Can any single dog beat a Cougar or a Jaguar?

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BjornIronside

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The Dogo Argentino fearless, muscular power, and bite force, combined are above any other dog breed, and way above any wolf, because they are product of years of artificial selection with the (Old Fighting Dog of Cordoba which was crossed at first with English Bull Dog, Great Dane, Pyrenean Mastiff, Bull Terrier, Boxer, Pointer, Dogue de Bordeaux and Irish Wolfhound).

"Its strength, tenacity, sense of smell and bravery make it the best in the pack of dogs to hunt wild boars, peccaries, pumas and other predators of agriculture and livestock that inhabit the vast and diverse regions of Argentina!"

http://www.fci.be/Nomenclature/Standards/292g02-en.pdf

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terry2012

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Unless its the dog from The Man Best Friend movie (that dog was either hybrid or mutated.) then the answer is no.

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Stormdriven

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Not any I can think of. Big cats are all around much more dangerous than any dog.

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#355 frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: Again, dog breeds do not reliably hunt large male Pumas, or even those in well-health.

They alert their owners and the 'hunting' begins.

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@frozen said:

@bjornironside: Again, dog breeds do not reliably hunt large male Pumas, or even those in well-health.

They alert their owners and the 'hunting' begins.

You are competently wrong, Dogo Argentino is pure catch Dog breed (even pumas), as you saw in the video, don't confuse Bay dogs with Catch dogs!

Bay dogs

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bay_dog

Catch Dogs

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_dog

I not saying that a single Dogo Argentino will beat a male puma by himself, what i m saying is that every time that a Dogo spot any wild boar or puma, he will go there with no fear to make the catch like in the video above, because that was the reason that the Martinez, created this breed!

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#357 frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: ...That video confirms exactly what I said. Dogs barking and surrounding and alarming an animal, alerting it's owners in the process.

Though, there are dogs that can possibly scare off a cat, cats have often retaliated and killed the dog.

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@frozen: did you saw the video until the end? Please do! In the end there is a clear catch by a Dogo Argentino!

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#359  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: I watched the end. That would not happen to a healthy Cougar. The Boar had little in terms of tools - a Cougar is capable of killing a Dog with the swipe of it's paws and claws, which can tear a Dog apart. It's jaws are also much, much stronger.

Cougars routinely kill lone Wolves and have been reliably documented to do this. Some accounts cite Cougars crushing the skull of a Wolf: Wolf skulls are far larger than those of a Dog.

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The_Titan_Lord

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Nope.

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CaptainUzi

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I think a Cane Corso or a Kurdish Kangle could easily give a big cat a fight of its life.

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#362  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@captainuzi said:

I think a Cane Corso or a Kurdish Kangle could easily give a big cat a fight of its life.

No. They would get stomped. Cougars kill lone Wolves. They have been known to crush their skulls. Do you know how much larger a Wolf skull is than that of a Dog skull?

Here. A Jaguar kills a Kangal. This is real.

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CaptainUzi

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@frozen said:

@captainuzi said:

I think a Cane Corso or a Kurdish Kangle could easily give a big cat a fight of its life.

No. They would get stomped. Cougars kill lone Wolves. They have been known to crush their skulls. Do you know how much larger a Wolf skull is than that of a Dog skull?

Here. A Jaguar kills a Kangal. This is real.

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Wolves(pending on the breed of course, if you want to go into extinct species dire wolves may differ the teeniest bit.) are naturally smaller, leaner canines than some of the larger breeds. The kangle portrayed in that video I believe was an Australian kangle, a large breed but nowhere near the size of a kurdish kangle, which can reach upwards to 300lbs. And Cane Corsos were often put up against lions in gladiator arenas in ancient rome. If 2 vs 1, cane corso definitely takes it, but 1v1 it could go either way.

For a Kurdish kangle however I'm pretty confident it could win against a large 160lb jaguar with sheer weight advantage alone.

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@frozen said:

@bjornironside: I watched the end. That would not happen to a healthy Cougar. The Boar had little in terms of tools - a Cougar is capable of killing a Dog with the swipe of it's paws and claws, which can tear a Dog apart. It's jaws are also much, much stronger.

