" Neither has ever beat the other. Batman and Captain America stalemated in both crossovers, if I'm remembering correctly. "
There wasn't a stalemate in Marvel vs. DC. Batman won that one, even though it wasn't canon. "
It was voted on by fans, that takes a great deal away from it's legitimacy. In the JLA/Avengers crossover Batman admits that Captain America could probably beat him.
"It was voted on by fans, that takes a great deal away from it's legitimacy. In the JLA/Avengers crossover Batman admits that Captain America could probably beat him. "
I'm not denying that it was voted by fans, but in Marvel vs. DC, Batman won, despite the fact that it's not legit. In the JLA/Avengers crossover, Batman can admit what he wants, but based on the battle they fought, it was a stalemate.
I'm just saying that all Marvel vs. DC proved was that Batman was more popular than Captain America.
In the very last panel of Cap and Bats fight in JLA/Avengers is depicts Cap landing a blow on Bats arm (when Bats couldn't do the same), which prompts Bats to call an end to the fight. So, I don't really see that as a stalemate.
Sorry, can't find any useful scans with my work filter.
" Like many people predicted - Batman was the winner against captain america
Cap does put up a good fight against the caped crusader
Batman laments his distain for the situation, noting the billions of lives at stake in each universe.He tries to join forces but the Captain can see no way to combat the will of the cosmic beings thats forcing them to fight. As the two toss their weapons in final battle, the pipe they stand before erupts with water as the system flushes out.Cap's shield misses it's target, but the smaller batarang connects with Captain America's skull.As the two are engulfed in filthy waters, Captain America is unable to protect himself, feeling the dizzying effects of a blow to the head.Searching frantically for the colourful hero, Batman submerges beneath the water, finding the helpless warrior sinking. He scoops him, and returns to the surface "
" Like many people predicted - Batman was the winner against captain america
Cap does put up a good fight against the caped crusader
Batman laments his distain for the situation, noting the billions of lives at stake in each universe.He tries to join forces but the Captain can see no way to combat the will of the cosmic beings thats forcing them to fight. As the two toss their weapons in final battle, the pipe they stand before erupts with water as the system flushes out.Cap's shield misses it's target, but the smaller batarang connects with Captain America's skull.As the two are engulfed in filthy waters, Captain America is unable to protect himself, feeling the dizzying effects of a blow to the head.Searching frantically for the colourful hero, Batman submerges beneath the water, finding the helpless warrior sinking. He scoops him, and returns to the surface "
1) This isn't a canon battle.
2) It involves use of the environment.
"
Not gonna address the issue of it not being canon effecting the out come just to avoid any type of argument.
I will however address the fact that your seeming to say that Bats won because it invloves the use of the environment. Every fight always tends to involve using the environment. Every good fighter knows that you should always use the environment to your advantage. Besides you can't rag on Bats for trying to buts a pipe with a batarang because every time Cap ever throws his shield with the intent of rebounding it of walls or any other structure he's using the environment. In this case bats just made better use of his surroundings than Cap.
The way I remember it, Cap got hit with the Batarang when the sewers filled, and Batman pulled Cap to safety. Once standing, Cap says something like "I guess you are the winner". Batman said "well, both of us are still standing...."
Also, they are the ones Access found that he used to combine the universes into the Amalgam universe. I don't think either of them won, because Access was able to do that, but chances are Batman won the vote.
if we were to look at it realisticaly Cap would easily win. For the following reasons: combat training: Cap has military combat training SHEILD Training and several forms or martial arts. Plus more experiance.
Endurance: Cap has the super Soilder serum: he can last longer due to fatigue not setting in he is also Peak human in everything reflexes speed stamina ect. The Super soilder serum gives him a huge edge as he can last longer and endure more than Batman can. This is not to say batman is a whimp or what not its going by stats.
Weapons: Caps sheild is both an offenceive and defencive weapon. It could bock almost any weapon batman has. and also be used as a throwing weapon much like Batmans batarangs.
by no means would this be an easy fight for either hero. and it could easily go one way or another due to a lucky blow or an extra hit. But toe to toe in a fight the longer the fight last the more it goes to cap due to the serum.
Dug out my copy of JLA/Avengers. I remember being dissapointed because everyone else actually fought apart from those two.
