Why do you love/hate Damian Wayne?

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InsaneArtisticNerd

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@darkman61288 said:

I like the idea of Batman having a child but I would prefer a daughter than a son on the grounds that a father/daughter relationship would have more depth.

He did adopt a girl before the n52, but there's no sign that she exists anymore =(

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Nathaniel_Christopher

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@Decoy Elite said:

I'm not sure how I feel about Damian, mostly because I haven't read a lot of stuff with him in it. The concept behind the character is interesting, but I didn't really get pulled in to the early stuff with him. Haven't read Batman and Robin, but it looks like character development hit pretty well and the character seems to have grown pretty well. He at the very least has some very good moments for better or worse.

Definitely suggest you read him in Batman and Son (1st appearance) and then Batman and Robin and everything after to see just how hard the development did hit.

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BATMAN9797

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I hate him because he is a whiny brat

ex: "I was trained by the league of assasins", "your not his real son",etc.

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BatWatch

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#54  Edited By BatWatch

I love Damian because he stands out from the crowd. He is a foil to everyone who interacts with him. He's an amazing fighter. He's got some awesome comebacks. He opens a lot of doors for the Bat Family as a son to Bruce and Dick and an annoying and psychotic little brother for Red Robin.

@darkman61288 said:

I like the idea of Batman having a child but I would prefer a daughter than a son on the grounds that a father/daughter relationship would have more depth.

He did adopt a girl before the n52, but there's no sign that she exists anymore =(

Yeah, Cass was adopted a couple of years before the reboot, but she was so independent of the family at that time that it really didn't have too much emotional weight.

@Decoy Elite said:

I'm not sure how I feel about Damian, mostly because I haven't read a lot of stuff with him in it. The concept behind the character is interesting, but I didn't really get pulled in to the early stuff with him. Haven't read Batman and Robin, but it looks like character development hit pretty well and the character seems to have grown pretty well. He at the very least has some very good moments for better or worse.

Definitely suggest you read him in Batman and Son (1st appearance) and then Batman and Robin and everything after to see just how hard the development did hit.

I concur. You get his starting point as a brat in Batman and Son, and then some development in Resurrection of Ra's Al Ghul, (though not a great story in the grand scheme), and then Batman and Robin all the way. You'd have to read The Battle for the Cowl to see how he became Robin. I have not read it, but I've heard mostly bad things.

I hate him because he is a whiny brat

ex: "I was trained by the league of assasins", "your not his real son",etc.

That's not really whiny. That's spoiled, prideful and entitled.

For more news, reviews, and commentary for the entire Bat Family, check out BatWatch.net.

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Dark_Vengeance_

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I love him.

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Geoschua

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I love Damian because he was a character designed to be hated from the start, but over the years made such leaps and bounds toward positive advancement and change. I was first a Tim Drake fan and quite disliked Damian at first. But, Damian's background forced me to see things from his perspective. Once I did that, it was easier to excuse his behavior. His progression was lightning-fast because the kid was super-smart and eventually understood what was best for him. How quickly he become a working member of the Bat family (regardless of some sibling rivalry to establish his place at the top) was astounding. The short duration of his run and the quick turnaround in how I felt for the character from hate to love was what made his death so unbearable for me.

The father-son relationship is sometimes a tough one, especially if it's a working relationship. I think the writing gets to the roots of a hardened father and son relationship. Themes like tough-love, pride, respect, angst, compliment- and affection-limited, and can-do-no-wrong attitudes run rampant in Batman and Robin and Batman, Inc. I think these themes fit their roles well. They were a perfect combo. I hope we get to see the dynamic again.

Does this cover release suggest he may be on his way back??? http://www.dccomics.com/comics/batman-and-2011/batman-and-nightwing-23

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RustyRoy

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I love him, he was the coolest Robin ever, he was actually the only Robin who transformed from a Bad guy to a Good guy. I'll always remember him, and I really hope that they bring him back in a year or two.