Cougars routinely kill lone Wolves and have been reliably documented to do this. Some accounts cite Cougars crushing the skull of a Wolf: Wolf skulls are far larger than those of a Dog.

if you watched until the end why you quote:

"Dogs barking and surrounding and alarming an animal, alerting it's owners in the process".

Yes they Bay Dogs are barking and surrounding and alarming an animal, alerting it's owners in the process (first 3), but the catch dogs mobilized the prey (white ones).

Didn't you saw the difference in terms of behavior (fearless) between Bay dogs and Catch dogs in the video?

Again I never said that single a Dogo Argentino will beat a male puma by himself, what i said was:

Every time that a Dogo spot any wild boar or puma, he will go there with no fear to make the catch!

Catch Dogs are not wild animals like wolfs or pumas they know that the owner will support them in the attack!

The bite force of a Dogo Argentino (Dogue de Bordeaux specific mix) is above any wolf!

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#365 frozen  Moderator

@captainuzi: Cougars kill Gray Wolves. Theodore Roosevelt documented how Wolves are far superior in contrast to Dogs and that they kill them with one snap of it's jaws; he then stated that a Wolf would defeat a large Mastiff Dog. Their skulls are much larger than that of any Dogs and because of this, they have a higher bite force. In addition to this, they are tougher and more savage as they are Wild Animals. Wolves > Dogs.

I do not know where you got the information that Kangels are 300lbs; nor do I know where you reliably got information of two Dogs killing a male Lion in Ancient Rome. A Lion would destroy a Dog. A Lion would destroy half a dozen dogs; there are accounts of large male Lions taking on Hyena packs.

A Kangel would not defeat a Jaguar.

Firstly, 160lbs isn't large for a Jaguar. A large Jaguar is 300lbs.

Secondly, with that said, the Jaguar would destroy the dog. It could kill a Dog with the swipe of it's paw; it's P4P the strongest of all the Big Cats and possesses the highest bite-force, in addition to it's razor sharp claws and clear strength advantage.

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#366  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: If you are arguing that the owner will accompany and support the dogs in the ''catch'' then that really defeats the purpose of this thread. You are dead wrong if you think Dogs > Wolves. It has reliably been documented by Wolf experts that their bite force is much higher than that of any Dog breed.

Here is a reliable source of Wolves demonstrating superiority over Dogs.

Theodore Roosevelt stressing the danger cornered wolves can pose to a pack of dogs in his Hunting the Grisly and Other Sketches:

A wolf is a terrible fighter. He will decimate a pack of hounds by rapid snaps with his giant jaws while suffering little damage himself; nor are the ordinary big dogs, supposed to be fighting dogs, able to tackle him without special training. I have known one wolf to kill a bulldog which had rushed at it with a single snap, while another which had entered the yard of a Montana ranch house slew in quick succession both of the large mastiffs by which it was assailed. The immense agility and ferocity of the wild beast, the terrible snap of his long-toothed jaws, and the admirable training in which he always is, give him a great advantage over fat, small-toothed, smooth-skinned dogs, even though they are nominally supposed to belong to the fighting classes. In the way that bench competitions are arranged nowadays this is but natural, as there is no temptation to produce a worthy class of fighting dog when the rewards are given upon technical points wholly unconnected with the dog's usefulness. A prize-winning mastiff or bulldog may be almost useless for the only purposes for which his kind is ever useful at all. A mastiff, if properly trained and of sufficient size, might possibly be able to meet a young or undersized Texas wolf; but I have never seen a dog of this variety which I would esteem a match single-handed for one of the huge timber wolves of western Montana. Even if the dog was the heavier of the two, his teeth and claws would be very much smaller and weaker and his hide less tough.

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BjornIronside

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@captainuzi: Cane Corsos in terms of bite force and muscular power are bellow the Dogo Argentino!

In some countries hunters adapted this ancient breed to hunt wild boars but the results are very bellow the Dogo Argentino!

You are completely wrong about the Kurdish Kangle, it's a Shepard dog it's used for protection not attack, his fearless can't mach any Catch Dog (Dogo Argentino, Cane Corso, Perro de Presa Canario).

A male lion is a gladiator a pure fighter he wasn't made to hunt like tigers or leopards, he would destroy any dog like he does with hyenas 10 lioness can't match 20 or more hyenas but a male lion can!

