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#1 Edited by SangriaMuffin (30 posts) - - Show Bio

I was reading an article about how the biggest problem in making a Wonder Woman movie is that she doesn't have that great of villains, and I got to thinking how The Flash kinda has the same problem. His main villains are probably Captain Cold, Gorilla Grodd, Mirror Master, and Professor Zoom. I don't see any of them being great villains for a movie. Captain Cold is more or less a rip off of Mister Freeze. Gorilla Grodd is a gorilla with telepathic powers, I don't see that working on the big screen. Mirror Master could work but I don;t think he has the motivation to become enough of a threat. Professor Zoom seems to be the one most people seem to want but from a movie stand point I think it would be kinda lame to put him up against a villain with the exact same power. That might work for a sequel but not in the first film.

I know a Flash movie is a long ways off if it ever happens in the first place, but who do you think should be the villain if he does get a movie? Do you think one of the ones I mentioned or is there someone else out of his list of enemies that you think might work better?

#2 Posted by LaserLambert (636 posts) - - Show Bio

I was reading an article about how the biggest problem in making a Wonder Woman movie is that she doesn't have that great of villains, and I got to thinking how The Flash kinda has the same problem. His main villains are probably Captain Cold, Gorilla Grodd, Mirror Master, and Professor Zoom. I don't see any of them being great villains for a movie. Captain Cold is more or less a rip off of Mister Freeze. Gorilla Grodd is a gorilla with telepathic powers, I don't see that working on the big screen. Mirror Master could work but I don;t think he has the motivation to become enough of a threat. Professor Zoom seems to be the one most people seem to want but from a movie stand point I think it would be kinda lame to put him up against a villain with the exact same power. That might work for a sequel but not in the first film.

I know a Flash movie is a long ways off if it ever happens in the first place, but who do you think should be the villain if he does get a movie? Do you think one of the ones I mentioned or is there someone else out of his list of enemies that you think might work better?

Well, to be fair.

Iron Man 1: Iron Monger- Same Power

Captain America: Red Skull- Same Power (in this instance)

Man of Steel: General Zod- Same Power

Incredible Hulk: Abomination- Same Power

You could even argue Batman Begins with Ra's Al Ghul having the same training and all.

But I think it comes down to the costume being identical, and the backstory of the character would have to change dramatically. I don't see it happening with Zoom.

and yeah a psychic ape, no matter how they could make it, I doubt general audiences would see that as anything more than a farce.

#3 Posted by SoA (4843 posts) - - Show Bio

movie 1: rogues

movie 2: zoom

#4 Posted by Nicowyp (4 posts) - - Show Bio

According to what I researched, Captain Cold (1957) came before Mr. Freeze (1959). So the rip-off would be Mr. Freeze.

#5 Edited by The_Red_Viper (4167 posts) - - Show Bio

A Flash movie would be a disaster. There should be a JLA movie with Flash in it, but a solo movie would be horrible. I mean, you wouldn't even be able to see the main character 90% of the time.

#6 Posted by MartianManhunterIsBetterThanCyborg (2243 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain Cold

#7 Posted by Black_Claw (2997 posts) - - Show Bio

A Flash movie would be a disaster. There should be a JLA movie with Flash in it, but a solo movie would be horrible. I mean, you wouldn't even be able to see the main character 90% of the time.

Well super speed worked to an extent in Man of Steel. Then again they were more than likely moving closer to the speed of sound. And the problem with Flash is that he moves at the speed of light.

#8 Posted by ssbm (92 posts) - - Show Bio

for the first movie i think it should either be the rogues or the grodd if the rouges i think they should be there before the flash let them have control of the city and then the flash takes it back the city for grodd maybe make it so that the flash is already established but then again it would be his origin story maybe an in film time skip kind of like in the first spiderman film but more noticeable then we see grodd pretending to be a circus ape to get into the states his goal being to gain access to us nuclear weapons to bomb gorilla city i think that could work

#9 Posted by SangriaMuffin (30 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_red_viper said:

A Flash movie would be a disaster. There should be a JLA movie with Flash in it, but a solo movie would be horrible. I mean, you wouldn't even be able to see the main character 90% of the time.

Well super speed worked to an extent in Man of Steel. Then again they were more than likely moving closer to the speed of sound. And the problem with Flash is that he moves at the speed of light.

Superman also had other powers to use. The Flash's only power is superspeed. I guess he can also pass through walls and in some version travel through time but those are both extensions of his speed. I don't think it's impossible to make a good movie about the Flash but putting him up against another villain with the exact same powers just makes it even more challenging.

