Posted by ccraft (5491 posts) 1 year, 1 month ago

Poll: Does DC have a better understanding of the future of their company than the fans? (78 votes)

Yes 41%
No 59%

What do you think?

#1 Edited by ArturoCalaKayVee (12232 posts) - - Show Bio

DC doesn't have any understanding of anything lately.

#2 Posted by PeppeyHare (4310 posts) - - Show Bio
#3 Posted by Marionettegeist (1912 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Posted by The_Lunact_And_Manic (3286 posts) - - Show Bio
#5 Posted by KnightRise (4785 posts) - - Show Bio
#6 Edited by turel_hash_ak_gik (350 posts) - - Show Bio

1 look at their moves in the last 2 years should answer this painfully obvious question. painfully.

#7 Posted by ccraft (5491 posts) - - Show Bio

Maybe not lately, but nonetheless, I think DC knows what their doing.

Hopefully another more "wordy" viner will come along agree :)

#8 Posted by Wolverine08 (45006 posts) - - Show Bio
#9 Posted by NorrinBoltagonPrime21 (6280 posts) - - Show Bio

I would assume so......

#10 Posted by ULTRAstarkiller (6285 posts) - - Show Bio
#11 Posted by ShadowSwordmaster (16007 posts) - - Show Bio

Maybe but a lot people hate there decisions lately .

#12 Edited by MonsterStomp (19852 posts) - - Show Bio
#13 Edited by sagejonathan (2011 posts) - - Show Bio

I think they know what's going on, they just like to make poor decisions.

#14 Posted by cameron83 (7614 posts) - - Show Bio
#15 Posted by mightyrearranger (1724 posts) - - Show Bio

No, I don't think any single company does. The fan determines, to the greatest degree, what future that company has. It's the company's best interest to interpret the fan's action any way they see fit.

Personally, I think that some of DC's interpretations have been flawed, while others have been accurate assessments. But in the end, nobody can understand you better than yourself, and we the buying fanbase are the future of any company.

#16 Posted by kgb725 (6440 posts) - - Show Bio

I would hope so

#17 Posted by danhimself (22682 posts) - - Show Bio

no and they haven't had any kind of plan for a while now....it's easy to see that they went into the reboot absolutely blind seeing as there's already been retcons

#18 Edited by Marionettegeist (1912 posts) - - Show Bio

I think they know what's going on, they just like to make poor decisions.

You know you're probably right. I wouldn't doubt it if I was told their was a giant plaque above Dan Didio's office door that reads:

"Any Publicity, is Good Publicity!".

#19 Edited by Tyrus (1120 posts) - - Show Bio

Movie-wise no.

WB/DC were messing with us when they said they had 12 movies planned out for the future. Even if they were telling the truth, they basically mean't that they had 12 more Superman/Batman movies planned out.

#20 Edited by Marionettegeist (1912 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyrus said:

Movie-wise no.

WB/DC were messing with us when they said they had 12 movies planned out for the future. Even if they were telling the truth, they basically mean't that they had 12 more Superman/Batman movies planned out.

They said they had 12 movies planned and a lot of them are going to be DC films, not all 12.

#21 Posted by WIshIWasSuperman (1351 posts) - - Show Bio

I think they know more than they are given credit for, but it also depends on what you mean. The future of their company in terms of popularity? In terms of generating revenue? Are you suggesting they will go out of business?

Considering they have been around in effect since the beginning of the super hero genre, I doubt they're going anywhere, anytime soon. Cinematically - they may be smarter than people realise. Marvel could be seen as flooding the market with CBM's and thus not only creating the CBM bubble - but bursting it as well. By 2015 people may be sick and tired of CBM's. If they are - will Age of Ultron do as well as expected (or Ant -Man even)? Will MoS2 for that matter? If not 2015 within a year or two after we may be facing a different world CBM wise, with some pretty scarce output (or at least "quality" output).

