#751 Posted by matchesmalone21 (8663 posts) - - Show Bio
#752 Edited by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: Which raises the question of which one of the 2 is stronger; Doomsday or FB. I'm not one for powerlevels, but this does again bring in Soule and Azz's interpretations. Azz had Diana lose and then when she came back, she was smarter and took out the FB. With Soule, she just jobbed and a few minutes later shes back to normal. Considering the number Doomy did on her, she should have more than just broken arms.

#753 Posted by Lvenger (19320 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: Azz isn't much for power levels in his writing hence the sketchy feats that crop up sometimes. Soule introduced a power that Diana doesn't seem to have in Azz's book either even if she did get busted up internally from the FB's attacks. She still needed New Genesis tech to heal for 3 days whereas she healed from broken arms from DD fairly quickly. The comparisons can be somewhat jaded when Azz keeps Diana separated from the DCU in his title for all intents and purposes.

Also have you heard anything about Azzarello leaving the title after this arc he's writing? One person hinted that this would be Azz's last arc but I haven't heard anything else which indicates this.

#754 Posted by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: And guess which one makes for a more interesting story? The absurdity of Soules feats makes me laugh and cringe at the same time. Hes not even bothering to have them be pertinent to the story.

I remember reading about Azz staying on WW for another year or so. I just don't remember how long ago that was. :P
I don't expect him to stay for long and once hes done telling his story, hes likely to quit considering the kind of crap he has to put up with at DC. DC would probably like to have someone who would bend over for them and let them make the important decisions about it too, so yeah, Azz will probably leave after this arc is done.

#755 Posted by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: Azz's leave!?THANKS FOR GOD!!!!!

#756 Posted by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: I dont know why you hate feats, In SMWW, WW wants to teach fighting moves but she sucks against a real threat,DD casual one blow that broken wonder woman two arms,I dont know that what mean,if not show us how silly and weak of wonder woman

#757 Posted by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@powerwoman: I hate feats when they're used like they are by Lobdell or in this very issue by Soule. Diana says she hasn't been hit that hard and all she has are broken arms. Blatant disregard of what Azz has written and established and essentially making WW's supporting cast a low tier threat. Its also funny that after getting her ass handed to her, Superman is the one who actually needs trainng and armor, not her.

#758 Edited by Lvenger (19320 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: True, he is having to put up with the rubbish of Superman and Wonder Woman together along with who knows what else. I was searching for any rumours on this news and found Azzarello making a snarky comment about how it seemed he didn't feel the same way about Supes and WW as DC :P Also he said in this Comicvine interview that he'd been on the title for beyond two years. But that could mean he's just 'going beyond' two years total on the series, not necessarily two more years on the series since this interview was conducted.

@powerwoman Don't jump to conclusions sir/madam (One can't honestly tell what gender users are on here sometimes so I'm just covering all the bases) One random person in this review said that this was Azzarello's last arc on the series but I haven't heard any confirmation on this. No sources or even rumours on the matter.

#759 Posted by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: She broken arms,read s/w it,DD casual one blow almost kill her,read it,

How did DDay break BOTH of Diana's arms?

One arm I can certainly understand, but breaking both seems just wildly unlikely? How do you hit someone with your fist and do that?

The only way I can think of would be if Wonder Woman were trying to block the blow with her bracers and the force broke her arms anyway.

Which would, to put it bluntly, be crap.

But is there another explanation? How else do you make contact with both of a persons arms with one fist?

Clark and Diana is that she is supposed to be a kick ass warrior - of which we have so far seen absolutely no evidence. Indeed, ass-kicked would be a more apt description.

Comparing how they have performed against their respective opponents, Diana gets totally owned by Doomsday while Clark shrugs off Heph, obliterates Apollo and pretty much has Strife thinking about having his baby.

The implication here is that if they swapped books Wonder Woman would die, and Superman would annihilate her biggest hitters in the first few pages and then sit around sipping a lattes.

#760 Edited by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: I like Azz's attitude towards Diana's relationship with Superman; he knows it doesn't bring anything interesting to the table besides cheap drama so it's not worth bothering about and he isn't afraid to let DC know they screwed up. As for the interview, he definitely meant he was going to stay beyond 2 years, which he has now. I'm giving him another year before he quits.

