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#1 Posted by fedykin87 (101 posts) - - Show Bio

I saw the issue and everything where he actually does so yes I know he died. What I'm wondering is if its actually sticking. Its clear that replacing Kon with Jon is purely out of laziness to fix the character by replacing him with the old 'son of superman' rewritten to basically be Conner. However, I still question if DC is actually killing him off for good or something. They have to know that doing so is going to basically kill the Superboy book which is the reason for the change itself. However, what was the point of Krypton returning for that split second only to disappear again, did it somehow bring Conner back or allow for him to escape the destruction in that short time some how? Also. Jon asks the records about Kon and his accomplishments which makes it sound like he had many over years. It also states he helps create the Legion which he clearly hasn't done yet. Are they just letting the character rest to try out this new Superboy who to me is a clear Superboy Prime reboot? Well he returns in the future as he did before and continue his adventures int he present day at some point? I certainly like to think so but also hope its retconned that he is a clone of Lex and Supes since this Jon Kent thing is just..........no just no.

#2 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

This is my theory,and so far it's only a theory,but I think time changed, and everything is different now.as in I don't think Jon is Lois's kid anymore,and I even think he is a clone himself now.

I don't think kon is a clone of Jon anymore, and I "hope" they change kon to a clone of kal and lex again, and change his powerset a lil ( YJ tv show as base, plus flight through full TK, and sonar vision from super hearing(it's another way to get his TTK senses without using TTK itself) so we get a more balanced powerset).

I think kon will show up in the Legion future,which is when he will help create the team,then comeback to stop Jon.

#3 Posted by danhimself (22217 posts) - - Show Bio

he's been dead since Flashpoint

#4 Edited by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself: the same could be said for Geoff johns Teen Titans#1,but both would be wrong, but I get that this version has been done really badly on many levels,when they could have rebooted him in a easy, clean, and more popular way.

Hopefully when he comes back we get what we want.

Btw Geoffs was great, besides not having enough attitude,and having to much kryptonian powers and almost no TK powers.

#5 Edited by danhimself (22217 posts) - - Show Bio

@stephens2177: I think Johns' more suppressed attitude for Conner worked because of what they had just gone through right before the series had started...it would have been awkward if Conner were still as carefree and easy going as he had been before Donna was killed

#6 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself: that's true at the beginning,but not in the long run.

Also his TTK disappearance,and almost total reliance on his kryptonian side was off.

#7 Posted by danhimself (22217 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself: that's true at the beginning,but not in the long run.

Also his TTK disappearance,and almost total reliance on his kryptonian side was off.

they kind of explained that...not in Johns run...it was either in the arc after New Krypton where they fought Brainiac or it was in Lemire's book...he said that he wanted so badly to be like Superman and because Superman didn't have TTK he stopped using it

#8 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself: it was during blackest night when that was written to smooth that over,but it was obvious from the first TT issue that his TTK was "limited" and from there on he used it in very weak ways, when he was extremely good at using it in his old book.

#9 Posted by The Stegman (22765 posts) - - Show Bio

I gave up on the Superboy title, this whole "Future son of Superman" crap is ridiculous and boring.

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#10 Edited by fedykin87 (101 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, the second I read about the future son of Superman I thought three things. 1) "this was clearly plucked from the hairiest, and sweatest a** they could find. 2) Isn't there already an Earth where this guy is alive, why is he in this one now? 3) Here we go, we're going to have the the DC version of Jean Grey who never had kids but some how 50 different ones from the future are in the present timeline's canon.Then it really pissed me off when they said Conner was a clone of him and not a supes/lex one.... you just don't mess with that it was far too good after they changed his original origin to it. When I first saw Jon and Kon fighting I thought Jon's suit looked a lot like that first one Conner wore in his own series and I sort of figured they'll be bringing the old Conner/Prime rivalry back through them or something.

Also, it strikes me as completely odd how its being played up right now. In some of the comics its clearly Jon pretending to be Kon but in Superboy's own series he's still Kon or at least he was when Psycho Pirate drained his powers or whatever. Then in TT 26 Jon/Kon is acting completely like Kon which could just be Jon taking his acting too seriously but it just seems like someone goofed at that. Still, I hope they don't try to turn Jon into the new Superboy completely. This kid massacred all the metas on the planet in his timeline and enjoyed it more and more. It might be fun to see him play a 'bad' superboy in the book for a while, but Kon should definitely come back, have an epic battle with him, and kick his butt back to is own timeline. Or, Jon's birth/conception is negated or something. But yeah, I get the feeling (or maybe a hope I'm thinking is a feeling) that Kon isn't really dead or dead for long and will be coming back. It would be far to stupid to kill off someone that has such a huge following (even if you're not happen with this post flashpoint version of him) for a version (future son/daughter of [insert important character here]) that has been done a million times in comics, books, games, tv, and movies and was a horrible, predictable, and pathetic deus ex machina all those times too.

