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#1 Edited by jhazzroucher (15764 posts) - - Show Bio

This is actually in connection to about getting a black actor as Human Torch. So I was thinking, if the director decides to assign an actress who isn't black to play as Storm, are you fine with it? Whether your answer is "yes" or "no", which actress who isn't black would you want to play as her?

I'll answer first.

I would say "no!" I mean a big "NO". That's pretty much not the Storm I know. Storm is a very popular black comic character, she's even the most popular black comic book character, and not getting a black actress to play as her even if the hair is white, people would be confused.

But if I can't stop them, then I would like Kelly Brook to play as Storm.

#2 Edited by Nerx (15088 posts) - - Show Bio

@jhazzroucher: Hell no, this is as disgusting as storm being race lifted (however hammond in WW2 should be black)

since movies are damaging to the comics as a whole in marvel, since we have samuel j fury now we have nick fury jr

#3 Edited by Bogey (946 posts) - - Show Bio

A "white" Storm would probably get her own solo since the African one is extremely boring and without a rogue gallery.

#4 Edited by Lux_Invictus (154 posts) - - Show Bio

If this happened people would complain nonstop. Especially the people saying that Torch being black is "ok" and "not a big deal". It's crazy how things work.

#5 Edited by Avenging-X-Bolt (13134 posts) - - Show Bio

If this happened people would complain nonstop. Especially the people saying that Torch being black is "ok" and "not a big deal". It's crazy how things work.

to be fair, Storm's race is a bit more important than the Human Torch's

#6 Posted by AweSam (7375 posts) - - Show Bio

Yes! So I can finally say "no big deal", or "it's okay".

#7 Posted by Bruxae (13847 posts) - - Show Bio

No, Storm should be black, torch should be white.

I think its really stupid when they chance race on an established comic character, in my eyes its like getting a white guy to play Malcolm X. Its not neccesarily wrong - but its no longer the same character.

#8 Edited by BumpyBoo (9242 posts) - - Show Bio

1. Ew.

2. Ewwwwwwwwwww.

Moderator
#9 Edited by SliverBat (60 posts) - - Show Bio

At least her skin tone should be dark if anything but I see no need for a change.

There is no point, you're just making the character be less of who they are.

#10 Posted by KnightRise (4785 posts) - - Show Bio

If this happened people would complain nonstop. Especially the people saying that Torch being black is "ok" and "not a big deal". It's crazy how things work.

The difference is that Johnny's ethnicity is not a defining element of the character. He's not "caucasian kid brother of the Fantastic Four: Johnny Storm!". Storm was specifically created to be an African and add diversity to the All-New, All-Different X-Men roster.

#11 Edited by Jorgevy (5114 posts) - - Show Bio

her whole shabang is about her being african and stuff

there's white africans, but it wouldn't be nowhere near as awesome.

just as I said for Human Torch, it's not about the skin colour (no such thing as races) but it's about what that affects the surrounding of the character - most of the times they won't have the same issues or cultural background and that's hugely influential - also, what about relatives or other people of interest

I'm not against it, but I'd much rather have Human Torch look like he looks like in the comics and Storm like she looks like in the comics. just cast an actor who's similar and who's good, easy

you dont' see the Marvel Cinematic Universe changing people's looks drastically

(DONT YOU DARE REPLY WITH NICK FURY THIS BLA BLA BLA - since this was a cinematic universe why not have a version of a character that already has a famous actor that looks like that version since that version was inspired by that actor? Sam L Jackson was the inspiration for Ultimate Nick fury and MCU takes things from both Ultimate and 616, so why not just grab Sam L Jackson? the man himself said he'd allow Marvel to use his likeliness for the comic character if he got to play him on the big screen if that opportunity arised!)

PS: hmmm if we really can't go with a black actress for Storm then Id go with....

maybe Charlize Theron since she is south african and played a nice super powered character and stuff

#12 Posted by Veshark (9058 posts) - - Show Bio

I'd definitely be a little weirded out. Her African heritage is a big part of the character.

There are times when alterations in ethnicity do work - like Kingpin in Daredevil. And other times where everyone doesn't mind, but doesn't particularly care for it either - like Pete Ross in Smallville. But my feelings about Storm are the same as my feelings about Johnny Storm - I don't like changes in the ethnicity of (relatively) major characters.

#13 Edited by ZombieMowlcher (677 posts) - - Show Bio

I thought she was latinio, or some native South or Central American.

#14 Posted by RustyRoy (12711 posts) - - Show Bio

@bruxae said:

No, Storm should be black, torch should be white.

