#1 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

A lot of people have problems with certain genres (mainly ones with lots of mindless sex or violence, or portrayals of certain groups that they find unfair)

So, if you think a work of fiction is really that bad, should you just not watch it, or is there a point where you petition to get it banned?

#2 Posted by ColonelRunAway (369 posts) - - Show Bio

#3 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Posted by Dabee (2380 posts) - - Show Bio

No. If something offends you, don't watch it. As long as it's not child pornography or anything where people are being taken advantage of, it has every right to exist.

#5 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

@dabee said:

No. If something offends you, don't watch it. As long as it's not child pornography or anything where people are being taken advantage of, it has every right to exist.

what if its super-racist?

#6 Posted by dondave (34560 posts) - - Show Bio

@dabee said:

No. If something offends you, don't watch it. As long as it's not child pornography or anything where people are being taken advantage of, it has every right to exist.

Online
#7 Posted by Guardian_of_Gravity (2973 posts) - - Show Bio
#8 Posted by BumpyBoo (7676 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

@dabee said:

No. If something offends you, don't watch it. As long as it's not child pornography or anything where people are being taken advantage of, it has every right to exist.

I just cannot agree with this enough.

#9 Posted by JediXMan (29623 posts) - - Show Bio
@dabee said:

No. If something offends you, don't watch it. As long as it's not child pornography or anything where people are being taken advantage of, it has every right to exist.

This.

what if its super-racist?

Then don't watch it.

#10 Posted by Samimista (20609 posts) - - Show Bio

@bumpyboo said:

@dondave said:

@dabee said:

No. If something offends you, don't watch it. As long as it's not child pornography or anything where people are being taken advantage of, it has every right to exist.

I just cannot agree with this enough.

#11 Posted by theTimeStreamer (2841 posts) - - Show Bio

twilight. it makes young girls old dumb women.

#12 Posted by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

:D

No but in all seriousness Id say no. No matter how grotesque, disturbing, unsettling or offensive you may find it, it has every right to still be there. At the end of the day its a work of fiction. If you don't like it, don't watch it. This is fiction we are talking about here. Not murder or rape or pedophilia or whatever else, but fiction.

#13 Posted by OblivionKnight (3356 posts) - - Show Bio

As some have stated, it depends entirely on the work of fiction. Anything that dehumanizes a certain ethnic group or religion should be looked at with careful scrutiny, but some movies have racism in it because the racism may have been part of the era in which the movie takes place. A perfect example being the recently released "The Butler." Nobody is up in arms about it. Now, there's a difference between a racist movie and a movie that has racism. If people are going around in black face or something along those lines, then there's a problem.

Ultimately, not all works of fiction should be allowed. Turning a blindeye to something doesn't help anything. Generally, however, I think everyone's on the same page on what should be allowed and what shouldn't.

#14 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

As some have stated, it depends entirely on the work of fiction. Anything that dehumanizes a certain ethnic group or religion should be looked at with careful scrutiny, but some movies have racism in it because the racism may have been part of the era in which the movie takes place. A perfect example being the recently released "The Butler." Nobody is up in arms about it. Now, there's a difference between a racist movie and a movie that has racism. If people are going around in black face or something along those lines, then there's a problem.

Ultimately, not all works of fiction should be allowed. Turning a blindeye to something doesn't help anything. Generally, however, I think everyone's on the same page on what should be allowed and what shouldn't.

@jedixman

#15 Posted by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

If the work of fiction itself is racist, in the sense that it conveys that kind of message. Then is it fiction anymore? Since that view point is a real view point that is actually being presented. It is no longer fiction but real. In the same sense that if someone was actually murdered on screen it is no longer fiction but reality.

#16 Posted by OblivionKnight (3356 posts) - - Show Bio

@betatesthighlander1: ?@mrdecepticonleader: I'm not sure if it works like that. The way I'm seeing it is that the racism is a real-world phenomenon, but the work itself can still be fiction. The way I always saw it, it depends on the story more than the themes to determine if it's fiction or not. I could be wrong of course.

#17 Posted by Batman242 (4860 posts) - - Show Bio

If the work of fiction itself is racist, in the sense that it conveys that kind of message. Then is it fiction anymore? Since that view point is a real view point that is actually being presented. It is no longer fiction but real. In the same sense that if someone was actually murdered on screen it is no longer fiction but reality.

Philosopher right here.

#18 Posted by Joygirl (18702 posts) - - Show Bio

My Little Pony.

#19 Posted by ShadowSwordmaster (12229 posts) - - Show Bio
#20 Posted by Pyrogram (35143 posts) - - Show Bio
#21 Edited by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

@betatesthighlander1: ?@mrdecepticonleader: I'm not sure if it works like that. The way I'm seeing it is that the racism is a real-world phenomenon, but the work itself can still be fiction. The way I always saw it, it depends on the story more than the themes to determine if it's fiction or not. I could be wrong of course.

