#1 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

I read The Ultimates a few months ago, and I am currently working through Ultimate Fantastic Four. I noticed a continuity errors. The Ultimates made reference to Reed Richards and the Fantastic Four, thus saying they were established and public before the Ultimates were formed. While in Ultimate Fantastic Four, before the FF went public, Franklin Storm made a reference to the Ultimates, establishing they were formed before the FF. I know I can't be the only one who noticed this, but onto my question: which one is correct? Did The Ultimates or Fantastic Four form first in the Ultimate Universe? If someone could help straighten this out for me, it would be much appreciated.

#2 Edited by Deadcool (6809 posts) - - Show Bio

I found this:

Continuity problems

Ultimate Fantastic Four is considered the source of several continuity problems within the Ultimate Marvel Universe.

The first problem revolves around when the team was founded and their ages. The Fantastic Four, as well as the "Reed Richards Science Center," are mentioned in early issues of Ultimate Spider-Man as well as the Ultimate Spider-Man video game, establishing that the team already existed. In The Ultimates series, it is also clearly stated by Nick Fury that the Fantastic Four were already in existence before the Ultimates roster was completed. This was contradicted in Ultimate Fantastic Four #5 when it is suggested that The Ultimates were already in existence before the "The Fantastic Four" officially went public. Writer Mark Millar, who wrote the plot, claims that he did not intend this to happen and blamed Brian Michael Bendis, who handled the dialogue chores, for the error. Additionally, the Ultimate Spider-Man Super Special, published approximately two years before the first issue of Ultimate Fantastic Four, features an appearance by the Fantastic Four who are written and drawn to appear older and almost identical to their established Earth-616 counterparts. Bendis did state that the appearance of this older version of the team would eventually be explained although this explanation has yet to be seen.

In response to confusion surrounding the team's earlier appearance in Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #9, Brian Michael Bendis has stated that the story was intentionally written to be non-canonical, as it features Spider-Man and a group of Skrulls going on a rampage through the Marvel Comics offices.

There are also inconsistencies concerning the appearance of Ultimate Doctor Doom and Latveria in Ultimate Marvel Team-Up. Latveria does exist within the universe but, although it is a dictatorship, it is not ruled by Doctor Doom. Despite this detail, Ultimate Marvel Team-Up #14, published well before his introduction in Ultimate Fantastic Four, features a painting of Doctor Doom on the wall of the Latverian Embassy.

#3 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@Deadcool said:

The Ultimates made reference to Reed Richards and the Fantastic Four

In which issue?

Second issue. When Fury was assembling the Ultimates, Iron Man asked him about the FF. Fury said he didn't want them part of the team due to the complaints the FF get. Not in those words obviously.

#4 Posted by danhimself (21904 posts) - - Show Bio

yeah there were a few issues of Ultimate Marvel Team-up that were retconned

#5 Posted by SoA (4592 posts) - - Show Bio

and here i thought this thread was pointing out psylocke being in ultimate x-men as a new character when she was already established as a x-men and i think she was killed too.

#6 Edited by Deadcool (6809 posts) - - Show Bio

@SoA: Well, in the ultimate universe there are multiple characters that share the same alias, there are two black widows, so maybe thats it, I dunno, I have never read the Ultimate X-men, maybe I should start.

#7 Posted by SoA (4592 posts) - - Show Bio

@Deadcool: it was actually good up until vol 18 or thereabouts . i could give you a little spoiler about what im talking about in a PM if you'd like

#8 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@SoA said:

and here i thought this thread was pointing out psylocke being in ultimate x-men as a new character when she was already established as a x-men and i think she was killed too.

I haven't gotten that far into Ultimate X-men yet. Only the first four story arcs, with nothing referencing Psylocke.

#9 Posted by danhimself (21904 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon said:

@SoA said:

and here i thought this thread was pointing out psylocke being in ultimate x-men as a new character when she was already established as a x-men and i think she was killed too.

I haven't gotten that far into Ultimate X-men yet. Only the first four story arcs, with nothing referencing Psylocke.

you'll get to her first appearance soon....it's during the World Tour arc...the other stuff he's talking about comes much much later...some of it after Ultimatum

#10 Posted by SoA (4592 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon: are you talking about kitty and jimmy or wolverine , cyclops, jean, and beat,etc

#11 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself said:

@TheCannon said:

@SoA said:

and here i thought this thread was pointing out psylocke being in ultimate x-men as a new character when she was already established as a x-men and i think she was killed too.

I haven't gotten that far into Ultimate X-men yet. Only the first four story arcs, with nothing referencing Psylocke.

you'll get to her first appearance soon....it's during the World Tour arc...the other stuff he's talking about comes much much later...some of it after Ultimatum

I read World Tour, though I was kind of busy that day and wasn't really paying attention, so I probably skipped right over her without realizing it. I'll have to read it again.