In terms of comics - they're doing just fine sales wise - they could use a few more titles in the top 30 or so sales wise, but over-all I'd say they're happy with their performance. Sure there's some continuity issues within only 2 years - that's bad editorial work IMO. But they'll recover and in the grand scheme it won't matter.

Animated universe - I think they know what they're doing here better than anyone - including Marvel (which is weird considering Disney should be making that area a whole lot better).

TV shows - they're going to have 3 TV shows compared to 1 from Marvel.... again I'd say they might have their heads screwed on correctly here too. Only time will tell though.

#22 Posted by sagejonathan (2011 posts) - - Show Bio

In all fairness, I don't like the way Marvel is doing things either.

#23 Posted by Girth (1041 posts) - - Show Bio

I think that their comics are great. Their movies are questionable. Recently, the Dark Knight trilogy was great & Man of Steel was awesome, but other movies like Green Lantern were disasters. Like any company they have their hits and misses.

#24 Posted by AllStarSuperman (22698 posts) - - Show Bio

I think they know more than they are given credit for, but it also depends on what you mean. The future of their company in terms of popularity? In terms of generating revenue? Are you suggesting they will go out of business?

Considering they have been around in effect since the beginning of the super hero genre, I doubt they're going anywhere, anytime soon. Cinematically - they may be smarter than people realise. Marvel could be seen as flooding the market with CBM's and thus not only creating the CBM bubble - but bursting it as well. By 2015 people may be sick and tired of CBM's. If they are - will Age of Ultron do as well as expected (or Ant -Man even)? Will MoS2 for that matter? If not 2015 within a year or two after we may be facing a different world CBM wise, with some pretty scarce output (or at least "quality" output).

CBM will be around for a while. the 1950s-1970s were buttloaded with westerns. i say the same is gonna happen for CBM's

#25 Posted by CheeseSticks (2565 posts) - - Show Bio
#26 Posted by longbowhunter (7468 posts) - - Show Bio

It's easy to be on the outside looking in and say how to steer the ship. Everyone thinks they know best. It's never quite that simple...except in this instance.

#27 Posted by RulerOfThisUniverse (6364 posts) - - Show Bio

And you ask this question to fans? You know you were going to get a totally biased answer from the start, right?

#28 Edited by WIshIWasSuperman (1351 posts) - - Show Bio

@allstarsuperman: true, but the consumer public is very different today. I'm not saying we will not have CBM's but I'm not convinced the quality or even the earnings can be maintained. There's an expectation that Age of Ultron will exceed the Avengers for example, but by then people may genuinely be sick and tired of this stuff or the characters. I'm not saying it will happen, just that it's possible. Everything comes to an end and no good thing can last forever so to speak.

#29 Posted by ccraft (5491 posts) - - Show Bio

@wishiwassuperman: I agree with ya, I like your answers the best so far.

DC lost some good writers and people were upset with it, but the writers they replaced were also good changes. Like with Greg Pak on Action comics and Venditti on Green Lantern, but that's just my opinion.

As far as tv shows; games; live action and animated movies goes they've been great at it.

#30 Posted by THORSON (2511 posts) - - Show Bio

all they care about is giving us another batman movie. while cyborg, wonderwomen, martianmanhunter, flash sits on the shelf collecting dust.

#31 Posted by MatteoPG (1927 posts) - - Show Bio

They are people whose job is making money. Despite some relatively unpopular decisions, they are still making money, so they do know best.

#32 Posted by Lvenger (21066 posts) - - Show Bio

They need fans to have a future. Annoy the fans enough and the fans can act by taking away the thing the company values most, money and revenue along with popularity and status. It's already happened to some degree with DC already and if they don't buck their ideas up, the fans will take notice of this.

#33 Edited by Dud317 (297 posts) - - Show Bio

@ccraft: the question you asked is not the one everyone is answering. Most everyone responding appears to think DC is "out to get" their beloved characters, as if some malicious intent were implied. That's obviously not the case considering DC's overall success. No matter what people may think, it's not in their best interest to alienate fans, whereas they contend with the same matters as everyone else. These being challenging ones in that keeping a familiar product fresh, while loyal, yet not intimidating to new consumers.

