I feel out of sync with the big two.

What with convergence Wonder Woman (which was a let down for me) being the only DC title other than Shazam I'll pick up I've been going more into the dollar bin and going for indie comics more. Last week aside from Convergence Wonder Woman I bought Catwoman 0 1994 and All Star Squadron 13, 1982. I was struck by how much less of a story there was in Wonder Woman. All Star Squadron had more characters and more story than Catwoman and Catwoman had more story than Wonder Woman. The only modern comic I bought last week that matched All Star Squadron page for page was Groo Friends and Foes, Groella. What with having less and less money I've been going into the dollar bin more and more and I keep noticing this. Wonder Woman was 3.99 and only 22 of the pages actually was the story, the rest being background material and a preview. Catwoman had a page count of 24 story pages and was only a dollar. All Star Squadron had a 25 story page count and more characters than either of the other two titles and again was only a dollar. Groo had 23 pages at 3.99. The value here is evident and it was the same last week, just with different titles. Also in the dollar bin was random issues of 52, infinite Crisis, Civil War, Dark Reign and secret invasion.

To be honest I would have bought Convergence Wonder Woman for the cover alone, I think this is the first vampire she's ever faced. But the story itself was so... Useless. Diana gets her powers back, fights well, faces internal doubts but that's that and next month the current Wonder Woman will take over, the one with the scum gods and murderous/rapist amazons. I feel the only reason she was brought back at all was for the writer to take a pot shot at history, making sure the Wonder Woman who at least had a moment of happy marriage to Steve during Crisis didn't have that moment and never would. The story didn't really matter in any way, but she was a handy character to use to fill a few issues. So many of the convergence and so many of the battle world titles I've looked at seem to repeat this trend: high price, good art, little story and characters in the end that are disposable. Or will be disposable in a year or two with actions that will be forgotten in a year or two. I picked up every issue of 52 at full price when it came out. How much of 52 is left? For that matter how much of Infinite Crisis, Civil War, Dark Reign or Secret Invasion is left? Tony Stark's fascist turn in civil war seems almost quaint now that marvel has been going in for the wholesale slaughter of universes and Tony was turned into a drug dealer. I've given up being interested in Supergirl at all since she has the most limited life expectancy of any character that I can think of.

I really feel that in the indy titles I pick up the writers and editors have more care and concern for the characters than the majority of the writers at the big two and it shows. Aragone's cares more for Groo than I think Bendis will ever care for the X-men or Slott for Spider-Man. Even though My Little Pony (in an issue that introduced Prancy Drew, a young unicorn detective, which as a fan of Nancy Drew got a laugh out of me) is a product of a corporate culture equal in it's own way to Marvel and DC I felt that the author and the editor gave a lot more thought and care into the issue. I still like comics but I'm realizing more and more that at 2.99 and 3.99 and up the comics coming out of marvel and dc just aren't worth that price, not when I can wait a year or two and pick those same issues up for a dollar.

But on the other hand I'd like to be able to enjoy new comics when they come out, just as I've done ever since I've started reading comics. There's a bit of excitement in reading the new storylines and truth to tell I'm feeling a bit sorry for my lcs since I'm not buying the new comics, or as many of them as I used to. The dilemma would be partially solved by a lottery win, if I didn't have to worry about price (as I didn't used to, bad comics were a lot easier to stomach when they didn't cost so much), but barring that I really feel disconnected with the current output of the big two.

Tl;dr.

Give Valiant or IDW a look.

I'll be honest, I only read the first paragraph.

Still, the solution is simple... READ VALIANT!

You're not the only one who feels like that.

The big two aren't very newfan friendly. Or oldfan friendly. Or friendly.

I get what your saying. Another thing that has always gotten me, especially with the new 52 and marvel now, is that so many things are simply expendable now. I think both try too much to just throw stuff and hope for an immediate stick instead of really giving it a chance to develop with a steady writer. A book comes out in a new wave and it doesn't work out so it either gets a new writer or canned in the next wave. I understand you want that quick hit and money maker, but I think some, not all obviously, but some could be decent if just given a little time to grow and develop. I think the 52 hurt DC like that. Because it seemed like they put a limit on themselves, which to me kinda limited ideas. You want this character or that character but to bad the 52 were filled up. Or you got a character not a lot of people really cared about when that slot could've been potentially used better. Seems that'll be coming to an end now though. It became confusing at times because it was a reboot, but then it wasn't a reboot for certain characters like the Green lantern stuff. The timelines became to fuzzy with it being 5 years before if I remember correctly, but things didn't seem like they could happen in that time span. I don't know if this will make sense, but it was like they tried too hard at the start and ended up with some bad execution in the long term. Plus both sides seem to just want to through these big crossover events out left and right and then it begins to just get to costly to try and keep up. Now I think there are some great titles to pick up, but just not enough consistency.

I've looked at Valiant and some of it I like. That helps, but even a quick look at the previews gives me a good idea how badly out of touch I seem to be. Superior Iron Man is no different to me from the Iron Man they've writing since civil war, how I do work up any affection for a hero who switches off his morality the way he switches his armor? Or a Dr. Strange that commits murder? On the DC side I was enjoying Huntress and Power Girl and their struggle to return home and look what they returned to. I'm tired of the only suspense in comics being when the next character will be turned gay, have his/her origin redone or just plain go evil or loose. Reading the Earth 2 end titles I got the feeling that the only thing missing was Bomb Queen. If you are going to have the heroes loose all the time and so completely might as well bring her in.

