AvX Vs #1 - I finally understand why people hate Marvel events.

I never understood why people didn't like Marvel events, the only ones I've read were Civil War and Schism, the latter of which is barely even an event and the first I read in trade so I suppose I've never really had that much experience. I only really starting getting into comics properly about a year and a half ago, and Fear Itself didn't seem that interesting to me. The more I read of AvX, the more I can understand this hatred by fans. Take AvX vs 1 for example

Inside the front cover of the book there are a bunch of questions and answers, which are there basically to help people understand whats going on in the book. Makes sense I think, then I read the second one,

Q:So this is part of a big event book that is the centrepiece of the Marvel Universe, with continuity connectivity to all corners of the super hero world?

A: NOPE! This book is about AWESOME BRAWLING! You want PLOT! LOOK ELSEWHERE, CHUM. You want a KNOCK-DOWN, DRAG-OUT WHUPPIN'? WE GOT YOU COVERED

So apparently this book isn't in continuity? WHAT!. I normally try to not be bothered by whats and whats out of continuity when I can, but something like this where you have Magneto vs Iron Man, thats a pretty big deal I think, and to have that outside of continuity is.. well.. a bit insulting to the readers. And they obviously are outside of continuity, there are some differences to what happened in AvX #2 (which I also had problems with but I was able to over look them because issues 0 and 1 were good) so this really does seem like its outside of continuity... which really grinds my gears.

Then there were the winners of the two fights, which grinds my gears even more..

Magneto Vs Iron Man.

Iron Man wins. Which I don't have that much of a problem with, I'd prefer if Magneto had won, but Tony Stark is a genius. Fair enough. The problem for me was how it all happened. The fight didn't seem to make that much sense. Iron Man pulled out all this big guns, and Magneto was still standing. Naturally Magneto was wearing a suit of metal himself to protect him even further he was also drawing on the magnetic fields of other planets to increase his power, or something and then the phoenix destroyed one, and Magneto was like Oh No its coming, we need to get Wanda and Iron Man punches him in the face and it's over. So this book, outside of continuity, which states at the beginning has no plot in it? Kinda seems important to me plot wise for Magneto's character that he's now going to going to be against Cyclops it would seem.

Namor vs The Thing

The Thing wins. This fight was completely idiotic. Read it if you want, I'm not going to go into too much detail, but it made no sense, Namor beat the freakin hulk before, and the Thing beats him by pinning him down with some giant fish teeth. Ya... I know... idiotic

All in all, I wanna love AvX, I really really do. I loved issue 1, like I got up super early and went to the comic book store to get it, but then Marvel pulls this kinda crap and I'm like whats the point in reading this if its just going to be pulp. I'll keep reading the main series, it's kinda hard to avoid with all the tie in's, as for this series. I'm hoping I won't get it again, but when the next issue rolls around my heart, and longing for this event to be high quality may just over rule my mind telling me how bad it is. :(

I try to stay away from hate and from negativity... but I admit that I feel similar frustrations... particularly with Marvel, and more specifically with events. In addition, as spoiled by another site, in order to get the "full picture" you apparently have to read Uncanny X-Men #10. I was already pushing it by signing up for the main event... I'm not going to bend in order to make it work... not to mention that Avengers and New Avengers are apparently the exact opposite, the "tie-in page" types, which drive me slightly crazy. Sorry, a bit of a rant, I normally avoid this but it has just frustrated me so much. Anyways, if it weren't for the internet providing "essential information" in the form of spoilers, I'd be out entirely. I'm trying really hard to stick with Marvel through this event... but they're making it really hard, and we're only 2 issues in.

So I feel ya.

@TheOptimist said:

I try to stay away from hate and from negativity... but I admit that I feel similar frustrations... particularly with Marvel, and more specifically with events. In addition, as spoiled by another site, in order to get the "full picture" you apparently have to read Uncanny X-Men #10. I was already pushing it by signing up for the main event... I'm not going to bend in order to make it work... not to mention that Avengers and New Avengers are apparently the exact opposite, the "tie-in page" types, which drive me slightly crazy. Sorry, a bit of a rant, I normally avoid this but it has just frustrated me so much. Anyways, if it weren't for the internet providing "essential information" in the form of spoilers, I'd be out entirely. I'm trying really hard to stick with Marvel through this event... but they're making it really hard, and we're only 2 issues in.

