should you be?

danke.

Black Panther, Wolverine, and now Marvel is lining up Kurt it seems. (Not that I don't like Nightcrawler. It's just the chemistry isn't there.)
Besides, tons of characters make descions they aren't ashamed of-- Doesn't mean the characters wouldn't have been much better off if they hadn't done that to begin with.
Examples:
Storm dating Black Panther
Rogue mainly joining Uncanny Avengers
Rogue ending things with Gambit and going out with Magneto
the list goes on depending who you ask and who is writing.

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oldnightcrawler

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@arturocalakayvee: @oldnightcrawler: @phoenixofthetides: Ugh.. It's not like Kitty's and Bobby's relationship started any differently. It started with a random kiss and some cute dialouge and low and behold they were a couple.

They were a kissed and possibly hooked up in: Wolverine & the X-men

Storm and Wolverine have been implied to be "friends with benefits" since the late 80's.

That they would ever hook up does not mean that they have some kind of monogamous commitment, and they've never said that they do.

my point was that it's crap to call someone a whore just because they've been in several relationships, or even more than one at a time; it's rude and offensive.

Examples:

Storm dating Black Panther

Rogue mainly joining Uncanny Avengers

Rogue ending things with Gambit and going out with Magneto

the list goes on depending who you ask and who is writing.

these are just examples of stories you didn't like, that doesn't make them "Degrading".

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darthphoenix

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storm is better off with wolvie than black panther. marvel married storm and panther so that storm can be a part of avengers to boost their sales.

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oldnightcrawler

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storm is better off with wolvie than black panther. marvel married storm and panther so that storm can be a part of avengers to boost their sales.

but didn't her and the Panther join the FF first? that doesn't make it seem like they were thinking about the Avengers (which Storm joined only briefly) at the time.

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poisonfleur

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storm is better off with wolvie than black panther. marvel married storm and panther so that storm can be a part of avengers to boost their sales.

This^ And as a fan, I find Storm becoming a trophy wife for Black Panther very degrading to her character.

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poisonfleur

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@poisonfleur said:

@arturocalakayvee: @oldnightcrawler: @phoenixofthetides: Ugh.. It's not like Kitty's and Bobby's relationship started any differently. It started with a random kiss and some cute dialouge and low and behold they were a couple.

They were a kissed and possibly hooked up in: Wolverine & the X-men

Storm and Wolverine have been implied to be "friends with benefits" since the late 80's.

That they would ever hook up does not mean that they have some kind of monogamous commitment, and they've never said that they do.

my point was that it's crap to call someone a whore just because they've been in several relationships, or even more than one at a time; it's rude and offensive.

@poisonfleur said:

Examples:

Storm dating Black Panther

Rogue mainly joining Uncanny Avengers

Rogue ending things with Gambit and going out with Magneto

the list goes on depending who you ask and who is writing.

these are just examples of stories you didn't like, that doesn't make them "Degrading".

LOL I sure think so... seeing as how Rouge was removed off Brian Wood's Great X-men run just to be axed off in Uncanny Avengers... (even if it's for shock value sake.) Seriously, another fail tally under her character's name, especially when Rogue was Legendary back in the 90s. Plus, Rogue and Gambit were one of the power couples of Marvel.. but yet again, that was botched. Everything that made her epic and iconic was stripped away starting with Anna Paquin portrayal in the X-films and it's influence & ripples on the x-comics. Degrading.

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CheeseSticks

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Storm is still boring.

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PhoenixoftheTides

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these are just examples of stories you didn't like, that doesn't make them "Degrading".

LOL I sure think so... seeing as how Rouge was removed off Brian Wood's Great X-men run just to be axed off in Uncanny Avengers... (even if it's for shock value sake.) Seriously, another fail tally under her character's name, especially when Rogue was Legendary back in the 90s. Plus, Rogue and Gambit were one of the power couples of Marvel.. but yet again, that was botched. Everything that made her epic and iconic was stripped away starting with Anna Paquin portrayal in the X-films and it's influence & ripples on the x-comics. Degrading.

