Posted by k4tzm4n (51017 posts) - - Show Bio

"Hold on... did that really just happen?"

This is a statement I mutter to myself all too often while reading comics (I'm a broken record like that). This phrase can be used if I really loved something... or if I really loathed something. Every week I make my checking account cry as I spend an unhealthy amount of money on new comics. I'm investing so much of my money into this medium because, just like you, I love the fictional worlds and characters these publishers continue to develop every Wednesday. While a lot of the titles skate by on a mediocre level, every now and then titles have moments that make them rise to greatness or plummet to new lows.

Every week I'll pick two moments that made me cheer (raves) and two that made me sad on the inside (rants). If the week is extra special, I'll have a bonus rant or rave. Keep in mind, a title having a rant doesn't necessarily mean the entire issue is garbage. After all, UNCANNY X-FORCE #34 has a rant this week and I thought the issue was phenomenal.

I don't have the money or the attention span to read every new comic, so please feel free to speak up if you feel there was a rant or rave worthy moment not included!

Warning! Thar be spoilers here!

Rant: Red Hood, Starfire and Arsenal shoot first... at Superman

My thoughts exactly, Supes.

Jason Todd has some major issues, but one thing's for sure, he's not an idiot. He's proven time and time again to have a sound tactical mind (see 'Under the Red Hood' for numerous examples), so I was shocked to see him attack Superman. After all, Todd spends the first few pages of this issue saying how much Superman frightens him. He knows there's nothing he could do to best the Man of Steel. Meanwhile, all it takes from Kal-El is an evil stare to turn him into a pile of ash. I get how he and his allies think they're in trouble and the powerhouse hero is looking to take them down, but Superman, a man not exactly known for blatantly lying, flat-out says he wants to say his piece before leaving. Todd, you heard that, right? He wants to say something then leave. My boy Todd knows he has about a 0.00005% chance of beating the Justice League member, but despite this, he and the Outlaws think the best way to respond is by attacking first. Why? I have no idea. I get they're aggressive, but they're not stupid.

Sure, Todd says they have a chance if they piss him off and find an opening, but what opening? Is kryptonite going to fall out of the sky? There's literally nothing at their disposal that could make them even harm Kal-El, and that's definitely showcased in this fight. Annoying him isn't going to make a means for victory suddenly appear, if anything, it's going to make your defeat swifter and far more painful. It's clear the team stood no chance and thankfully someone with some damn common sense (Isabel) stops the fight before Superman had the chance to. At the end of the day, this is simply a fight that happened because -- despite the bad reasoning -- it was a lot of fun to observe. I enjoyed it a good deal, but was it really that hard for the Outlaws to let Superman explain himself before going on a futile offensive?

Rave: AMAZING SPIDER-MAN'S Freaky Friday

The Amazing Doctor Octopus!

Love or hate this twist, there's no denying it has a solid grip on your attention and you're absolutely going to read #699 and #700 to see how it all plays out. While it certainly isn't the most original twist around, I commend writer Dan Slott for the move. Seeing a huge change (one that isn't ruined by previews and solicitations months in advance) feels incredibly rare in the big two and it goes without saying that this change is massive.

Will Doctor Octopus remain in Pete's body and that's why he's darker in SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN? If so, what will Otto do with this brand new life at his disposal? Will he still be a bitter old man lashing out at the world... or will it inspire him? After reading #698, there's an overwhelming sense of certainty that it'll be Oc in Pete's body for the long haul (that makes "Pete" kissing MJ reaaaaaally awkward), but a preview for #700 has been released and it has delivered a powerful punch to my brain. Pete's... coming back? But how? Will he still be in Ock's decaying body? Will Peter find a way to return to his body and if so, what makes him darker and need modifications to his costume? Will he go into a new body... and if so, whose? Or what if he manages to kick Ock's soul out of his body and throw another one in there... if so, who'd take the spot? And what about that alleged leak on Twitter about a certain alternate universe Spider-Man? Was that just a ruse? Argh! Curse you, Slott, the suspense is killing me!