@powerwoman: Don't try and make sense of how comic book injuries work. What you need to get from this encounter is that Doomsday is strong and Diana has no chance against him and Superman needs armor. And yes, considering this issue, Superman should essentially wipe the floor with all of her enemies. Great work Soule.

#761 Posted by Lvenger (19320 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: Hopefully that estimation turns out to be correct since I'm one of the few on here who actually like what Azzarello is doing with the series and with Wonder Woman. Another year to flesh out and bring together all his plot points seems accurate.

#762 Posted by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: The one aspect highlighted for WW - her skill - is only told to us, not shown, and quickly undermined.The author tells us that Diana thinks she is the better trained fighter, but he then follows it by showing her beat down by Doomsday. Do we see any effective use of skill there?

Serious,S/W just sucks

#763 Posted by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: I'm happy with him too cause we know what happens to her when writers don't know what to do with her. I'm looking forward to Azz completing his story so I can get the entire collection and then probably jump ship if DC decide to get some sub par writer on her title.

#764 Posted by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@powerwoman: It's a comic based on:

"We're so strong and lonely."

"Yes, but I'm stronger."

"Ok. Lets f*ck."

Of course it sucks.

#765 Posted by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: Superman is billion time stronger than wonder woman,I dont know why they are should be together,when a guy FTL,bench earth five days,,just let him go,Dont shame wonder woman

#766 Posted by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@powerwoman: She just wants the D. The Super D. And apparently DC think that makes for a great story.

#767 Posted by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: I dont know that what mean,A superman to shame her is not enough,we need every superman's villains.go to shame her again and again,ok,Doomsday is frist,who is next?zod?mongul?or even Faora?

Enough,Just let superman go,end of S/W things,I can't take anymore,I'm done.if dc belive wonder woman is weak,just dont shame her,I dont hope she could be has some good feats show,just stop shame her

#768 Posted by Primebonnick (1984 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: if it make sales then it here for a long ass time, don't forget its a company so profit needs to be made b4 anything else.

#769 Posted by Hastalavista (361 posts) - - Show Bio

@primebonnick: end the relationship and start a partnership, win-win. Why the hell can't DC see this?

#770 Posted by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@primebonnick: True. We'll have to see how fast the sales drop and what gimmick DC pull to keep 'em up.

#771 Edited by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio
#772 Posted by Lvenger (19320 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: The weapons come from an adjustment Hephaestus made on Diana's bracelets. It is NOT a regular spear which is evident by the Kirby dots and sound effect of summoning such weapons. Hephaestus made these bracelets and he knows how to tweak them to summon magical weapons from them. It makes sense given who Hephaestus is. Thus it makes some sense for the FB to be taken down by Diana's magical spear.

#773 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel: since when azz knows what he is doing with WW?,making her weaker than loeb did is knowing what to do with her?,making her hercules ripped off,a supporting cast in her own title?,no personality,true goals and development as a person and her relationship with other heros and characters?,don't make me laugh,a soup opera about a weak female hercules is not what i call knowing what to do with her.

#774 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

@gokuwarrior: The weapons come from an adjustment Hephaestus made on Diana's bracelets. It is NOT a regular spear which is evident by the Kirby dots and sound effect of summoning such weapons. Hephaestus made these bracelets and he knows how to tweak them to summon magical weapons from them. It makes sense given who Hephaestus is. Thus it makes some sense for the FB to be taken down by Diana's magical spear.

yeah right,azz better leave soon,because when you get to the point where you make WW weaker than loeb version,you screw it big time.

#775 Posted by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: Strength levels have very little to do with character. I don't particularly like her being Zeus' kid either, but every comic has flaws. Her personality is quite evident, actually, in how she acts and is noted by Apollo himself, IIRC. Compared to what every other writer is doing to her right now, Azz is miles better in that he has given her characteristics which are uniquely Wonder Woman. Lets not derail the thread, though. This isn't the place to discuss this.

#776 Posted by Hastalavista (361 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: it seems that there will be some development in#25. Plus I just went through my complaining cycle one or two days ago. Now I am a bit tired of discussing how each writer screws her up from so many approaches, which is a fact that feels like a mosquito bite - you know its there because it's itching, but scratching only makes it itches more... So I will take a break and gather my energy and make comments when #25 comes out...