Honestly, I don't think Rogue ever has reached iconic or epic status. I think our nostalgia for a certain powerset she exhibited during that time period might color our perception of the character - superstrength, enhanced durability and flight are very useful and tend to lend themselves to comic book drawing very easily, so she tended to get the best representation during fight scenes. She had some good characterization under Claremont, but was very much a one-note character ("Ah cain't touch anybody!!!") and even the Gambit/Rogue relationship played off f that one note ("Ah love you, Remy, but ah cain't touch you!"). She became an interesting addition to the team during Claremont's 80's run, and then became a mainstay during the Lee era, but she's always been one of those inconsistent characters IMHO - used for great splash pages of her flying around/using super strength, but often those abilities were showcased far more than her primary powers and her development has always been a bit uneven.

I definitely agree that the Paquin version was so muted that she didn't match what we generally know of Rogue's personality, though - spunk and a fighter mentality. She basically had no personality to build scenes around, so I'm not surprised her role in the new film was cut down.

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Lightblaze

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Storm and Wolverine if I recall, they were never together. I'm I wrong? Did I missed something? If they were then, I'm happy for their separation. I always thought Storm was too good looking for a man like Wolverine who can literally be her dad.

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oldnightcrawler

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LOL I sure think so... seeing as how Rouge was removed off Brian Wood's Great X-men run just to be axed off in Uncanny Avengers... (even if it's for shock value sake.) Seriously, another fail tally under her character's name, especially when Rogue was Legendary back in the 90s. Plus, Rogue and Gambit were one of the power couples of Marvel.. but yet again, that was botched. Everything that made her epic and iconic was stripped away starting with Anna Paquin portrayal in the X-films and it's influence & ripples on the x-comics. Degrading.

Even if I agreed with that (and I sort of half agree), I don't see how degrading a character in that way is comparable to writing a character to have casual or multiple romantic relationships; I guess I just don't see what's degrading about that.

Honestly, I don't think Rogue ever has reached iconic or epic status. I think our nostalgia for a certain powerset she exhibited during that time period might color our perception of the character - superstrength, enhanced durability and flight are very useful and tend to lend themselves to comic book drawing very easily, so she tended to get the best representation during fight scenes. She had some good characterization under Claremont, but was very much a one-note character ("Ah cain't touch anybody!!!") and even the Gambit/Rogue relationship played off f that one note ("Ah love you, Remy, but ah cain't touch you!"). She became an interesting addition to the team during Claremont's 80's run, and then became a mainstay during the Lee era, but she's always been one of those inconsistent characters IMHO - used for great splash pages of her flying around/using super strength, but often those abilities were showcased far more than her primary powers and her development has always been a bit uneven.

I definitely agree that the Paquin version was so muted that she didn't match what we generally know of Rogue's personality, though - spunk and a fighter mentality. She basically had no personality to build scenes around, so I'm not surprised her role in the new film was cut down.

I pretty much agree with all this.

I can get why people would be less interested in a less spunky, fighty version of Rogue, and like you imply, a lot of that attitude comes from that power set. For me, there's a lot of characters i wouldn't identify without (or with different) powers: Superman without super-strength just isn't going to be Superman for a lot of people, I'm sure it's the same with Rogue for many.

I guess I don't feel that way about Rogue so much because she always has those powers when she needs them, and she more likely to have different powers, which ultimately just makes her seem like a more versatile character.

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devilsgrin81

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@poisonfleur said:

LOL I sure think so... seeing as how Rouge was removed off Brian Wood's Great X-men run just to be axed off in Uncanny Avengers... (even if it's for shock value sake.) Seriously, another fail tally under her character's name, especially when Rogue was Legendary back in the 90s. Plus, Rogue and Gambit were one of the power couples of Marvel.. but yet again, that was botched. Everything that made her epic and iconic was stripped away starting with Anna Paquin portrayal in the X-films and it's influence & ripples on the x-comics. Degrading.

Even if I agreed with that (and I sort of half agree), I don't see how degrading a character in that way is comparable to writing a character to have casual or multiple romantic relationships; I guess I just don't see what's degrading about that.

@phoenixofthetides said:

Honestly, I don't think Rogue ever has reached iconic or epic status. I think our nostalgia for a certain powerset she exhibited during that time period might color our perception of the character - superstrength, enhanced durability and flight are very useful and tend to lend themselves to comic book drawing very easily, so she tended to get the best representation during fight scenes. She had some good characterization under Claremont, but was very much a one-note character ("Ah cain't touch anybody!!!") and even the Gambit/Rogue relationship played off f that one note ("Ah love you, Remy, but ah cain't touch you!"). She became an interesting addition to the team during Claremont's 80's run, and then became a mainstay during the Lee era, but she's always been one of those inconsistent characters IMHO - used for great splash pages of her flying around/using super strength, but often those abilities were showcased far more than her primary powers and her development has always been a bit uneven.