I think its really stupid when they chance race on an established comic character, in my eyes its like getting a white guy to play Malcolm X. Its not neccesarily wrong - but its no longer the same character.

This.

#16 Posted by krunkeela (188 posts) - - Show Bio
#17 Edited by fodigg (6146 posts) - - Show Bio

Absolutely not. Recasting white superheroes as minorities should be applauded because it increases diversity in a medium that—because so many characters were defined in the 40s—is overwhelmingly white. But white-washing traditionally black (or other minority) superheroes means eliminating one of the few roles available for black actors and actresses. It is incredibly offensive. (And no, swapping out one minority for another isn't better because you're still denying a minority a role.)

The racists (or at least, apologists) love to argue this false equivalency between recasting minority characters as whites and recasting whites as minorities. They argue that it's only "equal" and "fair" because they're both race-based swaps. This is nonsense. Same treatment in an overwhelmingly unequal environment is neither equal nor fair. Context has to be considered.

There are only a few exceptions where I wouldn't want to see a white character recast as a minority:

  • When whiteness is an integral part of their character (e.g., Red Skull),
  • when their powerset or archetype could have offensive implications (e.g., recasting blacks into stereotypical "monstrous" or "animalistic" characters), and
  • when a character already exists within a mantle that could be substituted without recasting (e.g., why recast Hal Jordan when you can just use John Stewart?).

There are NO circumstances where I think it's acceptable to whitewash a minority character.

I don't want to suggest any white actress for Storm because the thought should not even be seriously entertained.

#18 Edited by blkson (785 posts) - - Show Bio

@rustyroy said:

@bruxae said:

No, Storm should be black, torch should be white.

I think its really stupid when they chance race on an established comic character, in my eyes its like getting a white guy to play Malcolm X. Its not neccesarily wrong - but its no longer the same character.

This.

How the hell is getting a white person to play a historical important political like Malcom X similar to having a black person play a damn fictional non existing ass character?

#19 Edited by theTimeStreamer (2841 posts) - - Show Bio

i would be awesome with it. because storm fans hearts would just explode.

#20 Edited by blkson (785 posts) - - Show Bio

i would be awesome with it. because storm fans hearts would just explode.

lmao some people just want to see the world burn.

#21 Posted by ImNemotheGemini (845 posts) - - Show Bio

This is comic book politics to the fullest ! Johnny storm as black comes across (to some) as fine simply because he could be whoever ! Asian American.. African American.. Hell Martian American lol that last way may be pushing it but its true ! Storm on the other hand is written as a FULL AFRICAN ! Movies can get away with making her light skin , but still black ! If you make her a white African then everything that is storm's character is gone ! It's a terrible double standard .... But it just shouldn't be done !

#22 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio

If Storm is played by a white person. I will not only never see another Marvel film, i'll stop reading Marvel Comics entirely.

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#23 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio

@blkson said:

How the hell is getting a white person to play a historical important political like Malcom X similar to having a black person play a damn fictional non existing ass character?

Malcolm is real, put him in a film and now he becomes a "character". So the point is, as long as you're drawing the inspiration for the creation of a "character" in film from something else, it should be displayed how it was intended. Storm IS black and she always has been, although she's not real doesn't make her race any less important to what she is.

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#24 Edited by RustyRoy (12711 posts) - - Show Bio

OKAY BETTER QUESTION : WHAT IF BLADE WAS PLAYED BY A WHITE/ASIAN DUDE? WILL YOU GUYS BE OKAY WITH IT?

#25 Posted by Bruxae (13847 posts) - - Show Bio

@blkson: The point is that it doesnt really matter what character its about, you dont go changing an established character real or not, or its no longer the same character whether its race or gender or haircolor, its just not necessary and immersion breaking and more a political manouver then anything else. Also while a certain character might be nothing but a fictional thing for you to some people the same character can be a very important figure thats been with them through life alot more then some historical figure you never really met.

Imagine if they made Superman black, theres people out there all over the world to who he has been an extremely important figure since birth, and to their parents and even grandparents, Superman might be alot more important to them then a one country only politician.. Its not bad to be black not at all but its definetly bad to make such a well-known character a different race, just as wrong as it would be to potray a historical figure wrong in fiction. Either way since its a movie potrayal we are talking about they would -both- be fictional so you are kindoff contradicting yourself.

Also please watch the swearing, no need for that on a family friendly site. thx.

#26 Posted by V_Scarlotte_Rose (6286 posts) - - Show Bio

If they did make her white in a film, would they then write her out of the comics and replace her with a secret white daughter called Storm Jr.?