#11 Edited by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

Well hopefully all the clues(or clues to me) that were dropped in Superboy #26 that Jon has been changed will also happen to kon when he come back.

DC has him being a kal/lex clone on the YJ show,the Smallville digital first book,and pre flashpoint,that could be considered consistent to most I think,hopefully we get it back.

Then we can work on his outfit( either YJ show or half superman new 52 suit)attitude( funny,mature,and strong willed)and powerset(physically on par with kryptonians or a lil below,with superhearing,full TK,flight,and either TTK senses or a advanced version of sonar vision).

#12 Edited by fedykin87 (101 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm still hoping they reverse the DCnU or at least merge it with concepts or something from the previous universe but its not very likely ever going to happen really. Though I'm wondering... Is Jon actually in Kon's body now or did he somehow just get his suit on himself, I didn't actually read what happened there (can't find out what issue of what series it was in)? It makes me think because if you recall the first issue of the DCnU Superboy, Kon states how every cell in his body held his consciousness which is why he was never really 'asleep' when they had him 'offline' Would that mean that his mind and personality would resurface if that actually is his body?

#13 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@fedykin87: the suit was put on him in the future by future beast boy.teen titans annual

Jon and kon are not merged,Jon is with the Titans,and kon is seemingly dead in krypton a explosion.

One way to bring this kon back is to say he is a psionic being,like pure energy.

I would love for him to 1- awake on krypton and taken in by kals parents where he learns to be more "real" and his kryptonian DNA surfaces.or 2- he awakes in the Legion future where he brings the team together,or 3- Kara remembers kon saving her and she goes to the explosion site and collects his energy consciousness and brings him back.

Either way he needs more kesel,Geoff,YJ show,and Smallville inspiration when he comes back.

#14 Posted by fedykin87 (101 posts) - - Show Bio

You could also say that his Kryptonian powers 'kicked in' when he lost his TK ones when Krypton was blowing. I get the feeling that Krypton returning for a small instant after it blew up will either play a part in Conner's return or effect something that changes the timeline which I hope wipes Jon away/prevents his birth or something.

Would it be too much to just say Harvest is lying for the lulz and jon and kon are just a series of supes/lex clones he's made to wipe out metas?.... actually... that might work if played right.

#15 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@fedykin87: I would like that explanation,they can say Harvest was trying to different DNA combinations to get the kryptonian DNA to not go "Bizzaro".

#16 Posted by fedykin87 (101 posts) - - Show Bio

and/or he spliced in lex's DNA to see if he can produce a subject that had Superman's incredible power and Kryptonian Physiology as well as the genius intellect and ruthless traits of Supes greatest enemy to make a weapon that would enjoy the killing and not go good on him. The TTK being something that just appeared from his human side 'going meta' or something he squeeze in and advanced with each attempt. Jon did say Kon was the only threat he ever faced out of all the metas he killed before and Harvest said his power was far greater than Jon's own. They could easy play up the old Superboy/Superboy Prime rivalry or the Superboy/Match thing reversed or something.

#17 Posted by Lvenger (17887 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah he's dead but the death has left an obvious loophole to be exploited when someone decides to bring Connor back and hopefully make him well written for a change as well. He needs to be brought back to life physically and creatively.

#18 Edited by John Valentine (16270 posts) - - Show Bio

he's been dead since Flashpoint

Word.

#19 Posted by Rubear (375 posts) - - Show Bio

I have suspitions that he was somehow transported to Phantom Zone or snatched to Legion future.
I think that another question is more interesting. What is in Jon Lame Kent mind? That insectoid mind-form looks like evolved Mr.Mind from 52, but there was brief appearance of green skin and red hair, which suggest completly another M.M.

#20 Posted by fedykin87 (101 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: True and a part of me will always hope its pre flashpoint conner that returns. But since that likely will not be the case then at least have him return to form the Legion/Krypton where/when ever he is and have him grow on it much like Conner grew on the Young Justice comic series.

@rubear said:

What is in Jon Lame Kent mind? That insectoid mind-form looks like evolved Mr.Mind from 52, but there was brief appearance of green skin and red hair, which suggest completly another M.M.

I instantly thought it was Miss Martian since the red hair, green skin and the eyes that look feminine just made me think of her.

#21 Posted by Lvenger (17887 posts) - - Show Bio

@fedykin87: That's the best we can hope for in the New 52. The Pre Flashpoint universe isn't returning at all so the best recourse will have to be a better written Connor who can be instrumental in forming the Legion.