So I feel ya.

It's good to know someone gets it. I just read Uncanny X-men 10, that was okay thankfully although I didn't think it tied into AvX vs at all. I literally didn't want to read any other comics today after AvX vs. However the only fight in the book once again resulted in an X-man getting his ass kicked. But I did like the ending of the book, though Greg Lands interpretation of Hope can be little jarring compared to how everyone else draw's her.

And I also try to stay from negativity where possible :/

Wait...has someone actually stated that this is not in continuity or is that just your opinion. I have heard nothing mentioning that this title will not be considered art of marvel continuity...no matter ho much the fights frustrate us. So far the avengers are annihilating

@Kallarkz said:

Wait...has someone actually stated that this is not in continuity or is that just your opinion. I have heard nothing mentioning that this title will not be considered art of marvel continuity...no matter ho much the fights frustrate us. So far the avengers are annihilating

Q:So this is part of a big event book that is the centrepiece of the Marvel Universe, with continuity connectivity to all corners of the super hero world?

A: NOPE! This book is about AWESOME BRAWLING! You want PLOT! LOOK ELSEWHERE, CHUM. You want a KNOCK-DOWN, DRAG-OUT WHUPPIN'? WE GOT YOU COVERED

Word for word that's inside the front cover of the book. It makes me think that it's outside of continuity plus the fights here we also saw in AvX 2 and they are quite different.

And ya, it kinda makes the X-men look like a bunch of bumbling idiots and the Avengers all powerful.

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

...LOL.

@ReVamp said:

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

...LOL.

Rulk's going to fight Iceman soon as well. I can't wait to see how badly they're going to have Bobby get thrashed.

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

@CitizenBane said:

@ReVamp said:

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

...LOL.

Rulk's going to fight Iceman soon as well. I can't wait to see how badly they're going to have Bobby get thrashed.

This is reaching an unprecedented level of stupidity for Marvel. I mean, I know that Marvel aren't known exactly for their smarts, but this is taking it to a whole new world.

The reality is, this is a tie-in event comic about superheroes fighting each other. The plot was going to be so thin you could see your hand underneath it, and you know? I knew that going in, so it didn't bother me at all. We got to see two industry giants writer for two industry giants to illustrate and it was illustrated well, and it was FUN. This is the important element.

Yeah, okay, your favourite hero might not have won, but...screw it. It's contrived. The whole event is contrived. Obviously, the Thing is going to be Namor, Obviously, Iron Man is going to 'beat' Magneto. I have no doubts that in issue 2, the X-characters will beat the Avengers characters, but please, be under no illusions. This is contrived. The winners will be chosen to further or mirror the plot in further issues and the losers won't be KO'd because they're needed as well. It's just a fun messing around comic.

WTF Thing beat Namor underwater?! How?!

Please do not read this comic if you still somehow like Marvel

@Chaos Burn said:

WTF Thing beat Namor underwater?! How?!

Please do not read this comic if you still somehow like Marvel

I love Marvel for doing that.

@CitizenBane said:

@Chaos Burn said:

WTF Thing beat Namor underwater?! How?!

Please do not read this comic if you still somehow like Marvel

I love Marvel for doing that.

it....it... it just doesn't make sense!

@ReVamp said:

@CitizenBane said:

@ReVamp said:

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

...LOL.

Rulk's going to fight Iceman soon as well. I can't wait to see how badly they're going to have Bobby get thrashed.

This is reaching an unprecedented level of stupidity for Marvel. I mean, I know that Marvel aren't known exactly for their smarts, but this is taking it to a whole new world.

Colossus was dominating, then realized that during the fight they had damaged the support beam keeping Utopia afloat, made perfect sense.

@HotSauceCommittee said:

@ReVamp said:

@CitizenBane said:

@ReVamp said:

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

...LOL.

Rulk's going to fight Iceman soon as well. I can't wait to see how badly they're going to have Bobby get thrashed.

This is reaching an unprecedented level of stupidity for Marvel. I mean, I know that Marvel aren't known exactly for their smarts, but this is taking it to a whole new world.