@SoA said:

@TheCannon: are you talking about kitty and jimmy or wolverine , cyclops, jean, and beat,etc

I don't quite get your question.

#12 Posted by SoA (4592 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon: sorry. i meant are you reading the recent stuff or from the beginning , since you mentioned world tour i can be safe to assume the latter.

#13 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@SoA said:

@TheCannon: sorry. i meant are you reading the recent stuff or from the beginning , since you mentioned world tour i can be safe to assume the latter.

Yes, I'm reading the stuff from the beginning. I read all the Ultimate Spider-Man stuff at my library and loved it, so I bought some of Ultimate X-men and Ultimates from the beginning. I won't read any of the newer stuff until I get that far in the timeline, and if I decide I want to continue after Ultimatum (I've heard terrible things)

#14 Posted by danhimself (21904 posts) - - Show Bio

@SoA: yeah I'd say that he isn't that far yet...by the sounds of it he's still in the first volume of Ultimate X-men

#15 Posted by SoA (4592 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon: ultimatum and some books leading into it was horrible . i read ultimate x-men(its what got me back into comics after a 10 year hiatus ) and from there went with ultimate spider-man, the ultimates , then fantastic four , the series' after ultimatum is kinda pick and choose. if you haven't read ultimate thor's mini you should look into it (but wait until after reading vol 2 of ultimates ) its nice to know some people actually like the ultimate universe

#16 Posted by SoA (4592 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself: i just hope i didn't spoil too much , i was under the impression that he has re-reading and saw something didn't make sense

#17 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@SoA said:

@TheCannon: ultimatum and some books leading into it was horrible . i read ultimate x-men(its what got me back into comics after a 10 year hiatus ) and from there went with ultimate spider-man, the ultimates , then fantastic four , the series' after ultimatum is kinda pick and choose. if you haven't read ultimate thor's mini you should look into it (but wait until after reading vol 2 of ultimates ) its nice to know some people actually like the ultimate universe

I've heard that those books were horrible, though I'm determined to read most of the Ultimate Universe, so I'm reading Ultimatum. I think books after Ultimatum I'll just get anything of major significance. And I have not read the Ultimate Thor mini, even though I really want to. I know it's a prequel to the Ultimates, but I still want to wait until after Ultimatum. And yes, I am a huge Ultimate fan. I used to bad-mouth it all I could, but I was young and stupid.

#18 Posted by danhimself (21904 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon said:

@SoA said:

@TheCannon: ultimatum and some books leading into it was horrible . i read ultimate x-men(its what got me back into comics after a 10 year hiatus ) and from there went with ultimate spider-man, the ultimates , then fantastic four , the series' after ultimatum is kinda pick and choose. if you haven't read ultimate thor's mini you should look into it (but wait until after reading vol 2 of ultimates ) its nice to know some people actually like the ultimate universe

I've heard that those books were horrible, though I'm determined to read most of the Ultimate Universe, so I'm reading Ultimatum. I think books after Ultimatum I'll just get anything of major significance. And I have not read the Ultimate Thor mini, even though I really want to. I know it's a prequel to the Ultimates, but I still want to wait until after Ultimatum. And yes, I am a huge Ultimate fan. I used to bad-mouth it all I could, but I was young and stupid.

just be thankful that you're reading Ultimatum after it's been released so you can just breeze right through it and then forget it as soon as possible....it was bad though it did have some cool lasting effects on Ultimate Spider-man

#19 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself said:

@TheCannon said:

@SoA said:

@TheCannon: ultimatum and some books leading into it was horrible . i read ultimate x-men(its what got me back into comics after a 10 year hiatus ) and from there went with ultimate spider-man, the ultimates , then fantastic four , the series' after ultimatum is kinda pick and choose. if you haven't read ultimate thor's mini you should look into it (but wait until after reading vol 2 of ultimates ) its nice to know some people actually like the ultimate universe

I've heard that those books were horrible, though I'm determined to read most of the Ultimate Universe, so I'm reading Ultimatum. I think books after Ultimatum I'll just get anything of major significance. And I have not read the Ultimate Thor mini, even though I really want to. I know it's a prequel to the Ultimates, but I still want to wait until after Ultimatum. And yes, I am a huge Ultimate fan. I used to bad-mouth it all I could, but I was young and stupid.

just be thankful that you're reading Ultimatum after it's been released so you can just breeze right through it and then forget it as soon as possible....it was bad though it did have some cool lasting effects on Ultimate Spider-man

If it's as bad as people say it is, I will be thankful.