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RustyRoy

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#58  Edited By RustyRoy

I like the idea of Batman having a child but I would prefer a daughter than a son on the grounds that a father/daughter relationship would have more depth.

Why would a father/daughter relationship have more depth than a father/son relationship? I actually find Bruce's relationship with the Boy wonders (specially Damian and Tim) better than Casandra and Helena.

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smiling4ever

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#59  Edited By smiling4ever

I used to not like him. I like him a lot now. I also like that he has bucket loads of sass and attitude.He is funny.

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KingChronicle

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I like Damian due to his Kickass take charge attitude especially since his 10. Also he has a unique personality something I thought tim drake was lacking. I enjoy watching him challenge the other robins for the top dog position. I also like his costume.

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SlayerOFEVIL

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He's snobby, arrogant, a total jerk, and I freaking love him! For starters he's the son of Bruce Wayne, the original Batman, who is also kind of dick too. Damian is just such an awesome concept for Batman's partner. You can justify having him as a sidekick, because he was raised in the art of war, and is an actual assassin. The fact that he has killed challenges Bruce in ways, no other Robin ever has. Here his only blood relative, alive has murdered someone. With a Robin so dark it requires a lighter Batman, to balance him out. At first it was Dick, but since Damian wasn't so accustomed to dealing with someone who was as big a jerk as he is. He grew to act more violent once again. Bruce in response had to lighten up a bit, and eventually he was happy he had a son. It meant he wasn't all alone, and who knows. If Grant Morrison didn't decide to be a dick head, than Bruce could have moved past his parents deaths like Nightwing has. It shows that these characters can evolve. Plus Damian's overall personality is so interesting and flexible.

At first in Batman and Son, you kind of wanted him dead immediately. He kicked the shit out of Tim Drake, and went around just being a douche to everyone. But slowly in Batman and Robin, he begins to sneak up on you, and grow on you, and before you know it, you find yourself routing for him. I actually started routing for him, in issue 3 of Batman and Robin(Morrison run). He recieves a lap dance from the batshit crazy Proffesor Pyg and his reply, speaks for the reader.

On top of that, you have the scene when he beats Joker with a crowbar which was an awesome parody of Jason Todd's own attack. Then you have him in Batgirl vol. 3 when he hangs out with Steph Brown, it was some of the best character interaction in comics and I felt myself wanting them to become a dynamic duo. Of course there was his golden partnership with Dick Grayson. Peter Tomasi's run on Batman and Robin, had Damian at his absolutely most adorable. Especially the Annual, what he did for Bruce was really sweet and heart warming. Top it off with his rivalry with the man with the plan Tim Drake, his interaction with Supergirl, and his time as a Teen Titan. And you have one badass character. The kid, wanted to be Batman and was practically already there. Then Batman Inc 8 happened and it was by far one of the greatest moments in Damian's history. He was a full fledged hero and he wasn't afraid to show it, going as far as to fight to his last breath. That's how Bruce would have done it, and that's how Damian did it. His transformation from the asshole that no one liked to my favorite comic book character was really impressive. And I honestly find myself missing him, say what you will but I teared up a little when he died in Batman Inc 8, and even more so in Batman and Robin 18, heck even Nightwing 18. I'm really gonna miss him, and hope to see him again one day, until then I'll read Batman and Robin vol. 1 -2, Batgirl vol.3, and pretty much every other story including him, he was a worthwhile character and that's why I like him. So here's to Huntress finally meeting her daddy, he could really use some family right now. And Dick Grayson would help too.

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Dayvid3

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I thought he was great. This was my first non cartoon foray into a robin, so can't compare, but I was always rooting for him to go the good path and not become a killer, but I liked the edge a lot too.

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KingDII

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He kicked Alfred

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YOU NEVER HURT ALFRED

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Klad

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Damian fan here.

I like Damian because, at the raw age of 10, he's already a better fighter than Tim, a better intellect than Jason, and more badass than Dick. His potential is limitless, compared to the other Robins.

