Religion… What do you think?

Why would I need to go through the whole list, after one of the test confirmed God for me? God handily confirmed one test and scripture says not to put God to the test; thousands of separate people praying in the name of Jesus and having their prayers answered, along with my multiple answered prayers is enough confirmation; it's silly to flip a coin 50 times and base that on God's existence and some of my answered prayers could have been rather silly in the eyes of some. The answer to 6 could be answered somewhere in the scripture that I missed, for the time being, or, more likely, something on a cosmic level that require us to have faith in God; God seems to have answered in other ways, like giving people insight into prosthetics, and further insight in bionic parts, and further insight into stem cell research; God could be working indirectly, in that manner.

First of all you did not confirm it....

So couldn't do the 50 huh? Afraid it wouldn't work?

If someone can prove it , then I will leave my religion , but until then , I will keep my religion .

@dshipp17:

Dear God, almighty, all-powerful, all-loving creator of the universe, we pray to you to cure every case of cancer on this planet tonight. We pray in faith, knowing you will bless us as you describe in Matthew 7:7, Matthew 17:20, Matthew 21:21, Mark 11:24, John 14:12-14, Matthew 18:19 and James 5:15-16. In Jesus' name we pray, Amen.

In Matthew 7:7 Jesus says:

• Ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. For every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. Or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a serpent? If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give good things to those who ask him!

If "every one who asks receives", then if we ask for cancer to be cured, it should be cured. Right? If "our Father who is in heaven gives good things to those who ask him", then if we ask him to cure cancer, he should cure it. Right? And yet nothing happens.

http://godisimaginary.com/i1.htm Try again...

My assistant pastor is an example of someone who was cured of cancer by praying to God, in the name of Jesus; it strengthened his faith and lead to his becoming assistant pastor; the cancer went into remission for him; there are other examples discussed on the 700 Club. However, the scripture also says that God is not mocked.

Which of my post's are you referring to? Also do you know the definition of theory?

a coherent group of tested general propositions, commonlyregarded as correct, that can be used as principles ofexplanation and prediction for a class of phenomena

Yes! Lets pray to cure one person and not the whole world.

You lacked proof that God did it.

He's quite confident that God cured him; the doctors sentenced him to death, so no further medial intervention was taking place; God cured other cases on the 700 club. God requires faith on a case by case basis; that's God's stipulation to get His intervention.

LOL yes, let millions of children starve every day, 10s of millions of people die during WW2 because of God's plan(he planned every day of our lives). "Everything happens for a reason" so abortion is "okay". Murderers aren't "bad" because God planned that they would murder.

There's also thousands of Christian missions in those places were people are starving. During WWI, millions of Christians were targeted for persecution and murdered, no one did anything about that, and that mass extermination is largely forgotten. Satan has a plan too; God respects free will in both human and Satan; there are thousands of millionaires who would rather have a fifth car than to help their fellow human being; there's unfair poverty in the United States; unfair judicial proceedings in the United States; the product of Satan and human free will, working together; as such, God promises to end this in the days to come.

@king_saturn said :

Okay, let's try this One More Time...

This is the actual verse being referenced :

Quran 16:93 "And if Allah had willed, He could have made you all one religion, but he causes to stray whom he wills and he guides whom he wills. And you will surely be questioned about what you used to do"

Now you had me read that one piece of the passage at hand that's not even the fullness of the passage we are talking about... I said in specific that Allah guides whom he wills and he rejects whom he wills ( paraphrasing ) as Allah chooses whom he will save and whom he will not. How exactly is this passage NOT clear of this ? It even says, If Allah had willed, he could have made you all one religion in the beginning of the passage... meaning Allah did not will for this to be. In other words, Allah saves whom he will and rejects or turns away whom he wills. It's clear here... and YES, it is you who have twisted the passage as you are too afraid to even quote the verse correctly.

You are no different from Christians... You Quote Mine your Holy Book and Condemn People just like The Christians do... Same Sh!t, Different Toilet.