I definitely agree that the Paquin version was so muted that she didn't match what we generally know of Rogue's personality, though - spunk and a fighter mentality. She basically had no personality to build scenes around, so I'm not surprised her role in the new film was cut down.

I pretty much agree with all this.

I can get why people would be less interested in a less spunky, fighty version of Rogue, and like you imply, a lot of that attitude comes from that power set. For me, there's a lot of characters i wouldn't identify without (or with different) powers: Superman without super-strength just isn't going to be Superman for a lot of people, I'm sure it's the same with Rogue for many.

I guess I don't feel that way about Rogue so much because she always has those powers when she needs them, and she more likely to have different powers, which ultimately just makes her seem like a more versatile character.

unfortunately Rogue has become little more than just another Power-Mimic. Her method of obtaining is a bit more invasive... but its still the same power-set as Hope, Mimic... and a dozen or more others.

Without her iconic powers which without question are the Ms Marvel powers, she is nothing. her character is not the same, and has not been written so since she was depowered during X-Treme X-Men. Which was ironically, or coincidently, right around the time of the movies...

Frankly i see her only strength as a mimic, is due to her experience. She has probably seen almost all the people she fights using their powers before... so she can use them better than most other mimics - esp since the touch comes with a generalised "How-To" for the power-set. Her versatility, imho, is limited. Unless she can touch you, she has nothing and is utterly squishable. And the vast majority of her opponents will be stronger and or faster... not to mention the power-sets themselves.

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oldnightcrawler

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Without her iconic powers which without question are the Ms Marvel powers, she is nothing. her character is not the same, and has not been written so since she was depowered during X-Treme X-Men.

But is that because she lost her MM powers, or because she wasn't being written especially well?

Just because she stopped being as fun after she lost those powers doesn't necessarily mean it was those powers that made her fun.

Frankly i see her only strength as a mimic, is due to her experience. She has probably seen almost all the people she fights using their powers before... so she can use them better than most other mimics - esp since the touch comes with a generalised "How-To" for the power-set. Her versatility, imho, is limited. Unless she can touch you, she has nothing and is utterly squishable. And the vast majority of her opponents will be stronger and or faster... not to mention the power-sets themselves.

Sure, but being faster and/or stronger doesn't necessarily make a character a better character. Lots of the most enjoyable superheroes have either no powers or only some slight advantage or powers that don't even help them fight. Storm, Moonstar, and Richter are all characters who became way more bad-ass because they had lost their powers, and they didn't have being able to copy other characters' powers to level the playing field.

I mean, you mention her experience; do you really think a character trained by Mystique and Wolverine doesn't bring anything else to the table? What about combat training or stealth? What about a character having to be more clever because they don't have Superman powers?

When I speak of her potential for versatility, I don't mean just in a fight, I mean as a character. A character that's sometimes Superman and sometimes, I dunno, Robin is at least more versatile than a character that's always Superman.

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poisonfleur

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@devilsgrin81 said:

Without her iconic powers which without question are the Ms Marvel powers, she is nothing. her character is not the same, and has not been written so since she was depowered during X-Treme X-Men.

But is that because she lost her MM powers, or because she wasn't being written especially well?

Just because she stopped being as fun after she lost those powers doesn't necessarily mean it was those powers that made her fun.

Frankly i see her only strength as a mimic, is due to her experience. She has probably seen almost all the people she fights using their powers before... so she can use them better than most other mimics - esp since the touch comes with a generalised "How-To" for the power-set. Her versatility, imho, is limited. Unless she can touch you, she has nothing and is utterly squishable. And the vast majority of her opponents will be stronger and or faster... not to mention the power-sets themselves.

Sure, but being faster and/or stronger doesn't necessarily make a character a better character. Lots of the most enjoyable superheroes have either no powers or only some slight advantage or powers that don't even help them fight. Storm, Moonstar, and Richter are all characters who became way more bad-ass because they had lost their powers, and they didn't have being able to copy other characters' powers to level the playing field.

I mean, you mention her experience; do you really think a character trained by Mystique and Wolverine doesn't bring anything else to the table? What about combat training or stealth? What about a character having to be more clever because they don't have Superman powers?

When I speak of her potential for versatility, I don't mean just in a fight, I mean as a character. A character that's sometimes Superman and sometimes, I dunno, Robin is at least more versatile than a character that's always Superman.