Bats: 'Okay it's concievable you could beat me, Avenger but it would take a very long time. Tell me this though - Do you want to?' Cap: ' No. You're not the enemy. We're all just pawns in a larger scheme'
I really think it's a stalemate. If it was just hand to hand though, Cap would have it.
"if we were to look at it realisticaly Cap would easily win. For the following reasons: combat training: Cap has military combat training SHEILD Training and several forms or martial arts. Plus more experiance. Endurance: Cap has the super Soilder serum: he can last longer due to fatigue not setting in he is also Peak human in everything reflexes speed stamina ect. The Super soilder serum gives him a huge edge as he can last longer and endure more than Batman can. This is not to say batman is a whimp or what not its going by stats. Weapons: Caps sheild is both an offenceive and defencive weapon. It could bock almost any weapon batman has. and also be used as a throwing weapon much like Batmans batarangs. by no means would this be an easy fight for either hero. and it could easily go one way or another due to a lucky blow or an extra hit. But toe to toe in a fight the longer the fight last the more it goes to cap due to the serum. "
I'll take lady shiva and richard dragon training over military and shield training any day of the week. experience means nothing,batman is also peak human and he can match cap feat for feat.batman has sonics,flashbangs and KO gas something which the shield isnt going to stop. @.o0Johnny0o. said:
" Dug out my copy of JLA/Avengers. I remember being dissapointed because everyone else actually fought apart from those two.
Bats: 'Okay it's concievable you could beat me, Avenger but it would take a very long time. Tell me this though - Do you want to?' Cap: ' No. You're not the enemy. We're all just pawns in a larger scheme' I really think it's a stalemate. If it was just hand to hand though, Cap would have it. "
Yeah and batman said that after stopping his shield with his goddamn foot. batman wins due to better weapons.and can win h2h due to better fightung skills.
i think its cap ftw in a h2h fight. even if batman is peak human at one or two things, he can't be peak human at everything. the sewage pushing cap over was the thing that caused the batarang to hit him in the head. anyway, it's pretty much a stalemate if it wasn't just h2h.
"i think its cap ftw in a h2h fight. even if batman is peak human at one or two things, he can't be peak human at everything. the sewage pushing cap over was the thing that caused the batarang to hit him in the head. anyway, it's pretty much a stalemate if it wasn't just h2h. "
Why cant he be peak human in everything?does cap have the rights to the term . @Deprive said:
@thanos1970: like you said, it could have gone either way, both are at the peak of human perfection, cap is slightly stronger, lifting 500 lbs while batman seems to can lift around 350 (in batman R.I.P) however, capt knows a FEW martial arts, while Batman has been trained in EVERY major martial art known to man, including several extinct ones, cap's shield is really dangerous, but batman has far more in his arsenal than batarangs including smoke bombs, knock out gas, stun guns, grapple hooks with ropes made of titanium alloys (can tie a knot even cap can't break free of) etc, so i'm givin it to batman
Steve Rogers was trained extensively in multiple forms of combat including martial arts. Thanks to the Super Soldier Serum, he was able skip the physical conditioning and flexibility training. Although a few of them have been identified, every discipline he was trained in is unknown and unclear. American Boxing, Judo, Aikido, and Jujutsu are the only revealed disciplines, but he has utilized various different techniques and methods from multiple others. Among these are various Gong fu (or Kung fu) such as Taijiquan, Wing Chun, various Shaolin arm methods which he incorporates for his shield, Chin na, and northern kicking methods, Capoeira, Muay Thai, Karate, Eskrima, and hand techniques used in Ninjutsu. While there are potential other forms which may play a role, many of them were invented after WW2 or during it when Rogers was engaging the enemy axis. His private tutors' identities are unknown, and eastern martial arts were not well recognized during the late 1930s and early 1940s; many of them were regarded as flashy, and even useless movements. Many martial arts teachers refused to teach their methods to westerners. He may have possibly learned different techniques from fighting other persons who use them. Two of his best students Bucky and Hawkeye have been seen using at least one sophisticated hand technique from Ninjutsu that was meant for sensitive points of the body, confirming that Rogers taught it to them strengthening the idea that he may have learned it after confronting Hand ninjas before America officially joined the war.
