#1 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio
#2 Posted by tg1982 (2715 posts) - - Show Bio

I'd prefer 100%

#3 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

Yay!!!!

#4 Posted by pooty (10863 posts) - - Show Bio

I like Obama more then Romney but I was not AT ALL impressed by Obama. I don't see that he accomplished anything that will leave a positive mark on society

#5 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@tg1982 said:

I'd prefer 100%

Agreed!

#6 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty said:

I like Obama more then Romney but I was not AT ALL impressed by Obama. I don't see that he accomplished anything that will leave a positive mark on society

ObamaCare is pretty notable, although frankly I would have preferred if the Dems had pushed for a single-payer system like what they really wanted. Single-payer is better overall and even much more business-friendly. Our current system that puts the burden of healthcare insurance on businesses is anachronistic and, well... dumb.

Also, I think when history looks back Obama will be recognized for the monumental task of keeping the economy from completely tanking, and avoiding a second Great Depression.

#7 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

No more Don't Ask Don't Tell!!! I think that is very positive.

#8 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@charlieboy said:

No more Don't Ask Don't Tell!!! I think that is very positive.

Remember when Republicans were yelling that getting rid of DADT would be disastrous for the military? McCain said that it would do "great damage" to the military and that it was a "very sad day"?

Uhmm... yeah, I guess it was so disastrous for the military that no one even noticed. Literally not a single negative thing happened because of getting rid of DADT.

#9 Posted by Matchstick (565 posts) - - Show Bio

Sure not enough got done during his term, but you have to take into account Republican obstruction in the Congress. Republicans have used the filibuster a record breaking number of times to block anything from going to a vote. Now the same people that prevented things from getting done in Washington are the same ones complaining that nothing got done. The only thing that you can really blame Obama for is not ramming a bunch of stuff through Congress when the Democrats had a super majority. Pretty sad when wanting to work with the other party turns out to be a mistake.

Obama will get reelected though, hopefully he'll get a Congress that actually wants to get things done this time.

#10 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@Matchstick said:

Sure not enough got done during his term, but you have to take into account Republican obstruction in the Congress. Republicans have used the filibuster a record breaking number of times to block anything from going to a vote. Now the same people that prevented things from getting done in Washington are the same ones complaining that nothing got done. The only thing that you can really blame Obama for is not ramming a bunch of stuff through Congress when the Democrats had a super majority. Pretty sad when wanting to work with the other party turns out to be a mistake.

Obama will get reelected though, hopefully he'll get a Congress that actually wants to get things done this time.

I agree with this.

#11 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton: He has done more for the gay community than any other president so he definitely has my vote. And Republicans have been trying to keep gays in the closet forever.

#12 Posted by NlGHTCRAWLER (2899 posts) - - Show Bio

Big surprise there.

#13 Posted by Necrotic_Lycanthrope (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

Honestly, I hope he doesn't. I really hope he doesn't. I don't want to last another 4 years of having to see my family's business sink more and more because of a never-ending Depression (screw Recessions, this is a Greater Depression).

You guys can have him. I just don't want me and my little sister stuck for the rest of our lives paying back someone else's spending spree. We're already at birth with 40,000 dollars labeled to our heads. Let's not make it another 40 grand.

#14 Edited by Living_Monstrosity (428 posts) - - Show Bio

Hooray, 4 more years of the same bad economy!

#15 Posted by Matchstick (565 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope said:

Honestly, I hope he doesn't. I really hope he doesn't. I don't want to last another 4 years of having to see my family's business sink more and more because of a never-ending Depression (screw Recessions, this is a Greater Depression).

You guys can have him. I just don't want me and my little sister stuck for the rest of our lives paying back someone else's spending spree. We're already at birth with 40,000 dollars labeled to our heads. Let's not make it another 40 grand.

No it's not a Depression, it's a slow economy. By the numbers where not even in a recession anymore.

You have Congress to blame for that, not Obama. They are the ones that aren't voting on any bills. If nothing gets passed, nothing gets fixed.

#16 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope said:

Honestly, I hope he doesn't. I really hope he doesn't. I don't want to last another 4 years of having to see my family's business sink more and more because of a never-ending Depression (screw Recessions, this is a Greater Depression).

You guys can have him. I just don't want me and my little sister stuck for the rest of our lives paying back someone else's spending spree. We're already at birth with 40,000 dollars labeled to our heads. Let's not make it another 40 grand.