No matter what happens, there's no reason to believe this move is "destroying" Spider-Man or your childhood. At NYCC, Slott even confirmed that, while this will be the status quo for awhile, seeing Parker's eventual return is probable. Maybe it'll conveniently happen around the same time as The Amazing Spider-Man 2.

Rant: The puddle of DOOM!

Not exactly the most flattering demise.

Writer Rick Remender deserves tons of praise for Daken's death. The scene was shockingly emotional and gave me the chills. It really was tough to read and overwhelmingly powerful. That said, a puddle? I get he can logically drown in it, but the character that has gone toe-to-toe with Skaar, Thing and Cyber. To meet his end face down in a tiny puddle is... well, embarrassing and humiliating, especially at the hands of his own father. Even after killing Omega Red, Logan felt the diabolical villain deserved a better end. I can only imagine how he'd feel about this one, forcing his son to choke on water and dirt. Yes, it was from a broken fire hydrant, but it still feels really lackluster and, for a lack of better words, tough to swallow, especially after Wolverine was trapped in a tank for what seemed to be a much longer period of time.

I get that Remender is implying that suffocation -- be it an ocean or a mere puddle -- is enough to take down someone with a healing factor, but I'm finding it very hard to believe this will really be the last we see of Daken. Remender's other deaths have been far more definitive. Blob: eaten from the inside. Fantomex: heart cut out. Daken: face down in a puddle, fool! If a writer really wants to do something with a character I'm very confident they'll be able to bring him back from this. Again, amazingly powerful scene, but a rather lame means of death compared to the rest and given the character's history.

Rave: Best team-up EVER

Prepare for awesomeness.

Have I told you how fantastic X-O MANOWAR is? Because it really is. As Mat stated in his latest review, you need to drop something from your pull list to make room for this one. Simply put: X-O is the ultimate science fiction adventure book. Conflict with interesting aliens: check. Super cool futuristic technology: check. As if that wasn't stellar enough, Valiant's title has now thrown in the most badass ninja ever, Ninjak.

Seeing the two duke it out is fun and all, but you know what's even more fun? Seeing them tear it up side by side! The insanely anticipated 'Planet Death' is quickly approaching and pretty soon we're going to see this duo devastate the Vine in drastically different methods. Witnessing the two put aside their differences and join forces only adds to the excitement over what's to come. Let's just pray writer Duane Swierczynski doesn't kill off Ninjak. If anyone deserves their own series, it's that dude.

Usually I include a bonus rant or rave, but this was such a good week that I'm going to have a bonus for both!

Bonus Rave: Creed finally shows an ounce of intellect

One of the rare times Creed isn't drooling or going "RAWWWR!"

Hold the phone... Victor Creed did something that requires intelligence? If someone told me Sabretooth was able to manipulate both Daken and Wolverine, I'd say nonsense and need to read it for myself to believe it. In my opinion, this is long overdue for the villain. Creed had tons of training over the course of his life and has quite a disturbing mind, yet 90% of the time he's written as a rabid and mindless fool. It's nice to see the character given more respect even though I'm fairly certain this won't change much for him in the long run.

Jeph Loeb's run claims Creed recently spent a good deal of time trying to improve his tactics and talents, but in the end, his brilliant plan over in that book was "use a bomb if all else fails!" So, this was a very pleasant change of pace for the character. Creed, I'm sure the time we meet you'll be drooling and slashing like a moron. Oh well.

Bonus Rant: David Aja rotating on HAWKEYE

Indeed it is, Mr. Fisk.

Artist David Aja's work definitely isn't for everyone, but it grew on me and his absence from the latest issue of HAWKEYE was absolutely noticed by me. Immediately concerned by this, I checked out solicitations and realized he's still going to work on the title, but it's unclear how frequently. I see he's on another issue, but then it hops back to Javier Pulido, the man currently illustrating the book.

Javier's work does have a lot of similarities to Aja's and keeping Matt Hollingsworth as the colorist does give the book a fairly smooth switch, yet the change is still easy to spot. Javier's work certainly isn't bad, but his faces can be incredibly jarring at times (see the homepage picture of a constipated Kingpin for an example). Hopefully the two will rotate because it would be sad to see Aja go.