This Teacher Analogy again... we already been over this. There is no reason for the Teacher to give a Test if he already knows what the results of the Test will be... as a matter of fact the Teacher should create conditions for the students where they could pass the test knowing they would not under the current conditions... or not have the students for the test at all. This goes directly with Allah's Omniscience and Omnipotence... as the Teacher has none of the components of Allah's Divinity making the Analogy "Completely Stupid"

I didn't change the passage... as a matter of fact I am the only one here who even gave the full extent of the passage and elaborated on it... you took a clip of the passage and tried to use it for your own benefit in this discussion. You twisted the passage in other words.

If GOD knows where you will end up before you exist... then he has predetermined your fate beforehand... he may not directly choose every choice for you... but what does that matter if he knows what you will do before you do it ? It's like saying a Computer Programmer knows that he will create a Program that will do nothing but create Viruses for Computers before Crashing the System... but the Programmer still creates the Software because he wants to give it a chance to exist ? See how stupid that sh!t sounds ?

Yeah, and I just killed your argument like 4 or 5 times already in the last 2 posts I replied to you with.

GOD doesn't care where a Man goes... just as long as there is some in Heaven and some in Hell... GOD is straight with that. If GOD did care where all humans go... he would guide all of us. GOD would not care about Tests... as he would have to see the greater picture here... which is, guiding someone to an Eternal Life of Positive Existence is better than to purposely save some and lead other astray as what is said in Quran 16:93 ( The Passage You So Willfully Quote Mined )

Sorry, I am getting tired of this mess because you are losing on all fronts...

Ok this is the actual verse : Quran 16:93 "And if Allah had willed, He could have made you all one religion, but he causes to stray whom he wills and He guides whom he wills. And you will surely be questioned about what you used to do"

In your previous post you changed the verse and posted : "Allah chooses whom he will guide and whom he will not" See ?? YOU changed the verse .

You are paraphrasing wrong . You have not even understood the meaning of this verse and so you can't paraphrase it . And did you even read my previous post?? It looks like you completely ignored my post . You are again stating that Allah chooses whom he will save and whom he will not. I already explained that guiding is different than saving . And you are making it sound like we don't have a free will . You are making it sound like that God is like a baby who doesn't know anything and wanders the world and whoever he sees , he guides or rejects him without any reason . You have misunderstood this verse . God does everything for a reason . And he does not randomly guide or rejects someone . He guides everyone who wants to be guided and is striving to find Him . He rejects everyone who is not a good man , does not strive to find his God and is evil . He does not guide these kind of people and hence, he rejects them .

Yes , Allah could have made us of one religion by taking our free will , making us like robots , putting devils and beasts behind who ever doesn't follow him etc etc . There are a number of ways in which He could have made us of one religion and in all of these ways , we won't have a free will or won't be able to use it . So God could have made us of one religion , but he has decided to give us a free will .

LOL , it is I ?? I who have twisted the verse?? The above portion clearly shows that you are the one who has twisted the verse .

Muslims and Christians are different.

Man , it is pointless , just pointless , to be debating with you , you ignore everything I say and repeat the same thing over and over again . Do you even think about something before replying to it??

I clearly said that if the teacher knew that the student will fail and he fails him before giving him the test , the student won't accept the decision of the teacher and therefore , it is necessary to give the test . And what's the point of the test if the teacher creates conditions for the student in which he is sure that the student will pass? That's like saying that the teacher cuts all the wrong answers in all the MCQs in a test and marks the right one and then gives it to the student . Would that be a test?? No , it won't be . A test is something which we have to pass by our own hardwork . This analogy is nowhere near stupid .

You did change the passage . Yes , you gave the full extent of the passage but before , you only took a clip of the passage and tried to twist it . And now you are accusing me of using a clip of the verse to get to it to my advantage ?? Wow , just wow . You truly are a troll . You are the one who took the clip of the passage first and twisted it . I only used the clip of the verse because we were just arguing about that clip at that time which was that whether Allah predetermines our fate or not . The rest of the verse was irrelevant that's why there was no point in using it .

Can you understand things like a normal man ?? Why do you not understand anything and why do you ignore everything and repeat the same things over and over again?? God has not predetermined anything except our birth and death . He doesn't choose what you do , you choose what you do . Now you are being pathetic . Why are you comparing a computer program with a human being . A computer program doesn't have any free will . We have a free will . We decide where we will end up . God has created everyone equal . It is upto us to follow him or not . If we end up in Hell , it is our fault . God has given us a free will and His book and guidance . If we don't even bother to go to his path , then how is God responsible for our fate?