Steve Rogers incorporates every area of combat in his methods. He excels in punching, kicking, elbowing, kneeing, headbutting, hand techniques and pressure point fighting, grappling, blocking, parrying, trapping, joint locking and manipulating, restraining, disarming, ground fighting, and tricking. He is extremely fluid when fighting enabling himself to adapt to any change in the environment or the physical status of him or his opponent(s) (if they gained or lost a weapon for instance). Steve is very cunning, and creative in battle; even masters of overall combat have great difficulty predicting his next course of action, even through body language. He is able to shift from stand up combat to ground fighting, and even aerial combat due to his mastery over acrobatics. He generally uses many different techniques often seen today in modern kickboxing, wushu, and mixed martial arts. He is well known for using momentum to his advantage making it so that he could strike an opponent much harder than he could without it. He has turned his falls from being hit by an opponent into acrobatic kicks and punches by using the momentum from the assault and "flowing" with it. Tricking also plays an especially large role in his form often using many of those techniques against multiple opponents to create space and confusion, as well as aerial combat (he initially nicknamed it combat gymnastics since there was originally no official name for it). He does not generally use any other weapons than his shield, but his training in Aikido, Jujutsu, overall combat experience, and understanding of hand techniques as well as hand coordination enables him to wield all forms of weaponry with great proficiency.
He is well aware the existance of chi (Ki, or internal energy), and uses it for both combat and health reasons. Steve uses any advantage he can find against his opponents, especially superhumans. If they are physically larger than him, he would assault the larger and easier to hit pressure points. He has often defeated opponents much stronger, faster, and more durable than he. Rogers believes in limitations of both himself and his enemies as well as unpredictability. He trains routinely in simulated combat sometimes blindfolded, in dark and pitch black areas, and even in slippery and uneven terrains to the event of ever having fight in them. Steve uses any flaw he can find in terrains and objects to his advantage by assaulting them to trigger unexpected responses; he sometimes tricks his opponents into doing it for him without them knowing about it or realizing what the ending result would be.
While Steve Rogers is very serious when engaging one to multiple enemies in combat, he is not above teaching his methods to other people. He has trained only a few people in combat. Most of them are, or were at a time, Avengers. Steve only acts as a private tutor for his teammates and is not willing to train any civilians; he prefers any person to avoid any unnecessary fights. While he is an effective and highly competent teacher, he is very strict when teaching his pupils. He does not want any student with inhuman abilities to rely solely on them in midst of a battle or day-to-day activities in the event of not being able to use them, and simply because he saw them as no excuse to not know how to fight if they chose to oppose crime. Although Rogers is no pacifist, he generally does not like fighting unless it is for physical fitness or self-defense; he strongly encourages his students to abide by those principals and not abuse anything he teaches him/her. He teaches all of his students various different methods for self defense and sees to it that he/she can utilize creative and effective methods of their own that suits their strengths. Many of the techniques he teaches fall into the areas of boxing principals making it so that he/she can effectively use both standard punches and kicks, and grappling. Steve sees to it his pupils are formidable on their own; able to fend off anything from unskilled to skilled attackers and single to multiple opponents. He will only teach advanced, and even potentially lethal techniques to advanced students; most of them have great athletic and acrobatic talents which are required and do not have any superhuman abilities.
Got to Laugh at this. Anyone who thinks this is real doesn't know his head from his ......... It was a fan vote heck if we went by that. Wolverine is more powerful then Lobo.
Why do people insist on stating Cap is peak human. He's not. The SSS puts him beyond peak human. There's so many scans on this site that show him being beyond peak in areas that a non-enhanced heroes simply cannot train to get to like reflexes, "seeing faster" (that one even surprised me), and stamina to name a few.
Batman can beat Cap, but it won't be because of H2H skills. It will be due to his ability to think his way to a win using some combo of gadgets and deception. Otherwise Cap beats him down. And I've said it many times... the longer the fight goes the more it favors Cap for obvious reasons.
" Why do people insist on stating Cap is peak human. He's not. The SSS puts him beyond peak human. There's so many scans on this site that show him being beyond peak in areas that a non-enhanced heroes simply cannot train to get to like reflexes, "seeing faster" (that one even surprised me), and stamina to name a few. Batman can beat Cap, but it won't be because of H2H skills. It will be due to his ability to think his way to a win using some combo of gadgets and deception. Otherwise Cap beats him down. And I've said it many times... the longer the fight goes the more it favors Cap for obvious reasons. "
True. Didnt Batman admit that in the JLA/Avengers crossover?