Colossus was dominating, then realized that during the fight they had damaged the support beam keeping Utopia afloat, made perfect sense.

Rulk won through plot. It's kinda his forte. Made perfect sense.

Why is anyone remotely surprised that this sucks? 

@BKole said:

The reality is, this is a tie-in event comic about superheroes fighting each other. The plot was going to be so thin you could see your hand underneath it, and you know? I knew that going in, so it didn't bother me at all. We got to see two industry giants writer for two industry giants to illustrate and it was illustrated well, and it was FUN. This is the important element.

Yeah, okay, your favourite hero might not have won, but...screw it. It's contrived. The whole event is contrived. Obviously, the Thing is going to be Namor, Obviously, Iron Man is going to 'beat' Magneto. I have no doubts that in issue 2, the X-characters will beat the Avengers characters, but please, be under no illusions. This is contrived. The winners will be chosen to further or mirror the plot in further issues and the losers won't be KO'd because they're needed as well. It's just a fun messing around comic.

This is very true, Fun was the most important element here. But this still is a marvel 616 book, and this still is a marvel 616 book which is the most important tie in to the main event, in fact at the end of the day AvX VS is what the whole AvX event is all about, this is why the majority of people are reading the event. They want to know who would win out of their favourite heroes, and here they tried to make it fun which is great... but that doesn't mean that needs to be bad. A book can fun, but still make perfect sense within continuity and be high quality, there shouldn't have be a trade off.

As for issue 2. You have Spider-Man up against Colossus, come on... it's Spider-Man, he's going to win. And Cap vs Gambit... again.. duder, the X-men don't stand a chance in the next book, which is why I was hoping they'd get a win here. I was worried that this event was just going to be "Hey look how awesome the avengers are! You should totally check out the movie!!" or "Hey love the Avengers movie? Check them out here kicking the X-mens collective asses" And right now, that's kinda what it's looking like.

The whole event is like they are charging up super much the Avengers and want the X-Men to lose badly.And all the fights are just pretty bad.

@Illuminatus said:

Why is anyone remotely surprised that this sucks?

Nobody is surprised.Everybody that this event would suck even before it was announced.

@TDK_1997 said:

@Illuminatus said:

Why is anyone remotely surprised that this sucks?

Nobody is surprised.Everybody that this event would suck even before it was announced.

I'm surprised :/ The first issue was good... but like I said.. this is really my first experience of a marvel event so...

Avengers got a movie coming out, not good pr to have them lose :P

OK Iron Man beating Magneto I can accept but THING BEATING NAMOR UNDERWATER? Seriously Marvel you're going to have a guy who can go toe to toe with the heavyweights of the Marvel universe being beaten by someone who's never fared well against heavyweights like that before? Good grief this is ridiculous even when compared to Siege. And that's saying something.

@feargalr: Their recent events are not that good. It's because they're pulling one out each year for sales. Civil War, House of M, Avengers Disassembled those are good big Marvel events. And Marvel are doing good small scale events such as the Circle of Four, Ends of the Earth, Hickman's Fantastic Four run among others. But in terms of the big events, Marvel have really lost the plot.

I hated Circle of Four.

@Lvenger said:

OK Iron Man beating Magneto I can accept but THING BEATING NAMOR UNDERWATER? Seriously Marvel you're going to have a guy who can go toe to toe with the heavyweights of the Marvel universe being beaten by someone who's never fared well against heavyweights like that before? Good grief this is ridiculous even when compared to Siege. And that's saying something.

@feargalr: Their recent events are not that good. It's because they're pulling one out each year for sales. Civil War, House of M, Avengers Disassembled those are good big Marvel events. And Marvel are doing good small scale events such as the Circle of Four, Ends of the Earth, Hickman's Fantastic Four run among others. But in terms of the big events, Marvel have really lost the plot.

I read circle of 4 actually too, that was great, and usually I'm not that into magic related stuff in comic books. But it was really good.

@feargalr: You are surprised because you are new and this doesn't look that much bad like Fear Itself and Siege did.

@feargalr: Small scale stuff with writers like Remander, Slott, Brubaker and Hickman is where it's at in terms of Marvel. However, writers like Fraction and Bendis not only ruin individual series such as Iron Man, Thor and the Avengers but have been involved with recent Marvel events in the past. Why Marvel let them do that I have no idea

@CitizenBane: What didn't you like about Circle of Four if I may ask?

