Should Clark and Lois get back together ?

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davidgrantlloyd

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@darkman61288: Because from my perspective it symbolises stagnation. I mean the argument that it represents some sense of classicism, nostalgia, etc in the realm of mythology IS a somewhat valid point. Superman is a mythology. But Superman is also serialised fiction. If the protagonist in a serialised fiction format (particularly one that's been around for 75 years) only ever has one love interest, that's a handicap ... because it makes an already fairly predictable story even more predictable.

At the risk of sounding crude, Superman needs to play the field a bit more. We've had a brief run (too brief IMO) with the SMWW thing. It would be interesting (and a breath of fresh air) to see some others ie (as some have suggested) Lori Lemaris, Maxima, Dr Veritas, etc. Different relationships offer different stories. The whole Clois thing has been played upon soooooo much over the decades, there's simply no more different stories to tell -- only updated rehashes.

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davidwes

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Am I wrong in remembering that ww and sm are together in kingdom come? The way I always saw superman was that he was with Lois till she dies but he will have a much longer life and be with ww afterward.

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ssejllenrad

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@davidwes said:

Am I wrong in remembering that ww and sm are together in kingdom come? The way I always saw superman was that he was with Lois till she dies but he will have a much longer life and be with ww afterward.

KC is not canon though. But yeah there have been quite a number of elseworlds stories that have WW and SM ending up together. Dark Knight Strikes Again for one. Distant Fires is another. Still, DC One Million had pre-52 Superman ending up with Lois on the very very long run.

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amutant

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No. Superman should explore his options.

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davidwes

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@ssejllenrad:

Yes, but my point is many of those stories are loved even more then cannon. So it's not weird that sm should be with ww. The main problem is that the current pairing is not well done at all, not that it's being done.

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darkman61288

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@davidgrantlloyd: Stagnation. Stagnation is what Superman is. He is the first superhero. He is the archetype. Or the cliche of superheroes. Almost every parody of superheros has mocked Superman the most. Why because he is a cliche. Now you are here arguing that Superman dating Lois is a cliche but you ignore all the other ones. And those others ones that you ignore like say Supes being the most powerful hero have a much bigger negative impact on him. How many times have you heard the phase "Superman is too overpowered."

Another cliche is Superman's relationship with Wonder Woman. She is the second most common love interest for Superman since COIE other than Lois. There have been so many Elseworlds like Kingdom Come, Distant Fires, and TDKSA that have featured them as a couple. And in a lot of those stories WW follows Superman around like Renfield to Dracula. We see again it in Injustice. Also WW was shown to have a huge desire for Superman pre 52 like how a 15 year old girl desires Justin Beiber. So it is not at all a progression. In fact all the possible love interests you mentioned above but Dr. Veritas have been also used.

Now Dr. Veritas as a love interest. As Superman's girlfriend, that is a progression. But you know why DC did not do it? Because it would have been excepted by most fans and there would have been no hype to sell.

Another question is why do you, I and everybody else who has read or comment on this thread reads Superman? Because we view the cliches, the stagnation as a mythology. Which you criticized in your post above. If DC really want to progress its universe than DC would have killed off Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and all the other superheros and replaced them with new ones. But we would hate that now would we. So please stop talking about progression and enjoy the Superman/Lois romance when it starts again.

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Mercy_

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#107  Edited By Mercy_

Not under Lobdell's pen.

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Bogey

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Superman should compete with Apollo for the Midnighter.

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Eternal19

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@mercy_ said:

Not under Lobdell's pen.

this. I dont want Lobdell to mess it up

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Eeshaan1685

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Nope. Clark and Diana is a much better couple.

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Deranged Midget

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@mercy_ said:

Not under Lobdell's pen.

Word.

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RDClip

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Although I like the idea of Supes/Wondy (moreso than the current execution), I do want Clark and Lois to end up together.

It is important for Superman to have previous love interests before he hooks up with Lois. The idea of 'the one and only true love' is too old fashioned for a story today. So Supes relationship with Wondy is important for the future of the character. It could add future tension between him and Lois, Lois and Diana and Diana and Clark. On the other hand, him and Diana could have a amicable separation and then grow close as friends with small bits of romantic tension to spice it up a bit. Then when Lois finally gets with Clark, there can be bits of Lois feeling insecure that Clark once dated the woman that many consider to the the most beautiful in the world.

