#1 Posted by daak1212 (7901 posts) - - Show Bio

Can someone explain this to me?  I heard that terrible events came out of the 90's and that was a major reason for its decline but can someone go more in depth for me?  I would like to know why/how they declined.

#2 Posted by joshmightbe (24908 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212: Actually some really great events such as Fatal Attractions and Infinity gauntlet came out of the 90s but unfortunately all people seem to think about is the damn shoulder pads and pouches that every hero just had to have back then
#3 Posted by JediXMan (30709 posts) - - Show Bio

Here are my opinions of 90s comics in a nutshell:
 
Good stories; terrible art.

Moderator
#4 Posted by daak1212 (7901 posts) - - Show Bio
@JediXMan: Im not so sure Onslaught or Clone Saga won anybody over though or so I heard
#5 Posted by joshmightbe (24908 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212: Niether was great but in all honesty they weren't as bad as many claim Onslaught was a lot of hype for a pretty meh story and the Clone saga just had too much going on all at once and got silly 
#6 Posted by Mainline (1129 posts) - - Show Bio

Speculator bubble burst and bad investments put many corners of the industry into a tailspin. 
 
Irrespective of the qualities of the books themselves, the investors at the time had a higher opinion of comics than what the market would ultimately bear.  The companies though they could survive on stunts, foil on cardstock, or variant covers.  Fans thought it would all be worth mint someday and bought it up.  Shopkeepers thought the gold rush would last forever and opened dozens of stores.  Publishers thought they could discard writers and treat artists like rockstars.  Etc.  So, like so many bubbles, everyone thought there was more money than there actually was and over extended themselves.  The market corrected itself when kids realized that buying five premium covers meant reading ten less comics... but even then were there ten that you wanted to read (rather than just look at)?  Consumers tightened their purse strings, shops closed up, publishers went into debt and got desperate (we would have never seen the Marvel vs. DC crossover if the market hadn't tanked), and the stock price plummeted... Marvel was selling off its licensing and movie rights at bottom basement prices just to stay afloat (many of which have not returned yet, such as the X-Men to FOX or Spidey to Sony) until it could sell no more and declared bankruptcy. 
 
Bottom line, mainstream comics are a business first and foremost... if you manage that stuff properly, you'll land on your feet.  That's part of the reason Jim Lee and Wildstorm have fared much better than many other Image splinters is that work ethic and business sense.

#7 Posted by JediXMan (30709 posts) - - Show Bio
@joshmightbe said:
@daak1212: Niether was great but in all honesty they weren't as bad as many claim Onslaught was a lot of hype for a pretty meh story and the Clone saga just had too much going on all at once and got silly 
Seems a lot of 90s comics were rather cluttered.
 
Not saying it's a bad thing. It can just be irritating.
Moderator
#8 Posted by joshmightbe (24908 posts) - - Show Bio
@JediXMan: The clone saga actually had potential to be good but after awhile all the twists and turns got to be a bit much by the time Norman showed up it wasn't even that much of a surprise 
#9 Posted by FadeToBlackBolt (23334 posts) - - Show Bio

Clone Saga was awful. Ben Reilly sucked. Tons of Legacy characters introduced. 
 
Still better than Modern Marvel though (with the exception of Spidey, which is awesome).

#10 Posted by MydLyfeCrysis (106 posts) - - Show Bio
@Mainline said:
Speculator bubble burst and bad investments put many corners of the industry into a tailspin.  Irrespective of the qualities of the books themselves, the investors at the time had a higher opinion of comics than what the market would ultimately bear.  The companies though they could survive on stunts, foil on cardstock, or variant covers.  Fans thought it would all be worth mint someday and bought it up.  Shopkeepers thought the gold rush would last forever and opened dozens of stores.  Publishers thought they could discard writers and treat artists like rockstars.  Etc.  So, like so many bubbles, everyone thought there was more money than there actually was and over extended themselves.  The market corrected itself when kids realized that buying five premium covers meant reading ten less comics... but even then were there ten that you wanted to read (rather than just look at)?  Consumers tightened their purse strings, shops closed up, publishers went into debt and got desperate (we would have never seen the Marvel vs. DC crossover if the market hadn't tanked), and the stock price plummeted... Marvel was selling off its licensing and movie rights at bottom basement prices just to stay afloat (many of which have not returned yet, such as the X-Men to FOX or Spidey to Sony) until it could sell no more and declared bankruptcy.  Bottom line, mainstream comics are a business first and foremost... if you manage that stuff properly, you'll land on your feet.  That's part of the reason Jim Lee and Wildstorm have fared much better than many other Image splinters is that work ethic and business sense.
This. Exactly. You see, in the early 90's news got out at some newly rich young adults were paying a mint for rare comics. It created a speculation boom, that, well, just wasn't built on anything. People started looking at comics as investments, not entertainment. And really, those are the worst kinds of collectors. This created a rush to produce anything and everything simply to fuel the speculation bubble.
#11 Posted by xerox_kitty (15762 posts) - - Show Bio

Actually, there is some truth to the claim that comics were in decline.  Back then Marvel was owned by a crappy toy company & they were in stages of bankruptcy (Chapter 11 I think it is in the US).  Therefore they often resorted to cheap tactics to try and keep sales up... hence the rise of the cross-over which became so prevelent in the 90's.   
 
However, the big guns, bigger boobs & violence was more an attempt to appeal to the lowest denominator.  They assumed that fans only wanted cheap thrills, and have gone through a more apologetic darker & mroe series phase ever since.

Moderator
#12 Posted by MydLyfeCrysis (106 posts) - - Show Bio
@xerox-kitty said:
  They assumed that fans only wanted cheap thrills, and have gone through a more apologetic darker & more series phase ever since.
And thank goodness for that. If comics had continued down that path, I doubt I'd still be the diehard I am today. It was a shame to see the groundwork, that the likes of Frank Miller had lain, washed away by that failure tide of the 90's.
#13 Posted by Out_of_Space (720 posts) - - Show Bio

  
90's comics were awesome. Image were kings back there and DC had really good stories too.

#14 Posted by gravitypress (2069 posts) - - Show Bio

10 versions of the same comics with different covers didn't help. Overall the companies flooded the market in the 90s.

#15 Posted by ntb1124 (949 posts) - - Show Bio

Over saturation for sure was the biggest problem, some nonsensical crossovers often hurt the individual comics storylines.  The Early 90s were pretty outstanding as far as I remember for Marvel, but they later went through a lot of trouble financially.  I loved many of the big storylines, and it was the highest point for some of my favorites(X-Men).

#16 Posted by turoksonofstone (13199 posts) - - Show Bio
@daak1212 said:
Can someone explain this to me?  I heard that terrible events came out of the 90's and that was a major reason for its decline but can someone go more in depth for me?  I would like to know why/how they declined.
@gravitypress said:
10 versions of the same comics with different covers didn't help. Overall the companies flooded the market in the 90s.