Azula or Kuvira

Which of these two is more intimidating? A better leader? More cold and aggressive? More badass. Compare and contrast these two powerful antagonists

Not even close. Azula curbstomps.

Only category Kuvira takes is leadership which is pretty close considering the Fire Nation has way more feats than the Earth Empire atm.

Kuvira Slaughters.

Kuvira might be a better leader, right now Azula probably takes the others though that might change

I'd said Kuvira is a better leader while Azula gets everything else.

Ends in sex.

Kuvira's only a better leader than post mental breakdown Azula, but not sane Azula. Sane Azula inspired a high degree of loyalty, fear and respect from the Dai Li who had been Long Feng's subordinates for years considering she had only been around for a few weeks, not to mention she took Ba Sing Se in a few weeks, something never accomplished before... they don't call it Na Sing Se. Azula's perceived rejection by her mother, father and friends was what crushed her and distorted her perception of reality. I don't think Kuvira has anything on Azula in any area based on what we've seen of her so far.

@rogueshadow: These where suppose to be the Earth Kingdom elite (a joke in combat during both eras), they must have had 0 loyalty and 1 brain cell between them, never mind that she was a child.

Kuviras movement makes sense and is based on how things have happened for real, Azulas was pure PIS for the sake of moving things along. Other than the White Lotus adults in the original series where all morons.

I don't think any of that is actually more impressive of a feat than Kuvira bringing an entire nation from rioting and anarchy, every man for himself, to united under a single government/ruler, in just 3 years.

@jezer: Granted Kuvira had a rather large army backing her, while Azula accomplished what she did more or less by herself.

As @juiceboks said, that took Kuvira years, while Azula did it basically singlehandedly in a matter of weeks.

Avatar has quite a lot of PIS and deus ex machina, Bolin learning lavabending, the Lion turtle miraculously showing up etc. The White Lotus were morons too in my opinion, the obvious solution was for Pakku, Bumi and Jeong Jong to help Aang take down the Firelord and then liberate Ba Sing Se afterwards, but they wanted the final fight.

Dai Li weren't really a joke, they were just no match for prodigies, who were the best in the world. Toph, Katara, Azula etc (only snubbed so much because he was compared to Azula) were all prodigies beyond belief. Azula doing what she did is a testament to her fierce leadership qualities and youths throughout history have been more than just puppet Monarchs, they have commanded armies, won sieges, empires etc. Alexander the Great, Augustus Caesar etc. It's not an unbelievable notion.

The great uniter

Azula by quite a bit.

She conquered a nation that was already under stable leadership and of which she was not a native.

She also discarded her army as a hindrance. Kuvira is wholly dependent on hers and is therefore more limited.

Kuvira still needs to step up her game.

Kuivara wins IMO.

Earth Empire conquered Earth Kingdom, Fire Nation conquered the world.

Kuvira put down rioters and over 3 years, Azula took down an organized government in a few weeks.

Azula stomps.

Not really. Azula took charge of a City. Most of the Earth Kingdom had already been taken over by the Fire Nation by the time Azula was sent to try and take it down.

@rogueshadow: Yes Bolin learning lavabending so soon was plot but I fail to see how that makes the Dai Li following Azula any less stupid, why aren't you comparing Kuviras realistically progression with Azulas plot induced one.

The Dai Li motivation can be summed up with that they though she was cool!?

The Dai Li where a joke, they got taken out by a single shot or even being tripped vs equalists and metal bending forces who can take multiple hits. Adults in LOK tend ton be on a higher level, LOA worked with kids anime logic where outside of the respected teachers adults where incompetent.

They feared, respected and admired her. The Dai Li agent who went to see Long Feng made that clear and Azula made it clear that they didn't no who to side with because they didn't know who would win. As I said, child leaders are common throughout history, some of the greatest have been in their teens when they conquered nations, so them following her is not beyond belief. Kuvira took years and had armies, Azula took down the impenetrable city of Ba Sing Se in a couple of weeks basically by herself.

@rogueshadow: Your trying to make it seem more reasonable than it actually is, wouldn't matter if she was the Fonz, You need to see beyond your bias to realize how stupid it is for a large group like that to suddenly betray there country, do I even need to list the multiple reasons of why it's so stupid?

Those child leaders where leaders because they where part of the system, the soldiers where trained to be loyal to the leader of the nation/country/empire who just happened to be a child, if a foreign child said follow me and make me your leader they would laugh in there face never mind what they would do to one who they have surely been taught to hate.

Stop being so combative, there is no reason to get annoyed. I recognise it is stretching, but I think you are making it seem far worse than it is, it is not beyond belief.

The Fire Nation were taking hold of the Earth Kingdom, the Dai Li knew that Fire Nation control was likely eventual/inevitable, key cities like Omashu were falling before their might. They wanted to see how the situation played out. Azula wasn't a random urchin from the streets of some fire nation village, she was the princess of the fire nation, they wanted to see what was going to happen before choosing to side with her or Long Feng as they knew what an effective leader she was. They were willing to side with her because they clearly held no true loyalty to the Earth Kingdom as they worked for Long Feng over the King.

Azula used all of this knowledge to her advantage. It's a testament to her cunning.

Intimidation: Azula

Leadership: Kuvira

Coldness: It's pretty close but going with Kuvira

Badassery: Azula

@rogueshadow: But bias for Azula is incredibly high especially when they believe moments like this aren't PIS.

When you need to add in your own reasons on how a character could have pulled it off rather than what was actually stated or shown then your reaching.

For Azula to pull this off it would require.

