Marvel Civil War . . . Whose Side Are You On?

@depinhom: true. But other countries will thwn get their own superhuman weapons, and America won't attack them because that could cause a superhuman war.

It depends on how each side is portrayed but seeing as this is a Captain America movie, it's likely that Iron Man will be pushed into more of an antagonistic role. If that's the case, I'll back Steve.

Thanks. One of the many problems with the cw storyline was that this sort of conversation was never had by any of the characters, no court ever decided if the law was constitutional or not. The writers/editors at marvel were either too lazy or didn't think that they had enough talent to make this part of the story and keep the story interesting.

For the movie, rolling with #TeamStark

@depinhom: it's just a formality, they know all of those guy's identities anyway.

Cap.

Iron Man, indefinitely

And the comics?

And that could turn out very bad

Superheroes are just here because they were given powers and capabilities and they just decide to use them for good

Some don't and then must be fought by the superheroes

@depinhom: When there are criminals, there are cops. Cops are paid and have rules and laws. So should living, walking WMD's.

@depinhom: actually, I never really swayed towards either side in the comics tbh...Starks douche levels were peaking at that time, but I didn't necessarily feel he was wrong

Look, nobody respects cops more than me and I agree public safety is a priority but cops are most certainly not fit to deal with forces such as Ultron and those "living, walking WMD's" will actually become REAL WMD's, manipulated by the government

You know that Ross has been trying to weaponize Hulk for the longest time but it's just not right

It would have been better if Hulk and Thor wee actually in Civil War so we could see what would've happened there

@depinhom: true, especially if they were on opposite teams.

@maxlabp: Though they did have robot Thor who killed Goliath and regular Thor would not have

I agree with @overmonitor.

The law doesn’t always guarantee everyone same treatment, nor should it. There are legal exceptions that’s allow “differently” people be treated differently. For example if a person is 19 he/she is not allowed to drink or students with ADD/ADHD are legally allowed extra time when taking standardized tests.

Equality before the law is sometimes misunderstood. It does not necessarily mean “same treatment”.

Besides the 4^th amendment reads:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

This means given probable cause, i.e. a person has the power to blow up a school, the law allows for the violation of the citizens liberty.

Also super powered people are the minority when compared with normal humans in the marvel universe. For the greater good some restrictions can be made, a notable example is prohibiting smoking in public areas. To protect a public health the liberties of the minority was restricted.

I'm on team Panther

Not the same. Smokers have a choice. A person with powers can't just quit the habit. Removing or restricting the powers involves either wearing a power neutralizing unit or having them removed. That's either putting a person in shackles for life or forcing them to undergo some sort of invasive medical procedure. Just because a person has the power to blow up a school it doesn't mean that he will. Give me an hour and some household chemicals and I could blow things up.

The problem with the concept of the greater good is that it ignores the real consequences for those who aren't the greater good. Or to put it another way it's great to see the big picture, but for those who look at the big picture they often don't see the people being crushed by the frame.

Simple scenario: Character A has the ability to change stone into wood with just a touch. That's it, that's all he can do. This character has lived all his life as an American citizen, he's broken no laws, never used his power to hurt anyone, maybe just uses it as a party trick. His neighbor character B doesn't have that same ability. Registration is passed. Character A must sign up, leaving himself open to be drafted, watched at all times and probably be required to under go testing of his abilities and training. This takes months out his life. If he has a job and is suddenly outed and forced to take time off how long will he have that job? Even if the law requires that he can't be fired for the time off the job itself will not be the same because his co-workers and boss will know. Depending upon the job he could be forced out by the attitudes of his co-workers. In the old days it would have been like being identified as a jew. So character A must register, must be trained, must be tested and then is open to a draft. His life is completely disrupted even though he hasn't done anything and might never do anything. He is basically guilty under the law of existing and for all intents and purposes is arrested and imprisoned for a time until the government decides that he's not a danger. By what standards the government uses is left open for the government to decide. But to make character B feel safe all this must be done. If there is any fairness in forcing a minority to live with restrictions so that the majority can feel safe I don't see it.