See, growing up, that's how I viewed Rogue. As the southen belle Supergirl. To see her nowdays stripped practically everything away from the character I loved. As for Storm, to me she seemed more so the mother. And when she was grieving Kurt's death, it felt like she lost a brother. Now that there is attraction going on between them, the characterization seems very off. Especially now that it seems Storm and Wolverine are changing their relationship up again and are making room for Kurt & Ororo.. It all seems forced and off for everyone.

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devilsgrin81

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#38  Edited By devilsgrin81

@oldnightcrawler said:

@devilsgrin81 said:

Without her iconic powers which without question are the Ms Marvel powers, she is nothing. her character is not the same, and has not been written so since she was depowered during X-Treme X-Men.

But is that because she lost her MM powers, or because she wasn't being written especially well?

Just because she stopped being as fun after she lost those powers doesn't necessarily mean it was those powers that made her fun.

Frankly i see her only strength as a mimic, is due to her experience. She has probably seen almost all the people she fights using their powers before... so she can use them better than most other mimics - esp since the touch comes with a generalised "How-To" for the power-set. Her versatility, imho, is limited. Unless she can touch you, she has nothing and is utterly squishable. And the vast majority of her opponents will be stronger and or faster... not to mention the power-sets themselves.

Sure, but being faster and/or stronger doesn't necessarily make a character a better character. Lots of the most enjoyable superheroes have either no powers or only some slight advantage or powers that don't even help them fight. Storm, Moonstar, and Richter are all characters who became way more bad-ass because they had lost their powers, and they didn't have being able to copy other characters' powers to level the playing field.

I mean, you mention her experience; do you really think a character trained by Mystique and Wolverine doesn't bring anything else to the table? What about combat training or stealth? What about a character having to be more clever because they don't have Superman powers?

When I speak of her potential for versatility, I don't mean just in a fight, I mean as a character. A character that's sometimes Superman and sometimes, I dunno, Robin is at least more versatile than a character that's always Superman.

It may be because she wasn't being especially well written... but thats by-the-by for comic readers... we get what we are given, and that is what we KNOW about a character. Its all well and good to sweep the boring stuff aside and say "well it wasn't well written" it unfortunately HAS been, and that makes it fact for the character. And IMHO Rogue has been a consistently more boring character ever since she lost the Ms Marvel powerset.

Storm, Moonstar and Richter prove my point. Whilst powerless all were fantastically well written (tho Dani got new powers almost as soon as the spotlight was back on her). Making their bad-assery all the more awesome was the writing. Rogue has not received such decent writing. And that has made her boring. Claremont gave her guts still during X-Treme... he always liked her, but in Storm's shadow of course.

Of course Rogue brings experience to the table. BUT She obtained her training from both whilst weilding the powers of Ms Marvel. Her fighting SKILLS aren't exactly top tier... they relied on her strength, speed and resilience. Rogue's Legacy book gave her a BIT of her spark, but it didn't last. and most issues saw her borrowing some rookie's powers and using them better than they could... hmmm really? thats boring and bullshit.

I disagree about her character versatility. She's a Brawler Belle. That is all. There haven't been many layers to this woman shown that don't all boil down to "i will punch y'all." I don't think she's stupid of course, i just think she's rather limited. Robin - all of them - have been trained by the best, (Wolverine is NOT the best Marvel has to offer as a teacher - good yes, but no Bats) they'll all smart, interesting characters - coz they're written that way... Rogue is not like that. And has not been written to show her versatility in this respect... or not even remotely consistently.

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HAWK2916

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I hope Rogue gets her Ms.Marvel powers back while still being able to absorb others. If not Ms.Marvel I hope she can get something like Gladiator's powers or his cousin (I forgot her name, i think its Xenith) but Rogue with heat vision and frost breath plus as an indestructible tank would be pretty cool. I still want her to have control over her powers though like she had more recently to the point we she can touch other people without killing them and all, but still have that remaining base power set.

