Is a black Human Torch considered a retcon?

Bane was fully white with no hispanic connections Sue Storm was a Latina with a blonde dye and blue contacts but it was cool and they weren't rc's Everytime there's a black character there's a large scale outrage i.e. Heimdall,Miles Morales(even though he's original),Fury.

This is going to be a great thread.

I think it's only a retcon if it alters the established canon.

Isn't this still just a rumor....? O.o

This.

btw,wasn't that whole thing only a rumor? Can we stop bringing this topic up every single month?

@wolverine08 We can always count on you to bring on the joker

To tell you the truth,when I saw the movie a few years ago,I had no Idea that she was latina.

Also,I agree with most of this,especially the last sentence

@mitran:

Maybe we run in different circles but you are right about Heimdall,it isn't as big as the Torch fiasco but a decent amount of ppl were crying controversy,the other 2 though were pretty big.

@cameron83: Maybe it just comes up as he seems to be the only rumoured casting. I don't think I've heard any other ideas of who'll be be in it, apart from David Tennant mentioning he could maybe play Reed Richards. I think that could be cool.

For the record, I thought Bane was horrible in TDKR.

Race really isn't that relevant to most characters.

Changing Johnny from white to black to asian, to whatever. IDC.

However - I think Sue should be the same race as I feel their brother-sister relationship is most definitely relevant. And I feel like adopted would be a bit of a cop-out.

But otherwise go for it. When you break them down, the race of most character doesn't change who they are. You could cry if you wanted too, but if Batman was black it doesn't change anything about him really. He's not defined by his skin tone. (not saying it going to happen though either).

Red Skull for example though, would kind be weird if he wasn't played by a white actor (prior to becoming Red anyway)...as I'm not sure I'd buy someone being a Nazi that wasn't white. I'm sure their are more examples.

Making the Human Torch black is racist.

Towards black people or white people?

Towards black people. The one superhero they light on fire, and they make him black...

Is it racist if it's retconned?

He seems like an interesting Reed.

How would them being adopted be a cop-out? People can definitely say that they don't have to be blood-related to be considered (to each other) Brother and Sister. They can be really close while also not being related.

.........what?

Are you serious?

It's borderline offensive.

I don't think them being adopted would make a difference on who the characters are. I agree with the rest of this though.

@cameron83: Its a cop out because if they want to change the race of one, but not the other, then are presented with the problem of making them family they'll just be like "oh hey they're adopted"

that is why its a cop out

i don't care what race they are, but it should be the same. they're blood related. if you want to make them both martians...whatever, but I feel like bro/sis shouldn't be changed.

......Are people finding any reason to be offended nowadays?

His flame powers have no racial meanings or relations behind it.

They can't make the genius team leader black? It has the be one on fire?

I liked the new Bane. I didn't care for the new Sue Storm. I liked classic Nick Fury thought Liam Nelson would have made a great Fury. Himdel didn't mind that at all I liked it. New colored torch let's wait and see if the guy does a well job portraying Johnny then I'm all for it.

I get your point on them being blood related,but they don't really have to to be considered "family" or brother and sister. People don't consider that crucial in terms of a persons relation with another. They don't have to be blood related and can be closer than an actual blood related bro-sis duo.....know what I mean?

I understand your point on the cop out,but again,a person doesn't really have to be blood-related to be considered "brother" and "sister".

....You do realize that Johnny is a powerful member of the FF,right?

You do realize that they made a big bald white guy into an ugly orange rock monster....right?

What difference does it make? Wow,he's on fire and he's a black guy,so what? A persons ethnicity has NOTHING to do with their powers. (at least in this case)

@mitran: That's why I don't like Miles. They took a character I cared about more then mainstream Pete and had been reading for over a decade, killed him, then brought him back with a new name and ancestry. I'm still not pleased over it. I don't get what the big deal is with taking a character and replacing them. Minority or not, 99% of the time it does not stick. The original is sure to come back and resume their spot and then fill in character gets a new nickname and becomes a B chara. Nine times out of ten, anyhow.

