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#51 Posted by consolemaster001 (6121 posts) - - Show Bio

Now I'm going to argue just for the heck

1. It looks childish. I mean, who among us would wear such a thing? He looks like a walking U.S. flag. (Transferred patriotism.)

Considering he was created by 2 AMERICANS as WW2 loomed in the distance, it's understandable. Propaganda's a powerful tool. But I get you, too much Jingo in Comic Books (I'm not American)

2. Why does Superman need a cape? The cape has no function.

He uses it to foil sword fighters. Well he would, if he wasn't a flying brick

a) Is it realistic that Superman wears the letter (S) on his chest? If this letter is from his home planet, where would his father have known that people will call him Superman? If it were the initial of his name, it would be understandable. Which alien would make a (S) on his chest, so he is called Superman?

Um, how long have you been reading Superman? I thought it was common knowledge in this community that the "S" is the family crest of House El. The public started calling him Superman, not his dad

b) A pair of glasses as a perfect disguise? Isn´t it strange that when Superman wears normal clothes and has a pair of glasses on his nose no one recognizes him? Well, his hair is a little different, but does it matter so much? What about his face, his voice and his body size?

Someone made an excellent point somewhere on this site. When most people see Superman, it's in times of crises. Blood, dust, smoke and such obscure him. He flies so he's probably also seen from quite a distance. Not to mention actual physical reactions from people that are panicking and running for their lives; shock, hormones, memory blocks/loss. Makes partial sense that the glasses and suit would work. And I don't think anyone other that Lois Lane would suspect a shy klutz of a reporter to be the guy who always saves the day. Simple misdirection

c) How does his heroes gap fits under his regular clothes? Can you pull socks and shoes over long boots? And where's the cape?

N52 gone and explained that away. He sticks a little "S" shield onto his chest that warps into armour when he wants it to. I think the cape grows out of it as well

There, I think I've sufficiently argued against the reasoning of this thread. Also, how would people react if they made his skin blue? Remember Electric Superman? Hell, the reaction to giving WW pants just goes to show that comic fans are the whiniest b*tches on the planet. Almost completely unreceptive to change. We HATE it

#52 Edited by deaditegonzo (3690 posts) - - Show Bio

This is the new movie costume, it has already made a lot of changes that you suggest, to mixed reviews. But the cape denotes royalty, it give Superman a regal appearance. In the new film, it even seems that he is basically wearing what is typical fashion on Krypton. It is a completely different planet from Earth, Light Years ahead of us technologically speaking, there is no telling what sort evolution their culture has went through. Who knows capes could be in our future.

Think about Star Wars, a film that is decades old now, and still the most popular franchise in existence. People could call a lot of the concepts dated, but they do not, because it holds up. It affects some part of its fans hearts and minds, beyond the obvious or objective. And id note, that the baddest dude in the galaxy, Darth Vader, wears a cape and pulls that sh** off. Same for Supes. Youre either a Superman fan or not, but there is a reason he is the most popular comic book character of all time, and certainly the most iconic.

#53 Posted by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@wboy: Sorry, that I wrote so extensively. But there was no other way. I haven´t selected Arnold specifically. I was looking for a bodybuilder body from head to toe. When I found nothing useful, I took Arnold.

#54 Posted by ssejllenrad (12790 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu said:

@wboy: Sorry, that I wrote so extensively. But there was no other way. I haven´t selected Arnold specifically. I was looking for a bodybuilder body from head to toe. When I found nothing useful, I took Arnold.

Suggestion for next time. Use Steve Reeves. He's got better tone and proportion than Arnie plus he's got the iconic "Reeves" name. :D Not to mention bearded Steve Reeves look like bearded Henry Cavill (New Supes)...

#55 Posted by Z3RO180 (6718 posts) - - Show Bio

The op is so freaking wrong

#56 Edited by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@deaditegonzo: I totally agree with you. The cape itself has many meanings, it is maybe a part of Superman's culture and it gives him a special look. However, one must not forget the time Superman was invented. In 1938, there was still another image of heroes (think ancient war heroes and Zorro). Back then it was cool. But times are changing and with them the images. I think, the cape could also be a disadvantage. Imagine, a villain is faster than Superman and grabs his cloak, as in this case, for example:

Superman won this "brawl". But the cape seems to be a security risk, especially if stronger opponents are involved. The Flash is faster than Superman, if I´m not mistaken. What luck, that he is only faster and not also stronger.

Howsoever: for me, the cape is and remains an ancient or age-old symbol that I can not connect to the modern era (as long as the cape has a function, like Batman´s cape).