You never killed my argument . All you have done is ignore my arguments . You are only killing my arguments in your head .

God cares where a man goes . God already has given you the guidance ( his word , the Quran ) . It is upto us whether we use that guidance or not . And God guides everyone who wants to be guided . He wants that everyone take His guidance and go to Heaven but god doesn't guide those people who do not want to be guided .

"…He causes not to stray, except those who forsake (the path)," (Quran 2:26)

This verse clearly shows that God only misguides who don't want to be guided .

and this :

"And those who strive in Our (cause),- We will certainly guide them to our Paths: For verily Allah is with those who do right." (Quran 29:69)

God guides who want to be guided .

What's the point of this cheap comment at the end of your post?? What is this supposed to do?? Scare me?? You are not winning by anyway . If anyone's losing , that's you .

And , if you are further going to ignore what I say and keep repeating the same thing over and over again , then there is no point in arguing anymore .

My God Man... Why Does It Take You So Long To Respond Back ? On top of that... You must be Awesomely Desperate To Come Back With A Response After A Week Of Inactivity Towards My Last Reply.

Anyways, Lets See What You Say This Time.

I paraphrased the verse to save on time... but the meaning is the same. I didn't ignore your post... I answered it by showing you the actual verse so you couldn't bend it anymore than you already was. It put your ass in check... I know it did because for the majority of this paragraph you just talk about how I didn't answer your post when I did. Guiding being different than Saving is irrelevant... besides if Allah doesn't guide you how can you be saved anyways ? And the passage itself clearly says that Allah guides some and causes others to stray away meaning he doesn't lead everyone to Salvation or Truth. Hence the whole if Allah willed he would make you all One Religion... it's because Allah doesn't will it hence we have those who are Saved whom he guides and those whom he causes to stray. It's simple... yet you seem to let this very basic passage elude you in meaning.

I didn't twist the verse... simply paraphrased... you twisted the verse because you altered it's meaning in it's entirety. That's the difference.

You still miss the point, the Teacher in GOD's case has the power to not even create the Student... to allow him to even be put in a position to fail. So if the student doesn't exist... he can't demand to be tested regardless of GOD's known outcome of the Test and his desire to be tested anyways. That's what you miss. GOD can create the student with different conditions to where the Student would pass the Test ( that would elude to Allah's Power ) yet Allah chooses not to do so. Therefore Allah is cruel for creating Students whom he knows will fail a test beforehand when A. Allah has the power to create Student under conditions he could pass the Test and B. Allah could simply not create the Student putting it in a position to Fail altogether. Simple Man.

No I paraphrased the passage... that is all. I did it because of time issues and having a lot of ground to cover. That being said, I came back to show the whole passage when your explanation of it was way off from what was being eluded to the original context of the passage itself. You did only use a clip from the passage... I paraphrased the core of it... not just one part of the passage. It's not the same. The troll line seems to suggest you are fatigued by our discussion and losing... because you wait 5 or 6 days to reply back to one of my posts... and yet and still your responses are lackluster.

I have said this over and over again... the sad thing about this paragraph is that you blatantly didn't read it in response to what I said earlier... I said in specific that if GOD knows where you will end up before he creates you... then GOD knows what you will do beforehand and he knows the most important part of you life... as if GOD knows when you will die and what you will do with your life... then GOD knows whether or not you will be with him after death or not with him. It doesn't matter if GOD doesn't directly choose every move for you in your life... if he knows what you will do with your life and when you will die and under what circumstances spiritually and physically then GOD as well as he knows when he will create you and under what conditions... then GOD knows if you will be damned or saved even before he creates you. That's what makes Allah cruel as he could either not create you or created you under better conditions to where you would follow him as circumstances and conditions deal a lot with whether or not a person is Religious or so.

GOD has not given you Free Will... he has only given you the illusion of it... for if GOD knows what you will do before you do it... and he knows where you will end up at death. Then your choices are already predetermined... then are actions that are being completed in a sequence GOD already knew you would complete them in. In other words, you are only following the actions of what GOD has predetermined for you... the freedom of choice you think you are is only that... AS YOU ARE NOT ABLE TO CHOOSE SOMETHING AGAINST WHAT ALLAH ALREADY KNOWS YOU WILL DO... Hence, your free will is only illusion.