#27 Posted by PrinceIMC (5422 posts) - - Show Bio

Storm's history and ancestry is important to her character. It is important that she is black. The Human Torch just needs to be an American, no matter what color that is.

#28 Edited by RustyRoy (12711 posts) - - Show Bio

@princeimc: Why? They can also make her an Indian weather goddess instead of an African one. The origin will be the same just the ethnicity will change.

#29 Edited by blkson (785 posts) - - Show Bio

@vance_astro: @bruxae: hell, damn, and ass aren't allowed now?

Anyways what I'm saying is that we're talking about fictional non existing characters. This isn't about real people who affected people lives and the course of history on a grand scale. So don't bring them into this. This is a damn comic book. Also this is Johnny Storm we're talking about here. Not Superman, not Batman. This guy isn't no where near as big as those characters.

#30 Edited by TheAmazingImmortalMan (3120 posts) - - Show Bio

Hells no..........

@bruxae said:

No, Storm should be black, torch should be white.

I heard that!!!!!

Online
#31 Posted by The Stegman (24374 posts) - - Show Bio

@lux_invictus said:

If this happened people would complain nonstop. Especially the people saying that Torch being black is "ok" and "not a big deal". It's crazy how things work.

to be fair, Storm's race is a bit more important than the Human Torch's

This. Storm's race is an important part of her back story and her identity, taking that away severely damages the character, where is making Human Torch black won't change anything (though they might have to make Sue black too, or have him adopted :P)

Making Storm not African would be like making Superman not Kryptonian.

#32 Posted by ARMIV2 (8522 posts) - - Show Bio

Am I fine with-? NO.

#33 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio

@blkson said:

@vance_astro: @bruxae: hell, damn, and ass aren't allowed now?

Last I checked they were fine.

@blkson said:

Anyways what I'm saying is that we're talking about fictional non existing characters. This isn't about real people who affected people lives and the course of history on a grand scale. So don't bring them into this. This is a damn comic book. Also this is Johnny Storm we're talking about here. Not Superman, not Batman. This guy isn't no where near as big as those characters.

I think you're taking it the wrong way. Nobody is comparing Johnny Storm to Malcolm, they are comparing the disservice that would be done to either if their race was changed in a film. Johnny Storm not being as popular as Superman or Batman is true but Johnny Storm is well known (even outside of those who read comics) enough for most people to know, HE'S WHITE. Race changes are pointless in films regardless of the importance of the character.

Moderator
#34 Posted by lilcraig92 (80 posts) - - Show Bio

I realize that movie casters only cast one black person and make the rest of the cast caucasian.

And they think dat shows diversity. Cold Blooded Holmes

#35 Posted by PrinceIMC (5422 posts) - - Show Bio

@rustyroy said:

@princeimc: Why? They can also make her an Indian weather goddess instead of an African one. The origin will be the same just the ethnicity will change.

Because Storm is supposed to be descended from the oldest human culture on Earth and that is pretty much agreed to have begun in Africa. She is supposed to have walked across the Sahara alone as she developed her powers. India is large but walking across it isn't as impressive.

#36 Posted by Bruxae (13847 posts) - - Show Bio

@blkson said:

@vance_astro: @bruxae: hell, damn, and ass aren't allowed now?

Anyways what I'm saying is that we're talking about fictional non existing characters. This isn't about real people who affected people lives and the course of history on a grand scale. So don't bring them into this. This is a damn comic book. Also this is Johnny Storm we're talking about here. Not Superman, not Batman. This guy isn't no where near as big as those characters.

And what im saying is that fictional or not to some of us they are equally important no matter how small or big the character is, Superman was an example of a bigger character to show how off that would be, I know Torch is nowhere near his status but he is still important to some people and shouldnt be changed. And while Malcolm X is with no doubt more important than any comic book character, comic characters have alot more global influence and frankly has affected alot more people then any American exlusive figure, thus id say they are pretty important, and shouldnt be belittled as "a damned comic book" especially on a site like this where alot of people have a passion for comics.

Im sorry I cant explain myself better then this, english is my third language so im not that great at it.

#37 Edited by RustyRoy (12711 posts) - - Show Bio

@rustyroy said:

@princeimc: Why? They can also make her an Indian weather goddess instead of an African one. The origin will be the same just the ethnicity will change.

Because Storm is supposed to be descended from the oldest human culture on Earth and that is pretty much agreed to have begun in Africa. She is supposed to have walked across the Sahara alone as she developed her powers. India is large but walking across it isn't as impressive.