The problem is that much of that spending you dislike was caused by the Bush Tax Cuts and the Iraq and Afghanistan wars. So by "someone else's spending spree" whether you know it or not you're talking about spending that the Republicans created. Now if we consider the spending on TARP and the economic recovery was also a result of the economic meltdown that started under Bush... well, you get the idea.

http://www.cbpp.org/files/10-10-12bud.pdf

#17 Posted by KnightRise (4785 posts) - - Show Bio

@Matchstick said:

Sure not enough got done during his term, but you have to take into account Republican obstruction in the Congress. Republicans have used the filibuster a record breaking number of times to block anything from going to a vote. Now the same people that prevented things from getting done in Washington are the same ones complaining that nothing got done.

Thistimes one million

#18 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think the economy is going to be a quick fix. A president is not going to be able to magically fix it. It takes time.

#19 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope said:

Also, The Economist endorsed Obama. Not a ringing endorsement, but still an endorsement. I think they know something about economics and such.

http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21565623-america-could-do-better-barack-obama-sadly-mitt-romney-does-not-fit-bill-which-one

You say your family has a business... they have something to say specifically for people like you then:

"As a result, this election offers American voters an unedifying choice. Many of The Economist’s readers, especially those who run businesses in America, may well conclude that nothing could be worse than another four years of Mr Obama. We beg to differ. For all his businesslike intentions, Mr Romney has an economic plan that works only if you don’t believe most of what he says. That is not a convincing pitch for a chief executive. And for all his shortcomings, Mr Obama has dragged America’s economy back from the brink of disaster, and has made a decent fist of foreign policy. So this newspaper would stick with the devil it knows, and re-elect him."

#20 Posted by Wonderbrezzy (221 posts) - - Show Bio

Team Obama !

#21 Posted by Lvenger (18531 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm surprised psychoknights hasn't been on here yet. He's a pretty staunch Republican from what I've seen.

#22 Posted by Rumble Man (11119 posts) - - Show Bio
#23 Posted by King Saturn (223841 posts) - - Show Bio
I think Obama will be re-elected. 
#24 Posted by redbird3rdboywonder (3881 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm indifferent about this either way honestly.

#25 Posted by Nefarious (18883 posts) - - Show Bio

It is inevitable.

#26 Posted by Swagger462 (382 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton said:

ObamaCare is pretty notable, although frankly I would have preferred if the Dems had pushed for a single-payer system like what they really wanted. Single-payer is better overall and even much more business-friendly. Our current system that puts the burden of healthcare insurance on businesses is anachronistic and, well... dumb.

Also, I think when history looks back Obama will be recognized for the monumental task of keeping the economy from completely tanking, and avoiding a second Great Depression.

@charlieboy said:

No more Don't Ask Don't Tell!!! I think that is very positive.

@Matchstick said:

Sure not enough got done during his term, but you have to take into account Republican obstruction in the Congress. Republicans have used the filibuster a record breaking number of times to block anything from going to a vote. Now the same people that prevented things from getting done in Washington are the same ones complaining that nothing got done. The only thing that you can really blame Obama for is not ramming a bunch of stuff through Congress when the Democrats had a super majority. Pretty sad when wanting to work with the other party turns out to be a mistake.

Obama will get reelected though, hopefully he'll get a Congress that actually wants to get things done this time.

The voices of reason have spoken.

#27 Edited by Necrotic_Lycanthrope (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton:

I get it that you like Obama, fine. But I'd prefer it if there's an economic conversation that happens without having to go back 4 years to George W. Bush. The tax cuts many like to blame for everything. But here's an interesting tidbit I learned from a conservative speaker at the last Tea Party I went to (you'll probably ignore everything else I write after the words Tea Party, but I don't give a damn.)

People hate the rich. They hate that there are others out there with more money than them. But the rich are the ones that help put money back into the economy. The money they spend on buying businesses, paying employees etc. This increases the amount of cash people working for them get. They are then given an incentive to spend that money, thus building up the economy.

Now if you tax and tax and tax the rich, sure they have a lot of cash, but after a while, the money will run out. The millionaires who helped boost the economy leave, leaving behind those who relied on their economic impact. The taxes increase even more. More businesses move out. Then people with less cash are targeted and end up losing revenue fast. They also leave the area.

Soon, all that's left are those who rely entirely on the state and government. The system collapses on itself with the lack of cash that they used to get when they bullied businesses.