Yes that is how I see it, that the work itself can be fictional but if it is racist then there must be a real and not fictional idea behind it. The person/persons responsible for creating it are racist and are putting their ideals onto a film for example, then that is a very real thing. And is no longer fiction we are talking about but the real world.

Though ideas and opinions are of course alot harder to pinpoint than actions. So it takes more thought to actually access if a work of fiction in itself actually is racist or whatever else. As opposed to showing racism and using it in a fictional context as opposed to actually presenting real ideas.

#22 Posted by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrdecepticonleader said:

If the work of fiction itself is racist, in the sense that it conveys that kind of message. Then is it fiction anymore? Since that view point is a real view point that is actually being presented. It is no longer fiction but real. In the same sense that if someone was actually murdered on screen it is no longer fiction but reality.

Philosopher right here.

Is that sarcastic or a compliment or what?

#23 Posted by nickzambuto (12978 posts) - - Show Bio

The first answer made this thread.

#24 Edited by OblivionKnight (3356 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrdecepticonleader: I understand that the idea may be rooted in reality, but the content occurring may very well be fictional.

For example, maybe the author decided to write a piece of literature where Hitler was able to win WW2 and there are only a handful of Jews around. This would certainly be rooted in real world logic and have some historical accuracy to it, but I'm sure it would still be considered fictional.

#25 Posted by CaptainDoeo (789 posts) - - Show Bio
#26 Posted by Joygirl (18702 posts) - - Show Bio
#27 Edited by ColonelRunAway (369 posts) - - Show Bio

If the work of fiction itself is racist, in the sense that it conveys that kind of message. Then is it fiction anymore? Since that view point is a real view point that is actually being presented. It is no longer fiction but real. In the same sense that if someone was actually murdered on screen it is no longer fiction but reality.

I'm actually a little offended by this. You're saying that any fiction conveying a message or theme applicable to reality is unrelated to what fiction stands for? That's... I can't even describe how wrong that is. Encouraging and expressing thought about real world issues is arguably the most important tenant of art, and speculative fiction is one of the most direct routes to it. Creators with negative biases are an inevitability, they don't invalidate every single intelligent person in the medium that wants to do something meaningful with their work.

Fiction for the sake of fiction is a fun break at best and masturbation at worst.

#28 Posted by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrdecepticonleader: I understand that the idea may be rooted in reality, but the content occurring may very well be fictional.

For example, maybe the author decided to write a piece of literature where Hitler was able to win WW2 and there are only a handful of Jews around. This would certainly be rooted in real world logic and have some historical accuracy to it, but I'm sure it would still be considered fictional.

Well yes. I am just musing as all really. Since this is an interesting topic or one I find it as anyway.

But that example is a what if kind of scenario. It is different.

See this I guess is where people draw the line, between actions and ideas. Due to the fact they are different and ideas are alot harder to pinpoint.

#29 Edited by jojjimbo (2472 posts) - - Show Bio

@thetimestreamer said:

twilight. it makes young girls old dumb women.

It also makes old dumb women act like young girls. lol

#30 Posted by SpideyIvyDaredevilFan26 (5879 posts) - - Show Bio

William Brent Bell should be arrested for fraud and grand theft, that is what this garbage was. I defended this movie for MONTHS after the terrible reviews and audience reaction came in. The trailer was not only better than the movie, but one of the BEST horror trailers EVER made. The guy who made it should get 100% of the films earnings. Hell, the image on the GOD DAMN POSTER ABOVE YOU wasn't even intended as a scare in the movie. It's a 2 second shot that is thrown in for god knows why. It features some of the worst acting in history that isn't unintentionally hilarious, like say, a SyFy movie. The scares are stolen from other, better films like The Strangers and The Exorcist. The film goes out of it's way to completley offend the intelligence of the audience by using a DOG BARKING, a random, normal DOG BARKING as a scare. It also completley overuses that annoying as all hell, "contortionist exorcism movie scare" that wasn't that scary to begin with. By the time it's over, you never want to see that contortionist laziness ever again, even in a great movie. You think Revenge of the Fallen or Green Lantern is the worst piece of fiction ever! HAHAHAHAHAHA, YOU HAVE NO IDEA!!!!

#31 Posted by OblivionKnight (3356 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrdecepticonleader: would you mind giving an example of a movie or piece of literature you would consider non-fictional or fictional?

#32 Edited by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrdecepticonleader said:

If the work of fiction itself is racist, in the sense that it conveys that kind of message. Then is it fiction anymore? Since that view point is a real view point that is actually being presented. It is no longer fiction but real. In the same sense that if someone was actually murdered on screen it is no longer fiction but reality.