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kasino

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I hate him. no personal growth. he pretty much killed off Tim. he is what everyone hated about jason before he was Red Hood, who was a hard nose street kid, while being an entitled brat.

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kleo_94

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#66  Edited By kleo_94

Heh, I still don't know how anyone can like this little shit. Literally, I hate this brat. He's mostly annoying, and, as said many times before, he spoiled the dynamic in Batfamily. I respect Jason, I love Dick, and I immediately grew to love Tim, but Damian, him I just can't stand. [Mentioning only Bruce's sons, to be clear.]

Sorry to say, because I know how many fans Damian has, but I just loved it that they killed him off. I was so freaking happy to see he's gone at last, I guess even too much, that now I worry DC's going to bring him back, somehow. And I dread to think that may happen one day and spoil everything all over again.

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Avenging-X-Bolt

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I dont think i could ever brig myself to like him but i dont hate him anymore. thats something i guess.

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ComicStooge

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#68  Edited By ComicStooge

@kasino said:

I hate him. no personal growth. he pretty much killed off Tim. he is what everyone hated about jason before he was Red Hood, who was a hard nose street kid, while being an entitled brat.

No personal growth? He grew more as a character in the New 52 then Tim did in his entire run as a character. Tim just morphed into a 2nd rate Batman.

A lot of Tim Drake fans have a chip on their shoulder when it comes to Damian, as they should. He's a superior character and makes Tim obsolete and quite useless outside of the Teen Titans.

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Jeremy1989

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#69  Edited By Jeremy1989

Those who still hate Damian probably haven't read his most recent appearances, where the writer's have tried to make him more human and less twerp.

In Red Robin...

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In Batman & Robin...

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Sure he's still an annoying twerp, but he's a 10 year old assassin, what do you expect?

Yeah you got a good point there. Plus, it adds to Damian character development towards Damian.

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AkshSarpanch

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I hate him so far even more than i hate Edward.

He is an unwanted character writers trying to force down our throats. His characters is annoying and unbearable. If writers trying to show him cool, they are failing hard time.

I heard New 52 is not anymore continuing on. I'm so happy i no longer had to see stupid and useless characters like Damian.

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pcris

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Incredible about "shove down our throats" given account that he has been dead for more than a year and has barely appear out of his own titles. Where Damian has been out of it in comics, Tim Drake and Jason Todd has appear too. Of course, Dick Grayson is the nº 1 in that, but with some exceptions, I prefer to forget about it. The batgirl one is for having nightmares.

The raw reality is that Tim Drake and Jason Todd has been bad writing since the beginning of New 52 and that wasn't going to change for Damian disappearing. It happened with his death, it doesn't change anything at all. Face it. You like it or not Tim Drake wasn't come back to be Robin. Duke Thomas has more possibilities.

About the films, they are trying to sell other Robin that it isn't Dick Grayson. The two first are bad, and the last one isn't something spectacular. Frankly, maybe they will come back to Dick Grayson. That it's all that where going to happen.

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Lelanka

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Yep. He's like a copy of already existing characters in Batman's world. I totally hate him. He's a little arrogant whelp, nothing more for me.
How he treats other people, how he was vicious to all Batman's allies and to Alfred... argh. We should get the same option, like with Jason Todd's end, to vote for his end. I would definitely vote for his death. This is my opinion.

I would be happier if we would get more stories only about Batman, not always Batman and Robin etc.

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dragonrampage

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DieHard200904

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#74  Edited By DieHard200904

@Lelanka said:

Yep. He's like a copy of already existing characters in Batman's world. I totally hate him. He's a little arrogant whelp, nothing more for me.

How he treats other people, how he was vicious to all Batman's allies and to Alfred... argh. We should get the same option, like with Jason Todd's end, to vote for his end. I would definitely vote for his death. This is my opinion.

I would be happier if we would get more stories only about Batman, not always Batman and Robin etc.

I don't care much about him because now it shows that by being Batman's biological child you are now more important than everyone else. I find Carrie Kelly more interesting in the Dark Knight stories.

