First Look: SUPERMAN #13 by Lobdell and Rocafort

im thinking of getting this just beacuse of K-rocs art. man that guy is amazing. makes me wanna read my old cyberforce comics

Just when I thought I was finally gaining interest in Superman... seriously? He's been benching 6 sextillion metric tons for 5 days straight? What? What? WHAT?!

aaaand I'm done with Superman before I even began. Why does anyone, hero or villain, need to be that freaking powerful? I just... can't even. There's suspension of disbelief and then there's just pure lunacy.

I've never been a fan of Superman being able to move/lift planetary weights and wish Lobdell would've used something else large and ridiculously weighty instead of the earth. But that's a minor complaint. This is the kind of stuff I want to see from Superman.

Beautiful artwork.

art is fantastic, wouldve preffered the douchebag from star labs from the animated series

Wow it looks fantastic

Good art.

NIce, Art is awesome I love it

this is like All-star with bad dialogue, art is still good, in a different way.

now that the bar is set so high for his powers this guy better not miss the vault, if somebody whispers something within a mile of Superman he needs to hear it, if he suddenly is slower than we see here, it's fucked.

also did he say shave? and to shower you kinda need more than six seconds, you know, if you are waiting for water to actually come out of the nozzle. unless he has a COSMIC SHOWER HEAD.

and really, if superman is moving faster than light like that, without a "speed-force" to explain why he generates no friction, he should really destroy his apartment(and worse) by moving that fast in it. reasons like this I prefer a more restrained Superman.

in regards to his power levels,i hear a lot of ppl saying its like all star superman,but what about smallville superman,he pushed a planet. 
does this mean superman now is superior to other heroes like superboy prime was pre52? and does this mean future battle boards fights with wally west and martian manhunter will be no brainers? 
is Shazam supposed to be supermans strenght equal,so is he gonna be able to do the same? 
if kara is kryptonian,and superman can do this,does that mean kara can too? is kara gonna be considered stronger than wonder woman without a doubt now? 
if superboy is only a third kryptonian and a kryptonian can do this does that mean at full 1/3 rd power he would be as powerful as superman "used" to look like before this insanely awesome power upgrade? 
at thus power level i definetlay see a reason to keep kryptonite around. 
i cant wait

This is what i am talking about . Powerful as hell and having the enemies who can still knock him around like paper. Now i know the Marvel fans of Thor ,surfer, hulk ,juggernaut and gladiator will be hating this all day. The fact of the matter is this over the years they have weakened him. Now it is time to give him a fraction of his power back then. My only concern that with this level of power most of the battles can't happen in the city. Now his control and holding back will surely be place in effect here. Again i do like the into of him been that powerful and what he is capable without the power of the sun for few days at continuous motions. YES its about time. Now back the battle threads :)

How could i forget his speed 6 seconds :)

i prefer supes this powerful, it what makes him supes. If he not one of the most powerful DC heroes then hes just another hero.. not SUPERMAN.

@Lvenger said:

Ah man if I knew you were gonna post these scans I wouldn't have made a similar thread. Ah well these are still awesome scans all the same. Lobdell is earning my trust on Superman, as it should be after his poor Teen Titans, Superboy and RHATO run.

I've been enjoying RHATO, but Teen Titans has been terrible and Superboy... well, I guess I didn't read enough of it to judge, really. So Lobdell is pretty much 50/50 at the moment... I'm still not totally convinced he's a capable Superman writer. Nothing he's done so far has stuck out to me as particularly bad, but I haven't loved it either.

That art...is gorgeous! Red Hoods loss is Supermans gain in this case, i know ill probably get Hell for this but i actually prefer this style to Jim Lees, it seems more alive some how and less static.

I'm disappointed by the power level shown. Honestly, I really don't understand why DC wants to give Superman that much power. To say something like that and then show him actually need to be part of a team or get knocked around by Hellspont (may have mispelled that) is just too inconsistent for me. If he can hold the planet up for five days straight without sunlight to replenish him then we should never see a story with him getting knocked around or in trouble.

Would it really be so bad if he could only lift 200 tons or so? As long as other big league hitters (like Darkseid or Hellspont) were at that same level than it would still make Superman one of the most powerful beings in the universe and certainly still the most powerful hero. The idea of throwing moons or benching the Earth is just too excessive and leads to crap, inconsistent storytelling.

On another note.....has anyone figured out this suit yet? Does he always have the S-shield on his chest? Does it come from a tattooe/grafted seal on his right shoulder like Superboy has? The aspects of the suit keeping changing (like how in issue 11 the shield was on a white t-shirt and the suit spread out from it yet in Action Comics he seems to need to change into it). Just wondering how exactly the thing is stored/compressed when not in use.

Pass. I'm waiting for Man of Steel.

TEAM SNYDER~!

This is brilliant. Lobdell continues to impress. And Rocafort... holy hell... Supes is back on top of the game - where he belongs. Absolutely stoked! Lobdell&Rocafort are a great team, hoping they continue to deliver. I want K.Rocafort forever on Supes though.

man this is the superman comic that needs to be Lobdell knows what hes doing fuck the haters

@Ravager4: Well him being that powerful isn't a problem, Thor is capable of the same feats and no one complains, and its because Thor has sufficient challenges and villians, while superman had only a handful (Darkseid, Lex Luther, Braniac, Zod, and Doomsday) DC had to nerf him several times throughout the years and give him more weaknesses in order to give him sufficient challenges. Now Superman is facing Helspont, who back-hands Superman into the and the new kryptonian H'el who is said to be even stronger and smarter than Superman. Just give it a chance.