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BjornIronside

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@frozen: don't really on experts and ignore the numbers of the videos bit force? 556 (Dogue de Bordeaux) vs 406 Wolf

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Decide for yourself but the Wolfs don't have the Dogos fearless and power!

I don't know why you can't understand why wild animals can't risk injuries with miscalculating confrontations! and Dogos can, if a Dogo is in a fight with a puma he will fight until dead waiting the arrival of the owner, because he wants top please him like every dog!

There are several videos in youtube where Dogos Argentinos fight pumas by themselves, but i will not post them here because they were made by savage people that doesn't respect nature and doesn't understand the Dogo breed, that only was made for the hunt!

Just type Dogo Agentino vs Puma and you will see that a dogo will fight the Puma!

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#369 frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: I just gave you an account of a Wolf demonstrating superiority over two Mastiffs. Did you ignore that account? It then goes on to state that the Wolf is much more powerful. Here is the Rat Analogy of PSI:

Rats true biting force is from 0.8 to 2.8 lbs. But it depends how you measure it. This measurement tells how much weight their lower jaw can lift. But true pressure measurement is in psi (pounds per square inch). A crocodile bite is about 5000 psi, very strong, but covers the area of the whole jaw, as they bite with all their teeth. Rats however can separate their bite pattern at will. They can bite only with their incisors and they can even separate their lower incisors in a V shape up to an angle of 40 degrees. Also their incisors grow at a combined rate of 1.4 mm per day, and are kept very sharp by grinding them together. So the bite area in square inch being very tiny their bite can measure up to 7000 psi

If that does not suffice, then accounts here cite that The Wolf is much more powerful than any Dog: http://carnivoraforum.com/topic/10150968/1/

Wild animals often run away, hell, Pumas run away from humans. However, if the Puma is provoked then it will retaliate.

I have seen the videos. They are not legitimate --- they are under-fed and injured (beforehand) Pumas who have been exploited. They do not represent a true account of a wild Puma.

If you want to see what a real Puma can do, then here is an account of a Puma easily killing a Dog (German Shephard): http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/local/Aggressive-Mountain-Lion-Attack-Fontana-248603131.html

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Heh...now it's become the "What dog is stronger than a wolf" thread

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#371 frozen  Moderator

Heh...now it's become the "What dog is stronger than a wolf" thread

No Dog is the correct answer.

Enough evidence has been cited for Cats >>> Dogs.

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modernww2fare

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@frozen said:

@modernww2fare said:

Heh...now it's become the "What dog is stronger than a wolf" thread

No Dog is the correct answer.

Enough evidence has been cited for Cats >>> Dogs.

In that same carnivoraforums site didn't they say the wolf bites 1,500 psi?

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#373  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@modernww2fare said:

@frozen said:

@modernww2fare said:

Heh...now it's become the "What dog is stronger than a wolf" thread

No Dog is the correct answer.

Enough evidence has been cited for Cats >>> Dogs.

In that same carnivoraforums site didn't they say the wolf bites 1,500 psi?

I do not know about that, but I do not think that is reliable with the vast majority of Wolf sources.

I cited an analogy which explains it well.

Rats true biting force is from 0.8 to 2.8 lbs. But it depends how you measure it. This measurement tells how much weight their lower jaw can lift. But true pressure measurement is in psi (pounds per square inch). A crocodile bite is about 5000 psi, very strong, but covers the area of the whole jaw, as they bite with all their teeth. Rats however can separate their bite pattern at will. They can bite only with their incisors and they can even separate their lower incisors in a V shape up to an angle of 40 degrees. Also their incisors grow at a combined rate of 1.4 mm per day, and are kept very sharp by grinding them together. So the bite area in square inch being very tiny their bite can measure up to 7000 psi

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@frozen: i show you National Geographic bite force videos and you show me http://carnivoraforum.com/ ???? Where is their video test with numbers after the bite? I just don't thrust any theory or random sites! I presented videos with numbers, just do the same!

Has for the other part you are right that pumas are hurt and tired in the you tube fights (just bad and savage people), but still proves my point:

If the dogo spot a puma he will attack him for the Catch, that is certain, and as i said before i think a single Dogo will probably not beat the puma by himself, but he will go there with no fear don't doubt that!

Your first statement was:

"Again, dog breeds do not reliably hunt large male Pumas, or even those in well-health.

They alert their owners and the 'hunting' begins".

Hope you changed your ideas about this statement!

