Not all bullets are created equal. Bullet timing feats.

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TheJman

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@thejman: I am relaxed actually, I was just trying to stick up for Slim and then I felt the need to comment since the two of your first reaction was to lash out at me. Look I get that you're new here and you're probably just a kid, so I'm not trying to make a big deal out of nothing. Just try and think before commenting. That's all.

okie dokie, sorry if it came off as offensive.

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bflynn316

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MasterKungFu

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more detail is too much

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Venator_umbra

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GraniteSoldier

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@slimj87d: Good thread. I've actually brought this up in threads before. Being a military man I can tell based on the drawn design of a weapon what the make is, what rounds that weapon chambers, the most common grains, and the respective velocities of those particular rounds. It's useful when you're debating and someone argues that two classes of characters are near in speed (for example if someone argues Batman = Spider-Man due to bullet timing, etc) by blasting someone with knowledge that they might not know/consider.

However writers probably (I'd dare say definitely) don't know that much about firearms and their ballistics, so those are things they never factor in. Which brings me to a point I consistently have brought up in my debates which i think is often overlooked: writer's intent. Writers probably don't know an M16 from an M4, and likely don't know an M4 from an HK416 or SCAR. All look similar in design, but the weapons function differently. So if the writer says a group of men are say, Navy SEALs and are using a particular rifle that is drawn in appearance to an M4, am I correct in coming in and saying "no, modern SEALs currently kit out using an HK416"? The writer and artist probably wouldn't know the difference from a hole in the wall.

I know I'm probably really in the weeds with this, and while I'm in agreement that not all bullets and bullet timing feats are created equal, where would you draw the line when you consider that writers really don't put that much thought into it?

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VMole

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Eesh, what Granite and others have already pointed out.

Saved me a paragraph or two on why (most) writers and art majors shouldn't be looked on as an authority in weapon design and function, especially when they're played with a straight face.

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HeirToTheKingdom

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I agree with this

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slimj87d

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#58  Edited By slimj87d

@granitesoldier: i kind of gave an example and already stated how we don't really need to get into that much detail.

We should just diffrentiate a handgun, assault rifle and sniper rifle. Similar to how people say Batman and Iron Fist have similar feats because Batman deflected a handgun bullet and Danny caught a sniping rifle bullet. Those feats aren't really equal in reaction time and reflexes. Well one obvious reason, Danny was also drugged and focusing his chi to also fight off the poison, but I think you get what I'm saying. Danny's feat is more significant than Batman bullet deflection feat in this instance.

I'll just say this. If someone were to debate Batman and Iron Man's reaction time and speed and the above scenario played out. The Batman supporter stating "bullets are just bullets" won't have a good counter argument, they would lose everytime and anytime unless if they had a specific matching feat.

It doesn't hurt, but just strengthens the Iron Fist supporters argument. The "bullets are just bullets" argument will more than likely lose if someone can show exactly why one feat is better than the other.

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GraniteSoldier

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@slimj87d: I did see your addressing of it in the OP, but there is such a large variance in velocities and kinetic delivery for bullets (especially in handguns). I am totally accepting of the common acceptance of sniper rounds > rifle rounds > pistol rounds, because I don't think dodging pistol fire is comparable to either of the latter two.

However I will say this, and it might be unrelated, but I have always been of the reader viewpoint that all but the top of street-tier characters aim dodge, not bullet time. I accept Spider-Man or Iron Fist bullet timing, they have plenty to suggest it. However I think most aim dodge/block, simply because not everyone and their mother is a bullet-timer and it is easier to make it look like a bullet is dodged outright than to keenly accentuate that a character started dodging as the trigger was being pulled. It's simply a limitation of the art and not a key point in the storytelling.

Plus, even in that case, I still think writer's intent should be looked at.

Good thread, I agree with your assessment.

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slimj87d

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@granitesoldier: Yeah, there are some feats that actually show the bullet leave the chamber and the character moves afterwards.

Batman, Captain America, Wolverine, Dare Devil, Iron Fist, Shang Chi and Cassandra Cain come off the top of me head. But how equal are their feats can actually be discussed by gunfire.

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deactivated-5dace575ce059

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@bflynn316: I dont jump in here to piss people off, people should just relax and enjoy the comics for what they are, it's honestly that simple. If you're going to nip-pick every little thing, then whats the joy in reading? It's like reading a book or watching a movie and just tearing it down rather than just reading it for purpose of enjoyment. I have no problem coming in here and saying this is quite sad, why??? Because it is, people now days are taking comics wwwaaaayyyy to serious, and soon it will be so silly to have an argument with people covering over every little inch of proof and arguing over the smallest of facts. I get it, small facts add up, they really do. However, doing this is just plain silly. Either way it's not like I'm insulting him, I'm saying the idea of this was rather depressing to see something such as bullet timing being such an issue. Comic writers don't care, they dodge a bullet, they dodge a bullet. It's like trying to get sci fi writers to write actual stuff that make's sense ( aka warhammer, star wars, starcraft, etc. ) They don't always make sense, and tbh don't have to it imagination people can say this pistol here shoots rounds that are as hot as a sun and how it works is "because it does."

Anyway that's was my point you can accept it or not, but tbh its derailing the thread, so ill just drop it.