Gregg Katzman is a freelance writer for Comic Vine & IGN Entertainment. If he could add another bonus rave, it would be Remender's fourth wall joke.

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#1 Posted by Superguy0009e (2265 posts) - - Show Bio

Seeing the Amazing Spider-Man made me nearly piss myself.

#2 Posted by BatWatch (2881 posts) - - Show Bio

I think the fight between the Outlaws and Superman would have been great...if only Superman had not made it clear that he was there for peaceful reasons. If he was there to take them in, why not give it a go and try to get an opening? You never know. Crazier things have happened, but it was pretty stupid since Kal-El plainly said he wanted to talk. Nonetheless, I enjoyed the battle and the issue. BatWatch's review of Red Hood and the Outlaws #14.

The Spider-Man twist seems interesting. What would Doc Ock do if this does turn into a longer situation. It would be interesting if they did some Dollhouse type developments where the fundamental nature of Peter's body took some control, and Doc Ock found himself compelled, slowly, to be more heroic. I don't know. Interesting though.

I think the puddle is quite poetic. A nearly invincible character brought down by the lowliest means? Yeah, I buy it.

The only experience I've ever had with Man-O-War was a video game where he teamed up with Iron Man. I quite enjoyed it, but I was young at the time, and I have since heard it called one of the worst games of all time.

No strong feelings on Creed, but that Hawkeye artwork looks rough.

For more news, reviews, and commentary for the entire Bat Family, check out BatWatch.net.

#3 Posted by Outside_85 (9927 posts) - - Show Bio

I think it has to be taken into consideration that the manner of Dakens death is one of the few ways Logan could kill him with his bare hands (which is important since Logan physically has to hold him down) and have those images flash through his head. The other option is the two going at it until one runs out of blood or Daken's head is chopped off, which is not quite the same as what Logan did here. Or alternatively Logan manages to get him into a chokehold and just holds on.

#4 Posted by JamDamage (1118 posts) - - Show Bio

I actually liked that Wolverine killed Daken the way he did. He did it with his own hands and not his claws. The fight was good. The best part was Wolverine noticing that Daken was afraid.

#5 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (34318 posts) - - Show Bio

I detest that Remender killed Daken, I mean he literally JUST came back from the dead and now I cant read about him any more. What a waste.

#6 Posted by lykopis (10746 posts) - - Show Bio

1) I don't like what's happening in Spider-Man. At all. Yes, its crazy but no, its not crazy enough to work. Its...well, its lame. Just the comment from Ock stating he is like a good magician and won't reveal how he did it -- convenient much?

I would say more but Mr. Slott recently made a friend of mine laugh and enjoy herself, so --- I'll be good. Well, goodish. Marvel has become obsessed with brains/minds lately, whether its sawing off the top of a corpse's skull to scoop one out, or switching consciousnesses, its like a cheesy, 1980's level soap opera. I'm waiting for evil twins to appear....oh wait....

2) Daken's death. No. Just no. I will refrain from adding more to my no. Because its fitting. No.

3) I don't mind Sabretooth being clever enough to set up situations which took cunning. Problem is, he isn't. Give me some build up to make me believe he can be (not scans from much older comics showing he is). Consistent, linear story lines which have carried for at least a year and then I would cheer for him because I do agree, its annoyed me how the character has been portrayed as a mindless animal and then reflective etc. But I know this is subjective so there is that.

Interesting presentation of your rants and raves -- enjoyable read for sure.

#7 Posted by Miss_Garrick (1757 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Daken's death by drowning in a puddle is appropriate. He started out by Marvel making a big fuss about him and how dangerous he is. But to me, as time went by, he was getting more and more petty. He was, in the end, a small pathetic man who doesn't even warrant a "cool" villain death.

