Was Iron man really the wrong side in the civil war?

Well to be fair his actions of why he supported pro registration was understandable.Was he really the ''bad guy'' though he did somebad things.He believed he did it for a good cause

Motives don't really change the outcome....

Beata

The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

This. Still Any Tony is better then "Superior" :p

Also their was meant to truly be no "Right" Side. Even if Cap's side was the obvious....

It really depends on how much you trust the us gov't of the MU I would say. Having said that, his side wasn't wrong so much as stooped to doing wrong things in order to win. Which is why I thought it was a well done event, in that the source of the conflict wasn't some all powerful planetary threat but rather a difference in beliefs in how to solve a social problem.

I think that he was wrong because if some superheroes hadn't gone Pro-Reg, the government would have no choice but to back down. If the superheroes had just stopped protecting people, just for a week or two, the government would have run back to plead for their help when Doom, or Hydra, or the Skrulls, or any one of the myriad threats they have defeated attack.

Even if the government had tried to use force to make them comply, they would have failed. Heroes like Spidey or Hercules or Ms. Marvel are far more powerful than any weapon they could use, except a nuke (and Herc could probably withstand that too). Not to mention that the smartest people in the world are also super heroes, such as Reed, Pym and Peter. Any weapon that the government attempted to build would have been outdone a thousandfold by the amazing tech geniuses such as they could come up with.

Really, if the superheroes had stayed united for Anti-Reg, the government could have done nothing. However, the split (which that idiotic Stark caused) was the cause behind the undoing, the cause behind the war and destruction, and the cause behind Cap's death. So yes, Stark's idiocy was the cause of the destruction and he should have been killed by one of his superiors - such as Herc or Spidey, or Sue, or She-Hulk, or anyone.

No, in my opinion.

@blackspidey2099: Some of the pro reg heroes believed it was necessary though due to would be super heroes who didn't have the necessary training and whose methods of trying to be famous or stop villains was resulting in too many civilian deaths. There are many facets to the whole pro/anti reg theme. In theory, it has its pros while in practice is where the real problems lay.

I didn't really see there a right or wrong in Civil War, even though I leaned towards Cap I saw merits in both. That was part of what made Civil War impactful, there was no right side...but Tony was acting like a know it all tool.

I suppose everyone has their own opinions but I say yes

I could see both sides of it too, the problem with the Pro-Reg sides was in the implementation of the laws.

Heroes were forced to comply, sure it was the law but forcing someone to be a hero? Then you had the whole "secret identity" thing, who was to say that some lone nut felt like revealing Spidey's identity to TMZ (ok before he revealed himself). After the civil war during Dark Reign when Norman Osborne was in charge he had a legal right to see who every hero who'd crossed him was under their masks.

Then there's the compulsory training part of it, it was all opened to the potential for a corrupt element to cause serious havoc.

But the anti-reg side was actively breaking the law of the country they'd sworn to defend (ok only some of them had, but still). So they've gone from being troublesome vigilantes to active criminals in effect.

I think the end battle when Cap looked around at all the damage that both sides had caused summed up the whole thing perfectly. They both had the best intentions, but just ended up destroying what they meant to protect.

He's completely evil. I wish Cap would have snapped his neck like a twig, along with Hank Pym and Reed Richards.

Favorite storyline I think they both had good intentions but Tony used the worse ways to accomplish his goals he used a long list of illegal tactics and just completely lost sight of his goals....imo he became the bad guy by just by acting like one!

When you think about all he did.....how is he still an avenger lol

Read "What if? Civil War"

Without Tony Stark to provide a fairer path for registration, the government's response to Stamford is much more extreme (like Stark predicted it would be). The government doesn't tolerate the resistance as softly as Stark did and they end up destroying Cap's resistance and kill a bunch of heroes.

Yes... Less government ... not more

In all honesty, If I was in the shoes of a hero in the Marvel Universe, I would have chosen the Pro-Registration side. Like any group, I'm not going to say I would agree with everything Stark did, but I don't think Superhero Registration itself was a bad idea.

I don't think that would have worked with Reed, unless they froze him first or something.

At any rate, I've all but dismissed the Civil War arch as canon. Too many people acting out of character.

i liked all of the action in the event, but disliked how it seemed characters were used solely for pushing the plot forward. i wasnt buying it. and that includes tony being adamantly for registration and acting evil

I completely agree. I love the stories with lots of grey areas between "right" and "wrong".

We were supposed to be able to see both sides, but I don't think they did a great job of articulating the pro registration side. I expect the movies will do a much better job because...Robert Downey Jr. His Ironman is about a thousand times more likable than comic book Ironman.

Part of the problem there was that in the time it took to do the whole arc across all the comics, things had gone so far as to become close to unforgivable, regardless of motivation. Harder to do that in two and a half hours unless you're really trying to make someone the bad guy. I also think they made a misstep in their reading of the post 9-11 public, thinking that the reader would be more accepting/sympathetic to the idea of swapping civil liberty for safety than they were.

But in answer to the question asked....yes. Yes, he was, lol. Of course, Cap had a clearer view than the 'modern' superheroes as to where that sort of thing can lead, having seen it first hand in WW2.

I completely disagree, Civil War promised us a 'grey' story that we will have a hard time to decide which side is right or wrong, but then the grey area disappeared and we got a right side (Cap) and a wrong side (Iron Man), cause Iron Mans side cloned Thor, caused the death of Goliath, hired ex criminals to hunt down Caps team, and prisoned the heros inhumanly (for just because they save lifes 'illegally'!!) as if they are serial killers...