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EverMuse

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#75  Edited By EverMuse

He's self entitled.

And he treats people like crap. Even people who don't deserve it.

But that's alright because he's 'high and mighty' Damian who was raised as an assassin.

You know Cass was raised an assassin from childhood and she's still TEN TIMES as nice as him.

He's horrible to people.

Have you seen him in Injustice?

He's arrogant and self righteous and he acts like he has a right to be the opposite of kindness when he doesn't, nobody does, and whenever any of the robins try to explain that to them - he sneers.

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sleepygirl

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#76  Edited By sleepygirl

I love Damian. I think he's inexcusably rude and I'm not going to cover his arrogance but I feel like he's developed a lot and I always look forward to seeing him develop more.

I don't think he's had it harder than any robins but (of course thanks to his nature) he's always been mistrusted since the start and few characters seem to get close enough to believe in him completely. I love that he does have friends though, even in unconventional ways of getting them and it makes me happy to see his friendship towards animals

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RedTool

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Clearly most of you haven't read much of the comics that Damian is in.

"Oh he's an asshole that just kills always."

Wrong, he started out that way.

Then had that thing good characters have which is DEVELOPMENT.

Characters with development are the better ones.

Why? Because they change, they aren't always the same, they better themselves. Being repetitive is boring, lacking in change shows no creativity. Like beating a dead horse.

He had the hardest childhoods out of all the Robins. He was trained by assassin terrorists who are even more evil than The Joker. You expected some dandy happy go lucky romeo riding upon a pink pony down a rainbow leading into a field of flowers? Batman comics are supposed to be deep and dark, his past is that. He was forced into a life he had no control over, so much so that it became a habit that he needed to be taken from his upbringing and taught that he wasn't a pawn in Ra's schemes. That he was a human being who can make his own choices and become who he chooses to be. If you want to hate people, hate Talia and Ra's. They forced that on him.

He's developed so much that he's regarded to have the most heart and care out of all the Robins, by Alfred, Dick, Tim and even Jason. They all agree that there is only one true Robin and that's Damian.

All the reasons you people spout to hate him for was him when he first started out, if anything he's the opposite now. If he ends up killing, he feels guilt and hatred for himself. Like any other of the Robins, excluding Jason Todd. Since Jason accepts killing, he isn't a loose cannon that's rebellious. He used to be, but that was what he was brainwashed into being. You just have to see it from other points of view, imagine if that were you in that situation. How alienated you would feel being a trained killer in a situation where you are supposed to save people and only rough up criminals a bit.

You people need to actually do your research rather than reading like 2 comics of his origin story and thinking "Ugh, shitty character will always be shitty."

I like all of them, not so much Jason Todd. But in Rebirth I am liking Jason.

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Jeremy1989

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#78  Edited By Jeremy1989

I hate Damian....

  • He treats people like sh*t.
  • He has a the same PIS/CIS Prep God genetics as Batman.
  • His attitude altogether.

What I love about Damian...

  • The fact that he get's his ass kicked once in a while.
  • He gets humbled
  • In rare occasions, he does help out and do good things. So I'll give him props for that.
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adrikito

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#79  Edited By adrikito

Why I love Damian?

Because despite I know and see Damian past(Pre-flashpoint begin of Damian, begin of N52 Batman-Robin)....I don´t hate Damian, I've seen enough to hate the character and.. was useless..

I can understand Tim fans hate... That fight that they had and.... I guess this fact always happen with the fans of the previous robin.. and is impossible be fan of all the characters.

Although, I appreciate that N52 made him better person and now Damian is less repellent.. Robin: Son of Batman only makes me enjoy the character and his team in the comic... I don´t see any wrong in my decision if I can enjoy him..

