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Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio

Something occurred to me this past weekend that I had never thought of before. I was away from the internet and thus I was catching up on some reviews and some other comic reading. In an issue from some 1960s era romance comic there was a woman that was pulling her nylons up her legs. This is a fairly common image among women, as it has become famous in other movies such as the Graduate and Pretty Woman. Without going too far into details, the nylons or pantyhose go to the same place essentially that a man fantasizing of sex would want to go. The process is therefore charged with sexuality, at least as an image in popular culture. Fast forward about 40 years of comic history and Supergirl was doing the same in a recent issue of her own series, albeit with her knee high socks (which I had assumed were boots previously). It does seem to be a bit of a double standard when the usual image is applied to superheroes, because the majority of superheroes wear tights or something to that degree. We never get to see Dick Grayson of Gambit seductively pulling on his uniform, but it is still a common enough image among female characters. I am not naive enough it think that this will ever change, but it is always nonetheless interesting for me to point out the differences in the medium as between male and female readers.

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#1 Edited by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

It's not as attractive when a man does it. Trust me

PS: THOSE ARE SOCKS???? I thought they were boots! Need to pay more attention to the images than to the speech bubbles

#2 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

Ummm how else would you put on those boots?

As to the "Never seen Nightwing do it" you also never see Nightwing viciously beat Batman over a misunderstanding. Supergirl is a horrifically bad character.

I also think you're reading WAY too much into the "male mind" I have NEVER looked at a woman putting a sock on and thought "Damn now that's hot," in anyway shape or form.

#3 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@Jorgevy: No doubt, it is just interesting that only women have to put on their clothes for others to see on panel.   
 
@TheCrowbar: I am not saying that men fantasize over watching women put on pantyhose, but say if a woman did it in a crowded train station, a lot of men would stop for a look.  
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#4 Edited by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar said:

I also think you're reading WAY too much into the "male mind" I have NEVER looked at a woman putting a sock on and thought "Damn now that's hot," in anyway shape or form.

I have. Also, what's the problem with Supergirl? are you talking about her beating up Supes in a recent issue?

@RazzaTazz: because of that I just remembered Thor in his movie when he is pulling his pants up. It's the male equivalent, putting pants up (or puttin on a tight sleeveless shirt)

#5 Posted by umbrafeline (5300 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz: not only would men stop, but i bet a percentage of women will stop too, just to hit their husbands/boyfriends for looking lol

#6 Posted by Jotham (4564 posts) - - Show Bio

Those are definitely boots.

#7 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz:

Well to put on pantyhose though you need to reveal more than a normal sock. The equivalent would be a man putting pants on.

@Jorgevy:

Every iteration of her is belligerent and insane for no good reason.

#8 Edited by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar: well, she has just arrive at an unknown world and in the 1st 5 minutes a bunch of robots attack her and a maniac kidnaped her. I think she has pretty good motives to distrust most humans for now. Specially when Superman was acting insane, almost killing people and Superboy told her he was a clone (she has a slight phobia of clones) and a super weapon

#9 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@Jorgevy:

I read the first arc, Superman wasn't acting insane. He was explaining himself and she attacked him. And right before the reboot we had "Dark Supergirl" I could go on. No really I could. I want this character killed off, she's useless.

#10 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheCrowbar: I know a thing or two about putting on pantyhose, I just chose the word sock in the title because of the alliteration, maybe that i confsuing but I talk about pantyhose throughout.   
 
@Jotham: She puts her boots on like I put on knee high socks though.  I am sure the bottom of the foot is quite sturdy.  
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#11 Edited by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz:

Ahh then I stand corrected on that, but again still sexualization of characters in comics isn't anything really new or specific to females. If you like I could find you the collage of Nightwing's ass.

#12 Posted by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar: wasn't acting insane? he threw a person of a roof!

#13 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@Jorgevy said:

@TheCrowbar: wasn't acting insane? he threw a person of a roof!

In Supergirl or in Action Comics? When she meets Superman for the first time, he tries to talk to her.

#14 Posted by Jotham (4564 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz: Actually, that's pretty much the way I put on socks too. Although it looks more manly when I do it.

#15 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheCrowbar: No doubt but Nightwing is an exception.  There are pictures of him for sure, but how many more of female characters?  I wasn't trying to overthrow the comics industry here, I was just making an observation, half expecting no one to read or comment on it.  
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#16 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@Jotham: Fair enough, only they don't usually show men putting on socks in a seductive way.  
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#17 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz said:

@TheCrowbar: No doubt but Nightwing is an exception. There are pictures of him for sure, but how many more of female characters? I wasn't trying to overthrow the comics industry here, I was just making an observation, half expecting no one to read or comment on it.