Steve Rogers was trained extensively in multiple forms of combat including martial arts. Thanks to the Super Soldier Serum, he was able skip the physical conditioning and flexibility training. Although a few of them have been identified, every discipline he was trained in is unknown and unclear. American Boxing, Judo, Aikido, and Jujutsu are the only revealed disciplines, but he has utilized various different techniques and methods from multiple others. Among these are various Gong fu (or Kung fu) such as Taijiquan, Wing Chun, various Shaolin arm methods which he incorporates for his shield, Chin na, and northern kicking methods, Capoeira, Muay Thai, Karate, Eskrima, and hand techniques used in Ninjutsu. While there are potential other forms which may play a role, many of them were invented after WW2 or during it when Rogers was engaging the enemy axis. His private tutors' identities are unknown, and eastern martial arts were not well recognized during the late 1930s and early 1940s; many of them were regarded as flashy, and even useless movements. Many martial arts teachers refused to teach their methods to westerners. He may have possibly learned different techniques from fighting other persons who use them. Two of his best students Bucky and Hawkeye have been seen using at least one sophisticated hand technique from Ninjutsu that was meant for sensitive points of the body, confirming that Rogers taught it to them strengthening the idea that he may have learned it after confronting Hand ninjas before America officially joined the war.
Steve Rogers incorporates every area of combat in his methods. He excels in punching, kicking, elbowing, kneeing, headbutting, hand techniques and pressure point fighting, grappling, blocking, parrying, trapping, joint locking and manipulating, restraining, disarming, ground fighting, and tricking. He is extremely fluid when fighting enabling himself to adapt to any change in the environment or the physical status of him or his opponent(s) (if they gained or lost a weapon for instance). Steve is very cunning, and creative in battle; even masters of overall combat have great difficulty predicting his next course of action, even through body language. He is able to shift from stand up combat to ground fighting, and even aerial combat due to his mastery over acrobatics. He generally uses many different techniques often seen today in modern kickboxing, wushu, and mixed martial arts. He is well known for using momentum to his advantage making it so that he could strike an opponent much harder than he could without it. He has turned his falls from being hit by an opponent into acrobatic kicks and punches by using the momentum from the assault and "flowing" with it. Tricking also plays an especially large role in his form often using many of those techniques against multiple opponents to create space and confusion, as well as aerial combat (he initially nicknamed it combat gymnastics since there was originally no official name for it). He does not generally use any other weapons than his shield, but his training in Aikido, Jujutsu, overall combat experience, and understanding of hand techniques as well as hand coordination enables him to wield all forms of weaponry with great proficiency.
He is well aware the existance of chi (Ki, or internal energy), and uses it for both combat and health reasons. Steve uses any advantage he can find against his opponents, especially superhumans. If they are physically larger than him, he would assault the larger and easier to hit pressure points. He has often defeated opponents much stronger, faster, and more durable than he. Rogers believes in limitations of both himself and his enemies as well as unpredictability. He trains routinely in simulated combat sometimes blindfolded, in dark and pitch black areas, and even in slippery and uneven terrains to the event of ever having fight in them. Steve uses any flaw he can find in terrains and objects to his advantage by assaulting them to trigger unexpected responses; he sometimes tricks his opponents into doing it for him without them knowing about it or realizing what the ending result would be.
While Steve Rogers is very serious when engaging one to multiple enemies in combat, he is not above teaching his methods to other people. He has trained only a few people in combat. Most of them are, or were at a time, Avengers. Steve only acts as a private tutor for his teammates and is not willing to train any civilians; he prefers any person to avoid any unnecessary fights. While he is an effective and highly competent teacher, he is very strict when teaching his pupils. He does not want any student with inhuman abilities to rely solely on them in midst of a battle or day-to-day activities in the event of not being able to use them, and simply because he saw them as no excuse to not know how to fight if they chose to oppose crime. Although Rogers is no pacifist, he generally does not like fighting unless it is for physical fitness or self-defense; he strongly encourages his students to abide by those principals and not abuse anything he teaches him/her. He teaches all of his students various different methods for self defense and sees to it that he/she can utilize creative and effective methods of their own that suits their strengths. Many of the techniques he teaches fall into the areas of boxing principals making it so that he/she can effectively use both standard punches and kicks, and grappling. Steve sees to it his pupils are formidable on their own; able to fend off anything from unskilled to skilled attackers and single to multiple opponents. He will only teach advanced, and even potentially lethal techniques to advanced students; most of them have great athletic and acrobatic talents which are required and do not have any superhuman abilities. "
you sir rock so hard, not as much as cap but still pretty hard
In the semi-canon (JLA/Avengers) they were on a stalemate with Bats admitting to the possibility of him being beaten by caps. The op pic is just something to be ignored.