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RaptusNebula

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Damian is cool but if he aged along with the rest of the titans that would be better, I mean have you seen the injustice Damian Wayne that is older? he is like that freaking starter pokemon from alola but with a cool ass sword

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AssassinB

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#81  Edited By AssassinB

@redtool

And you shouldn't tell people what to like dude. Or assume they are more ignorant than you about his development as character, because in reality you don't really know how much people has or not read about Damian in the comics. I personally "hate" Damian Wayne and yes I have read many comics where he has "grown" (example Tomasi) and I still don't like him. Is like if you hate apple juice you just gonna hate it and it doesn’t matter how many times other people tells you how tasty it is, or how nutritious or whatever a thousand things they expose you to the stuff and reasons of their likes, if you don't like something you just don't and there is nothing "wrong" about it. No one is here telling people that likes Damian to hate him right?. But is ok that you like him, because the rest of us just can't stand him. :P

Now to answer the OP my reasons why I don't like Damian:

I don't like or enjoy overly dramatical, convoluted and kinda cliché father/son tough love nonsense stories in a Batman comic. To be clear, I know many people like the "soap opera" into their favorite characters and I get that, we all kind of want to relate to which is familiar to us but for me the Damian father/son dynamic has ruined the fun out of Batman.

First, it automatically ages the character, Bruce can't be mid 30's or late 20's. He has to be on his ealry or mid 40's to have a 10 or 13 year old son. That, if you take into account his early years and training before becoming Batman and his "adoption" of Dick Grayson.

Secondly the presence of a "blood son" has kind of diminished the presence of the "adoptive sons" in the Bat-family. Dick, Jason, Tim, Stephanie, Carrie have all been there to learn from Bruce, we all have easier time relating to them because they all have been "just kids" that happens to be taken under the wing of Batman. Some of the things about them are fantastical true, (Dick an acrobat, Jason a street kid, Tim a genius kid, etc.) but they still feel mostly human and we have easier time understanding and imagining what is like to be them. Also their backgrounds are more realistic.

The genetically enhanced baby trained to be assassin that can do amazing things since age 2 doesn’t. Many people still resent the "kid genius complex" fashion of the 90's. (example, Wesley Crusher/ Star Trek, Anakin Skywalker, etc.) What's the point of Batman being the hero and mentor if you have a kid beside him that can do everything he can do?

Thirdly, ( I know many will disagree) Batman is not really a father figure emotionally mature enough to be taken as a sort of role model to follow. Exposing Batman to fatherhood contradicts and complicates the core of his character foundation, which is the loss of his own parents. Batman can no longer "grieve" the same way he does his parents because Damian will push him to move on. It may look as a good thing, and I would agree, if Bruce were a real person. But he is not. Batman is a character motivated by tragedy. And to stay true to his character he has and most remain that, a tragedy character.

You can't simply change a fundamental element of a character and make them the same afterwards. Characters can evolve, but you can't take away the hearth of what makes them in the first place, because unlike real life people, there are emotional elements of a character that can't change without making them unrecognizable as they would no longer hold the candle of what created them in the first place. Batman is that character, we all want him to move on from his trauma, we all want him to see him happy, we all want him to have his own Lois Lane, etc. But Batman never and will ever be happy because that's the fundamental element of the character, he is and always will be a tragedy, no matter how many fans wish otherwise. If you make Romeo and Juliet find happiness at the end it would no longer have that fundamental element of their story and would not be otherwise remembered as one of the best stories of their time.

The loss of Bruce's family is in the core of his motivation to become this, dark, angry and obsessive man that seeks vengeance against that unfairness that happened to him, which inspired all those sidekicks and people he works with to fight crime. This is called "characterization" and is this psychological make-up of a character that makes them a recognizable, believable personality. You can't simply take away Bruce's motive to crimefigthing without changing it.

The compelling thing about the Bat-family is that Bruce has "adopted" this many people to fill that dark hole on his soul. There is a symbolism on the Robin figure as the "son" of Batman, just as there is a symbolism with Alfred being that surrogate father figure, but who will never be able to replace Thomas Wayne as Bruce's real father, see?. Damian takes away that symbolism and makes it literal which is one of the problems I have with Bruce having children. This is what happened in the recent Batman and Robin comics when Damian died, see how Batman reacted (he wanted to resurrect his son, why not his parents too? what about when Jason died?) I’m sorry folks but this is not Batman.