@maxlabp: @depinhom: Banner is most likely against registering just based on the fact they wanted to make the Hulk into a weapon and hunted by the gov. but I'm sure he would agree with Tony to a point but would probably stay neutral.

I don't see Thor siding with Tony. Thor is a free spirit and would trust that superheroes know how to make the right decision

I could see them both teaming up to fight the Sentry

@kgb725: Sentry was really not a big deal

Robo Thor was

@depinhom: Thor (Ragnorok) was weak he got one shotted by Hercules which Hulk /Thor could both do. I'm just saying Thor & Hulk would've fought the sentry or maybe the void because these would be 2 heavy hitters who'd probably be on the same side

I'm pro registration, but I'm not on Tony's side. Stark made some ridiculous calls that just made him villainous for the sake of peace.

The reporter debunking Cap's stubbornness was absolutely correct and it was a hint at the 'correct answer' to it all.

Gone are the days when heroes are fighting people who want nothing more than to rob banks, or nazi's wanting to take over the world.

Times have changed. There was a great Golden age of Heroes but now is the age of accountability. We see this in the last fight scene. Cap & Tony completely forgot who they were. They weren't fighting for the people anymore but they were fighting for themselves.

Cap was fighting for his rights

They both thought they were doing what was right but got lost in all of it

That's war, soon you forget what you're fighting over and suddenly you're just fighting

Not really. Cap believes in old American Ideals, and one of those were freedom from big governmental control. And nothing screams big governmental control louder than taking the names and identities of a whole bunch of people.

Someone before has commented how dead on this is, and I agree, with a few more thoughts.

One of my main issues (touched on in mark-stephen's response) is that in the Civil War story line, the Govt wasn't just wanting all Costumed Super Powered Heroes to Register they wanted EVERY super powered CITIZEN to not only register, but be trained and deputized as a government agent. The registration of a self appointed super powered vigilante I could understand (to a point), but forcing average people to basically be super powered cops. That's BS.

Another issue is along the same line as mark's gun control point. It's been said a thousand times, and I think it's very true. "If guns are banned, only criminals would have guns". If the govt. created this registration act, only super powered criminals who had been previously been caught and/or convicted, and law abiding citizens would register to begin with. Does anyone seriously think the Green Goblin would line up to register his powers? (Assuming he hadn't already been caught multiple times already?)

That's really all I had to add mark_stephen had everything else already nailed down tight.

@kgb725: them both teaming up against Sentry would be epic.

Registration, to me, sounds a lot like the Eugenics programs started in the late 20s by a variety of governments, which led to some truly atrocious actions against the targeted groups. (Forced sterilization of the 'insane' or 'disabled', and culminating in the very open mass genocides of WWII.)

The handling of the storyline was even worse, as the two primary targets Stark wanted to make 'examples' of, Luke Cage and Captain America, were both created BY the Government. They could have simply called them 'pre registered' and avoided a ton of political fallout.

Then lastly, Spider-Man, a registered hero, speaks against registration. So lets send the Sinister Six after him. He doesn't cause property damage, or overtly help any non-registered hero yet, or do anything else illegal. He just goes on the news and says "Hey, this imprisonment without a trial is going to far." and Tony sics the dogs on him.

Pro-registration.

Security measures can't exist without compromising the application of freedom.

Freedom can't exist without a fair application of government power and oversight of that power.

The side that will take the win... duh

Well Iron Man technically won . . . so . . .

Hopefully... The side that this looks like another good movie by the Russo brothers!

Captain America because the government is corrupt as f*ck.

Anti-Reg.

Captain America. Iron Man was willing to give sell out his fellow superheroes and everything they once stood for just because he was ordered to.

Both in fiction and in the real world, anyone who has to rationalize their actions with "I was just enforcing the law" or "I was just following orders" did something wrong. Excuses like that are never used by the good guys.

ever since I read civil war, Fuck iron man. I'm definitely anti registration if the government had control over that many superpowered people how what would stop them from using them to do what ever they wanted. Like cap said people have agendas and most especially with power can not be trusted. It also violates peoples rights and is not only a list of where they are at it's also a list of what they can and cannot do putting any possible weakness out there.

tony was right, responsibility is needed but maybe his methods were quite a bit too extreme