#22 Posted by Dernman (14612 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't feel like he's dead.

#23 Edited by TDK_1997 (14435 posts) - - Show Bio

I think he is dead but Lobdell made the death into something that allows the next writer who writes the book or the character to have a way to make him come back.

#24 Posted by comicbookfan93 (392 posts) - - Show Bio

What issue did he die?

#25 Posted by fedykin87 (101 posts) - - Show Bio

@comicbookfan93: Superman 25

it was pretty much a really quick and like two panels type death. They really left it open to rather he really actually died and if he did then its so sudden and open that he can easily be brought right back

#26 Posted by Bigbadwolfx0 (277 posts) - - Show Bio

He is the real superboy they can't completely cut him out I think that he is lost in time again

#27 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

There has to be a happy medium between Geoffs(almost all kryptonian) and lobdells(all TTK) versions,cause that's what I want when he finds his way back to our universe.maybe cosmic boy, Saturn girl, and lightning lad will find him out in space somewhere and assume he is superman.maybe he will awake and lead them while his kryptonian powers grow(atleast physically) and he has no TTK to speak of.maybe brainy will find away to send him back home where Jon and his evil Legion is running amok.maybe

Hopefully the time shenanigans gives kon his more popular origin,a better mindset ready to be a hero, a new set of tron-less clothes( Kevin Moran just posted a pic of the teen titans on deviantart,has a perfect kon in it), and a more well balanced powerset(powered by the sun, physically powerful, but with TTK manipulation and perception), and plz punch Jon to the same source wall prime is on.

#28 Posted by The Stegman (22765 posts) - - Show Bio

@stephens2177: At first, I was kinda happy with his almost exclusive TK abilities, a way to differentiate him from the average Kryptonian, but to be honest, I'm not even sure how his powers work now in the n52. So does it augment his actual strength? Or is he just pushing others back with the TK with extreme concussive force?

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#29 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_stegman: I'm thinking it's all pushing and stuff,but I know it seems to make his durability insane though.

But yeah I was happy with it to,I was thinking of it as the next level in the kesel SBs growth,but it is a lil to much xman,not enough superman for me.he needs both are he isn't right to me,so I would just say he has the strength,speed,and durability that a kryptonian gets from gravity,and all the advanced powers were mutated to TTK, which is TK that can manipulate and perceive anything it touches that way he can punch and fight like a brick,but also do high end TK feats.

#30 Posted by batmannflash (6170 posts) - - Show Bio
#31 Posted by The Stegman (22765 posts) - - Show Bio

@stephens2177: I think he does that in the "Titans Tomorrow" story arc in Geoff's Teen Titans. He becomes Superman in the future, pretty much with all Kryptonian powers plus his TK is advanced enough that he can repel others easily.

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#32 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_stegman: yeah he can do that now also, but he does punch with it, not so much as a regular brick punches,more like he is powering up a punch.

Btw I know a lot of ppl won't agree with me, but having full new 52 TTK powerset and the whole kryptonian powerset together is a lil overkill IMO.superman has superior physical stats plus heat vision, super breath, and a huge amount of super senses, if you tAke away all these advanced powers you still have a superior physical body, and if you add full TK and TTK senses( touch or no touch) he is still way powerful.the more overpowered you are the better chances of you going bad or getting killed in comics.

#33 Posted by Dernman (14612 posts) - - Show Bio

I prefered Superboy with the TTK powers and not the Kryptonian ones.

#34 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@dernman: he was a lot more fun and unique with his TTK,but the kryptonian powers are popular with a lot of ppl,like the Geoff johns TT,YJ show, and the long time superman fans who don't think he is enough like superman.

I like the idea of combining the two now, but I used to want just the kesel touch TK, then I wanted the lobdell TTK senses to go with it,but I know to bring all the different Superboy fanbases together you need avoid mix of both.

A superman level brick with full TK and TTK senses/sonar makes for a badass combo, he could punch it out with the big guns,block magic with his TK,and sense just as much as superman can.

#35 Edited by Dernman (14612 posts) - - Show Bio

@stephens2177: As a long time Superman fan myself I liked the fact he was more removed from Superman in his powers. I thought it was better for both characters that way and was disappointed when they gave him Kryptonian ones. I also liked it when he tried to live a different like than one which was just too similar to Clark in Smallville. Though I didn't mind the jeans and tee shirt look.

I don't mind Lobdell's full TK abilities but the story and new look leave much to be desired. The Young Justice Powers I didn't mind for the show but for the comic I would prefer they stayed away from that.