Anyone that thinks they don't care about what fans think should read the Superman book bye Larry Tye that Gman has been plugging. That clearly illustrates a history of indifference in an era that laid the foundation for the characters we know and love. Passionate as we may be, fans have a bias. We assume no risk but expect all reward. Let's not forget that many of DC's staff are fans, adding to a legacy that doesn't have an end.

Look at it this way. Could you imagine Walter White stories for 70 more years without having to change?

#34 Edited by sinestro_GL (3282 posts) - - Show Bio

Of course they do.

We as readers will obviously have some concerns over the direction that the company chooses, but they do their best.

#35 Posted by Fallschirmjager (18745 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm going to play devils advocate here and say something most people aren't going to want to hear.

Just because you're a fan of something, does not automatically make you an expert of it.

I think its a bit arrogant for anyone to say they could run a company better than its current leadership. 99% of us fans don't have even the slightest requirements to do so. Even if you did, anonymity on the internet means you could be the smartest dude alive or the dumbest.

There I said it. I read comics and enjoy them a lot too. But I don't pretend to know how to run a company that has been around for several times my lifespan. Would I like to see more movies from DC? Absolutely. But thats my only real problem as of right now. I've enjoyed the New 52 thus far, I've enjoy EVERY animated film DC has produced since I-can't-remember-when and I loved Smallville and Arrow and will definitely be (at least) checking out Gotham PD and Constantine.

#36 Edited by Lvenger (21066 posts) - - Show Bio

@dud317 said:

@ccraft: the question you asked is not the one everyone is answering. Most everyone responding appears to think DC is "out to get" their beloved characters, as if some malicious intent were implied. That's obviously not the case considering DC's overall success. No matter what people may think, it's not in their best interest to alienate fans, whereas they contend with the same matters as everyone else. These being challenging ones in that keeping a familiar product fresh, while loyal, yet not intimidating to new consumers.

Anyone that thinks they don't care about what fans think should read the Superman book bye Larry Tye that Gman has been plugging. That clearly illustrates a history of indifference in an era that laid the foundation for the characters we know and love. Passionate as we may be, fans have a bias. We assume no risk but expect all reward. Let's not forget that many of DC's staff are fans, adding to a legacy that doesn't have an end.

Look at it this way. Could you imagine Walter White stories for 70 more years without having to change?

A very interesting point about the New 52. I hadn't thought about things in this way before despite not being zealously opposed to the New 52.

#37 Posted by SupBatz (1813 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not going to say that I would do a better job. But one thing that I know for certain is that DC does not have enough respect for its characters and its history. I'm sure that there are some fans who would do a better job handling characters in a way that would appeal to people. If one thing is certain, it is that DC is pissing a lot of fans off lately.

#38 Edited by Sinisteri (550 posts) - - Show Bio

I think one of the best points so far is that DC staff are fans... of the 90s, flashy covers, vague interpretations, re-hashing previously well done stories and demolishing unique qualities(Titans lost family connections, mythical characters made of clay and golden age legacies).

It is important to note that DC has been successful for decades, but please do not mistake past success for current success. That false assessment means a company with a strong past is always successful-- Montgomery Wards(Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer outlived its creator), Pan Am, Hostess baked goods... New leaders can come along and decrease value or completely tank something that was once thought unsinkable.

No, these guys do not know what they are doing beyond gimmicks and successfully running off writers before products are even finished(also not a positive sign of solid vision).

#39 Posted by Omnicrono (2003 posts) - - Show Bio

I think they know what's going on, they just like to make poor decisions.

#40 Posted by CrazyScarecrow (1573 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: Plus the fans will one day become the creator writing and drawing the characters in the future. Expanding the DC Universe and producing new books featuring them.

#41 Posted by muhabba (301 posts) - - Show Bio

Personally I think they should scrape Man of Steel and just have Smallville build up to becoming their Cinematic Universe.