#57 Edited by AlForeigner (80 posts) - - Show Bio

@blackreaper said:

@lvenger said:

This is literally one of the most ridiculous Superman topics I've seen for some time. And that's saying something. So basically what you want is to get rid of everything that makes Superman such an awesome character? Yeah bad idea. Very bad idea. Can't say I disagree more with the sentiment of this thread. Blue skin? Making Superman into another 'badass' character? And no cape? The cape is awesome. I'd wear a cape all day if I could :P

They should reinvent Batman. Instead of all black, he should wear pink. Also, they should replace his cape with a Dora bag. Instead of crime fighting, he should become a travelling hate salesman and change his name to "Hatman".

I agree fully with these guys. Especially what @blackreaper wrote, it's fair to say it did make me chuckle quite a bit.

Also, your asking to change a character which has inspired millions of children and inspired the creation of many other comic book characters simply because he looks "childish" by your standards? Fair play.

#58 Posted by BiteMe-Fanboy (8092 posts) - - Show Bio

Those pictures of Arnold scare me. Shame on you.

#59 Posted by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio
#60 Posted by Eternal19 (2076 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu: There is nothing wrong with superman's cape. He doesnt need to be reinvented. If you dont like the chracter then dont read his comics and dont go to his forum. Superman fans have enough of this nonsense already, we dont need anymore of it

#61 Posted by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't believe capes will be around forever altho it could take decades before Superman loses the cape since Dc only tweaks the costume a little bit at a time. Marvel has more characters without capes so that is probably a good place for those who don't like capes.

#62 Posted by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@eternal19: This is my thread. The topic of this thread is: Is it time to reinvent Superman? I made suggestions and would like to know what others think of my ideas. If you don´t like my thread, then why you are here? If you have factual counter arguments, then let me know. If not, then please stop to express your negative rejection. Words like:

"this is a stupid thread"

"just get out of the superman forum please"

"dont go to his forum. Superman fans have enough of this nonsense already, we dont need anymore of it"

are not wanted here.

#63 Posted by mhanuroth (209 posts) - - Show Bio

i think you are trying to apply real world logic into comics and that usually doesn t work

#64 Posted by danhimself (22718 posts) - - Show Bio

as others have said already this is just plain ridiculous....I'm getting kind of tired of people suggesting that the only way to write a good Superman is to change everything about Superman...these are the people who really just don't understand the character at all and I fully believe that the OP is one of those people

I also don't understand why people want things in comics to be more realistic....why would you want that? one of the biggest reasons people read comics is for the escapism...why would you want things in comics to mirror the crap that's going in the real world...use your imagination, get into the book, and have fun with what you're reading and quit trying to change it

the people who can't do this are the reason why we have the New 52 and it's crap takes on characters...they're why Superman went from the most honorable and idealistic characters ever to a punk in a blue suit who doesn't resemble his past self in the least

#67 Posted by danhimself (22718 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu said:

@ssejllenrad: Here to appease the minds:

Unfortunately I couldn´t make it perfect. I hope this design is more acceptable. (Yes, the S-Shield is a bit different.)

that's even worse than the New 52 suit

#68 Edited by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman has been around since 1938 and has indeed gotten some updates every now and then to keep up with the times. It is always fun to see people suggest changes for Superman. Some reasonable changes can take many years to implement. For example, I suggested for many years in the dc forums to get rid of the red briefs, switch to a kryptonian armor costume and copy more from Philip Wylie's Gladiator, so I got lots of the usual reactions from the conservatives. Some of these suggestions finally happened in the New 52 reboots. Changes to Superman do happen but we all need to be patient. Dc has no choice but to make changes to Superman every now and then to maintain profits. Right now, Superman is not selling well compared to Spider Man, so we can expect dc to implement more changes to Superman. Dc is still working on its answers to Marvel's x-men franchise which is why dc is always behind Marvel most of the time. An all blue costume for Superman is just too plain and does not look respectable if it is spandex and people will just make crotch jokes. The movie spider man is one of the few that retained spandex for the movies and it works bec. it is not just 1 plain color, they darken the bottom to hide the crotch and spider man is more of an acrobat which is one of the few areas of real life where spandex is still used.

#69 Posted by Eternal19 (2076 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu: But this has been done several times and it shows that you probably know very little about superman or his history based on the OP. If you're going to complain about stupid stuff like superman's cape and colors then you have to complain about every superheros cape and colors. Theres a reason the character has lasted this long and its not because he wears black and acts like batman. So, how about you research a little bit before you make an argument about superman being outdated.

#70 Posted by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't believe Superman is outdated altho he is losing out to the Marvel competition in both comics (teen market) and movies (teen market). The more fantastical dc stuff is still doing ok in the kids market which is where comics started in 1938.