I don't really think he should be a Superman lvl brick while he's so young in fact I would prefer him not to be a brick. He could start out with TTK while he's young then when he gets older he would grow and develop full TK abilities. Then if they go the way of him taking over for Superman he would be a different kind. One of the mind and not of the body. A Superman for a new age. Though to be honest if I was writing it by the time Superman was ready to hang up his tights Superboy would have already ditched the boy and used a different name a for long time. He would be glad to be his own person instead of going by someone else's name. Kind of like Nightwing until they forced him to become Batman.

#36 Edited by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@dernman: I agree with everything you said here, but at the same time I know there is a huge fanbase who love the YJ show, like Geoffs version,and enjoyed that last Smallville:titans arc to ignore, and if you want one strong voice, instead of many less strong fanbases you need to appeal to them also,and that means incorporate things they liked in those versions of kon.

Dress him like the YJ, smallville, and Geoff version, give him the physical body powers like those versions, and have all the rest from Lobdells version to pull in the TTK lovers.atleast that's what I would do.

#37 Edited by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

Actually those Titans of Tomorrow pics from above where the adult kon is blocking, then blasting adult Freddy freeman is exactly what he should look like when using his powers, then minus the heat vision, super breath,and replace kryptonian super senses for a TTK sense that can scan/read without physical contact.

He would still have pluses that superman didn't have like being able to block magic and kryptonite,and reading things no matter what it's behind or in like lead.

#38 Posted by daredevil21134 (10638 posts) - - Show Bio
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#39 Edited by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: actually kon has been alive and well in the new 52,the young justice tv show universe,and the smallville universe at jay Garrick's school,so no he hasn't been gone since then.now you can absolutely argue that the best version isn't with us now,but superboy fans are not on the same page about that.

#40 Edited by Teerack (5219 posts) - - Show Bio

I think he is dead because DC is on a campaign to ruin the few good things in it's universe.

#41 Posted by daredevil21134 (10638 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: actually kon has been alive and well in the new 52,the young justice tv show universe,and the smallville universe at jay Garrick's school,so no he hasn't been gone since then.now you can absolutely argue that the best version isn't with us now,but superboy fans are not on the same page about that.

He's gone to me

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#42 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: that's why I rewatch the young justice tv show,reread the Kesel comics and hope that Jon lane kent dies or is erased so we get a superboy back in the regular DCU again.

#43 Posted by daredevil21134 (10638 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: that's why I rewatch the young justice tv show,reread the Kesel comics and hope that Jon lane kent dies or is erased so we get a superboy back in the regular DCU again.

I can only hope.What was wrong with him being named Conner?Why did they change his name? And I hope Tana Moon comes back

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#44 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: kon/Conner is the name of the good hero clone Superboy,Jon lane kent is the evil psychotic son of Lois and Clark from a alternate future who wants to kill all metas,who in the new 52 is said to be who kon/Conner was cloned from.i want him dead or atleast have kon/Conner to comeback and kick his ass.

Tana is probably gone for good sad to say.wondergirl or ms Martian will probably be Kon's love interest in the future.

#45 Posted by daredevil21134 (10638 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: kon/Conner is the name of the good hero clone Superboy,Jon lane kent is the evil psychotic son of Lois and Clark from a alternate future who wants to kill all metas,who in the new 52 is said to be who kon/Conner was cloned from.i want him dead or atleast have kon/Conner to comeback and kick his ass.

Tana is probably gone for good sad to say.wondergirl or ms Martian will probably be Kon's love interest in the future.

Did he ever hook up with Cassie in the new 52?

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#46 Edited by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: they kissed in teen titans once,I would post the pic if I could.

#47 Posted by daredevil21134 (10638 posts) - - Show Bio

@stephens2177: Its too bad DC had to erase all their development from pre 52. Superboy is one of the many reasons I don't read DC anymore

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#48 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: I think they wanted to make him different than superman,where as Geoff johns tried to make him more like superman,also superman took a lot of the concepts that kon used before the reboot for himself.

The Kesel,johns,and YJ tv show versions are done with,but you still have the smallville version to look forward to,and he is a lot like his pre reboot days,just with TK and his own attitude.

#49 Posted by daredevil21134 (10638 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: I think they wanted to make him different than superman,where as Geoff johns tried to make him more like superman,also superman took a lot of the concepts that kon used before the reboot for himself.

The Kesel,johns,and YJ tv show versions are done with,but you still have the smallville version to look forward to,and he is a lot like his pre reboot days,just with TK and his own attitude.

I miss pre 52 Conner

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#50 Posted by stephens2177 (982 posts) - - Show Bio

@daredevil21134: did you read the original superboy series started by Kesel and grummett?