Lois is intrinsic to the Superman mythos and their love is one of the classic love stories of modern fiction. Lois can be and at times was written to be a very interesting character that is more than just a damsel in distress. And what people always seem to ignore when they call her a damsel is that she isn't just a passive participant (she isn't being kidnapped for being Superman's girlfriend) she takes an active role. She is put into danger because she is ridiculously stubborn, sworn to her jounalistic duty and courageous to a fault. She's brash and honest and unafraid. She is just the type of person that will put Superman in his place if he makes a mistake and to pull him up if he is feeling down on himself. Since they killed off the Kents (which I think was a mistake) Lois will have to play the role as Clark's emotional center and keep him tied to the human race.

As an aside, I hope that one day a new hero is introduced that is the child of Supes/Wondy from a alternate future.

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deactivated-60ae841330527

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It is a done deal. It has been confirmed that Superboy is a clone of Superman and Lois future son!

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davidgrantlloyd

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@davidgrantlloyd: Stagnation. Stagnation is what Superman is. He is the first superhero. He is the archetype. Or the cliche of superheroes. Almost every parody of superheros has mocked Superman the most. Why because he is a cliche. Now you are here arguing that Superman dating Lois is a cliche but you ignore all the other ones. And those others ones that you ignore like say Supes being the most powerful hero have a much bigger negative impact on him. How many times have you heard the phase "Superman is too overpowered."

Another cliche is Superman's relationship with Wonder Woman. She is the second most common love interest for Superman since COIE other than Lois. There have been so many Elseworlds like Kingdom Come, Distant Fires, and TDKSA that have featured them as a couple. And in a lot of those stories WW follows Superman around like Renfield to Dracula. We see again it in Injustice. Also WW was shown to have a huge desire for Superman pre 52 like how a 15 year old girl desires Justin Beiber. So it is not at all a progression. In fact all the possible love interests you mentioned above but Dr. Veritas have been also used.

Now Dr. Veritas as a love interest. As Superman's girlfriend, that is a progression. But you know why DC did not do it? Because it would have been excepted by most fans and there would have been no hype to sell.

Another question is why do you, I and everybody else who has read or comment on this thread reads Superman? Because we view the cliches, the stagnation as a mythology. Which you criticized in your post above. If DC really want to progress its universe than DC would have killed off Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and all the other superheros and replaced them with new ones. But we would hate that now would we. So please stop talking about progression and enjoy the Superman/Lois romance when it starts again.

Your entire argument is flawed. But that doesn't surprise me. The fact you have stated that "Superman is stagnation" and a "cliche" and should therefore always embrace the same concepts again and again forever, proves that you have absolutely no imagination or open-mindedness or any deep and/or diverse sense of perception. That's pretty pathetic.

BTW The reason I didn't address other elements of Superman's character is because that would've been irrelevant to this discussion (if you look at the thread starter, you'll notice it asks one question: "Should Lois and Clark get back together?" It doesn't ask anything about his superpowers or if he's overpowered ... so I didn't "ignore" these elements, as you suggest; I didn't address them because that's not what this thread is about. Duh.

Also, you're really reaching if you're seriously implying that SM/WW is as cliched as Lois & Clark. It's only been touched upon a handful of times. Lois & Clark, however, has been everywhere for decades. It's been done to death. There are no more stories to tell. It is stagnation. If you can't accept that reality then that's your problem. There are still several more stories that can be told with Superman and Wonder Woman, Superman and Lori Lemaris and ... well, pretty much Superman and anyone other than Lois. Once DC revert to that, there's really no need for them to call this continuity the New 52 any more. Incidentally, it was the New 52 which got me back into mainstream comics ... so, unlike you, I don't read these mainstream comics for the "cliches" and "stagnation" as you do ... I came back to the mainstream, hoping to read something "New", as DC said they would be doing.

And, with respect, when you assume to know why I and others read Superman comics, you do come across as extremely ignorant and obnoxious; just like you do at the end of your post when you're requesting me to "stop talking about progression". Just so you know, you are not the boss of me. I can do whatever I like. And I WILL continue to do so, whether you like it or not. Get over yourself.

Last word: SM/WW does symbolise progression. SM/LL does symbolise stagnation.