#777 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel said:

@gokuwarrior: Strength levels have very little to do with character. I don't particularly like her being Zeus' kid either, but every comic has flaws. Her personality is quite evident, actually, in how she acts and is noted by Apollo himself, IIRC. Compared to what every other writer is doing to her right now, Azz is miles better in that he has given her characteristics which are uniquely Wonder Woman. Lets not derail the thread, though. This isn't the place to discuss this.

well this is a place to talk about feats,so once again let me point out the obious,new 52 is the weakest version of WW ever based on her feats,the weakest(after the one ones without powers of course).

#778 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: it seems that there will be some development in#25. Plus I just went through my complaining cycle one or two days ago. Now I am a bit tired of discussing how each writer screws her up from so many approaches, which is a fact that feels like a mosquito bite - you know its there because it's itching, but scratching only makes it itches more... So I will take a break and gather my energy and make comments when #25 comes out...

new 52 is the weakest version of WW based on feats,so yes,you better save your energy because we aren't going to see a competent diana in a long time probably.

#779 Edited by toplel (906 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: You seem to be really obsessed with her strength level. It doesn't define her or who she is. I'm more interested in characterization than feats, so Azz isn't disappointing me. If you want feats, I suggest following Soule, since he can't write her to save his life, he'll probably have her pull some idiotic feat soon enough. So far, she can't stop talking about how strong she and Superman are.

#780 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel said:

@gokuwarrior: You seem to be really obsessed with her strength level. It doesn't define her or who she is. I'm more interested in characterization than feats, so Azz isn't disappointing me. If you want feats, I suggest following Soule, since he can't write her to save his life, he'll probably have her pull some idiotic feat soon enough. So far, she can't stop talking about how strong she and Superman are.

oh my god,i don't care about power more than character development,i hate all her version from new 52,azz,johns,soule,all of them,you were talking about power levels here so don't act like if i'm the one bringing the topic.

#781 Posted by matchesmalone21 (8663 posts) - - Show Bio

bump

#782 Posted by Primebonnick (1984 posts) - - Show Bio

so let me get this straight no one likes the new 52 diana because how the writers treat her and the lack of feats. in the old 52 that was kinda the same problem after a while, but meh can't plz everyone i guess.

#783 Posted by Bezza (3518 posts) - - Show Bio

@toplel said:

@gokuwarrior: Strength levels have very little to do with character. I don't particularly like her being Zeus' kid either, but every comic has flaws. Her personality is quite evident, actually, in how she acts and is noted by Apollo himself, IIRC. Compared to what every other writer is doing to her right now, Azz is miles better in that he has given her characteristics which are uniquely Wonder Woman. Lets not derail the thread, though. This isn't the place to discuss this.

well this is a place to talk about feats,so once again let me point out the obious,new 52 is the weakest version of WW ever based on her feats,the weakest(after the one ones without powers of course).

I think you'll find the WW in the TV series was far, far weaker, but I take your point.

talking of weakness, was cool the way she lassoo'd Zod in this months SS/Wonder Woman and completely neutralised him after he had just beaten up on MM. Not bad for a Weaklin'!

#784 Posted by matchesmalone21 (8663 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder Woman 26

Deflecting bullets and a arrow.

Beating Cassandra's soldier and men-hyenas.

#785 Edited by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@bezza:if you have good feats of her in the new SP/WW issue,can you post them?.

#786 Posted by SanoHibiki (1521 posts) - - Show Bio

@bezza:if you have good feats of her in SP/WW issue 5,can you post them?.

?.

So far only three issues of SM/WW title were released.

#787 Edited by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior said:

@bezza:if you have good feats of her in SP/WW issue 5,can you post them?.

?.

So far only three issues of SM/WW title were released.

yes,i wasn't paying atention when i wrotte it.

#788 Posted by Bezza (3518 posts) - - Show Bio

.. Reading the past few pages on this thread, it does seem that most people are really unhappy with the New 52 WW and for a "New 52 respect thread" there isn't a lot of respect going on, just lots of "she is really weak, Superman is stronger, S/W Sucks, Azarello sucks...." Maybe this thread should be shut down and revived when WW starts doing something impressive- lol!!