Comics to me throughout most of my reading history has been DC and Marvel and while I am picking up other stuff now I still find myself asking the question is it me or is it them? I'm sure the callous and petty reading this will say it's all me, that I'm holding onto the past and other such things that have been screamed at me over at cbr, and I'm not sure it isn't. But I have realized that when a character goes bad for the sake of a plot I'm not one of the people who can 'just let it go' after a quick crying spell in a redemption storyline. Zatanna, Tony Stark, Dr. Strange, Reed Richards, Carol Danvers... all of them threw out a basic part of what made them heroes and none of them suffered in any real way for that. I just can't read stories like that and then keep thinking of them as heroic. I can't think of the writers who craft such tales and in some cases abandon the characters and in other cases write poorly written redemption stories and then forget about the acts as good, hardworking writers who care about the characters. They seem to be just churning them out for a quick paycheck. Childrens Crusade, Avengers Prime come to mind as two very bad stories. Zatanna was rebooted so quickly I didn't even read her redemption story, but I think it amounted to little more than some group therapy. On the other side of that Catwoman does nothing to her, nor did she or any of the other villains thrown off the Earth do anything to the people who sent them on Salvation Run, and these are characters who in large part live for vengeance. To say nothing of the pass the old Amazon's got for Amazons Attack before they were written even more badly for the current Wonder Woman series. Not to mention Wonder Girl and Super Girl who attacked the president and got a pilot killed. No repercussions at all.

I think that part of the requisite for reading stories from marvel or dc in their modern era is that the reader has to take it as given that the stories have zero lasting effect beyond two years, that they be over priced and contain less content and that characters will act any way the story demands regardless of past history. If I'm right then I'm really not the target audience. So that leads me to ask who is? Someone must be if the sales figures are right. Can someone really enjoy reading future Dr. Strange stories after he murdered the heroes of the Great Society? Can someone really think of She-Hulk and Catwoman as strong characters after they did nothing when suffering abuse? What is the attraction after the characters been shredded? Rebuilding? What good does that do when they'll just tear them down again?

It is the destiny of every fan to get distanced from the big two at some point. And new fans come to take their place. Its a circle.

loled.

Seconded.

Go indie.

Yes, you need to embrace the fact that the stories will have zero lasting effect, be over-priced, be light on content, and out of character interaction/behaviors to really enjoy Marvel and DC nowadays.

It's possible you're no longer the target audience. That's not a bad thing. It shows you have taste, and don't want to read the same recycled story with different presentation ad nauseum. I personally think the target audience are moviegoers 14 years old for most titles, with a cross section of 30-50 year old comics fans that will continue reading the same titles because they think they have a sense of ownership over these characters after years if investment.

I also don't like the characters being shredded, and torn down. Took me years to let go of my old favorites to the same extent I used to be invested in them. Bendis was the major reason I dropped most of the Marvel titles - he ruined characters, but never seemed to have anything interesting to follow it up with.

I started to explore more indie and smaller publisher's titles, and am having a blast. Just purchased "The Fifth Beatle", am deep into "Lady Killer", "The Mouse Guard", "Invincible", "Artesia", "Sex Criminals", and "Black Science". Rediscovered "The Watchmen", "The Books of Magic", classic "Dr. Strange" (very inexpensive when getting the larger collections), and others. Loving every minute of it. Especially supporting smart, talented, and extremely creative people that are trying something new.

Love going into a comics store, asking the owner/employee/fan for recommendations, and legitimately trying out new things based upon what looks good, creators who are trying new things, and etc. I still pick up some Marvel or DC titles, but these are now tending towards the off-beat ones - "New 52 Aquaman", "New 52 Wonder Woman", "X Factor", "Future Foundation", and etc.

Letting go of trusting the Big Two has freed me from having my imagination restricted by corporate-pushed titles, and I feel like a legitimate fan again. If anything, I sometimes forget that there are younger readers who still have the need to be uber fans, and don't recognize the vast amount of better comics out there. Once you've left the cave, it can be confusing to see people who still are satisfied with pointless hero worship, deus ex machina, more ads in a book then story, and stories without any resolution.

Image is where it's at. No major shared universe, no continuity hooblah, just good stories written by good writers.

@phoenixofthetides: It's interesting that going indie to me means basically letting go of only DC and Marvel with just a few exceptions. Like I said I would have picked up the Wonder Woman convergence title for the cover alone, but I know I'll stick with Harley Quinn for a while. She doesn't really have a solid continuity or anything like that, her title is basically a 3 Stooges short directed by Lenny Bruce. Her basic character is already dark and twisted, just with a cute touch. I think that's a large part of it, I could read a What-if or an Imaginary tale where the character is turned inside out and not mind because it wasn't the main character, but marvel and dc have incorporated character distortions into the standard universes, but as pointed out seldom have a follow up. But the Archie publishers are corporate, as are the companies behind Transformers, My Little Pony and a few others. But I've surprised myself by liking Afterlife with Archie and Sabrina, both dark variations of the type DC and Marvel have incorporated into their main titles. Then again they are also completely different versions/universes from the standard (or what was, I think they are changing it now) Archie universe.

Tl;dr version required..

@mark_stephen: I may have mis-used the word 'indie' to apply to any publisher or company that isn't one of the Big Two, but I think we're on the same page.

start reading Image comics

Image Comics... Just read those...

@phoenixofthetides: Yea, even though it does take little more work to make sure I miss nothing in previews and in some cases comics just vanish before the story ends.

ok

Just stay away from the big 2 right now. They've been biting the bullet, lately.