How many times did Superman go half naked(from explosions and such) in comics during the 90's?

Batman's recent stint in the Catwoman comic.

Namor...in general.

The overly tight spandex men wore in the 80's forward.

Sexualization is actually rather equally applied in women and men.

#18 Posted by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar: oh yeah I was confusing with the other incident. but still. my interpretation

as you can see, he does try to calm her down but he barely knows who she is.

I mean, if a super powered stranger appear out of nowhere claiming to be your cousin on an alien world 5 minutes after you being attack when he was supposed to be 1 year old 2 days ago, Id probably think it's a trap

#19 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheCrowbar: There is certainly some sexualization, my point was more so that things like a revealing costume or having that costume blown off are passive activities, whereas when a female character seductively rolls up her tights, it is an active decision.  
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#20 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@Jorgevy:

Thinking it's a trap and attacking someone are two different things. Neither his actions or postures are offensive.

#21 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

Seductive? The image has to be very specific but even in that case it's not that eye-catching to me.

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#22 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz said:

@TheCrowbar: There is certainly some sexualization, my point was more so that things like a revealing costume or having that costume blown off are passive activities, whereas when a female character seductively rolls up her tights, it is an active decision.

How else would those be put on though?

When I put on my rubber pants(Shut up) for river fishing it's a very similar pose.

#23 Posted by menaceforever (3696 posts) - - Show Bio

Why don I find that attractive...........like at all.

#24 Posted by ratman19 (525 posts) - - Show Bio

i dont like how they draw supergirl, her face looks weird

#25 Posted by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar: she thought it was some kind of dream, or an alien world, and he was very supernatural. I dont blame her. Also, he has a somewhat threatning posture when he appears flying above, but that could be just me

@RazzaTazz said:

@TheCrowbar: There is certainly some sexualization, my point was more so that things like a revealing costume or having that costume blown off are passive activities, whereas when a female character seductively rolls up her tights, it is an active decision.

I think I remember seeing somewhere a hero dress his costume in a seductively manner... But I agree, it happens more with women than with man. But I think it's because men are almost always dressed in a way they can quickly get costumed but women aren't

#26 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheCrowbar: Its jut that they don't show the same action for male characters, though comics would be one of the few places where it would be something actually relevant (other than some fishing magazine I guess)
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#27 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio
#28 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@TheCrowbar: I am sure there are some there, it doesn't change the fact that there is a passive sexualization and an active one.  
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#29 Posted by sesquipedalophobe (4691 posts) - - Show Bio
@menaceforever said:
Why don I find that attractive...........like at all.

You were reared in a generation without the oppression of socks. It takes others years to become orphaned to the illusory, that the shin is the most attractive part of a woman.
#30 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz: I think it being active or passive is irrelevant being someone has to draw them in that pose. Either way sexualization still happened.

#31 Posted by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@sesquipedalophobe said:

@menaceforever said:
Why don I find that attractive...........like at all.
You were reared in a generation without the oppression of socks. It takes others years to become orphaned to the illusory, that the shin is the most attractive part of a woman.

I just find most parts of a woman's body attractive. Nº1 being legs, so I guess stocks/stockings have that effect, but I can vouche it's not something common amongst this newest generation

#32 Edited by Dernman (14731 posts) - - Show Bio

Points to the issue where you see Gambit's naked butt in the shower and him casually walking out to his closet in the other room..

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#33 Posted by sesquipedalophobe (4691 posts) - - Show Bio
@Jorgevy: In other words, sexuality is transforming. It's not hard to imagine given that the women in my family work in construction.
#34 Edited by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@sesquipedalophobe: really?!? that's unheard and awesome!

@ratman19 said:

i dont like how they draw supergirl, her face looks weird

I like it :D Id totally help her out with her stockings

#35 Posted by sesquipedalophobe (4691 posts) - - Show Bio
@Jorgevy: It's becoming pretty common for women to work construction, actually. It's just a matter of surviving the few, those being the chauvinists. My sister once told me, "It's considerably more difficult for me to take a desk job than it is to do what I do. Makeup, staying quiet, keeping pretty. In construction, I can be just as good as the men and I don't have to work so hard for it."
#36 Posted by Renchamp (2286 posts) - - Show Bio

"nylons or pantyhose go to the same place essentially that a man fantasizing of sex would want to go"

Perfectly worded for your point, but I think another more R-rated explanation is more fitting. I'll not go into it so as to protect those of pure minds and young hearts (you were probably already shielding for these reasons). That said, the right nylons can do amazing things for a woman.