#71 Posted by Z3RO180 (6718 posts) - - Show Bio

Bad just bad

#72 Edited by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

The Smallville tv show was able to appeal to a few million customers (teens and adults). Costumes used in the Smallville tv show were : 1. blue jeans. 2. black like matrix movie. 3. red leather jacket. A similar blue jeans version has been used in new 52 for the early days of Superman and maybe also for the early days of the earth 2 Superman. I prefer the armor look like Steel, Rocket Red, Hardware, Atomic Knights, etc.

#73 Edited by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@eternal19: I make arguments because I am familiar with the elements. I don´t have to be a Superman fan or Superman expert to have an opinion. And yes, all the other superheroes also need an update. You wrote: "this has been done several times". One should ask why? If Superman is so great, why do so many people make suggestions for amendments? The time of heroes in tights and capes is over. If DC won´t do anything, then they´ll have big problems.

#74 Posted by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

If the superman movie makes some money, dc will probably continue with the tights and capes for a little bit longer. In the comics, new 52 superman is supposed to have armor rather than tights altho it looks more like super tight armor. The movie Thor has a similar red cape and did manage to make tons of money.

#75 Edited by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself: Realism has nothing to do with the destruction of escapism. On the contrary: realism and escapism are one. Unfortunately that is not the case in the comics. Iron Man for example: he accelerated in a fraction of a second to supersonic speed. The occurring G-forces do not seem to affect him. His suit certainly can not protect him. Now the realism: his suit has a force field that protects him from the G-forces. Yes, neither the suit nor the force field do exist. But this is about science fiction. Unknown energy, new materials, etc. All this is fiction, but not necessarily impossible. But if it is impossible it should be believable. So to speak: The logic within fantasy. Superman does not exist, that´s clear. But he does exist in the comics and in the movies. And there he should be in the context of logic.

Superman's suit and his secret identity is my main concern. It's not about whether Superman is realistic; it's all about amendments that adapt to modern times. Is spandex still up-to-date? Or the cape? If not, what and how should be changed? I think Superman - as shown as in the comics and movies - is no longer up-to-date. He needs a change, otherwise on day his name will be the only one that remains. Anyhow he is not able to beat the Marvel heroes. Someday Hulk will come and devour his suit :-)

#76 Edited by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman does seem overdressed altho Hulk and the Thing are usually too underdressed. Maybe Hulk should always wear armor just to avoid becoming naked during battles.

#77 Posted by Avenging-X-Bolt (13684 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu said:

@deaditegonzo: I totally agree with you. The cape itself has many meanings, it is maybe a part of Superman's culture and it gives him a special look. However, one must not forget the time Superman was invented. In 1938, there was still another image of heroes (think ancient war heroes and Zorro). Back then it was cool. But times are changing and with them the images. I think, the cape could also be a disadvantage. Imagine, a villain is faster than Superman and grabs his cloak, as in this case, for example:

Superman won this "brawl". But the cape seems to be a security risk, especially if stronger opponents are involved. The Flash is faster than Superman, if I´m not mistaken. What luck, that he is only faster and not also stronger.

Howsoever: for me, the cape is and remains an ancient or age-old symbol that I can not connect to the modern era (as long as the cape has a function, like Batman´s cape).

doesnt Superman have X-Ray vision and enhanced senses? i doubt putting a cape over his head is going to hurt all that much.

Online
#78 Posted by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@avenging_x_bolt: It´s not about putting a cape over his head. The point is that one can grab Superman's cape and can throw him to the ground. It cant´t hurt him, but it would be quite embarrassing for the most powerful superhero of all time.

#79 Posted by Z3RO180 (6718 posts) - - Show Bio

@Zardu the point is your saying that superman needs reinventing when he doesn't he's an I comic character and what your suggesting if done will completely ruin the character.

#80 Posted by Avenging-X-Bolt (13684 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu said:

@avenging_x_bolt: It´s not about putting a cape over his head. The point is that one can grab Superman's cape and can throw him to the ground. It cant´t hurt him,

if it cant hurt him than what is the big deal? and couldnt he just spin around at super-speed and throw them off or something?

but it would be quite embarrassing for the most powerful superhero of all time.

Superman isnt the most powerful. he might have the greatest physical strength but he isnt the most powerful.

Online
#81 Posted by deaditegonzo (3690 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu said:

@deaditegonzo: I totally agree with you. The cape itself has many meanings, it is maybe a part of Superman's culture and it gives him a special look. However, one must not forget the time Superman was invented. In 1938, there was still another image of heroes (think ancient war heroes and Zorro). Back then it was cool. But times are changing and with them the images. I think, the cape could also be a disadvantage. Imagine, a villain is faster than Superman and grabs his cloak, as in this case, for example:

Superman won this "brawl". But the cape seems to be a security risk, especially if stronger opponents are involved. The Flash is faster than Superman, if I´m not mistaken. What luck, that he is only faster and not also stronger.