In a real fight given say 24H of prep. Batman would destroy cap. Without it after a while he would discover his weaknesses and attack those beating cap again. People forget that even without prior knowledge batman still adapts his fight to target opponents obscure weaknesses. This is why he can beat pretty much every superhero in both omniverses
American Boxing, Judo, Aikido, and Jujutsu are the only revealed disciplines, but he has utilized various different techniques and methods from multiple others. Among these are various Gong fu (or Kung fu) such as Taijiquan, Wing Chun, various Shaolin arm methods which he incorporates for his shield, Chin na, and northern kicking methods, Capoeira, Muay Thai, Karate, Eskrima, and hand techniques used in Ninjutsu. While there are potential other forms which may play a role, many of them were invented after WW2 or during it when Rogers was engaging the enemy axis. His private tutors' identities are unknown, and eastern martial arts were not well recognized during the late 1930s and early 1940s; many of them were regarded as flashy, and even useless movements. Many martial arts teachers refused to teach their methods to westerners. He may have possibly learned different techniques from fighting other persons who use them. Two of his best students Bucky and Hawkeye have been seen using at least one sophisticated hand technique from Ninjutsu that was meant for sensitive points of the body, confirming that Rogers taught it to them strengthening the idea that he may have learned it after confronting Hand ninjas before America officially joined the war. 
Steve Rogers incorporates every area of combat in his methods. He excels in punching, kicking, elbowing, kneeing, headbutting, hand techniques and pressure point fighting, grappling, blocking, parrying, trapping, joint locking and manipulating, restraining, disarming, ground fighting, and tricking. He is extremely fluid when fighting enabling himself to adapt to any change in the environment or the physical status of him or his opponent(s) (if they gained or lost a weapon for instance). Steve is very cunning, and creative in battle; even masters of overall combat have great difficulty predicting his next course of action, even through body language. He is able to shift from stand up combat to ground fighting, and even aerial combat due to his mastery over acrobatics. 
He generally uses many different techniques often seen today in modern kickboxing, wushu, and mixed martial arts. He is well known for using momentum to his advantage making it so that he could strike an opponent much harder than he could without it. He has turned his falls from being hit by an opponent into acrobatic kicks and punches by using the momentum from the assault and "flowing" with it. Tricking also plays an especially large role in his form often using many of those techniques against multiple opponents to create space and confusion, as well as aerial combat (he initially nicknamed it combat gymnastics since there was originally no official name for it). 
He does not generally use any other weapons than his shield, but his training in Aikido, Jujutsu, overall combat experience, and understanding of hand techniques as well as hand coordination enables him to wield all forms of weaponry with great proficiency. 
He is well aware the existance of chi (Ki, or internal energy), and uses it for both combat and health reasons. Steve uses any advantage he can find against his opponents, especially superhumans. If they are physically larger than him, he would assault the larger and easier to hit pressure points. He has often defeated opponents much stronger, faster, and more durable than he. Rogers believes in limitations of both himself and his enemies as well as unpredictability. He trains routinely in simulated combat sometimes blindfolded, in dark and pitch black areas, and even in slippery and uneven terrains to the event of ever having fight in them. 
Steve uses any flaw he can find in terrains and objects to his advantage by assaulting them to trigger unexpected responses; he sometimes tricks his opponents into doing it for him without them knowing about it or realizing what the ending result would be. 
Although Rogers is no pacifist, he generally does not like fighting unless it is for physical fitness or self-defense; he strongly encourages his students to abide by those principals and not abuse anything he teaches him/her. He teaches all of his students various different methods for self defense and sees to it that he/she can utilize creative and effective methods of their own that suits their strengths. Many of the techniques he teaches fall into the areas of boxing principals making it so that he/she can effectively use both standard punches and kicks, and grappling. 
Steve sees to it his pupils are formidable on their own; able to fend off anything from unskilled to skilled attackers and single to multiple opponents. He will only teach advanced, and even potentially lethal techniques to advanced students; most of them have great athletic and acrobatic talents which are required and do not have any superhuman abilities.
Log in to comment