I'm not crazy about putting him up against the rogues either. Mostly because I find the "All the bad guys team up" story lines to be kinda silly. I haven't read much Flash but after digging though his villains I think the best one for a movie might be Cobalt Blue. I think his powers would work well for the movie and it might be a little cliche but I think putting him up against his evil twin might be a good way to match the tone the DC seems to be going for with their movies now.

#10 Posted by RulerOfThisUniverse (6350 posts) - - Show Bio
#11 Edited by Wolverine08 (42816 posts) - - Show Bio

Flash has the WORST villains of ANY top tier character. A film with his crappy villains would be prosaic.

#12 Edited by _Black (2302 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08: @sangriamuffin: Yeah both of you obviously haven't read much Flash. Flash has one of the best rogues gallery in comics in my opinion. The Rogues are another team-up of villains but they are truly a unique team.

1st movie: Captain Cold

2nd movie: Mirror Master

3rd movie: Professor Zoom or Zoom

Although a Flash movie with the entire Rogues would be nothing short of amazing.

#13 Edited by batmannflash (6224 posts) - - Show Bio

Flash is usually said to have one of the greatest rogues galleries of all time. I like Flash's villains but I think you need to increase their motivations to make it work on the big screen. The Rogues are awesome (Captain Cold, Mirror Master, Heatwave, Weather Wizard...) and could make for some cool and creative fight scenes. That's not the problem. The problem is, they don't seem threatening enough and don't have a very deep motivation. But who says you can't change that? Give them a bigger goal in order for them to be threatening.

Unfortunately, Grodd looks a little silly. With a few tweaking he could look more monstrous.

Zoom would be awesome and have that sick motivation to mess up Barry big time and ruin his life. He wouldn't have the problem of not being threatening.

As for his super speed, his fighting isn't all running...he phases through walls, creates strong winds. Super speed has been explored in other movies. He runs, punches, stops. He runs, saves people, stops. He isn't constantly running...plus you could use a little slow motion which would look sick (if not overused in the movie). At times, we could see the world from Flash's perspective where everyone else looks incredibly slow.

As long as they don't try to make it dark. Flash's movie should be similar to Marvel's. Light.

@_black: Like you said, the entire Rogues in one movie would be amazing. I don't think Captain Cold and Mirror Master should be separate. Keep the Rogues together. Captain Cold isn't much of a threat by himself, neither is Mirror Master. Keep the entire Rogues in one movie, so we can also see Weather Wizard, Heat Wave, and so on...

#14 Posted by Saren (25694 posts) - - Show Bio

Just do Thawne if you're that worried about making the villain a major threat.

Moderator
#15 Posted by danhimself (22578 posts) - - Show Bio

pfft....the Flash has one of the best Rogues Galleries in comics...they're called the Rogues!!!

the best way to do a Flash movie is just do a very very brief origin then skip a head a few years to a point where he's already beat the Rogues separately a few times and they're sick of it so a mystery figure sets them up to work together to take him down...then have the mystery figure be Thawne in the next movie

#16 Posted by Black_Claw (2997 posts) - - Show Bio

@batmannflash: Have you seen Rise of the Planet of the Apes? That movie pretty much convinced me that Grodd can indeed work in live action.

#17 Edited by batmannflash (6224 posts) - - Show Bio

@black_claw: yeah I have and I think it could work in live action. I'm just saying that a gorilla with telepathy could very easily become silly. The writers need to be extra careful with him

#18 Posted by Lone_Wolf_and_Cub (5080 posts) - - Show Bio

It'll be a flop

#19 Posted by SangriaMuffin (30 posts) - - Show Bio

I guess since they are going to introduce Flash in a Justice League movie first it is possible for them to start him off with a long list of enemies but I still don't love the idea of putting him against a team of villains. Especially in the first movie. If I had to put together a trilogy I'd do it like this:

Flash 1: Cobalt Blue & Mirror Master as a side villian

Flash 2: Professor Zoom with a subplot featuring Captain Cold, and Golden Glider

Flash 3: In the final movie you could do a rouges team up.

#20 Posted by RulerOfThisUniverse (6350 posts) - - Show Bio

The only villain that I could picture to be on screen would be Zoom. Lets just face it, the rogues are WAY too gimmicky for a movie audience. They work in a light-hearted comic book, but not a DC Cinematic Universe that we saw in Man of Steel. And a telepathic talking Gorilla leading an army of talking gorillas on a quest for world domination? No. Zoom, however, could work.

#21 Posted by TDK_1997 (14900 posts) - - Show Bio

Flash has great rogues gallery and they are called the Rogues.Each one of them can be interesting but they are their best if they are together.