What they did was evil, but the stance had merits. The premise of the story was much better than it's execution though, but the battle of morality between Steve and Tony, in their shared dialogue moments, was what made it impact. The actual action bits were...lackluster...more often than not.

I stilll enjoyed it more than most 'event' series. It had a clear and identifiable plot and whille they failed at not making the pro registration side into straight up villlains, it was responsible for some wonderful dialogue and art. And, omg, is it ever going to make a heartwrenching movie.

Ok so the ideas of the both sides were 'grey', but the actions were totally black and white...i am just saying how the story played out couldnt fulfill what it promised, and thats only my opinion of course..

Like I said: good in premise but poor in execution. Unfortunately that seems to happen a lot.

That reminded me '' I'm with the X-men/ I'm with the Avengers " variant covers of AvX suddenly...heck, sure i am with the Avengers lol

Yeah AvX was another idea that was good but poor practice.

@granitesoldier: I don't think the execution was that poor. I just take it for what the writer wanted it to be. I don't think he really under any obligation to make the story as gray as possible from a moral standpoint even if Marvel was portraying it that way. He wrote it the way he wanted it to be. Overall, there are parts that could have written better but it was still a pretty well done event imo. I think it was meant to be sort of a lesson in how public reaction can easily justify extreme measures to what are seen as social crisis just as we saw with the Patriot act and wars in the middle in reaction to 9/11.

You're right on the stance and everything, I still enjoy the event. I think it's execution was a bit abrupt though, and certain things like cloning Thor were well beyond what an even out-of-character Tony would do. There were just some things that dragged it down, especially when it was consistently advertised as a "grey" issue with the 'what side are you on' ads (similar for AvX). They wanted it to spark debate among comic fans, similar to the Patriot Act (I don't think the public at large was divisive on Afghanistan at all...but that's for another day) did to the American public, but they made one side clearly evil. That was disappointing, when it was advertised and explained to be a "no right side" story.

Yes he was.

I was wondering If ultimate Iron Man is a mutant. Would be funny If he was in Civil War.

Thats exactly why some (including me) found it poor, you cant satisfy me with just ''pretty well'' when you first promise of ''magnificent"..

@-daydream-: That is a kind of unrealistic basis for calling something poor though. Its Marvel's job to hype and try to sell their comics. You can't judge a comic based upon hype. You just judge on whether you found it to be entertaining. Marvel hypes all of their events anyhow. If they didn't they wouldn't sell as many.

You are right in everything u said, sure it makes sense and it is understandable in the perspective of Marvel, but looking at the things from the eyes of a customer (cause we are customers in the end), people at least has the right to call it poor or be whiny about it when you tell them 'i will sell you a ferrari' but then hand them a 71 model Ford Pinto

@-daydream-: I understand that point of view I just don't think I'd call it a 71 Pinto. I'd call it more like a 97 Corvette or something. Its a matter of opinion though. I just liked how the story didn't get overly convoluted and moved at a decent pace.

Yeah, without Tony, Sentinels would probably be designed to hunt not only mutants, but all superhumans

i didnt call it poor too, i just agreed on somebody else saying there it was 'pretty well', i just meant 'pretty well' made me say "meh" after Ferrari kind of stuff expectations. this is also a 'grey' area, i can be wrong to some, right to some..tastes are tastes, no need to seek an agreement

So did Cap. But unlike Tony who wanted to find a way so most people would have an livable situation, Cap acted like an angry bully. AND he made his fair share of deals with the devil as well, like joining forces with the Punisher(which is also REALLY stupid, since he is Marvel's biggest loose canon) and making a deal with the Kingpin. At the end of Civil War, Cap actually admits that he was wrong in his way of handling the problem, which is why he handed himself to the authorities.

... Something that all writers choose to ignore, because Cap being the hero of Civil War and Tony the bad guy is easier to write...

To be fair he had Frank on a short leash and when Frank went all 'kill'em all' Steve put him down.

I didn't see Cap really as an angry bully, more so just very disappointed in a country that once valued freedom that he and so many others fought hard to protect.

But, interpretations and all. Tony has always been a tool, he was just more toolish in Civil War than usual it seemed to me. But again, perspective and interpretation.

@granitesoldier: Not short enough, since he managed to kill someone. And EVERYONE told him that letting Frank join the rebellion was a bad idea. But he did it anyway.

Yep, you're right. I've already admitted that many characters characterization was off to make the story work.

I agree that Cap chose the worst way possible to try and rebel against what the gov't and shield were trying to do. He could have made his case to the American public and used whatever good will he had built up with both the gov't and the people to try and make his voice heard but instead he immediately chose to be part of an outlaw team that was acting outside of the law while still trying to fight crime.

Exactly.

I do not think Tony would ever sell out his fellow humans he is to much a person that is to himself and would never want others space to be invaded. You can see that because he gets upset when others push into his private life.

So Tony of all people would say no to registration act.

Spiderman as well he wears a mask to protect his loved ones and also so he can avoid people wanting to praise him to much and heap rewards oh him. How much saving of life could you do with people constantly beating down your door with good intentions or bad. Both would get in the way.

Tony would want to be left alone and he would know that so would others and not force the issue.

Registration at it's base might have some good points but Tony's was undeniably evil. Just because he believed he was doing for a good cause or it would have gotten worse if he hadn't doesn't make what he did less horrible.