I'm actually a little offended by this. You're saying that

any

fiction conveying a message or theme applicable to reality is unrelated to what fiction stands for? That's... I can't even describe how wrong that is. Encouraging and expressing thought about real world issues is arguably the most important tenant of art, and speculative fiction is one of the most direct routes to it. Creators with negative biases are an inevitability, they don't invalidate every single intelligent person in the medium that wants to do something meaningful with their work.

Fiction for the sake of fiction is a fun break at best and masturbation at worst.

No I am not saying that at all. I never said it was wrong that encouraging and expressing thought about real word issues. I was talking more in line that the creator is racist and creates a work of fiction based on that view. I never said they invalidated other people either. It was just thought as all.

#33 Posted by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

@mrdecepticonleader: would you mind giving an example of a movie or piece of literature you would consider non-fictional or fictional?

As I said I consider the works themselves fictional. The ideas of the author should be taken into account and it should be that, that is considered, not necessarily the fiction itself. Since it still is fiction.

#34 Edited by WillPayton (9170 posts) - - Show Bio

I really, really hope they reboot GL with a director/writer that understands the character and how to make a good movie.

#35 Posted by RisingBean (3587 posts) - - Show Bio

No. We don't have the right to pick and choose our censorship. That slope is too slippery and would never end well. We take the bad with the good or we lose the right to speak freely. It is up to the viewer to decide if the message conveyed by the medium has merit or not.

#36 Posted by mrdecepticonleader (17594 posts) - - Show Bio

I am not sure if I have made myself very clear on the subject I have been talking about. Could be down to the fact I was thinking out loud maybe a bit tired too.., and have made a bit of a fool myself. Eh. It happens to all of us.

Anyway to clear things up. In short my initial post in this thread is pretty much my outlook on this. And that is where I stand. And regarding ideas and how they are presented in fiction, the fiction itself and the ideas conveyed in it should not really be the thing to be brought into question necessarily but the creator and there view points, since again a piece of fiction is just that. Think I stated that above but yea anyway...

Not sure if I have much else to say on this subject now.... Censorship I guess does play a part but that is a different subject too. I actually made a thread about that subject ages ago too.

But regarding things getting banned and peoples reaction to them and trying to censor them. I have been watching a couple of videos lately about the "Video Nasties" I have read up about it before but it always helps to know more. That was a pretty interesting though. Might do a bit of a write up about myself as a Brit and a horror lover...

#37 Posted by Batman242 (4860 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman and Robin

Catwoman

Captain America (1990)

#38 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

As some have stated, it depends entirely on the work of fiction. Anything that dehumanizes a certain ethnic group or religion should be looked at with careful scrutiny, but some movies have racism in it because the racism may have been part of the era in which the movie takes place. A perfect example being the recently released "The Butler." Nobody is up in arms about it. Now, there's a difference between a racist movie and a movie that has racism. If people are going around in black face or something along those lines, then there's a problem.

Ultimately, not all works of fiction should be allowed. Turning a blindeye to something doesn't help anything. Generally, however, I think everyone's on the same page on what should be allowed and what shouldn't.

So any movie that could be said to support something you don't approve of should be banned?

#39 Edited by lykopis (10756 posts) - - Show Bio

A lot of people have problems with certain genres (mainly ones with lots of mindless sex or violence, or portrayals of certain groups that they find unfair)

So, if you think a work of fiction is really that bad, should you just not watch it, or is there a point where you petition to get it banned?

If it's fiction, anything goes. Anything. If you are talking accessibility, that's different. I wouldn't want works of fiction depicting child rape in an elementary school's library -- if there are works of fiction put to a visual medium like movies that have extreme violence and/or sexuality then apply the appropriate restriction but as for existing, it should. All of it.

Just don't watch/read/hear it.

#40 Posted by JetiiMitra (8193 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't like Fountainhead by Ayn Rand. So I'll say that.

Online
#41 Posted by Blood_Red_Rage (508 posts) - - Show Bio

Banning a work of fiction because you don't like it is ridiculous. That is where censorship comes from and is further part of controlling society. I say screw that.

#42 Posted by Web_Flotsam (1088 posts) - - Show Bio

Your work has a right to exist as long as I have a right to make fun of it.

#43 Posted by Betatesthighlander1 (7462 posts) - - Show Bio

Your work has a right to exist as long as I have a right to make fun of it.

Absolutely True

#44 Posted by Durakken (1593 posts) - - Show Bio

Batgirl Special #1

The Twilight Saga

Both of those should be cast into oblivion... the first for making Barbara Gordon such a week character and the latter for making Vampires and the word Twilight associated with the writing of that book series...