Man don't compare a German Shepard with a Dogo Argentino, it's embracing for both breeds, The German Shepard is probably the most complete Dog Breed in the world they can do anything (Guard, Rescue, Shepard, etc), but they were not build to hunt big prey's they don't have the dogos fearless, power and bite force, the dogo also wasn't made for (Guard, Rescue, Shepard, etc). Different great breeds that have different work functions !!!

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#375  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: Read the forum and the responses. A number of studies were cited and almost all of which cite the Wolf as much more powerful. Prior to this, I gave you an account of Wolves easily killing large Dogs --- and Mastiff's being no match for them. The information is there.

It does not prove your point. Starving and intentionally harming a Puma before a fight, and then letting a Dog attack it represents nothing of what the Puma is capable of. Healthy Pumas, in captivity have been documented to have killed Leopards.

Your ''catch'' 'argument' is telling me that a bunch of Dogs, with the help of it's owner can defeat a Puma. You do know that the vast majority of owners who have these Dogs simply aim and shoot at the Puma while the Dogs are barking at it?

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modernww2fare

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#376  Edited By modernww2fare

@frozen said:

@bjornironside: Read the forum and the responses. A number of studies were cited and almost all of which cite the Wolf as much more powerful. Prior to this, I gave you an account of Wolves easily killing large Dogs --- and Mastiff's being no match for them. The information is there.

It does not prove your point. Starving and intentionally harming a Puma before a fight, and then letting a Dog attack it represents nothing of what the Puma is capable of. Healthy Pumas, in captivity have been documented to have killed Leopards.

I wanna see this!

@frozen said:

It does not prove your point. Starving and intentionally harming a Puma before a fight, and then letting a Dog attack it represents nothing of what the Puma is capable of.

Can you say that the dog the Jaguar killed in the video was in poor condition as well?

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BjornIronside

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@frozen: you present some random theory and site and i present real videos!

Don't you get that Dogos Argentinos are not Mastiffs or German Shepard's ??? If you don't get that you don't know anything about dog Breeds!

Why you chose ignore the videos where we can see that the Dogos have more power than the wolfs when they both face wild boars?

A Dogo Argentino will bark at a puma if he spot one? this statement is offensive to this breeds, and shows that you don't know absolutely anything about Dogos, the Dogo Argentino is not a Bay dog he will not bark at any prey, he will instantly attack after the spot, you saw that in my first video where the dogo didn't bark to the wild Boar like the bay dogs, he instantly attack the the wilder boar, why do you ignore this? Why he wouldn't attack the puma if he attack the wild boar? After all this was the reason why this breed was created in first place, to be able to catch large prey not to bark at them, check the FCI link!

I have a Dogo Argentino, and my uncle is a creator of Dogos, don't try to teach me how Dogos behave!

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#378  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: You clearly did not read the threads. In that thread, links were cited which linked to bite-force studies/accounts. Those studies demonstrated that Wolves are much more powerful than Dogs. I also cited you a reliable account of a Wolf destroying Dogs and being said to be superior.

You have cherry-picked videos. That does not show a Dogo to be superior whatsoever. Gray Wolves have been documented to, while lone, kill prey much larger and more dangerous than a Wild Boar. Are you legitimately claiming that a savage Gray Wolf cannot kill a Wild Boar despite the fact that they have been documented to kill larger prey? While your video demonstrates 3 Dogos, with the help of an owner, forcing a Boar into water to overwhelm it.

Lol. It is not offensive --- watch your own videos, the Dogs are yapping when it meets the Wild Boar and make frantic noise. Those noises instantly alert their owner. Why would he not attack the Puma? You cannot seriously compare a Wild Boar to a Puma. The comparison makes no sense. A Puma has sharp, retractable claws which it can use to kill prey. It can bite with a snapping jaw and is much faster and more agile than a Wild Boar. Puma's have killed prey much larger than Wild Boar. A Puma is not prey either....why do you keep glossing over this and attempt to inter-change Boars with Puma's? It makes no god-damn sense.

I am drawing evidence from your own sources.

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#379  Edited By BjornIronside
@frozen said:

@bjornironside:

While your video demonstrates 3 Dogos, with the help of an owner, forcing a Boar into water to overwhelm it.