@Lvenger: I've never liked Marvel's magic stuff. And I felt like it put a blemish on an otherwise spotless (up until that point) series, because I'd enjoyed every issue of Venom up till that point.

@CitizenBane: Fair enough. I'm not that up to date on Marvel's magic stuff but I did enjoy JMS' Thor series, that's what got me into the character. I wish I'd read Gilleon's run though instead of dropping it when JMS left the title. It proved to be better than I thought it would. Fraction's run has been appalling and whilst I know Journey into Mystery is good, I want a good book where Thor is the protagonist. Sorry, Thor is more fantasy than magic now I've realised. Sorry for going off track a bit in my rambling.

And i'm a big fan of this event so far.

@feargalr: It was a fun book, in my opinion. The problem is people, not saying you are by the way, are treating this like a personal attack upon themselves. I can't say I'd view this as THE most important tie-in to AVX any more than say, New Avengers, Uncanny X-Men, or indeed, Secret Avengers. They all add or subtract from the plot in their own ways, New Avengers especially. The did try to make it fun, and the thing is here, is that in the 90's people had the EXACT SAME reaction to Marvel Vs DC. WHAT? SUPERMAN WOULD NEVER BEAT HULK! Or say, about 6-7 Years ago, WHAT?! CAPTAIN AMERICA CAN'T BEAT BATMAN! It's a rolling cycle, and you'll never please everyone. They pleased me, because I thought the fight between Namor and Thing was fun. It was what....10 pages, maybe? Not a lot you can do with that, but they did what they did, and we both know that the winner was only the winner in the last panel. Nobody got punked.

I'd like to say that perhaps Spider-Man will 'lose' and the same with Cap, because again, in this issue...nobody actually won properly. Nobody got KO'd, nobody got beaten into a bloody pulp, and nobody died. The fights just ended and declared a winner because if they didn't people would scream about the point of it if there was no winner. I don't think you can base the entire event on...what one tie in comic that's about fights? It's always going to be about cool points. But, seriously, this isn't bigging up the Avengers? Magneto and Iron Man, I can see that but...Thing vs Namor? Could you honestly see a non-comic person pick this up and go 'Whoa! Thing vs Namor? That's wicked! Now we can see whats what.' No, it'll be someone going ' Why is an orange wall punching a giant, male tinkerbell?'

I see your point, I really do, but I think it's too early to judge this event based on a setup issue, and this tie-in which is about smacked each other in the mouth hole. Sorry we've got such differing opinions here but...you know.

@BKole: Admittedly it is fun but in the same way that Justice League's first arc was fun. There's plenty of action, fighting and conflict but no plot. All A vs X is is a match up of fights that can't be finished in Avengers vs X-Men and a way to get more money. A lot of what you're saying is true which is why I'm not arguing with it but the Thing vs Namor fight is ridiculous. Namor has been shown to be in the league of Hulk, Hercules, Thor and other Marvel heavyweights, especially underwater. The Thing is nowhere near that strength level yet is capable of beating Namor in an environment where Namor is strongest? That's pure PIS and utterly unacceptable.

The whole event is like they are charging up super much the Avengers and want the X-Men to lose badly.And all the fights are just pretty bad.

@BKole: I completely get what your saying in terms of pleasing fans, that's never going to happen, theres always going to be people disagreeing. I went into this expecting comic book fun, pow kablamo etc, I wasn't expecting the next Saga or Y. But I didn't think this book was that fun, it seems to me like they just ignored all continuity, and really I think thats incredible important to a book like this, because everyone is going to say "Well Namor beat the Hulk that time in water" or "Magneto took on all of the avengers and won before" type stuff, so really continuity is incredible important here, especially since this book,to me anyway, just seems to be fan service. But really.... it's very badly done fan service.

I'd say that this tie in is the most important, when you completely exclude story. Of course there are people reading AvX to find out what happens with Hope and the Phoenix force etc. But I bet there's a hell of a lot more people reading it just to find out who wins in a fight. Which is why I feel this series is so important, and I think Marvel know that, which is why they love doing events like this and I guess that's why I was so let down by it.