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#40  Edited By oldnightcrawler

  1. It may be because she wasn't being especially well written... but thats by-the-by for comic readers... we get what we are given, and that is what we KNOW about a character. Its all well and good to sweep the boring stuff aside and say "well it wasn't well written" it unfortunately HAS been, and that makes it fact for the character. And IMHO Rogue has been a consistently more boring character ever since she lost the Ms Marvel powerset.
  2. Storm, Moonstar and Richter prove my point. Whilst powerless all were fantastically well written (tho Dani got new powers almost as soon as the spotlight was back on her). Making their bad-assery all the more awesome was the writing. Rogue has not received such decent writing. And that has made her boring. Claremont gave her guts still during X-Treme... he always liked her, but in Storm's shadow of course.
  3. Of course Rogue brings experience to the table. BUT She obtained her training from both whilst weilding the powers of Ms Marvel. Her fighting SKILLS aren't exactly top tier... they relied on her strength, speed and resilience. Rogue's Legacy book gave her a BIT of her spark, but it didn't last. and most issues saw her borrowing some rookie's powers and using them better than they could... hmmm really? thats boring and bullshit.
  4. I disagree about her character versatility. She's a Brawler Belle. That is all. There haven't been many layers to this woman shown that don't all boil down to "i will punch y'all." I don't think she's stupid of course, i just think she's rather limited. Robin - all of them - have been trained by the best, (Wolverine is NOT the best Marvel has to offer as a teacher - good yes, but no Bats) they'll all smart, interesting characters - coz they're written that way... Rogue is not like that. And has not been written to show her versatility in this respect... or not even remotely consistently.

1.) You're right that how she was written is the facts of what she is, but that you find that boring is your opinion. i'm just saying, It's not a fact that she's boring.

2.) Yeah, Claremont was the one who made her most likable in my opinion too, but stories I don't care for don't change my opinion of stories I actually like. There's good and bad stories of every popular character, I tend to base my opinion of any character on the stories they're in that I think are good, rather than the ones I don't care about.

3.) That her experience as a fighter has been largely ignored in her character development doesn't mean that that potential in itself can't be interesting. Arguably, no character would ever become interesting without someone being interested in their potential as a character. Madrox is an example of a character who was cool-in-theory for decades before Peter David became interested in actually exploring his potential. And any character can be boring if their potential is being wasted.

4.) Depends how much you boil off, I guess. For me, her origin with Mystique and Ms. Marvel, how she came to join the X-men, the effect she had on that group dynamic in the 80's and 90's, her powers, and the potential that all of those stories collectively present make Rogue far more interesting, distinct, and versatile to me than many superheroes. (Certainly more than most of the Robins).

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devilsgrin81

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@oldnightcrawler: we'll have to agree to disagree then. You're opinion is definitely valid. Just opposed to my own. Enjoyed the debate :) Will agree wholeheartedly about about boring when potential is wasted. Madrox is definitely the best example. He was why i bought X-Factor... that and PAD.

@hawk2916 said:

I hope Rogue gets her Ms.Marvel powers back while still being able to absorb others. If not Ms.Marvel I hope she can get something like Gladiator's powers or his cousin (I forgot her name, i think its Xenith) but Rogue with heat vision and frost breath plus as an indestructible tank would be pretty cool. I still want her to have control over her powers though like she had more recently to the point we she can touch other people without killing them and all, but still have that remaining base power set.

Super-Rogue...

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Wolverine gonna get with Adult Jean when she comes back, it seems...

Wolverine & Jean would be a disaster.

for me, Lady Mariko was the only for Logan-san.

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@slimlim said:

@avenger85 said:

Wolverine gonna get with Adult Jean when she comes back, it seems...

Wolverine & Jean would be a disaster.

for me, Lady Mariko was the only for Logan-san.

On that note, If you can get over the whole lesbian-thing, I think Storm and Yukio would make a good couple. They were really close

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Its funny to me that there are some saying that Storm bed hopping is not degrading. And saying or implying, or maybe I misunderstood, that her being multiple relationships at the same time is just fine and dandy. I mean really if your girl was with you then jumping on to the next guy, I think most of us would calk her a whore and throw her out on her ass. In school,college or whatever theres always that girl that sleeps around and while you may get down with her, you dont make her your girl. Then in reality how is she viewed by most? Part of the point being made here at least as I see it is that Storm has always been presented as a strong female character. To present her now as jumping into one relationship after another turns into a needy, and seemingly insecure person. As if in order to be relevant she must defines by a male character in the picture. Amazingly this is not being pushed on most single male superheroes, thats whats degrading. Also with the whole lesbian thing can we stop with this please? At this point it would degrade her even more because now she cant figure out what she is and as long as its got two legs she'll sleep with it, or least that is what will be said. Everybody doesnt have to be gay. I mean really I see more belly-aching about needing more gay characters than minorities. We got whole teams that are gay and bisexual and theres actually more gay characters being featured than black or native american. I mean come enough with overly pushing this agenda. Give each group of people their fare share not one over the other. Talk about equality! Is it just coincidence that in the x-books currently theres not one native american character on any teams being featured? In the history of the xmen how many have been black? How many are featured currently? Its less than gays or bisexuals. Is it really a problem? Not necessarily. I try not to be bothered by things like this but when I see comments in threads that seem to be trying to push certain things or when threads are created about it, I feel it gets ridiculous and instead of being impactful and profound, it becomes downright aggravating and agenda-based fad-thinking. Some fans are degrading characters like Storm far more-so than some of these ridiculous writers, and considering some of these current people we are stuck with, thats saying something and not in a good way.