#42 Posted by Lvenger (21066 posts) - - Show Bio

@crazyscarecrow: Indeed, some of the fans reading comics today may intend to become the next gen of creators themselves. Gotta set a good example for them.

#43 Edited by Outside_85 (9901 posts) - - Show Bio

Not by the looks of it. Their editors still seem prone to suddenly change their minds and force writers to take books in new directions there is no time to properly plan for.

Online
#44 Posted by Blackdog2009 (1873 posts) - - Show Bio

I hope so

#45 Posted by Rouflex (19532 posts) - - Show Bio
#46 Edited by Wyrmdog (39 posts) - - Show Bio

Well, the question is vague, so it's no surprise the answers are all over the map. Additionally, most of us have to answer within our biases as we have little or no actual understanding of what's going on behind closed doors, what's the result of actual decree and what is just botched execution. Sure there are elements we can point to and say, "That was vetted and I hate that." But that just illustrates our own biases.

That said, I think their animated films are the best in the superhero business. They demolish anything by Marvel in my opinion. If will brook no argument here. If you disagree you are wrong (I kid, I kid!). Their animated series are likewise better than Marvel's taken in aggregate. They seem able to manage character and visual spectacle in a far more satisfying equation IMHO (thought I must admit to not having seen everything and I may change my mind as I do). Their live-action films seem to be far less under their control than the Marvel stable, but they do seem to have fewer studios with their hands in the pot and that could be a strength. Additionally, while Arrow still isn't a great show, it gets steadily better and is eminently more watchable than MAOS, and that kinda breaks my heart. That's a whole other topic, though.

My biggest gripe is less the New 52 and what it's done to longtime characters and more the way they've let so many of their acquisitions wither, Wildstorm in particular. Say what you will about Wildstorm properties being hollow reflections of DC and Marvel, or of Wildstorm books not being good enough to maintain sales, but I believe (revealing my bias) that they just didn't put as much effort into them as they put into their own longtime originals. Given the widely varied reception of that, it's no surprise that Wildstorm has been given the short-shrift.

As with all fans, I have my own ideas about what would be awesome and amazing and inspiring, but I'm sure the DC execs and creatives thought that about the decisions they made that led us to where we are with DC now. I can only speculate and dream. They got to give it a go. Some of it worked and some didn't and that's to be expected.

So yeah, I think that DC does have a better understanding, a better grasp than we do. But like us, it's filtered through a specific lens (profitability being a big part of it, surely), one they do not share with us, even if it is staffed largely by fans. Every fan has a different reason for being a fan. Each of us could probably argue long and hard about what makes a given character what he or she is and each of us would be right in our own way. Sure some of us have thought it through more and probably have more coherent arguments but I'm willing to bet that's where DC is coming from too: looking back over their history and seeing how each character in their stable has changed over time, sometimes rather dramatically. They simply see that these characters and properties are mutable things that can be molded to fit different eras and different demands, and...holy crap I'm rambling.

Oh, one last thing: Wildstorm isn't really my biggest gripe with modern DC live-action, just their printed comics (though I do wish they'd do an animated series of something from that setting). What bothers me most about DC's live-action properties is their utter lack of attention to what is inarguably the most recognizable female superhero of all time: Wonder Woman. Sure we may all have different favorites, but in the end, no other female superhero has the same cachet she does. Yet they let her collect dust, play second-fiddle to the boys, and step back so they can yet again, produce another Batman movie. So that thing I can't quite figure out. Though I'm hopeful it's just that they want to do her right SO BADLY they are waiting on the perfect creative team to do it, the perfect script and incarnation. But I'm also cynical enough to believe that it's less that and more that they don't think she'll sell to the boys. Even Marvel has this issue, but in their defense, they don't have a signature stand-alone female hero even remotely as recognizable as Wonder Woman. Most of the best and most recognizable female Marvel characters have their identity tied to their team affiliations.

Sorry for all that. Just my rambling $0.02.