Indian culture is the oldest one in my knowledge. And are they gonna show her walking across the Sahara in the movie?

#38 Posted by blkson (785 posts) - - Show Bio

@vance_astro: @bruxae: Ok first of all, thanks on the language part.

I think that was just a horrible analogy though, IMO. But I get what y'all are saying. What you both are saying makes sense. This is a site for comic folk so I can see how this would be important to some folk.

@avenging_x_bolt said:

@lux_invictus said:

If this happened people would complain nonstop. Especially the people saying that Torch being black is "ok" and "not a big deal". It's crazy how things work.

to be fair, Storm's race is a bit more important than the Human Torch's

This. Storm's race is an important part of her back story and her identity, taking that away severely damages the character, where is making Human Torch black won't change anything (though they might have to make Sue black too, or have him adopted :P)

Making Storm not African would be like making Superman not Kryptonian.

When it comes to race bending, it dose not get any simpler than that. Yea I'm not tired of it and would like to see the development of the minority characters we have but racebending is not that hard to grasp.

If the characters race is important to the character, then race bending that character is wrong. Heimdall is a good example. Heimdall maybe fictional but he's based on Norse mythology. Norse mythology is European/white. Idris Elba playing him didn't sit well with me because if Osun, Shango, Imhotep, ect. was racebent it would bother me, seeing as they are African deities. Therefore, they should be African/black. Heimdall race matters, because he is an European deity. His race is a key element of his existence. Character's like Storm and T'challa race are important to the characters.

@rustyroy said:

OKAY BETTER QUESTION : WHAT IF BLADE WAS PLAYED BY A WHITE/ASIAN DUDE? WILL YOU GUYS BE OKAY WITH IT?

lol if we're going to do an eye for and eye when it comes to racebending, then I game. 'Cause white folk will run out of prominent minority characters to racebend before minorities run out white characters to change.

#39 Edited by JulieDC (954 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm a black chick and I am not a fan of any kind of race lifting be it Storm or Human Torch even if race isn't an important part of the character. To me, changing the race for diversity doesn't actually fix the lack of diversity issue it just seems like putting a band-aid on a gunshot wound. I fully believe we need more black characters in comics, especially black women but I don't want it to be through race changes because its offensive to both racial groups, hurts an admirable cause, and in the end, never actually fixed the problem.

#40 Posted by blkson (785 posts) - - Show Bio

@juliedc said:

I'm a black chick and I am not a fan of any kind of race lifting be it Storm or Human Torch even if race isn't an important part of the character. To me, changing the race for diversity doesn't actually fix the lack of diversity issue it just seems like putting a band-aid on a gunshot wound. I fully believe we need more black characters in comics, especially black women but I don't want it to be through race changes because its offensive to both racial groups, hurts an admirable cause, and in the end, never actually fixed the problem.

True.

#41 Posted by deaditegonzo (3686 posts) - - Show Bio

Turn about is fair play as they say. I think we need to move past being so hypocritical as a society.

Johnny's race has never seemed as important because there is no "white culture." What sort of White traditional things could they show him doing? Making potatoes? Besides, he has a white sister which will need a typically unnecessary explanation.

Ive been ok with almost all the racial changes, most of them lead to better actors in those parts (Kingpin, Fury), but I am ok with it any direction so long as leads to better actors (Halle Berry is not a great actress).


#42 Posted by frogdog (3246 posts) - - Show Bio

#43 Posted by SOG7dc (7178 posts) - - Show Bio

@vance_astro:

guys.....how about make up? remember tropic thunder??? I for one did not know that the black guy in that movie was Robert downey jr until the end. I was shocked. they could just hire whatever actor they liked and hire the best maeup team on the planet

#44 Posted by joshmightbe (24885 posts) - - Show Bio

Well if the whole African goddess thing wasn't a key part of her character then it wouldn't bother me but since the movies completely ignore that aspect of her anyway it probably wouldn't matter.

#45 Posted by Z3RO180 (6538 posts) - - Show Bio

Couldn't care

#46 Posted by Farkam (4889 posts) - - Show Bio

As long as they are better than Halle Berry. That chick that plays Uhura should be the next Storm.

#47 Edited by Lux_Invictus (154 posts) - - Show Bio

@blkson said:

@vance_astro: @bruxae: Ok first of all, thanks on the language part.

I think that was just a horrible analogy though, IMO. But I get what y'all are saying. What you both are saying makes sense. This is a site for comic folk so I can see how this would be important to some folk.