#8 Posted by Cavemold (1684 posts) - - Show Bio

really lame "death for daken" . seriously would of expected more for his death. xo -manowar has been amazing

#9 Posted by The_Peter_Cosmic (401 posts) - - Show Bio

IIRC Daken wasn't even left face down in the puddle so bringing him back wouldn't even take two panels.

#10 Edited by thegentlemanrogue (722 posts) - - Show Bio

I thought Daken's death was very apropos. This larger than life character with Machiavellian aspirations of power, held down and snuffed out in a inch deep puddle of dirty water like he was nothing. As great as he thought himself to be, he was taken out like a piece of gutter trash, and to add insult to injury we find out that for all his cunning and manipulation, he was nothing but a pawn being adeptly maneuvered behind the scene into this very outcome. It's mundane, but that's what makes it poetic.

Brilliant issue.

Also on the issue of Sabretooth, if you remember back to the time of Identity Disc, Fury fully believed that Creed was the one pulling everyone's strings and manipulating the outcome. We of course know that isn't true, but Fury and Shield believed it, and it wasn't a hard sell. Wolverine has said in the past that Sabretooth plays the fool because it suits his needs and allows him to fly under the radar, in fact it's arguably that very character trait that allowed him to go over Daken like this in the first place, because very few people know Creed is capable of pulling it off. That's one of the things that makes him dangerous.

#11 Posted by pspin (894 posts) - - Show Bio

I liked Daken's death and considering that he also most likely had a sucking lung wound and multiple concussions and broken bones, drowning in a puddle is very reasonable. Plus it was poetic and emotional.

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#12 Posted by Target_X (379 posts) - - Show Bio

I feel that Daken's death in the puddle added gravity to the seen. It was poignant, it was symbolic. It wasn't a glorious death, and it wasn't meant to be, but it was certainly fitting.

#13 Posted by VeganDiet (1090 posts) - - Show Bio

@thegentlemanrogue said:

I thought Daken's death was very apropos. This larger than life character with Machiavellian aspirations of power, held down and snuffed out in a inch deep puddle of dirty water like he was nothing. As great as he thought himself to be, he was taken out like a piece of gutter trash, and to add insult to injury we find out that for all his cunning and manipulation, he was nothing but a pawn being adeptly maneuvered behind the scene into this very outcome. It's mundane, but that's what makes it poetic.

Brilliant issue.

Absolutely 100% this.

#14 Posted by Master_Thief (774 posts) - - Show Bio

Here is what is going to happen with spiderman............. peter is able to reverse the affect with him and doc ock, which makes ock stop dieing anymore which will piss of peter which will make him do something really dark. 
 
 
Peter was also in the age of ultron preview sooooo...

#15 Posted by Cap10nate (2662 posts) - - Show Bio

I liked Daken's death. It was a very personal fight and holding someone's head down as they struggle for air is about as personal as you can get. You can feel the struggle as the life slowly leaves their body and you have the power to stop it just by letting up. He could have gone the easy way out and swiped his head off in one stroke. This was much more personal and traumatic.

#16 Edited by k4tzm4n (51017 posts) - - Show Bio

@The_Peter_Cosmic said:

IIRC Daken wasn't even left face down in the puddle so bringing him back wouldn't even take two panels.

That's correct. Wolverine rolls him over to hold him.

@pspin said:

I liked Daken's death and considering that he also most likely had a sucking lung wound and multiple concussions and broken bones, drowning in a puddle is very reasonable. Plus it was poetic and emotional.

Before having his face shoved in the water, Daken was only slashed once.

@BatWatch:

would have been great...if only Superman had not made it clear that he was there for peaceful reasons

Exactly! A fun fight that certainly looked great, but the logic behind how it began is pretty bad.

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#17 Posted by Cavemold (1684 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n said:

@The_Peter_Cosmic said:

IIRC Daken wasn't even left face down in the puddle so bringing him back wouldn't even take two panels.

That's correct. Wolverine rolls him over to hold him.

@pspin said:

I liked Daken's death and considering that he also most likely had a sucking lung wound and multiple concussions and broken bones, drowning in a puddle is very reasonable. Plus it was poetic and emotional.