#20 Posted by danhimself (21904 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon said:

@danhimself said:

@TheCannon said:

@SoA said:

@TheCannon: ultimatum and some books leading into it was horrible . i read ultimate x-men(its what got me back into comics after a 10 year hiatus ) and from there went with ultimate spider-man, the ultimates , then fantastic four , the series' after ultimatum is kinda pick and choose. if you haven't read ultimate thor's mini you should look into it (but wait until after reading vol 2 of ultimates ) its nice to know some people actually like the ultimate universe

I've heard that those books were horrible, though I'm determined to read most of the Ultimate Universe, so I'm reading Ultimatum. I think books after Ultimatum I'll just get anything of major significance. And I have not read the Ultimate Thor mini, even though I really want to. I know it's a prequel to the Ultimates, but I still want to wait until after Ultimatum. And yes, I am a huge Ultimate fan. I used to bad-mouth it all I could, but I was young and stupid.

just be thankful that you're reading Ultimatum after it's been released so you can just breeze right through it and then forget it as soon as possible....it was bad though it did have some cool lasting effects on Ultimate Spider-man

If it's as bad as people say it is, I will be thankful.

It was written with no regards to continuity at all

the best book by far is Ultimate Spider-man...I really hope that you're catching just how dark and twisted that book is when you know that Peter is going to die

#21 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@danhimself said:

@TheCannon said:

@danhimself said:

@TheCannon said:

@SoA said:

@TheCannon: ultimatum and some books leading into it was horrible . i read ultimate x-men(its what got me back into comics after a 10 year hiatus ) and from there went with ultimate spider-man, the ultimates , then fantastic four , the series' after ultimatum is kinda pick and choose. if you haven't read ultimate thor's mini you should look into it (but wait until after reading vol 2 of ultimates ) its nice to know some people actually like the ultimate universe

I've heard that those books were horrible, though I'm determined to read most of the Ultimate Universe, so I'm reading Ultimatum. I think books after Ultimatum I'll just get anything of major significance. And I have not read the Ultimate Thor mini, even though I really want to. I know it's a prequel to the Ultimates, but I still want to wait until after Ultimatum. And yes, I am a huge Ultimate fan. I used to bad-mouth it all I could, but I was young and stupid.

just be thankful that you're reading Ultimatum after it's been released so you can just breeze right through it and then forget it as soon as possible....it was bad though it did have some cool lasting effects on Ultimate Spider-man

If it's as bad as people say it is, I will be thankful.

It was written with no regards to continuity at all

the best book by far is Ultimate Spider-man...I really hope that you're catching just how dark and twisted that book is when you know that Peter is going to die

That sucks. I can't stand continuity errors (as you can probably tell by this thread).

I know Spidey is the best book. That's what got me into the Ultimate Universe. It's so awesome.

#22 Posted by Timandm (3374 posts) - - Show Bio

With all the time loops, resurrections, reboots, and what not, it seems continuity is a thing of the past in any Marvel universe.

#23 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@Timandm said:

With all the time loops, resurrections, reboots, and what not, it seems continuity is a thing of the past in any Marvel universe.

Nothing was rebooted in Ultimate Marvel. Something may of recently happened, though not during the time period this continuity error happened.

#24 Posted by Timandm (3374 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon said:

@Timandm said:

With all the time loops, resurrections, reboots, and what not, it seems continuity is a thing of the past in any Marvel universe.

Nothing was rebooted in Ultimate Marvel. Something may of recently happened, though not during the time period this continuity error happened.

It's true that the Ultimate Marvel Universe has not been rebooted yet. It's only ten years old in real time, which makes it about two years old in comic book time. Although, that is rather odd since Peter Parker (in the Ultimate Universe) became Spider-Man at the age of 15 and ten years later he died...at the age of 15....

But they have already had time loop type of things. Consider the recent Reed Richards thing... How long had he been alive in that other dimension? Long enough for his brain to grow into the shape of a huge banana...he builds a city complete with super beings and then jumps back to the past...

And then there's the confusion in the Ultimate Universe about whether The Avengers existed BEFORE the fantastic four. There are different storylines that conflict. If you go check this for yourself, you'll see what I'm talking about... So there's already continuity confusion built into a universe that is only ten years old...

#25 Posted by blur1528 (1055 posts) - - Show Bio

Pete had a birthday. And I see comic years as reverse dog years. For every seven of our years, it is one year for them.

#26 Posted by TheCannon (16073 posts) - - Show Bio

@blur1528: Flagged for spam/trolling. That has nothing to do with this thread.

#27 Posted by blur1528 (1055 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCannon: What? My comment? It was in direct response to the guy above me. He said Peter was 15 when he became Spider-Man and 15 when he died, but Peter had a birthday. He turned 16.

He also brought up points about the universe being ten years old. I gave my opinion on that- how for every seven years in real time, one year passes in the comic.

#28 Posted by blur1528 (1055 posts) - - Show Bio

@SoA:

Yeah... Brian Wood hasn't read any of the Ultimate X-Men stuff. He said he's just trying to tell a good story. We won't get any connection/throwback/continuation to previous stuff with him. Psylocke is the one character I won't call BS on coming back from the dead. She's done it before.