We already been over this... the evidence that GOD doesn't care where Man goes is in the Quran itself... the very passage we have been discussing is proof enough... as it shows Allah doesn't guide everyone to salvation or truth. Allah doesn't guide everyone to Islam... making him cruel. Because he doesn't will for it to be so. The passage clearly says that.

So you finally found some other verses eh ? Problem is I found other verse that elude to the Opposite.

Quran 14 : 4 "And we did not send any messenger except speaking in the languages of his people to state clearly for them, and Allah sends astray whom he wills and guides whom he wills"

Quran 16 : 37 "Even if you strive for their guidance Muhammad, indeed Allah does not guide those whom he sends astray, and they will have no helpers"

So now we have 3 verses that says Allah chooses whom he will guide and leave astray against your 2 verses that says otherwise. So really your point is being mooted out with other verses. So much for the Quran being a guide... Hell, the book itself is wayward on basic Theology.

Nope, the last line is Truth. You are still losing... the best thing you did was bring these other verses from the Quran... the problem is there are more verses against your position.

@hylian: it's the one where the christian guy was saying the Big Bang, evolution, etc were theories, so I was telling you that that is correct, those all are theories.

Btw I find many of your memes offensive, but I guess that makes you happy, huh?

yes it makes me happy. Also what I feel like you are saying to me is that religious people are allowed to critisize atheists but atheist's aren't allowed to criticize religious people.

Also you should look at this website. It explains in depth the difference between a scientific law and a theory.

http://science.kennesaw.edu/~rmatson/3380theory.html

@hylian: I'll take a look a little later, but tbh i don't really care to much. My point was that your meme was wrong.

No one should be attacking anyone, we should all just respectfully bring up points supporting out position, and accept that 99% of the time that person will not change his beliefs/opinions.

Also when have I ever approved the attacking of atheists, and when have I ever done it?

why is it wrong? It seemed like you were inferring that atheist were completely wrong and that we shouldn't even try arguing.

@hylian: it's wrong because the man in the meme was right those are just theories. I hate to be a grammar natzi but it's implying not inferring. I do believe your wrong, but that doesn't mean I'm gonna hate on you, or say you can't have your own beliefs.

@equilbrium: @theamazingbatman: You say if someone can prove your religion wrong then you will leave it. My questions: Shouldnt you wait until it is proven true to start believing? What proof is required to convince you your religion is wrong?

@matthewparker: Just to let you know as @wolverine08 has let other people know I post a lot of things as bait to start arguing with people. As seen with my arguing thread. But I don't see anything wrong with people believing in a god but I hate when people try to use him as an excuse as why they don't accept things that have already been proven.

If God answers the prayers of the faithful, then no true Christian should ever need a hospital, be homeless or go hungry. I guess the millions of Christians who are in those situations don't have proper faith. God did,however, answer my prayer that The Miami Heat make it to The Finals this year!! So I'd like to thank him for that!

God answers all prayers with one of a few responses.

yes.

wait. (it will happen for you eventually)

No, you aren't worthy. (you're clouded by to much sin or disbelief for him to respond) and straight no. (probably because it would do more harm than good in the long run i.e. domino effect)

The biggest issue is that people most turn to God when they are in trouble and then shocked and outraged when he ignores you.. if your relationship is weak all along, it's unreasonable to expect him to pull through when something goes wrong.

@yodaprime wow, really? Good to know God put me on hold.

@theamazingbatman good luck with the bombings

ATT, Church Members

Please stop listening to Pastor Patterson and his Crazy End Times stories... No, the Sun and the Stars are not going to fall from the Sky and destroy the Earth. The Sun and the Stars are not literally located in the Sky but in Space... and they can't fall on to the Earth... Sun could Supernova... but that aint really falling to the Earth. In any case, stop letting these Dumb Ass Black People who call themselves Pastors school you on Science when their specialty is supposed to be Theology. Even though they get a lot of that stuff wrong too.

Thanks,

King Saturn

@yodaprime: Billions pray everyday not only when they need something. Even those peoples prayer go unheard. and the scriptures doesn't say He'll answer with wait or no. It says ANYTHING you ask in Jesus name will be given you. Where is the scriptures that says God will answer with no?