Before having his face shoved in the water, Daken was only slashed once.

@BatWatch:

would have been great...if only Superman had not made it clear that he was there for peaceful reasons

Exactly! A fun fight that certainly looked great, but the logic behind how it began is pretty bad.

yea i think they had find way to kill em off quickly

#18 Edited by CircularLogic (282 posts) - - Show Bio

So many people don't realize all it takes is three inches of water to drown. Not saying it was the best, but work with what you have.

As for the rest, Spider-man was lame because Villains swapping bodies is sooooooo over done. Doctor Doom did it to Daredevil once, and actually SECRET INVASION was entirely based on the premise of villains taking over heroes lives. So Dan Slott really dropped the ball there, though the ASM 700 previews are pretty damn sentimental

And RHATO has not been known for it's intelligence. Hell, Scott Lobdell as a writer hasn't really made any smart characters during the entire new 52.

#19 Posted by SavageDragon (2252 posts) - - Show Bio

@thegentlemanrogue said:

I thought Daken's death was very apropos. This larger than life character with Machiavellian aspirations of power, held down and snuffed out in a inch deep puddle of dirty water like he was nothing. As great as he thought himself to be, he was taken out like a piece of gutter trash, and to add insult to injury we find out that for all his cunning and manipulation, he was nothing but a pawn being adeptly maneuvered behind the scene into this very outcome. It's mundane, but that's what makes it poetic.

Brilliant issue.

I totally agree. Its fitting, a dangerous psychopath ends up dying with dear and regret in his heart in a simple dirty way.

#20 Posted by tximinoman (262 posts) - - Show Bio

Aparently I'm one of the few that liked how Wolverine murdered his son. I find it much more personal, hardcore and cold than anything Logan could have done, I mean, he's over Daken CHOKING HIM, it's not an accident and it's not fast, but he doesn't hesitate, doesn't let him go... I don't know, I think it was much more personal than leaving him in a tank that Daken ripped of from Dr.Evil or some other megalomaniac villain.

It's like shooting someone or stabing him, a shot is fast, you just pull the trigger and he's dead, a stab on the other hand is personal, you have to be close to someone to stab him.

#21 Posted by kid Apollo (717 posts) - - Show Bio

FINALY A TOPIC I CAN GET BEHIND! !

its about time someone starts calling out comics for random stupidity!

#22 Posted by Mucklefluga (2609 posts) - - Show Bio

Pete will use his doc ok mind to control the octobots to make him escape. Aja and the other dude are rotating. And i think they are doing an arc each.

#23 Posted by Med (291 posts) - - Show Bio

i don't know why it had to be the puddle. couldn't Logan have pushed his face into the broken fire hydrant? it would have been shooting water like a geyser. a powerful jet of water > puddle.

#24 Posted by Queso6p4 (1459 posts) - - Show Bio

Good stuff, good stuff. I was also quite disappointed in Daken's death for the same reasons and was glad to see Sabretooth use his head for once. He's a favorite villain of mine, but, like you said, is typically written as a sputtering, mindless, killing/vengeful machine. Might have to pick up Red Hood and the Outlaws for that stupid yet fun fight. I initially decided against it but will have to take a second look at it.

#25 Posted by pspin (894 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n said:

@pspin said:

I liked Daken's death and considering that he also most likely had a sucking lung wound and multiple concussions and broken bones, drowning in a puddle is very reasonable. Plus it was poetic and emotional.

Before having his face shoved in the water, Daken was only slashed once.

Oh, well it was still in the chest so I stand by the sucking lung wound. Either way, I think he was going for the emotional value of the kill. I thought it was good.

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#26 Posted by k4tzm4n (51017 posts) - - Show Bio

@pspin said:

@k4tzm4n said:

@pspin said:

I liked Daken's death and considering that he also most likely had a sucking lung wound and multiple concussions and broken bones, drowning in a puddle is very reasonable. Plus it was poetic and emotional.

Before having his face shoved in the water, Daken was only slashed once.