Howsoever: for me, the cape is and remains an ancient or age-old symbol that I can not connect to the modern era (as long as the cape has a function, like Batman´s cape).

doesnt Superman have X-Ray vision and enhanced senses? i doubt putting a cape over his head is going to hurt all that much.

That fight ends with Supes predicting Flash's next move, AND FLICKING him like 3 city blocks. Cape over the head? Not a problem for Supes,

#82 Edited by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

The Legion cartoon had a Superman X from the future with no cape :

http://thesuperherocostumingforum.yuku.com/topic/2209/Superman-X-DC-Animated-Universe#.UWMrv1tPuYE

#83 Posted by Press Oblivion (1658 posts) - - Show Bio

No, It's not time to reinvent Superman . . .

#84 Posted by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@deaditegonzo: That's right. But the cape will always be something that can attack by faster foes to pester Superman. Imagine an equally strong opponent who is faster than he would not let go of the cape. That would be very embarrassing for Superman.

But that's just speculation. I just wanted to say that the cape is a point of attack.

#85 Edited by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman's suit in the changing times:

#86 Posted by Eternal19 (2076 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu: the reason people do it over and over again is because they dont know what they're talking about.Many of them have never read a superman comic and just base their entire argument out of out of date material like you. DC is not going to change superman to fit your terrible reasoning for why he's out of date. The thousands of superman fans would disagree with you. People like you need to realize that its a comic book not real life thier is no need to change these characters when they're pretty successful right now.

#87 Posted by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

It is easier to reinvent a property if there is no knowledge of the history of the property. Imagination can come from anywhere whether newer material or older material. Superman tends to be reinvented around every 10 years to keep up with the times. Latest comic sales are out and lots of super heroes are beating out Superman titles in the sales.

#88 Edited by drgnx (3566 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman has been reinvented plenty of times.

and then some

and then some more

#90 Posted by Superguy0009e (2265 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

This is literally one of the most ridiculous Superman topics I've seen for some time. And that's saying something. So basically what you want is to get rid of everything that makes Superman such an awesome character? Yeah bad idea. Very bad idea. Can't say I disagree more with the sentiment of this thread. Blue skin? Making Superman into another 'badass' character? And no cape? The cape is awesome. I'd wear a cape all day if I could :P

Also, this is the result of a superman like that:

#91 Posted by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

@eternal19: In the comics, everything works. But not in the movies. My focus is on the comic adaptions for movies. Although I must say that the changes that I have suggested would be also well taken in the comics. Most people can not take seriously the colorful suit of Superman. It just looks totally ridiculous (that was not meant to be insulting). This is the reason why the suit for Man of Steel has been changed. The colors are no longer so candy colored and the worn outside pants is gone too. I think we must move with the times. Of course, not all things can be adapted to the modern age. But when it comes to superheroes, one should not be set too traditional. Hawkeye was completely changed, Batman has been changed, etc. The more modern the superheroes are shown the more credible they are.

One must not have read the comics. It just about the appearance of Superman. I know his background story and I know his suit. Even someone who don´t know Superman would find his suit ridiculous. Men in tights or heroes in colorful suits, you know what I mean. Imagine Batman would still walk around with tights:

Would it be a blockbuster?

I know, Batman is not Superman, his suit is mainly composed of black. Well, now we are looking at Superman:

Do I have to say something?

I know, it has changed much. But one thing remains: the colors. One of the effects of those super heroes is that people are identified with them. How can one identify with someone wearing those clothes? If you had super powers, would you wear the suit? I don´t think so.

It's not about whether someone is a Superman expert.

#93 Posted by Z3RO180 (6718 posts) - - Show Bio

@Zardu nop

#94 Edited by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

How about that?

In my opinion the S-shield is weird and too big. But the suit is not bad, more believable than the classical one.

#95 Posted by consolemaster001 (6121 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu said:

@ssejllenrad: Here to appease the minds:

Unfortunately I couldn´t make it perfect. I hope this design is more acceptable. (Yes, the S-Shield is a bit different.)

A big no no IMO

#96 Edited by Zardu (348 posts) - - Show Bio

There are many different ways to adapt Superman suit to the modern age:

The suits with the cloak reminds me too much of Neo from Matrix. But it does not look bad. In Smallville there was something similar. The main thing is that the suit is as far away as possible from the classic version.

#97 Posted by Z3RO180 (6718 posts) - - Show Bio

@drgnx under the picture with all the superman clones who's that dude in the picture above from blue marvel

#98 Edited by drgnx (3566 posts) - - Show Bio

@z3ro180:

Plutonian

When they start to make variations of your variations, you don't need more re-invents

#99 Edited by Z3RO180 (6718 posts) - - Show Bio

@drgnx thanks dude

#100 Edited by consolemaster001 (6121 posts) - - Show Bio

@zardu: Where did you find the trench coat one ?