@mikex20: False. It may alienate people but it isn't being prejudicial to whites.

@fallschirmjager: What is hilarious then is that in the 1990 Cap movie is that the Skull is Italian.

@cameron83: I didn't say they had to be. I just think its part of who they are and should be included.

Not saying it would totally ruin the movie, but I feel like its a little bit of a cop out, =P

Although if Sue was black, and they cased Reed as a white guy or any other race, it would be cool to see an interracial superhero couple. It shouldnt be like the main theme of the movie, (and should not be a big deal to the plot in ANY way) but if it just so happened to work out like that it would be cool.

I think they should do the same for a gay superhero in movies, whenever that happens. Just be a normal superhero movie, except make them gay. Don't make the movie centered around that as a plot just be like "hey I'm a superhero, and I'm gay, lets go save the world."

no big deal type stuff. (because even though it is, things like that shouldn't be a big deal)

know what I mean?

I completely understand :)

However,some people think that them being blood-related isn't a necessity for their relationship (I am NOT one of those people,just giving their side of the argument),but I completely understand.

I guess a lot of white boys still think that way.

........wow. Such racism.

I'm black btw.

But lol at people who think that ethnicity determines who you are,or your personality or your views. lol wow. Talk about ignorance and close-mindedness. Talk about irony.

But I guess that no black superhero can have fire-based powers because it automatically has racial intent,right?

Guess no black superhero can also be a speedster,right?

Because it automatically has to do with race,right? Ethnicity has something to do with powers,right?

Wow. I don't even want to live on this planet anymore if people still think like this.

What's next,you think that my ethnicity determines what music I like? What color I like? How I think (oh wait,you already think so)? How I act?

wow....humans really are....something.

I'm just playin. I don't care who plays the Torch. I'm just tired of this subject and flipped it to the extreme other side.

@risingbean: Are you upset about the new names and ancestries of Batman i.e. Bruce Wayne then Azrael then Dick Grayson? Or is it cool because they were all white.

Ah,okay. =O

WOOH!

I got so pissed there!

I'm also tired of this subject,it really needs to stop being brought up every 2 months.

I cannot believe I walked right into that trap XD

lol yeah,I walked right into it XD

@jeanralphio: Hm? Are you asking if I am pissed that Robin became Batman? Or when Azrael took over? No it wasn't ok because they were white.

To be clear, I did not like it either time, though I wasn't following Batman much during the Dick era. I don't much care for "residual" or "legacy" characters in general. I could be happy without the Superboys, Wonder Girls and X-23's. I think it takes away from a characters uniqueness when you have them half a dozen times over via son's, clones and protege's.

When Batman "died" he should have been buried. We don't need fill in's. That is just my two copper pieces, for what it's worth.

Also I don't appreciate the connotation that I am racist. I don't dislike Miles because he is a minority. I dislike him because he was shoehorned in at the expense of the life of one of my top five favorite characters in fiction.

Yet you still haven't said that you aren't a racist.

The bold should be enough to figure it out. If not, Well, I. Am. Not. A. Racist. That clear enough?

@risingbean: Most racists don't know they are racist. So still a racist.

You're either a troll, or a completely ridiculous fool.

@fallschirmjager: totally agree idc if he's black as long as sue is also black but they could always say adopted brother

This made me laugh hard.

Haha, didn't even notice the typo.

Not that just the response. I feel like it has a very high "are you kidding me" attitude behind it. Made me laugh haha.

Its not a retcon because its in another universe. That's like calling Ultimate Nick Fury a retcon

@jeanralphio: You've opened Pandora's box. And guess what? There's f*cking trouble inside.

I remember when I saw Fury in the Movies and I thought it was odd but thought nothing of it. However I think it would be odd for Human Torch to be African-American, because he has a sister also famous/superhero, unless they do a half-sibling thing, which I think would lead to a retcon