Oh, well it was still in the chest so I stand by the sucking lung wound. Either way, I think he was going for the emotional value of the kill. I thought it was good.

Absolutely, and like I say in this feature (and over in best battles), he certainly accomplished a disturbingly powerful scene.

@Queso6p4: Thanks. Just a heads up, the fight is only 3 pages.

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#27 Posted by weenman1 (128 posts) - - Show Bio

I cannot believe I am saying this but Miguel O'Hara as the new Spider-Man would have been a better move.

#28 Posted by k4tzm4n (51017 posts) - - Show Bio

@weenman1 said:

I cannot believe I am saying this but Miguel O'Hara as the new Spider-Man would have been a better move.

We still have two issues until ASM concludes. This latest development doesn't guarantee Ock will be Superior Spider-Man, especially after seeing that preview for 700! I guess we'll have to wait and see what Slott has in store for us.

@tximinoman: No, you're definitely not one of the few. I loved the scene and thought it was chilling... I just don't think that's a very fitting way to "kill" Daken.

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#29 Posted by yowereggaesir (6 posts) - - Show Bio

I think it will be Doc Ock in Parker's body as the Superior Spider-Man, for a while at least.

But I could see it being that as he has Parker's memories the memory of Uncle Ben dying and that famous message he leaves Peter is so powerful it's able to convince even Octavius to want to be the man Parker became.

#30 Posted by MadeinBangladesh (7648 posts) - - Show Bio

How many Marvel Character's have Rick Remender killed while writing XFORCE?

#31 Posted by Grey56 (753 posts) - - Show Bio

@thegentlemanrogue said:

I thought Daken's death was very apropos. This larger than life character with Machiavellian aspirations of power, held down and snuffed out in a inch deep puddle of dirty water like he was nothing. As great as he thought himself to be, he was taken out like a piece of gutter trash, and to add insult to injury we find out that for all his cunning and manipulation, he was nothing but a pawn being adeptly maneuvered behind the scene into this very outcome. It's mundane, but that's what makes it poetic.

Brilliant issue.

Also on the issue of Sabretooth, if you remember back to the time of Identity Disc, Fury fully believed that Creed was the one pulling everyone's strings and manipulating the outcome. We of course know that isn't true, but Fury and Shield believed it, and it wasn't a hard sell. Wolverine has said in the past that Sabretooth plays the fool because it suits his needs and allows him to fly under the radar, in fact it's arguably that very character trait that allowed him to go over Daken like this in the first place, because very few people know Creed is capable of pulling it off. That's one of the things that makes him dangerous.

Enjoyed this explanation. Additionally, the notion that Outlaws would attempt a frontal attack on the most powerful being they know of ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWYm51Eh-D4

#32 Posted by hobanho (24 posts) - - Show Bio

That's how Sabretooth is supposed to be written! You only have to go back to Jason Aaron's last arc to see Sabretooth set a huge plan into motion. In the span of 5 issues, he became the head of the entire Asian criminal underworld, something Daken tried to do and never did. He did something similar in the Weapon X series, before Agent Zero showed up. Someone mentioned Identity Disc and how Fury knew what Victor Creed was capable of. Sabretooth is a master manipulator, if anyone knows how to use Wolverine's emotions against him, it's Sabretooth. Sabretooth's original mini-series written by Larry Hama showed the way Creed lived, in a huge mansion with every luxury imaginable. He's one of the most sought after assassins in the world and became wealthy doing it, that's why he always thought Wolverine was an idiot, for squandering his powers on trying to help other mutants. Remember they were on Team X together, and it wasn't Logan calling the shots. Even Xavier knew, that's why he asked Creed to join the X-men before Logan,

#33 Edited by k4tzm4n (51017 posts) - - Show Bio

Never said Creed isn't smart. I said a lot of writers don't treat him as such. Only saying this in case people thought I was implying such in the feature.

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#34 Posted by TheCerealKillz (10269 posts) - - Show Bio

I was happy to see that Creed being smart was in this. He's mostly a big idiot when he's written.