#789 Posted by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@bezza said:

.. Reading the past few pages on this thread, it does seem that most people are really unhappy with the New 52 WW and for a "New 52 respect thread" there isn't a lot of respect going on, just lots of "she is really weak, Superman is stronger, S/W Sucks, Azarello sucks...." Maybe this thread should be shut down and revived when WW starts doing something impressive- lol!!

You can check them,read them,that all impressive?I want to know what you point

#790 Edited by ArchiZoom (1124 posts) - - Show Bio

I like the art work though. WW's got the best art work in the new52 imo. Some artists just don't know how to draw wonder woman, they draw a prostitute in a wonder woman costume.

The first couple issues of S&W were all about showing who's the man, he put things back in their rightful place. Soule contextualized superman's strength right off the bat - He's the Man with capital M, he's strong and manly. She's the woman, the damsel in distress, she's even a bitch to his ex boyfriend now. The poor thing took one hit from doomsday and it broke her arms. And he flies better too!! Batman thinks she's a conceited bitch with a god complex.

And what a tedious couple.

And in justice league, she's a bimbo. The best wonder i have ever seen was actually in the flashpoint paradox. And why didn't they include their name in batman superman the apocalypse? I thought she was depicted well there too, just not good enough to be in the title.

#791 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@archizoom: the didn't include supergirl in the title and she was the main character in that movie,wonder woman's best runs are perz,ruka and simone and new 52 is nothing next to them.

#792 Posted by ArchiZoom (1124 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: i'm wondering why. She's one of the 3 vertices of DC's holy trinity but in reality she's well below superman and batman in the chain of command. Like in the 3 legendary sannin in naruto and the orphans of Amegakure. I often feel like authors promise us powerful women and then trample all over the expectations we built, with infinite ifs and buts.

#793 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: i'm wondering why. She's one of the 3 vertices of DC's holy trinity but in reality she's well below superman and batman in the chain of command. Like in the 3 legendary sannin in naruto and the orphans of Amegakure. I often feel like authors promise us powerful women and then trample all over the expectations we built, with infinite ifs and buts.

women don't get good treatment compared to men,i hope they start to treat everybody properly.

#794 Posted by Outside_85 (8702 posts) - - Show Bio

@bezza said:

.. Reading the past few pages on this thread, it does seem that most people are really unhappy with the New 52 WW and for a "New 52 respect thread" there isn't a lot of respect going on, just lots of "she is really weak, Superman is stronger, S/W Sucks, Azarello sucks...." Maybe this thread should be shut down and revived when WW starts doing something impressive- lol!!

It's just two or three people trolling their hatred of the current state of things, as they have done in nearly every thread on this WW board.

Online
#796 Posted by r2datu (638 posts) - - Show Bio

From the latest SM/WW:

#797 Edited by PowerWoman (3347 posts) - - Show Bio

@r2datu said:

From the latest SM/WW:

Really dont know that was a fight?So,wonder woman use weapon hurt her,and zod beat superman with his girlfriend...

#798 Posted by r2datu (638 posts) - - Show Bio

@r2datu said:

From the latest SM/WW:

Really dont know that was a fight?So,wonder woman use weapon hurt her,and zod beat superman with his girlfriend...

...

I'm sorry, but what?

#799 Edited by kidstandout (118 posts) - - Show Bio

@bezza said:

.. Reading the past few pages on this thread, it does seem that most people are really unhappy with the New 52 WW and for a "New 52 respect thread" there isn't a lot of respect going on, just lots of "she is really weak, Superman is stronger, S/W Sucks, Azarello sucks...." Maybe this thread should be shut down and revived when WW starts doing something impressive- lol!!

It's just two or three people trolling their hatred of the current state of things, as they have done in nearly every thread on this WW board.

QFT

#800 Posted by Bezza (3518 posts) - - Show Bio

@kidstandout:

Yeah, or maybe its the fact that fans of iconic characters like WW and Superman have such high standards its hard to please them. I mean Wonder Woman was voted IGNs comic of the year recently, ahead of some highly rated stuff, so you'd think WW fans would be fairly pleased, but most slate the current WW comic....