@the_stegman said:

@avenging_x_bolt said:

@lux_invictus said:

If this happened people would complain nonstop. Especially the people saying that Torch being black is "ok" and "not a big deal". It's crazy how things work.

to be fair, Storm's race is a bit more important than the Human Torch's

This. Storm's race is an important part of her back story and her identity, taking that away severely damages the character, where is making Human Torch black won't change anything (though they might have to make Sue black too, or have him adopted :P)

Making Storm not African would be like making Superman not Kryptonian.

When it comes to race bending, it dose not get any simpler than that. Yea I'm not tired of it and would like to see the development of the minority characters we have but racebending is not that hard to grasp.

If the characters race is important to the character, then race bending that character is wrong. Heimdall is a good example. Heimdall maybe fictional but he's based on Norse mythology. Norse mythology is European/white. Idris Elba playing him didn't sit well with me because if Osun, Shango, Imhotep, ect. was racebent it would bother me, seeing as they are African deities. Therefore, they should be African/black. Heimdall race matters, because he is an European deity. His race is a key element of his existence. Character's like Storm and T'challa race are important to the characters.

@rustyroy said:

OKAY BETTER QUESTION : WHAT IF BLADE WAS PLAYED BY A WHITE/ASIAN DUDE? WILL YOU GUYS BE OKAY WITH IT?

lol if we're going to do an eye for and eye when it comes to racebending, then I game. 'Cause white folk will run out of prominent minority characters to racebend before minorities run out white characters to change.

I'm sorry guys, but you guys aren't being honest with yourselves. In the X-Men films Storm was hardly even African. There was no accent or anything. She seemed like a typical weather controlling mutant who just happened to be black. Did people get angry about this? No. No one did. Why? Because she was still black. The color of a characters skin is a defining trait and may be one of the most important physical aspects of a character. If the makers of the new F4 wanted to make a movie about a black character they should have just made a Black Panther movie which would have been waay cooler anyways. (Also there are tons of white people in Africa, so your reasoning for that goes out the window) The difference between Torch and Heimdall and Kingpin is that Human Torch is a main character of his comic. Without him there is no Fantastic Four. He IS white and was created white by his creators for a reason. What if Luke Cage was white? What if Captain America was Hispanic? What if Wolverine was green? It just wouldn't add up. It's pretty oblivious to just flat say "oh.. I don't see differences in skin color. Everyone is the same color to me." Why? Because it's right there in front of your eyes. Skin color ISN'T everything, but that doesn't mean that it's nothing. I'm not saying a black guy can't act the part of Torch. For all I know he is probably the most down-to-earth dude in the world. But because he doesn't physically identify with the character I and a sh*t load of movie goers will have an extremely hard time accepting him as Torch which will take my attention away from the movie and thus make it a bad experience. I would even accept this movie if the Fantastic Four were different characters than the ones in the comics and were all black or Hispanic or ANYTHING because that would give me the opportunity to have a clean slate thinking process diving in. I mean just look at all the controversy this thing has sparked before it even has a trailer. Either the creators are REALLY REALLY smart, or extremely lacking in hindsight. Either way this thing will either be the death of this movie or it's savior. A single thing such as the skin color of Torch will probably make this movie 10xs more/less money. And you guys are going to still sit there and say skin color doesn't matter?

#48 Posted by Vance Astro (91230 posts) - - Show Bio

@sog7dc said:

@vance_astro:

guys.....how about make up? remember tropic thunder??? I for one did not know that the black guy in that movie was Robert downey jr until the end. I was shocked. they could just hire whatever actor they liked and hire the best maeup team on the planet

Tropic Thunder was a comedy and it's kind of hard to not be able to tell that was him in brown make-up....

Moderator
#49 Posted by RustyRoy (12711 posts) - - Show Bio

@blkson: I said that because everyone was saying Storm and BP's ethnicity was important for their origin(African goddess and King).

@sog7dc said:

@vance_astro:

guys.....how about make up? remember tropic thunder??? I for one did not know that the black guy in that movie was Robert downey jr until the end. I was shocked. they could just hire whatever actor they liked and hire the best maeup team on the planet

I'm cool with it, as long as they make him white and blonde I don't have a problem. And its possible, Halle Berry played a white character in Cloud Atlas and a white dude played a Asian character and an Asian girl played a British character in the same movie. And they kooked perfect.

#50 Posted by SOG7dc (7178 posts) - - Show Bio

@vance_astro:

I know it was a comedy......and maybe I was the only one but I sware I didn't know that it was RDJ. and aside from the tropic thunder reference....what do you think about the make up thing?