#22 Edited by flameboy298 (1908 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Honestly WW and Flash would work ALOT better in a JL movie where the enemy is 10x times greater

#23 Posted by Black_Claw (2997 posts) - - Show Bio

@flameboy298: Flash yes. But I disagree about Wonder Woman, she's part of the trinity so she should be more than capable of handling her own solo film. And her strong ties to Greek Mythology gives the creators a lot to work with.

#24 Edited by Brcomicbookguy (22 posts) - - Show Bio

Maybe they could change gorilla Grodd to a Che Guevara like commando leader of the gorillas. Not as the main villain but a chance for flash to show off his powers after he gets them and save Iris. Also maybe flash and zoom can get there powers at the same time. Flash stops zoom using his powers to break the law then zoom goes about f'ing Barry's life up.

#25 Edited by SangriaMuffin (30 posts) - - Show Bio
@nicowyp said:

According to what I researched, Captain Cold (1957) came before Mr. Freeze (1959). So the rip-off would be Mr. Freeze.

Yeah I didn't bother to look that up. Mr. Freeze is still a more well known and interesting villain. Anyone who isn't well versed in Flash comics will thing that Captain Cold is a Dr. Horrible would put it a "Poser in a parka."

#26 Posted by blkson (785 posts) - - Show Bio

It'll be a flop

a huge flop. but it'll make a lot of money. just like MoS

#27 Posted by MonarchofMotion (231 posts) - - Show Bio

@black_claw: I think there would be a lot of we see a blur - cut to super super slow motion and the flash seems to still be moving very fast where everything else is still

#28 Edited by MartianManhunterIsBetterThanCyborg (2243 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

Flash has the WORST villains of ANY top tier character.

That distinction goes to Iron Man.

#29 Posted by Wolverine08 (42816 posts) - - Show Bio
#30 Edited by MartianManhunterIsBetterThanCyborg (2243 posts) - - Show Bio


@_black: Like you said, the entire Rogues in one movie would be amazing. I don't think Captain Cold and Mirror Master should be separate. Keep the Rogues together. Captain Cold isn't much of a threat by himself, neither is Mirror Master. Keep the entire Rogues in one movie, so we can also see Weather Wizard, Heat Wave, and so on...

I think Captain Cold should be in the first movie because he is one of the most well known Flash villains. Maybe you could have hints of Golden Glider because she's related to him. But after he gets defeated, the sequel could be where he gathers up the rogues.

I also wouldn't mind seeing some other obscure Flash villains revamped and turned into a bigger threat. I think Colonel Computron or The Thinker could pose a threat to the Flash.

#31 Posted by batmannflash (6224 posts) - - Show Bio

@martianmanhunterisbetterthancy: maybe. I don't think Captain Cold is powerful enough by himself. But then now that I think about it, they could use New 52 Captain Cold who actually has powers this time.

#32 Posted by Wolverine08 (42816 posts) - - Show Bio

@batmannflash:

Gosh that art is just awe inspiring. Flash fans are lucky to have such great artist on their book.

#33 Edited by batmannflash (6224 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08: yeah, pretty lucky. And I disagree, I think Flash has one of the best rogues gallery, even among top tier heroes. They're unique, fun, and work very well as a team like Spider-Man's villains. They have reformed villains like the Pied Piper and the Trickster. They are all very different in terms of powers/abilities: Captain Cold, Heatwave, Golden Glider, The Trickster, Pied Piper, Gorilla Grodd, Zoom, Mirror Master, and Captain Boomerang, unlike Iron Man's or Hulk's rogues. Stark's villains are usually armored/technology villains (except the Mandarin, which is why he's the best Iron Man foe). Hulk's villains are usually bruisers and have something to do with gamma radiation. Green Lantern's villains usually have some sort of ring (Sinestro Corps, Black Lanterns, Red Lanterns), except for like Anti-Monitor and Mongul. Not saying that IM, Hulk, or GL have bad villains (I like their villains), I'm saying that's why I think Spidey and Flash have great villains and that's what brings them above the other rogues galleries. Because they're all so different.

#34 Posted by Bezza (3679 posts) - - Show Bio

I've always wanted a Flash movie and don't see how his opponents are any cornier than some of Batman's. I have the Flash "Showcase presents" number 2 at home and its by far my favourite of the 4 "showcase presents" I have which cover the silver age Flash era. Captain Cold is certainly no cornier than Mr Freeze and he is a great character. What about the mirror master? He was wicked!