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lykopis

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What would be refreshing is to see a relationship in the comic world actually work without it needing to be in constant flux.

That would be great.

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darkman61288

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#116  Edited By darkman61288
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z3ro180

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Pre-52 people complained superman was married and that it was with lois lane and that he should be with someone else. New-52 that's what you get a young single Superman who is not with lois lane and with Wonder Woman. You got what you want and you still moan .

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davidgrantlloyd

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Nope. Clark and Diana is a much better couple.

Quoted for truth

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davidgrantlloyd

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#119  Edited By davidgrantlloyd

@amutant said:

No. Superman should explore his options.

Also quoted for truth

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deactivated-60ae841330527

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BeautifulTemptress

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@darkman61288: Here it is - John Lane Kent.The son of Superman and Lois Lane in "New 52."

Does anyone really thinks that Clarke have feelings for Diana?He meets up with one, but wants to be with another.Moreover, he cold towards Diana.

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davidwes

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@davidgrantlloyd: Stagnation. Stagnation is what Superman is. He is the first superhero. He is the archetype. Or the cliche of superheroes. Almost every parody of superheros has mocked Superman the most. Why because he is a cliche. Now you are here arguing that Superman dating Lois is a cliche but you ignore all the other ones. And those others ones that you ignore like say Supes being the most powerful hero have a much bigger negative impact on him. How many times have you heard the phase "Superman is too overpowered."

Another cliche is Superman's relationship with Wonder Woman. She is the second most common love interest for Superman since COIE other than Lois. There have been so many Elseworlds like Kingdom Come, Distant Fires, and TDKSA that have featured them as a couple. And in a lot of those stories WW follows Superman around like Renfield to Dracula. We see again it in Injustice. Also WW was shown to have a huge desire for Superman pre 52 like how a 15 year old girl desires Justin Beiber. So it is not at all a progression. In fact all the possible love interests you mentioned above but Dr. Veritas have been also used.

Now Dr. Veritas as a love interest. As Superman's girlfriend, that is a progression. But you know why DC did not do it? Because it would have been excepted by most fans and there would have been no hype to sell.

Another question is why do you, I and everybody else who has read or comment on this thread reads Superman? Because we view the cliches, the stagnation as a mythology. Which you criticized in your post above. If DC really want to progress its universe than DC would have killed off Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and all the other superheros and replaced them with new ones. But we would hate that now would we. So please stop talking about progression and enjoy the Superman/Lois romance when it starts again.

Stagnation. I'm sorry to beat a dead horse, but I want to bring up Kingdom Come again. In that we are introduced to the fact that Superman will live longer then most other superheroes. So will Wonder Woman. So at some point, Lois will die and the Superman will move on and be with Wonder Woman.

The BIG PROBLEM is that we are never going to move the "continuum" forward enough for that to happen. Because then too many of the current characters would have to pass on. I mean, look we have comics for what, 50 years? and Batman's gone through 4 Robins, but he is still what, under 40 years old? They add characters but don't age anyone. So we will never get to a period in time where Lois and Superman have been married, maybe had a super kid, and now Lois is dead and Superman can have a real relationship with anyone else.

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davidgrantlloyd

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@davidwes: Exactly. Mainstream comics stories tend to suffer the problem of having a beginning, a middle and ... that's it. It's serialised fiction and therefore is unable to complete the most fundamental basic principle of storytelling (that being, a story must have a beginning, a middle and an end). Giving Superman only one love interest is a handicap in serialised fiction. We already know he will always save the day, that's inescapable. If we always know he will only ever have one love interest ... that makes a predictable story even more predictable.

As I've said before, Different relationships offer different stories. Therefore, if anything, Superman's eternal marital status should be: Single. Because it keeps him in a state of relative unpredictability (as far as Superman goes).

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BeautifulTemptress

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Lois Lane wins Comixology’s poll for Favorite Superman Love Interest.

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BeholdTheSuperman

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They already have a kid together, what more do you want?!

:P

I don't like the reationship that he and Wonder Woman have. It is more of a plot device than a real relationship. I think Clark and Lois should get back together.

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STELIOS23

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Nope

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BeholdTheSuperman

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I like that alien chick that's always trying to abduct him.

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Lois Lane wins Comixology’s poll for Favorite Superman Love Interest.

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ZariusII

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STELIOS23

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#130  Edited By STELIOS23