#35 Posted by Mega_spidey01 (3078 posts) - - Show Bio
@Cap10nate said:

I liked Daken's death. It was a very personal fight and holding someone's head down as they struggle for air is about as personal as you can get. You can feel the struggle as the life slowly leaves their body and you have the power to stop it just by letting up. He could have gone the easy way out and swiped his head off in one stroke. This was much more personal and traumatic.

#36 Posted by Queso6p4 (1459 posts) - - Show Bio

@k4tzm4n: Ok, thanks.

#37 Posted by SexualLobster (995 posts) - - Show Bio

@yowereggaesir said:

I think it will be Doc Ock in Parker's body as the Superior Spider-Man, for a while at least.

But I could see it being that as he has Parker's memories the memory of Uncle Ben dying and that famous message he leaves Peter is so powerful it's able to convince even Octavius to want to be the man Parker became.

That's what I was thinking, h has all his memories, so maybe he gains some of his humanity and principles from occupying the same mind with the same memories and experiences.

#38 Posted by Jake Fury (19160 posts) - - Show Bio

Raves for my week:

ASM #698, X-O Manowar & Justice League.

#39 Posted by RedheadedAtrocitus (6885 posts) - - Show Bio

Pretty laughable the Outlaws trying to take a shot at Superman. Other than that, the rave really for me is Wolvie having to kill Daken and finding out it was all part of Sabretooth's plan. That is solid gold coming from Remender I tell you. Chilling to the core.

#40 Posted by Cavemold (1684 posts) - - Show Bio

@Jake Fury said:

Raves for my week:

ASM #698, X-O Manowar & Justice League.i

x-o manowar was amazing

#41 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6562 posts) - - Show Bio

I read the Spoiler about Daken's death before having had the chance to actually read the book.

I read many a Viner rant and rave about it. Complaining about him being drowned in a mere 'puddle'. And reading this off the Vine, I was mortified and in complete agreement that it was just silly.

Reading it myself however, changed my mind entirely. It was a fantastic moment, very poignant, and the puddle was kind of poetic. Anyone can drown in a puddle if your face is held down - it's no more or less logical or rational than a pool or a lake.

But the fact it was as ignominious as a that ... poetic.

Don't worry though, no way does Daken remain "dead". The body was left behind. More than this, it was left intact. Wolverine too traumatized to remember that you actually have to separate the head from the body for an extended period of time should you want the 'death' to stick (like he did with the, sigh, 'clone' of Creed).

Heck, were I to rant about something, it would be the fact Logan was dumb enough to think Daken fully dead from that considering all the experience he himself has had with a healing factor all his life. Wolverine too has drowned, and it didn't keep him from bouncing back.

That's the bit I found a bit convenient and silly. The fact folks, us fans, and even the character 'Wolverine' can assume Daken dead for good from that.

I

#42 Posted by G_Money_Christmas (884 posts) - - Show Bio

I was very surprised when I saw the faces Pulido drew in Hawkeye... and it wasn't a good surprise, either. Aja should be the only artist on this book.

#43 Posted by Spideycap (212 posts) - - Show Bio

Lets think about it for a sec,

Ock is in Pete's body but he still obviously has his memories in addition to Pete's, therefore Pete in Ock's body most likely has Ock's memories as well as his own. If this is the case, then even if Pete gets his body back he could very well hold on to the memories of Ock which would definitely influence him to be a little "darker".
#44 Posted by Nicodemus (65 posts) - - Show Bio

I think I like Daken's death the most. That death has meaning. You see, this kid was raised on revenge and hatred. He spent his whole life manipulating people for his own personal game. He's a user, one of the lowest form of humanity. So yeah, dying facedown in a puddle of mud and water by his own father's hand is a fitting death for the lowlife. I also liked the fact that his father was the one who done it. In Logan's mind, he feels responsible for the actions of his son, it is after all, his blood. He's tried to help Daken, even love him as a son but the rabid dog needed to be put down. Daken would never stop being Daken. It had to happen eventually and Logan had to be the one who done it. But yeah, lying face first in a puddle is a fitting way for Daken to go. You reep what you sew.