• soldiers betray there country
• side with an enemy they where taught to hate
• have no loved ones/family/friends they where betraying
• everyone of them agree because it would only take one with a shred of loyalty to inform the earth kingdom forces
• actually believe they could commit high treason and the other side trust them.

The Dai Li are mooks with no personality or background, like those mooks that die in droves they are not human when it comes to motivation. There only stated reason for following Azula was that they though she was a better leader.

Azulas moment that people fanwank is PIS and is not applicable to any realistic situation, the Dai Li where not fleshed out enough for her manipulation of them seem impressive, what Kuvira has been done before by charismatic but insincere individuals to countries in the past.

Kuvira was a massive hypocrite when she kept pretending that she was the peaceful and honest one but it works.

Kuvira had a large army backing her? She had most of the security force of the small city of Zaofu. She acquired a large army gradually as a consequence of her leadership, but it wasn't there at the beginning.

"As @juiceboks said, that took Kuvira years, while Azula did it basically singlehandedly in a matter of weeks."

You're forgetting the scope. City versus an entire nation. Washington DC versus the United States. Still significantly more impressive.

"Earth Empire conquered Earth Kingdom, Fire Nation conquered the world.

Kuvira put down rioters and over 3 years, Azula took down an organized government in a few weeks.

Azula stomps."

Err... do you actually think coup is more impressive than establishing a new government from a state of total anarchy, destruction, and chaos?

Kuvira is the better leader, but Azula is more intimidating and badass (except when she went crazy). I mean, she hunted the avatar non stop.

As for cold blooded, Kuvira seems to be cooler, as in she doesn't every change he expression, while Azula seemed to enjoy fighting and playing mind games, she was more sadistic.

^

Please stop saying I'm fanwanking Azula, it's just rude and makes me not want to debate. Most of these reasons were strongly hinted at or outright stated, I'm not just making them up. Azula articulates bluntly that they were waiting to see who would win. She presumably knew they would do this because they were traitorous. The Dai Li agent said they were awestruck by Azula, a combination of fear and inspiration, she had a quality that makes people want to follow here. People like Hitler were said to possess this quality. The scene where she addresses them shows that they feared her. She made a calculated risk and it worked.

Also, Kuvira's army isn't any more fleshed out than the Dai Li.

I see nothing but bias going around from the jump.

The Fire Nation conquered the world but that wasn't soley because of Azula. How much of Azula's fear, came simply from the fact she was the daughter of a tyrant.

I want to wait until the season ends before deciding.

Azula is definitely more intimidating. Kuvira is...rather polite, actually.

Although I think Azula's probably smarter and more cunning, I have to say Kuvira is the better leader. She was meant to be a leader. Azula had to use fear tactics, and her closest team betrayed her.

I say Azula's colder. She would throw you off a ship or banish you as she saw reason to. And she was so paranoid, she saw a looot of reasons to.

More badass definitely goes to Azula for me. I thought Kuvira could have been, but that last fight cemented it for me that Kuvira's not a second Azula. She doesn't have a back up plan for everything, it feels like. I thought it was dumb of her to challenge Korra and let her use all of her bending and the Avatar state. She won, but not because she should have expected to. Azula, on the other hand, was always prepared and could not be fooled and used every bit of her resources

I found Kuvira's motivation's more interesting as I believe her political/nationalist ideas make her a more interesting villain.

She was kinda bland on a personality level though. Azula was more interesting: controlled yet psycho, sweet one moment and vicious the next. She was also very enjoyably despicable. But her motivations are... eh, what exactly was her end goal?

I still prefer her though.

@cpt_nice: become Fire Lord, rule the world etc. You know? Cliche.
However...

Azula 4ever. lmao

Jk aside tho, Azula was more developed since she had like 2 seasons and she keeps going on. Kuvira only had 1 season, so yeah.
What I loved about Azula the most was that she is one of those tragically tragic villains. She didn't know how to love cause she hadn't really felt any love. Who's to blame? Ozai imo.

I also loved her Book 3 pre-Comet developement. Mai told her "I love Zuko more than I fear you". Who else loved Zuko more (or at least Azula thought so)? Her mother. In her fight with Zuko at the next episode, she unleashes the most ferocious of attacks at him and doesn't even care about Aang anymore, she is obssesed with killing him more than ever. Which is pretty sweet. lol I guess, not so sibling sweet, but I mean, it makes you feel sympathy for her character. Makes you feel bad for her.

Azula's hotter so I'll go with her.

Azula is probably my fave character in the Avatar franchise, so her. Every time they showed her I payed close attention, and literally smiled during Azula scenes.

#AzulaForever

Kuvira

Azusa, by far. She was awesome.

@anthp2000: There's some missing context in that lol. The Earth Kingdom during Azula's time was still all together and unified, she just replaced the head. Earth Kingdom in Kuvira's time was in chaos and disarray, she literally had to go and reunite the entire nation.

Azula was the scarier villain and better character but I would argue that Kuvira is more badass.

AZULA, She's crazy and awesome. One of the greatest female villains ever

@queen_marceline: You know I just love the meme tho.

Kuvira was more intimidating and Azula was way too vain to be a leader, but Azula is a better character.

Intimidating is not the word I'd use for either, but azula is a far more dangerous opponent than the ozai wannabe.

RShadow's points make pretty solid case.

Which of these two is more intimidating? Azula

A better leader? Kuvira

More cold and aggressive? Azula

More badass. Kuvira

Nah, Azula is still more BA. Although, Kuvira could be more intimidating.

Azula, Kuvira, Azula and Azula again