Lol. It is not offensive --- watch your own videos, the Dogs are yapping when it meets the Wild Boar and make frantic noise. Those noises instantly alert their owner.

What's is offensive is that you did not saw the video if you saw it you could't post the statements above!

Why reply without seen the all content of my posts?

The Dogo Argentino only appears at min 2:30 the other 3 dogs that you mentioned are not Dogos they are Bay dogs (different breeds) who definitely bark that is their job, the Dogo doesn't bark that is not his job, he simply attacks and mobilizes the prey! The owner doesn't even show up!

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"Morocho" didn't bark at the puma did he??? don't forget to watch until the end before reply!!!!

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#380  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: LOL. The Dogo appears after the Dogs are barking at him --- you do realize that by then on, the owner has already been alerted because of that? You cannot ignore the previous Dogs actions just because the Dogo did not do that. It was accompanied by barking Dogs.

Sigh...

You do realize that @erik clarified what truly happened on page 2? The Dogo did not kill the Puma. It hatched onto it's neck long enough for the owner to arrive and stab it with a knife. And then suffered heavy injury, while not even beating the Puma.

It wasn't even remotely strong enough to kill the Puma. It needed it's owner with a knife to kill it --- had the owner not arrived, the Dogo would have died.

What REALLY happened with the Dogo and Puma.

Seems like the owner saved the Dogo's life, and not vice versa. The above link is a clarification of the true events, without T.V dramatization.

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BjornIronside

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@frozen: another random site? (http://members3.boardhost.com/) Vs Animal planet Dogs 101... Nice you have very credible sources!

But even if the Dogo did not kill the puma the by himself he attack him there no doubts about it! and that contradicts your first statement!

"Again, dog breeds do not reliably hunt large male Pumas, or even those in well-health.

They alert their owners and the 'hunting' begins".

Dogos don't need other dogs to attack wild boards or pumas they were made to attack just check the youtube!

You just made a wrong statement! just admit that! i never said that a Dogo would beat a puma by himself!

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#382  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: It is not a random site. It is a clarification of the actual events and not a T.V dramatization.

Look man, stop telling me to YouTube it. I told you, and you acknowledged yourself, that the Puma was under-fed and beaten before letting the Dogo attack it. That is not representative and I have no idea why you acknowledged that yet still prompt me to YouTube it.

By this point I have no idea what you are arguing. You claimed that a Dogo could not defeat a Puma yet then cite a video which (falsely) claims that it did and use that as your evidence?

You said Dogos attack --- a Dogo attacked a Puma, it happened, however, it could not defeat the Puma and sustained injuries, and it nearly died before the owner arrived to kill the Puma.

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#383  Edited By BjornIronside
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@frozen: You were the one that reply to me, with this post! This is what i m arguing!

Man your quote is not true! If a dogo spot a puma he will not bark and alert the owner he will attack the puma immediately, like "Morocho" did! simple as that! of course if the owner don't show up he probably will die!

The puma will win in one on one, but why you don't admit that you don't knew the Dogos Argentinos breed and thought in first place that no dog breed could possible have the courage to attack a puma or a wild boar by himself!

They were made specific for this propose, because wild boars are a plague for the Agriculture in Argentina, and the pumas a constant threat! i have nothing else to say!

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#384  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: You are neglecting to acknowledge your own contradictions. Your argument is all over the place.

You cite the Puma will win.

No Caption Provided

Post #379 you post the video for your argument of the Dogo allegedly killing a Puma. You are claiming this is evidence for a Dogo attacking what it can? Cool.

Post #380 I reference the website which confirmed and clarified the Dogo did not win whatsoever and cite it's initial reference on page 2. This would directly fall into line with the agreement that a Puma wins

Post #381 You then claim the clarification is bogus and the Puma did lose, despite saying that the Puma would win?

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#385  Edited By BjornIronside

@frozen: i never said that the Dogo would win, in one on one, where are that statements (Words??? where i said that?) Nice trick!!

I always said that the Dogo always will attack the Puma! not win!

You were the one that reply to me, with this post! This is what i was arguing! and the wolfs inferior bite force!

No Caption Provided

This debate was lost time you never show any valid proof of anything, only random sites, no videos of national Geographic, just random theories, you knowledge about dog breeds also is is very limited!

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#386  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside:

where are that statements (Words??? where i said that?)

Did you ignore my post? Or genuinely not read it?