I went into AvX fresh faced and eager, I really really wanna like this event, but Marvel are not making it easy on me. :/

Why expect anything less from this event? The teams are mismatched.Without Jean Grey the Avengers have the upper hand.Thor alone could kill just about every mutant on earth.

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

I didn't think the issue was bad. I found it quite a step up from the main books. And next UXM they are doing Namor vs Thing so I wonder how Gillen will play that one out since the main book covered it or if they will just make Namor lose again.

@Vance Astro said:

Why expect anything less from this event? The teams are mismatched.Without Jean Grey the Avengers have the upper hand.Thor alone could kill just about every mutant on earth.

Not sure how that's possible when the mutants have at least one guy who can stuff Thor into a wooden box and throw it into the fire.

@god_spawn said:

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

I didn't think the issue was bad. I found it quite a step up from the main books. And next UXM they are doing Namor vs Thing so I wonder how Gillen will play that one out since the main book covered it or if they will just make Namor lose again.

I don't think it was bad either, I was just amused that they managed to find some way for Rulk to win despite being outmatched.

@Fuchsia_Nightingale said:

Avengers got a movie coming out, not good pr to have them lose :P

Or else the fans may throw a fit. Its a shame really a good story being ruined for the sake of public relations.

Not sure how that's possible when the mutants have at least one guy who can stuff Thor into a wooden box and throw it into the fire.

@Vance Astro said:

@CitizenBane said:

Not sure how that's possible when the mutants have at least one guy who can stuff Thor into a wooden box and throw it into the fire.

And that would be?

Legion.

Legion.

@CaioTrubat:

Comics have to please the casual fans as well ^___^

@Lvenger said:

OK Iron Man beating Magneto I can accept but THING BEATING NAMOR UNDERWATER? Seriously Marvel you're going to have a guy who can go toe to toe with the heavyweights of the Marvel universe being beaten by someone who's never fared well against heavyweights like that before? Good grief this is ridiculous even when compared to Siege. And that's saying something.

@feargalr: Their recent events are not that good. It's because they're pulling one out each year for sales. Civil War, House of M, Avengers Disassembled those are good big Marvel events. And Marvel are doing good small scale events such as the Circle of Four, Ends of the Earth, Hickman's Fantastic Four run among others. But in terms of the big events, Marvel have really lost the plot.

QFT

We are not surprised this "event" sucks, but we are still bitterly disappointed at HOW MUCH it sucks. It's never easy to see a company you've faithfully been buying the comics off for over thirty years playing the painted whore for the sake of covering the release of a movie.

@CitizenBane said:

@Vance Astro said:

@CitizenBane said:

Not sure how that's possible when the mutants have at least one guy who can stuff Thor into a wooden box and throw it into the fire.

And that would be?

Legion.

True.

@Vance Astro said:

@CitizenBane said:

Legion.

I was going to disagree with this but i'm not going to lie, I don't know sh#t about Legion.

Technically Thor could beat Legion too, with super speed.........but then again, Thor is not renown for his operational speed.

Forget Legion, why couldn't Xavier just shut down Thor's mind if he wanted?

This event seems to be Casual fan candy

With the movie coming out, people might pick up some Avengers comics, and come on,... avengers vs X-men, talk about cool

for people who don't know much about the characters and stuff involved

Why expect anything less from this event? The teams are mismatched.Without Jean Grey the Avengers have the upper hand.Thor alone could kill just about every mutant on earth.

@god_spawn said:

@CitizenBane said:

Best was Uncanny X-Men #11, where Colossus surrendered and let Rulk pummel him into unconsciousness.

I didn't think the issue was bad. I found it quite a step up from the main books. And next UXM they are doing Namor vs Thing so I wonder how Gillen will play that one out since the main book covered it or if they will just make Namor lose again.

I don't think it was bad either, I was just amused that they managed to find some way for Rulk to win despite being outmatched.

 why couldn't Xavier just shut down Thor's mind if he wanted?

@Vance Astro said:

@CitizenBane said:

why couldn't Xavier just shut down Thor's mind if he wanted?

Wasn't aware telepathy worked on Thor.

Sure it does. Didn't Moondragon use her mind-control on him?