Psalm 66:18- If I had cherished sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened;

Matthew 6:7 -“And when you pray, do not heap up empty phrases as the Gentiles do, for they think that they will be heard for their many words.

John 9:31 - We know that God does not listen to sinners, but if anyone is a worshiper of God and does his will, God listens to him.

Matthew 21:22 - "And whatever you ask in prayer, you will receive, if you have faith.”

etc etc etc etc....

@yodaprime: . Many Christians are sinners and hypocrites so their prayers are not answered. Makes sense

Whoa I totally fount the conspiracy. lol According to the Bible everyone is born a sinner. So that must be why no one's prayers get answered. hahaha

@marvel_boy2241: Not only that, but 95% of Christians are Gentiles(anyone not Jewish) and God doesn't answer Gentiles either. lol

Wait for it...

Uh oh here it comes...lol

@pooty@marvel_boy2241

Psalm 66:18- If I had cherished sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened; -if my bond with acts of sin is greater than my bond with God, he's not gonna acknowledge me.

Matthew 6:7 -“And when you pray, do not heap up empty phrases as the Gentiles do, for they think that they will be heard for their many words. -Don't BS God. He can tell.

John 9:31 - We know that God does not listen to sinners, but if anyone is a worshiper of God and does his will, God listens to him. - No one knows what God's will is. But Christians believe the bible a guide. Therefore follow the commandments and such and God will be fair with you. No matter who you are.

Matthew 21:22 - "And whatever you ask in prayer, you will receive, if you have faith. - if you have faith God will respond. If you're faith is weak and you're skeptical he probably will not.

What do you mean?

@yodaprime: Post 13,381 didn't disagree with anything I said. Many Christians intentionally PRACTICE sin. Adultery, theft,murder, rape, war, greed, alcoholism, lying, abortion and my favorite FORNICATION, are all things regularly practiced by Christians. Therefore their prayers are not heard by God. So we agree on why God doesn't listen to many Christians prayers.

@deathhero61 said:

I believe in god but i don't believe in the bible or any of the bullshit pastors usually spout. i believe he created us just for the heck of it, the reason why i believe in his existence is because there has to be a higher power, life doesn't just spring itself. That makes no sense. There has to be someone behind it all. Let me give you some examples of how flawed religon and the bible can be:

Why would god allow millions of people to die in the worst of situations? Think about the personalities of some people in this world. Some people would help others regardless of what those certain others did to them in the past. Some people would even help their enemies. Take that into consideration. Why let so many lives be taken just because someone thinks differently? An omniscient person does not sound like the type of person to hold a grudge against someone who has different ideals and against someone who chooses to live his life without having a lingering attachment to faith. Its annoying and bothersome.

Masturbation is a sin? why did god make it possible? Being gay is a sin? why make people born gay? Not believing in the same god makes you evil? so technically any religon is right but at the same time any religion is freaking wrong yeah that makes sense.

Oh, Oh and i just wanted to point this out:

Thats going to be on the list of excuses for the Illuminati.

Honestly life could potentially be like this

But its like this:

I could go on and on about my theories of religon but there is no point really.

By the way to add on read this you guys:

http://listverse.com/2013/03/23/10-reasons-for-man-to-leave-religion-behind/

@dshipp17: @marvel_boy2241: @noone301994: @matthewparker: @dernman: @theamazingbatman: @equilbrium: @dimitridkatsis: @hylian: @yodaprime @king_saturn@willpayton

I made a thread about " would you survive the end of the world" it's about religion, world war etc. check it out if you can. thanks

http://www.comicvine.com/forums/off-topic-5/if-the-end-of-the-world-came-today-would-you-survi-1570389/#0

Good list.

@dshipp17 All of the people who were raptured and the people that accepted Jesus, after the rapture.....Yes, those that repent after the rapture will be saved,

Clarify please. When jesus comes the true believers will be raptured up with Jesus. The lost sinners will become part of the army of satan. Who's left to accept Jesus after the rapture?

