Affirmative action and racial quotas: a justifiable racism?

I watched this Harvard debate on the topic of affirmative action and racial quotas on Youtube and gave good reasons to why it's justifiable, even though I still find it unfair. Yes, I am black and hope that within a couple of decades these two things will be abolished and everyone can live fairly. So re-read the question posed and share your thoughts, please let's not take things too far.

Affirmative action is probably less debatable as it's just equal opportunities within education and the workplace really, which nobody can truly say is a bad thing. My father for example didn't have to pay for university because he came from a poor area and he left Uni with a masters degree and has contributed much to the economy now, although things like racial quotas are a little more easy to debate against because it's just there to make things more representative of the populations they serve, (police, doctors etc). Which relies on more things than most people would debate. I mean, does having a higher % of black people make people trust the police more? Who knows.

@pyrogram: I personally would give it another couple of decades till eventually the scales have evened out. After that, it should be everybody for themselves in terms of their own determinations and capabilities without the need to look at skin colour. That would be a dream come true.

I'm not really completely sure of my views on the matter, I mean I don't think people should get a place in a university or a job instead of another person purely to meet a racial quota however at the moment racial quotas are probably still necessary to make sure that certain ethnicities are not discriminated against.

Nope, you are asking someone whether they should be screwed over for someone who is less able than yourself regardless of personnel circumstances.

You can go about race all you want, someone's getting screwed over for someone worse.

Merit should take precedence.

Its just trying to level the playing field that was set up in such an unbalanced way since the begining of the USA. Money and power affects education and education affects money and power.

I'd agree with things like the police, doctors, etc, racial quota's and such shouldn't endanger lives. What the UK are doing to fill the racial gap is making a new rule that you can only be a police officer in London if you live in London, because London has a big % of ethnic minorities, it means it'll naturally balance the racial differences. Hopefully to them at least.

@dextersinister: That's honestly not what I'm trying to get at. I'm kind of 50/50 about it, I can see the good intentions behind it but the end result is still sad for both parties.

I don't want to see anyone discriminated against because of the color of their skin. Afirmative action laws seek to address past injustices. There certainly have been many racial injustices. And there is nothing wrong with seeking to balance the scales. However, any policy that wants to correct past injustices should not make more victims in its wake. Imagine if you were a poor white kid in Appalachia, where the closest community college is is over an hour away, and you are told that you did not get the scholarship because a rich kid of another color with lesser scores than yours was given it due to Affirmative Action. Is that justice? Did she do anything to deserve being discriminated against? Probably not. That's the problem with many quota based affirmative action policies. They are well intentioned, but they don't adversely affect the rich, they hurt poor white people who often don't have many other alternatives and are struggling to make a living.

@mfundroid:

That's honestly not what I'm trying to get at. I'm kind of 50/50 about it, I can see the good intentions behind it but the end result is still sad for both parties.

Sure there are good intentions for the person who gets a leg up based on the colour of there skin but again if I go for an interview I don't want to have a disadvantage based on that, you can say you don't want to look at that angle but that's pretty much the point of it.

@pyrogram:

I'd agree with things like the police, doctors, etc, racial quota's and such shouldn't endanger lives. What the UK are doing to fill the racial gap is making a new rule that you can only be a police officer in London if you live in London, because London has a big % of ethnic minorities, it means it'll naturally balance the racial differences. Hopefully to them at least.

It should apply to most things obviously common sense comes into play, I think female police or of a certain ethnicity should be given favourable reviews if they are seen as the better for handling certain aspects or policing certain areas, they will use female police officers in instances of following up domestic violence.

I'm not entirely sure on it. There's two sides. In one way, it is bad that a person gets automatic preference because of the color of his/her skin and that isn't really fair. Then on the other side, there's the minorities need some opportunity to catch up. I don't know, the only thing I definitely agree with is the Best man for the job mentality.

I'd say it's necessary. I'm hoping it won't be one day.

Meritocracy is the best approach in any organisation, but a consistent and universal application of it has yet to take hold in any real, demonstrable way. t think maybe we'll see results in a few more decades. Hopefully? I don't know if ever, frankly. There are so many factors at play; nepotism, boy club (and girl club) networking usually at college level through sorority/fraternity team building and relationships which open doors and in essence leap frog over other, probably better, qualified people. Unpaid internships, things of that nature. Not everyone can take advantage of opportunities like that. Usually due to economic hardship associated with disadvantages prevalent in groups which have been historically marginalised.

It's more nuanced and complicated, obviously. I'm comfortable calling it a necessary "evil" in a tongueincheek way, but I'd argue against it being "racism". More like reparation to society at large.

Affirmative action benefits white women the most, so I don't see how it's being racist.

Blacks still have higher unemployment rates than whites and black college graduates are 54% underemployed and 12% unemployed

People still get discriminated against if they have a black sounding name and a white man with a felony is more likely to get a job than a black man without a criminal record.

The thing is with AA, is that you still have to qualify. People really think that that companies are just hiring random black people off the street. In that case there would be no point in me wasting my time to go to college if I knew AA was that sweet.