Post #379 you post the video for your argument of the Dogo allegedly killing a Puma. You are claiming this is evidence for a Dogo attacking what it can? Cool.

Post #380 I reference the website which confirmed and clarified the Dogo did not win whatsoever and cite it's initial reference on page 2. This would directly fall into line with the agreement that a Puma wins

Post #381 You then claim the clarification is bogus and the Puma did lose, despite saying that the Puma would win?

This debate was lost time you never show any valid proof of anything, only random sites, no videos of national Geographic, just random theories, you knowledge about dog breeds also is is very limited!

I will genuinely ask again. Did you ignore my post?

I cited you a book, which gave an in-depth and detailed account of Wolves easily killing larger Dogs with a snap of it's jaws. I then cited you a PSI analogy to add context to your vague posts.

I then linked you, to a website, WITH valid research studies in PDF file format for Wolves and Dogs, which detailed reliable accounts of Wolves showing the utmost superiority over any Dog breed.

These accurate and consistent reports, published over the years, demonstrated that the Mastiff, the Kangel, the Dogo, Pitbull, etc are all inferior in contrast to Gray Wolves. By far. I am not going to spell it out in ABC if I have cited my consistent and reliable sources.

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@frozen: you are absolutely right i contradict myself and all your theories of random sites are true, dogos never could ever attack a puma by themselves "Morocho" story was made up by animal planet, and the wolf bite force is stronger than Dogos even if the videos of national geographic show otherwise!

You were the one that reply to me in first place! Read you statement and remember of "Morocho", and don't forget to watch videos until the end!

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Just don't reply anymore! the reason is on your side!

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frozen

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#388 frozen  Moderator

@bjornironside: You keep citing the Animal Planet video. It was legitimately clarified what truly happened here:

http://members3.boardhost.com/DOGOMAN/msg/1319221148.html

Cited from credible sources. No dramatization from a dog-loving show. No fake re-constructors. Stick to your dramatizations though rather than a follow-up clarification of what actually happened.

Again, are you actually reading what I'm writing? I am not linking you to random websites. I am linking you to websites containing links which re-direct you to research studies and sources, which cite Wolves as being far superior to any Dog breeds and carrying out research over the years to confirm this general fact. I then cite a book which you continuously ignore.

Here, I will cite my post again for you.

Post #379 you post the video for your argument of the Dogo allegedly killing a Puma. You are claiming this is evidence for a Dogo attacking what it can? Cool.

Post #380 I reference the website which confirmed and clarified the Dogo did not win whatsoever and cite it's initial reference on page 2. This would directly fall into line with the agreement that a Puma wins

Post #381 You then claim the clarification is bogus and the Puma did lose, despite saying that the Puma would win?

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frozen

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#389  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@modernww2fare:

I wanna see this!

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Can you say that the dog the Jaguar killed in the video was in poor condition as well?

Nope.

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Probably though a lot of factors come into play such as the species or breed of dog, the age and experience of the animals and whether this is a complete random encounter or ambush tactics are allowed.

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modernww2fare

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#391  Edited By modernww2fare

@frozen: What's a Jaguar's bite force again? Some guy on YouTube keeps telling me that carnivoraforums says the tiger and lion bite harder.

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modernww2fare

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#393  Edited By modernww2fare
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#394 frozen  Moderator
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leonkarlen123

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A mastiff

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dshipp17

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#396  Edited By dshipp17

A single dog cannot take a single, healthy cougar or jaguar. It's unlikely that any single dog could take a lynx, without being left seriously wounded.

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TheVivas

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Krypto?

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Outside_85

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The only single dog-related animal that could take a Jaaagggg is a bear.

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deactivated-61bde0e570bb9

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Wolf Dogs. My neighbor owns one. This isnt her, but It gives you a good idea of the size of these animals.

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#400  Edited By frozen  Moderator

@rd189: That would not stand a chance against a Jaguar or a Cougar. An average male Jaguar not only has one of the strongest bite-forces of all the big-cats but is P4P the strongest Cat; they are capable of dragging an 800lb bull 25 feet. It could kill a dog with a swipe of it's paw.

Cougars have been documented to kill Grey Wolves (A Grey Wolf is superior to any Dog or Wolf-hybrid). A Wolf would need a pack to pose a threat to a Cougar.