@knightfall225 Well my christian faith says that God forgives so those who sin but ask for forgiveness are forgiven. But not if they major crimes like take a life on purpose.so i doubt 1.8 billion will go to hell

That is not exactly what is says. God does not forgive just because you ask for forgiveness. You have to repent AND not practice sin. Repentance is needed otherwise you are taking advantage of God's mercy. You can't just ask for forgiveness and keep intentionally sinning. And it doesn't say just major sins. If you keep intentionally sinning whether it is lying or having sex without marriage, you won't be forgiven

Acts 3:19

That is why I think so many religious people will die. because they think they can commit all the sins they want and God will automatically forgive them.

Can God pick up a rock so big that he can't pick it up? If he can then he isn't omnipotent because he can't lift the rock. If he can't make a rock that he can't pick up then he isn't omnipotent because that is something that he cannot do.

Jesus will rapture up all of the true Christian believers. The tribulation will start. Some people will accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior, while most people will continue to reject Jesus. Those who continue to reject Jesus will all accept the mark of the beast. Some of those who accept the mark of the beast will join Satan's army. Most of the rest of the people to accept the market of the beast will be slaughtered (e.g. first death); most of those who accept Jesus will be slaughtered (e.g. first death). The people who accept Jesus will not experience the second death. The people who accepted the mark of the beast will experience the second death. Those that accept Jesus and was fortunate enough to somehow live through the tribulation will live under Jesus's rule for one thousand years. Those who accepted the mark of the beast and lived to join Satan's army will perish in the first death to await the second death.

God does forgive those who truly repent and accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior. As I previously mentioned, they will be endowed with the Holy Spirit to help guide them and help them avoid backsliding; becoming Christian does not suddenly make people perfect, nor does God require perfection, upon becoming a Christian; therefore, these people are saved. A change will occur in these people; they should loss the desire to sin, or, it will become very difficult for these people to continue to sin (e.g. they develop a powerful conscious that keep them in check; that feeling and voice in their head is the Holy Spirit); if the person never truly accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior would feel no different and they will continue to sin easily.

@dshipp17: If it happens the way you say, I have no problem with that. Many people don't have faith in Jesus because their isn't much evidence outside the Bible to verify that he was the son of God. but after he appears, I think many will follow him. Some still will ignore him as they did in the past. My point about forgiveness is,as you said, you have to repent. Action is needed. I think many wrongly believe they can continue to practice sin without consequence.

it was necessary probably still is to get us into a society were we can share morels besides tribe. but since its start its been misused to control the populous.

Why can't we? All justifications for not committing sins come from rules and ideas (the nature of which are all often to be debated as figurative or manmade) that succeed the sin itself. All sins have existed in nature long before they were every considered sins. Nature teaches us that a vast amount of horrific deeds randomly occur and are often unpunished. Injustice is rampant in the world, you may consider it immoral, but saying that every instance of sin will be accounted for is a pipe dream at best.

Gods are infallible moral authorities that are generally created by men to justify their only beliefs without actually having to verify these conclusions through logic or science. Sins are subjective areas of behavior which a God has prohibited his followers from enacting. Different people worship different Gods, consider different types of behavior to be sinful, lack the cultural awareness to know the implications of committing sin or know of another faiths sin but do not fear the consequences of sinning. Even from a secular viewpoint making laws against sin will not result in the punishment of every or even most sinners in the world. Therefore, many people can practice sin without consequence.

@dngn4774: I'm talking about Christian views and what the Bible says.

The above is just awful.

I dont like religion

so a invisible man in the sky made everything out of nothing

It is proven to be true . The Quran (which was revealed 1400 years earlier ) contains scientific miracles that no man could have had written at that time and some on them have been recently discovered and many of its prophecies have come true and are coming true .

I don't know what proof I need to be proved wrong . You decide . It is upto to you to use anything that proves that my religion is wrong .

@dimitridkatsis said:

@yodaprime wow, really? Good to know God put me on hold.

@theamazingbatman good luck with the bombings

LOL . Bombings?? Are you serious??

Sure .

@dshipp17 said:

What about people who don't believe in this god? What happens to them. They didn't grow up in a Christian country so they can't help but believe in those other gods. You can't control what you believe. And aren't you leaving out the part about the seven-headed dragon that comes out of the ocean. And Death riding around on a horse.

You don't have children? Do you?