Damian Wayne was only an element to bring tension and unconformity to the readers, as may of the things Morrison has done. And while it doesn’t make Damian a bad character it doesn’t necessarily makes Batman stories better. I think Damian would have worked better as an alternate reality character, just like Helena Wayne from Earth 2, she is that happily ever after wishful desire of many of us, with Bruce married and with a family but still fighting crime. And yet, this daughter/father dynamic would not have worked out for long if you really think of Batman as a dark and tragic character.

The same thing is applied to Damian, he had stories that many people got interest in (Dick Grayson and Damian as Batman and Robin, the Dead of Robin, Robin Rises, Batman Inc. etc,) but after all of that is done, what’s left is this family thing that only adds this baggage of daddy and son issues or overly exhausted family drama a la Star Wars; which is getting tiring and it takes away Bruce's excuse from not moving on from his traumatic childhood.

Take Superman for example who's character is centered on an idealization of the guardian and protective father who looks invincible to us when we are kids. Now, that’s a character who makes sense he would have children, because Superman is already that idol father figure. As one the creators got inspired on his own father when they created Superman.

Superman with a wife, a child and a happy life feels natural to his character. But it can't be said the same about Batman.

Bruce is a Sherlock Holmes with an obsession and Joker is his Moriarty. The battle of brains, the tension, the crimes, the death and tragedy around them makes their stories transcend time. Now, imagine if Sherlock Holmes had children it would have ruined his character, as he would not had the same focus or obsession he is known for, as his impulses and almost zealot desire to solve crimes crowded out almost everything else from his life, including the possibility of warm and reciprocal relationships, just like Batman. And imagining Sherlock Holmes having children and trying to balance that cold and calculating personality would have made him a bad parent at best and a poorly written character at worst. The same with Batman.

I'm sorry, but gonna have to kind of agree with Joker a little bit when he tried to murder the Bat-Family in Death of the Family. :P

"The Bat-babies are making you fat and slow Bats and is killing our relationship!"

(please forgive my English if some paragraph doesn’t make much sense)

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Sinestro2828

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To me, Damian is the worst Robin ever, he's rude, he's murdered people, he's completely full of himself, he's way too OP for someone so young EVEN in a superhero universe (especially without any super powers), and he treats everyone around him like trash including those who don't deserve it, and he rarely receives any proper comeuppance for it. Essentially, Damian is all of Batman's worst attributes combined together into one insufferable package and magnified tenfold, he's like a bad fanfic character brought to life, and I wish DC would stop trying to make him the center of attention all the time, like in the Teen Titan & Batman animated films. They WANT us to like him but I for one just DON'T, its bad enough Batman is so oversaturated these days, last thing we need is his awful son trying to boss around and steal the spotlight from far better characters, like Starfire, Tim Drake, & Beastboy etc. Damian is a bad Robin, a bad Titan, and overall a bad character, and I wish he'd either be killed off or retconned out of existence.

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deactivated-5d1e792b21485

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In a future blog I will explain in further detail why I don’t like him. Batman having a kid doesn’t fit. Batman’s adopted kids have more in common with him 1). Dick Grayson is just like Bruce Wayne but if he is grounded and more human. 2). Jason Todd has Bruce Wayne‘a guts, and rage 3). Tim Drake has Bruce Wayne’s intelligence. I buy his adopted kids are actually his kids. Grant Morrison‘s terrible fan fiction. Just like Superman marrying Wonder Woman. Bruce already has Jason Todd. Think of Damian if Jason Todd had nothing positive. Batman kicked Red Hood out, and nearly beat him to a inch of his life. While Damian goes on a murder spree. Batman has double standards.

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GarfieldLogan0

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@hi_i_m_new: , I agree with you that after Tim Drake was introduced DC should have stopped after Tim Drake became Robin/Red Robin, and both Helena Wayne and Terry McGinnis are better biological children of Batman than Damian i.