The tax cuts weren't implanted to spoil the evil millionaires. They were implanted so as to give the millionaires more incentive in spending cash they saved up in order to benefit the economy. Spending all that cash only of taxes does nothing for the economy. It just gets put into the pockets of state workers and politicians.

Ever wonder why Los Angeles has roads like in the rural areas, despite being in the middle of millions of buildings and people? It's because all the cash that was said to be used on the economy via taxes gets filtered into pay-outs. Nothing is left to benefit the people.

@WillPayton:

My response is a question: If there are 300 plus million registered US citizens living in the US, why are only about 800,000 working or have acquired new jobs?

#28 Posted by Sherlock (7246 posts) - - Show Bio

TBH I don't really care who wins.(If I had my way neither would)Neither one or the other is going to do anything note worthy in four years (Obama already has a term proving that)

#29 Posted by TheNooseIsLoose (1900 posts) - - Show Bio

I already voted Green. I would just like anybody else. Democrats suck, Republicans blow.

#30 Posted by Necrotic_Lycanthrope (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

@Matchstick:

A Republican Congress has been in place less than 2 years. Before then, and into the Bush era, it was almost entirely Democratic.

The only thing I believe Bush was able to pull from Congress was to retaliate because of the attacks on 9/11. Everything else was only enacted after the Democrats in power gave their consent.

But Obama has passed a lot of stuff without going through due-process, the most obvious being Obama-care (Affordable Care my ass. If my grandpa was here under Obama-care, they'd pull a Kevorkian on him.)

The vote said specifically that most Americans did not want it passed. It passed anyways, and all I hear as a reason is because we need to pass it in order to understand it.

I'm no idiot. I've spent my life having people shove their interests down my throat. To talk to me, my family, my friends. My fellow PEOPLE like we're kindergartners with no brains?

You guys may love it all you want. But I prefer doing things on my own, and not have a mortal god tell me how to live my life.

#31 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope said:

@WillPayton:

I get it that you like Obama, fine. But I'd prefer it if there's an economic conversation that happens without having to go back 4 years to George W. Bush. The tax cuts many like to blame for everything. But here's an interesting tidbit I learned from a conservative speaker at the last Tea Party I went to (you'll probably ignore everything else I write after the words Tea Party, but I don't give a damn.)

People hate the rich. They hate that there are others out there with more money than them. But the rich are the ones that help put money back into the economy. The money they spend on buying businesses, paying employees etc. This increases the amount of cash people working for them get. They are then given an incentive to spend that money, thus building up the economy.

Now if you tax and tax and tax the rich, sure they have a lot of cash, but after a while, the money will run out. The millionaires who helped boost the economy leave, leaving behind those who relied on their economic impact. The taxes increase even more. More businesses move out. Then people with less cash are targeted and end up losing revenue fast. They also leave the area.

Soon, all that's left are those who rely entirely on the state and government. The system collapses on itself with the lack of cash that they used to get when they bullied businesses.

The tax cuts weren't implanted to spoil the evil millionaires. They were implanted so as to give the millionaires more incentive in spending cash they saved up in order to benefit the economy. Spending all that cash only of taxes does nothing for the economy. It just gets put into the pockets of state workers and politicians.

Ever wonder why Los Angeles has roads like in the rural areas, despite being in the middle of millions of buildings and people? It's because all the cash that was said to be used on the economy via taxes gets filtered into pay-outs. Nothing is left to benefit the people.

@WillPayton:

My response is a question: If there are 300 plus million registered US citizens living in the US, why are only about 800,000 working or have acquired new jobs?

You start off by saying "People hate the rich", which is actually why someone would tune out what you're saying, not because of any of what you said afterwards. This is a straw man argument I often hear on Fox News and from the Tea Party. So if you actually want a real discussion you should probably start by not regurgitating stuff like that which is simply nonsense.

Now I could go on to give counter-points to what you said, but then this will become a whole long debate. I think maybe instead you should go back and read the endorsement I posted from The Economist. If you want to come back and tell me that they're wrong because they dont know as much about economics as you, well, I'll be interested to hear what your qualifications are. I dont think you can really accuse them of being biased, since their endorsement was equally harsh on Obama.