#35 Edited by SangriaMuffin (30 posts) - - Show Bio

I think most of his Golden/Silver age villains are pretty cheesy and campy. That's true of most villains from that time though. The difference is a lot of his villains still seem as campy as they were then. I'm sure it works great for Flash's comics but I'm not sure how great it would work on the big screen. I still think the best villain for a Flash 1 movie is Cobalt Blue. Since Professor Zoom is actually descendant of him it would actually be a good lead up to a sequel too.

Also yay 25th post!

#36 Edited by MonarchofMotion (231 posts) - - Show Bio

I think it would really work if they used the Rogues, but start off with them as bank robbers who just get foiled by the Flash when he starts out, and then they get their powers bonded to them, like in the New 52 - then now with their augmented powers, they try to get their own back on the Flash and then it plays out where they pull him into a mirror world where they have the upper hand and mess with his mind and then it plays out kinda like Flash Wonderland

But use Barry and have it so he's still got his powers but in there The rogues control everything and really get in his mind, then the whole thing can lead to the reverse flash, like the new 52

#37 Posted by PCN24454 (454 posts) - - Show Bio

What makes an adaptation an adaptation is the fact that you can modify characters to work with the plot, like the Lizard in the Amazing Spider-man movie. The only problem is most fans will cry over every single change that's made to movie and make mountains out of molehills.

#38 Posted by MartianManhunterIsBetterThanCyborg (2243 posts) - - Show Bio

@pcn24454 said:

What makes an adaptation an adaptation is the fact that you can modify characters to work with the plot, like the Lizard in the Amazing Spider-man movie. The only problem is most fans will cry over every single change that's made to movie and make mountains out of molehills.

Though that can be an advantage sometimes. If the character isn't as well known, things can be changed without upsetting to many people. Marvel's heroes like Iron Man and Thor definitely utilized this tactics before they hit the big screen.

#39 Posted by ULTRAstarkiller (6206 posts) - - Show Bio

Vandel Savage

#40 Posted by PCN24454 (454 posts) - - Show Bio

@pcn24454 said:

What makes an adaptation an adaptation is the fact that you can modify characters to work with the plot, like the Lizard in the Amazing Spider-man movie. The only problem is most fans will cry over every single change that's made to movie and make mountains out of molehills.

Though that can be an advantage sometimes. If the character isn't as well known, things can be changed without upsetting to many people. Marvel's heroes like Iron Man and Thor definitely utilized this tactics before they hit the big screen.

When I think about it, that's half the reason why John Stewart from Justice League was so popular. He had little actually prior significance.

#41 Edited by sinestro_GL (3175 posts) - - Show Bio

Mirror Master would be awesome on the big screen!

Imagine using all the special effects.

#42 Edited by w0nd (3524 posts) - - Show Bio

@sangriamuffin said:
@black_claw said:

@the_red_viper said:

A Flash movie would be a disaster. There should be a JLA movie with Flash in it, but a solo movie would be horrible. I mean, you wouldn't even be able to see the main character 90% of the time.

Well super speed worked to an extent in Man of Steel. Then again they were more than likely moving closer to the speed of sound. And the problem with Flash is that he moves at the speed of light.

Superman also had other powers to use. The Flash's only power is superspeed. I guess he can also pass through walls and in some version travel through time but those are both extensions of his speed. I don't think it's impossible to make a good movie about the Flash but putting him up against another villain with the exact same powers just makes it even more challenging.

I'm not crazy about putting him up against the rogues either. Mostly because I find the "All the bad guys team up" story lines to be kinda silly. I haven't read much Flash but after digging though his villains I think the best one for a movie might be Cobalt Blue. I think his powers would work well for the movie and it might be a little cliche but I think putting him up against his evil twin might be a good way to match the tone the DC seems to be going for with their movies now.

the stuff he's done with his speed in the new 52 he should be invincible by all means he has been able to take on kryptonians, heck anyone who can shove superman through a brick wall gets points by me.

anyways for the first film their powers should be similar, or the antagonist should be able to negate the heroes powers

#43 Edited by Pokeysteve (8330 posts) - - Show Bio

Reverse Flash would be great but really with an origin story there wouldn't be anyone better than Savitar.

@blkson said:

@lone_wolf_and_cub said:

It'll be a flop

a huge flop. but it'll make a lot of money. just like MoS

Flops are movies that DON'T make money. Man of Steel is in the $600 million area. It was a flop four hundred million dollars ago.

#44 Edited by anthonygiu (65 posts) - - Show Bio

If I had to think of one....

Grodd with cameos from the Rogues.