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#45  Edited By Eeshaan1685

@slimlim said:

@avenger85 said:

Wolverine gonna get with Adult Jean when she comes back, it seems...

Wolverine & Jean would be a disaster.

for me, Lady Mariko was the only for Logan-san.

lol Marvel was sure as hell pushing it in the movies and in the alternate reality stories. THey were realy trying hard to make that the new status quo.

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Eeshaan1685

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@hawk2916 said:

Its funny to me that there are some saying that Storm bed hopping is not degrading. And saying or implying, or maybe I misunderstood, that her being multiple relationships at the same time is just fine and dandy. I mean really if your girl was with you then jumping on to the next guy, I think most of us would calk her a whore and throw her out on her ass. In school,college or whatever theres always that girl that sleeps around and while you may get down with her, you dont make her your girl. Then in reality how is she viewed by most? Part of the point being made here at least as I see it is that Storm has always been presented as a strong female character. To present her now as jumping into one relationship after another turns into a needy, and seemingly insecure person. As if in order to be relevant she must defines by a male character in the picture. Amazingly this is not being pushed on most single male superheroes, thats whats degrading. Also with the whole lesbian thing can we stop with this please? At this point it would degrade her even more because now she cant figure out what she is and as long as its got two legs she'll sleep with it, or least that is what will be said. Everybody doesnt have to be gay. I mean really I see more belly-aching about needing more gay characters than minorities. We got whole teams that are gay and bisexual and theres actually more gay characters being featured than black or native american. I mean come enough with overly pushing this agenda. Give each group of people their fare share not one over the other. Talk about equality! Is it just coincidence that in the x-books currently theres not one native american character on any teams being featured? In the history of the xmen how many have been black? How many are featured currently? Its less than gays or bisexuals. Is it really a problem? Not necessarily. I try not to be bothered by things like this but when I see comments in threads that seem to be trying to push certain things or when threads are created about it, I feel it gets ridiculous and instead of being impactful and profound, it becomes downright aggravating and agenda-based fad-thinking. Some fans are degrading characters like Storm far more-so than some of these ridiculous writers, and considering some of these current people we are stuck with, thats saying something and not in a good way.

There's a word we have for women like that : Slut.

And you make some great points in your entire post. You gotta love those Political Correctness enforcers these days...

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#47  Edited By oldnightcrawler

@hawk2916 said:

Its funny to me that there are some saying that Storm bed hopping is not degrading. And saying or implying, or maybe I misunderstood, that her being multiple relationships at the same time is just fine and dandy. I mean really if your girl was with you then jumping on to the next guy, I think most of us would calk her a whore and throw her out on her ass. In school,college or whatever theres always that girl that sleeps around and while you may get down with her, you dont make her your girl. Then in reality how is she viewed by most?

That some guys view women as possessions is not a reflection of those women.

Not everyone thinks that monogamy is inherent to a loving relationship, not everyone's character should be judged on that basis.

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HAWK2916

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@oldnightcrawler: So its ok with you if the girl you are currently with, goes out sleeps with other people?

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@hawk2916 said:

@oldnightcrawler: So its ok with you if the girl you are currently with, goes out sleeps with other people?

what's okay and not okay for me and my relationships needn't be the measure by how other people are judged.

Some people prefer monogamy and some don't, but neither is the basis for which we should judge one's character.

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HAWK2916

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@oldnightcrawler: lol. Why even try its impossible. Sometimes this stuff just descends into arguing for the sake of arguing and thats ridiculous. Sometimes its ok to not be a liberal, its not a crime to have an opinion that doesnt please everyone.