In any case what I will say is that while agree that some of what you said are valid points, I think that you're doing what conservatives and Tea Partiers do constantly, which is to oversimplify and misunderstand how the overall economy works. You conveniently ignore, or are not aware of, the fact that we actually had much, much higher top tax rates (around 90%) at the times when the US economy was doing its best. You ignore that as top tax rates have come down, income inequality has gone up. There's a very strong correlation between the two curves. I could go on, but since you've already decided that people who disagree with you "hate the rich", I'm not interested in wasting time. Feel free to ignore facts and context all you want, you're only hurting yourself.

#32 Posted by WillPayton (9192 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope said:

@WillPayton:

My response is a question: If there are 300 plus million registered US citizens living in the US, why are only about 800,000 working or have acquired new jobs?

I have no idea where this 800,000 number comes from or how exactly it's relevant to the US population.

#33 Posted by ssejllenrad (12847 posts) - - Show Bio

Meh... Both suck... But at least he is the lesser evil.

#34 Posted by YoungJustice (6697 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't see why everyone is mad at Obama (concerning the economy), this was a real life case of the butterfly effect. IMO, if Bush didn't screw everything up, we most likely wouldn't be in this mess.

#35 Posted by Xanni15 (6758 posts) - - Show Bio

If only he had already been re-elected and our country could move on. Rather than attack Obama, people should try their very best to pump up someone better. Good luck with that.

#36 Posted by Necrotic_Lycanthrope (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton:

Well I'm sorry if I'm not up to Ivy League material when it comes to economics. You could be talking to Reagan back in the '80s and still say the exact same things about not knowing jack about how the economy works.

And my reasoning for the numbers was that, as far as I know because I can and will be off by several thousand, that is the number of people who gained jobs in the US. The unemployment has kept at a steady 7-8 percent average, but per state can be lower or higher. For example, California has the highest, if not one of the highest of all debt and poverty per state, with South Dakota being one of the lower ones.

Now I'm only a Geology student, but that doesn't seem like a healthy economy now does it? Tell me more about how wonderful our country has turned out to be under the guiding light of Mr. Obama, or the Democratic house legislature as a whole (the Republicans in office do not include in this since they came in halfway during his term.)

#37 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

Just the thought of Romney getting elected gives me nightmares.

#38 Posted by Gambit1024 (9890 posts) - - Show Bio

Cool.

I could care less about Romney, but Paul Ryan is an idiot. The further away he is from the White House, the better.

#39 Posted by Necrotic_Lycanthrope (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

@WillPayton:

Dude, I don't ignore. I study at an intensely liberal college and was taught subjects by nothing but liberal school teachers. The only once of conservatism I've ever heard is either during dinner time with the fam or the (once every few years) Tea Party I attend.

And don't start telling me about the issues with the Tea Party. I've heard about how evil, racist and vile they are for a quarter of my life span. If I even try saying something to defend them, I get mugged.

#40 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope: You should be able to say how you feel without getting attacked. You have every right to your opinions. I hope everybody on here can be adults.

#41 Posted by Necrotic_Lycanthrope (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

@charlieboy:

Oddly enough, I did spend a year fearing for my life during the last election. Mainly because I was shifting towards a more conservative opinion in a liberal school, and hearing about kids and adults getting shot and tarred and feathered for it made me freak out big time.

#42 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope: I can understand that. I live in Oklahoma and am very liberal. lol

#43 Posted by Living_Monstrosity (428 posts) - - Show Bio

All I see from WillPayton is pseudo-intellectual partisan hackery.

#44 Posted by Nova`Prime` (4157 posts) - - Show Bio

Really you can guarantee this? Do you know this weeks powerball numbers as well?

#45 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

@Nova`Prime`: Did you read the op? Just talking percentages.

#46 Posted by Necrotic_Lycanthrope (2388 posts) - - Show Bio

@charlieboy:

Lol, I'm a Californian. :3 Surrounded at all times by nothing but liberals (think extremist liberals instead of the nice, but gently refuse kinds). Plus we have Mexico nearby (like 3 hours away for me, but what ev.)

#47 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

@Living_Monstrosity: Can't you just say your opinion without having to resort to attacks? There are conservatives on this post that aren't attacking.

#48 Posted by Living_Monstrosity (428 posts) - - Show Bio

@charlieboy: no

#49 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

@Necrotic_Lycanthrope: Yeah we are in exact opposite situations. I am around lots of extremist Conservatives. One of our state representatives think that gay people are as bad as terrorists.

#50 Posted by charlieboy (7154 posts) - - Show Bio

@Living_Monstrosity: Yeah I figured. A lot of your posts I read are rather aggressive.