Establish 30 minutes as an origin story and build Barry Allen (or Wally or whoever). Give him 10-15 minutes of developing his powers slowly but the same time establish Grodd.

As long as they make the Villian as big as the Hero then the movie will be fine. The Dark Knight Trilogy was good because they established the villian as much as the hero. Man of Steel somewhat did that.

I would put Mirror Master as villian 2 (if they did a trilogy) and Reverse Flash for #3

#45 Posted by SangriaMuffin (30 posts) - - Show Bio

@w0nd:

@w0nd said:

the stuff he's done with his speed in the new 52 he should be invincible by all means he has been able to take on kryptonians, heck anyone who can shove superman through a brick wall gets points by me.

anyways for the first film their powers should be similar, or the antagonist should be able to negate the heroes powers

I still feel like they shouldn't put him up against a villain with the same powers for the first movie. With some heros you can get away with it, but even if he can do a verity of things with it super speed is a very specific power.

And yeah of course who ever he is fighting should have some way of negating his power. I'm pretty sure most his villains can do this though. I mean otherwise they'd make pretty crappy Flash villains wouldn't they? Some of them might use a bit more fuzzy comic book logic to do it though. I've said it before but I think Cobalt Blue might be the best villain to use. One of his abilities is power absorption so that's a great way to negate Flash's speed.

I haven't hear anyone say why he wouldn't work yet. I know the character wasn't created till the 90's so he defiantly isn't gold or silver age. Being Barry Allen's twin brother I wouldn't think he would be considered that obscure. Like I said though I haven't read many Flash comics. On paper he sounds like the coolest Flash villain but does he not actually come across that way in the comics?

#46 Posted by MartianManhunterIsBetterThanCyborg (2243 posts) - - Show Bio

@w0nd:

@w0nd said:

the stuff he's done with his speed in the new 52 he should be invincible by all means he has been able to take on kryptonians, heck anyone who can shove superman through a brick wall gets points by me.

anyways for the first film their powers should be similar, or the antagonist should be able to negate the heroes powers

I still feel like they shouldn't put him up against a villain with the same powers for the first movie. With some heros you can get away with it, but even if he can do a verity of things with it super speed is a very specific power.

And yeah of course who ever he is fighting should have some way of negating his power. I'm pretty sure most his villains can do this though. I mean otherwise they'd make pretty crappy Flash villains wouldn't they? Some of them might use a bit more fuzzy comic book logic to do it though. I've said it before but I think Cobalt Blue might be the best villain to use. One of his abilities is power absorption so that's a great way to negate Flash's speed.

I haven't hear anyone say why he wouldn't work yet. I know the character wasn't created till the 90's so he defiantly isn't gold or silver age. Being Barry Allen's twin brother I wouldn't think he would be considered that obscure. Like I said though I haven't read many Flash comics. On paper he sounds like the coolest Flash villain but does he not actually come across that way in the comics?

IDK Cobalt Blue is kind of an obscure character. Also his relation to Barry is kinda confusing.

#47 Posted by Knightfall225 (1995 posts) - - Show Bio

All of his villains are pretty lame now that I think about it

#48 Posted by Xalidin8 (74 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain Cold

#49 Posted by w0nd (3524 posts) - - Show Bio

@w0nd:

@w0nd said:

the stuff he's done with his speed in the new 52 he should be invincible by all means he has been able to take on kryptonians, heck anyone who can shove superman through a brick wall gets points by me.

anyways for the first film their powers should be similar, or the antagonist should be able to negate the heroes powers

I still feel like they shouldn't put him up against a villain with the same powers for the first movie. With some heros you can get away with it, but even if he can do a verity of things with it super speed is a very specific power.

And yeah of course who ever he is fighting should have some way of negating his power. I'm pretty sure most his villains can do this though. I mean otherwise they'd make pretty crappy Flash villains wouldn't they? Some of them might use a bit more fuzzy comic book logic to do it though. I've said it before but I think Cobalt Blue might be the best villain to use. One of his abilities is power absorption so that's a great way to negate Flash's speed.

I haven't hear anyone say why he wouldn't work yet. I know the character wasn't created till the 90's so he defiantly isn't gold or silver age. Being Barry Allen's twin brother I wouldn't think he would be considered that obscure. Like I said though I haven't read many Flash comics. On paper he sounds like the coolest Flash villain but does he not actually come across that way in the comics?

captain boomerang and mirror master are useless in my oppinion

#50 Posted by MartianManhunterIsBetterThanCyborg (2243 posts) - - Show Bio

@knightfall225: The New 52 have made them into threats as they no longer need their guns.