#37 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@Renchamp: I had to think about how to write that part ;)
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#38 Posted by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

@sesquipedalophobe: that's incredible awesome! Kudos to your family!

#39 Posted by Jotham (4564 posts) - - Show Bio

@RazzaTazz said:

@Jotham: Fair enough, only they don't usually show men putting on socks in a seductive way.

Frankly, I think it's more intimate than seductive. Maybe they feel readers need a more in depth relationship with the character than you would get just watching them in action. I don't know, otherwise it's just another case of female characters being treated differently than male characters.

#40 Posted by No_Name_ (17403 posts) - - Show Bio

@sesquipedalophobe said:

@menaceforever said:
Why don I find that attractive...........like at all.
You were reared in a generation without the oppression of socks. It takes others years to become orphaned to the illusory, that the shin is the most attractive part of a woman.

This. So much.

#41 Posted by shadowpdf1 (18 posts) - - Show Bio

Stems. Pins. Gams. The female leg has been the object of male affection and attention for millennia. The male leg, however, has not been such a singular object of attraction with women. Men and women focus on different features (physical, material, and personality). I cannot speak for women, but I believe that the female leg (as well as the well-turned ankle) has received such attention over the years because until fairly recently those limbs were well hidden beneath folds (often many folds) of cloth. What you can't see you fantasize about.

That particular pose you mention is specific to motion pictures and was carried into print in magazine photographs and in comics. It didn't originate in print. And you're right that it is sexually charged, but not always. Sometimes (like in your Supergirl example) it's just a pretty way to draw a girl.

And you forget one important, very historical use of the image of a male donning clothing in comics:

#42 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@shadowpdf1: I agree completely with you, it is just that one of the few places where the image might be used for males is in comics, and it is not used there.  
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#43 Posted by VyseCarma (257 posts) - - Show Bio

So hard at the Nightwing comment

#44 Posted by tdrake (7 posts) - - Show Bio

I'd definitely be up for more male characters pulling on (or taking off) tights lol

There's a pretty funny blog that collects a lot of sexy male scenes actually:

http://shirtless-superheroes.blogspot.com/

#45 Posted by Shotgun (900 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar: @TheCrowbar said:

@RazzaTazz said:

@TheCrowbar: No doubt but Nightwing is an exception. There are pictures of him for sure, but how many more of female characters? I wasn't trying to overthrow the comics industry here, I was just making an observation, half expecting no one to read or comment on it.

How many times did Superman go half naked(from explosions and such) in comics during the 90's?

Batman's recent stint in the Catwoman comic.

Namor...in general.

The overly tight spandex men wore in the 80's forward.

Sexualization is actually rather equally applied in women and men.

But there are more scenes of women showering, dressing, and so on.

Sexualization happens to both men and women, yes, but more so often to women. Quit denying the truth.

#46 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@Shotgun said:

@TheCrowbar: @TheCrowbar said:

@RazzaTazz said:

@TheCrowbar: No doubt but Nightwing is an exception. There are pictures of him for sure, but how many more of female characters? I wasn't trying to overthrow the comics industry here, I was just making an observation, half expecting no one to read or comment on it.

How many times did Superman go half naked(from explosions and such) in comics during the 90's?

Batman's recent stint in the Catwoman comic.

Namor...in general.

The overly tight spandex men wore in the 80's forward.

Sexualization is actually rather equally applied in women and men.

But there are more scenes of women showering, dressing, and so on.

Sexualization happens to both men and women, yes, but more so often to women. Quit denying the truth.

Sorry that's patently untrue. When men are wearing what might as well be a painted on costume with little speedos more often than not, to say "It happens more often to women" is remarkably blind.

#47 Posted by DocFatalis (1419 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar said:

@Jorgevy:

I read the first arc, Superman wasn't acting insane. He was explaining himself and she attacked him. And right before the reboot we had "Dark Supergirl" I could go on. No really I could. I want this character killed off, she's useless.

I totally agree with this statement. When you get a female rip-off of a hero to start with it usually is a bad omen.

#48 Posted by CapFanboy (4520 posts) - - Show Bio

@menaceforever said:

Why don I find that attractive...........like at all.

Cause it's not real.

#49 Posted by cyberninja (10413 posts) - - Show Bio

Awesome thread, and yet again I don't know what we men did but on behalf of all men I would like to say "we're truly sorry."  I can't wait for your next thread so I can apologize yet again.  This is fun. 

#50 Posted by RazzaTazz (9478 posts) - - Show Bio
@cyberninja: On behalf of my kind I graciously accept your apology.  It seems as though we misjudged you, things are gonna change for the better now.  
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