I really like the scars on his back, adds character :)

@Nheritor: problem is, nobody needs to be that stupidly strong. At all. There's no reason to make Superman lift planets (and that's not even the limits of his strength, as indicated there. So really, he can lift far more than the planet... that's just utterly ridiculous), whether or not you keep throwing villains at him that are even stronger. I'll never understand the need to make a hero that strong... and it leads to inconsistencies between titles. Aside from upper level super villains like Darkseid, Helspont, etc. (which are apparently even stronger than that, which is further ridiculous... seriously, couldn't they just punch the ground and split the earth apart if they're that powerful?), Superman, if he's that strong, should be able to stop anyone by himself in about two seconds. All he has to do is hold the person down with his pinky, or tap them and knock them out. You can create the same engaging stories with the same kinds of challenges without needing to make your hero bench planets... I mean that even sounds ridiculous, even for a comic book.

I don't want to read about someone that strong. I just don't. It completely takes me out of the story, and ruins my interest in it. I mean, according to this, there is nothing on the planet that Superman can't lift.... nothing. He could rip up a mountain and use it as a baseball bat. Not that they'd ever write him doing that, but just knowing that he could do that if he wanted to is extremely distracting to me... I'm not interested.

I love rocafort on superman...but the lines are a little iffy,but this is only a sneak peek,but I love how they were telling the strength,etc and it's good he has someone to talk to other than lois.And I love the armor,too bad superboy is taking it away

@darth_jones said:

@johnny_spam said:

Reads very much like All Star Superman.

...What? Literally just no. No. Are you kidding me? All Star Superman is a masterpiece.

I don't know what "All Star Superman" you read, but it is NOTHING like these scans up here. I don't think the All Star Superman I read had Clark acting like a dumb jock saying "Seriously?! That's awesome!" or "Man, I have to fly" or having awkward sexual interactions with some random lady. The dialogue here is excessive and childish. All Star Superman uses about half the dialogue and still pumps more heart and passion into it's panels.

Edit: I'm not saying that you can't like Lobdell's work. Not my personal cup of tea, but if you like, that's more than fine. But it's nothing like All Star Superman. That's just blasphemy.

this is Sparta!!.... i just could not resist.

@Ravager4: because he is superman...did you remember in the old universe when superman,wonder woman,and martian manhunter were moving the entire planet.Also,he just had a fight with helpsont a while back,so he wants to test his strength,but he always holds back.

But to anyone else,saying superman is too strong....seriously?He has always been strong like this,but he always holds back.With one tap he can kill someone,remember the mental barriers.He has to have that.And Superman was always strong like this,this is probably nothing to old superman,old superman just always held back,like this one.So it isn't inconsistent.People are just not taking his barriers into account.And people,your acting as if he can blow away galaxies with a sneeze,this is nothing.And saying it is unnecessary,I mean,he is superman.That is like saying batman being the world's greatest detective is overpowering him,which I do hear people say.And one more thing,this is a test,it only makes sense for him to go all out,until then,HE ALWAYS HOLDS BACK ALOT!!!!

This isn't anything new,he holds back all the time.Which he always and still does.In fact I think it said he had MANY multiple barriers,I love the freaking armor,but it seems that The S has to appear first,and before we hate it we should also know the other reason behind it (*cough greedy seigels cough*).

But IF superman is mr majestic level at regular,I think I would be pissed but I am not,this is all out superman,something which he will only go to once in a blue moon (or red sun,whatever you wanna call it)

i love the fact that superman is SO strong and that he has got enemies that are even stronger than him! now we are finally getting some potentials for good superman stories.

Gotta love Rocafort's art and of course I love Lobdell's writing, and I'm truly happy to see that Superman here is back to his Silver Age levels of power it seems since it seems he can easily lift the weight of the Earth and still hasn't found an upper level to his strength yet. Really can't wait for this to come out. So excited!

@toptom: agreed,but at the same time DC are making him more....human,I love it,it also fits well with his barriers

@cameron83 said:

@Ravager4: because he is superman...did you remember in the old universe when superman,wonder woman,and martian manhunter were moving the entire planet.Also,he just had a fight with helpsont a while back,so he wants to test his strength,but he always holds back.

Yes, I do remember that, and I thought it was just as ridiculous then as I do now. I honestly don't care that he always holds back, like you're saying. He can always hold back to keep from hurting people without being able to lift planets, too. A few hundred tons, heck, even a thousand tons, is okay. Still kind of ridiculous, but a lot more acceptable. But 6 sextillion tons (without even trying, apparently)? Seriously? I just can't even fathom that. Don't like it, don't want it, won't read it.

And as a side note, no, saying Superman being able to lift planets is unnecessary is not the same as saying Batman being the "world's greatest detective" (which he's not) is overpowering.

Not sure if I feel the whole SA power levels thing...It worked for Prime...But for Supes...nawh...

@cameron83: Actually, he hasn't always been strong like this. The original Superman (so the really, really, really old universe) was nowhere near these levels of power during the Golden Age of comics and the entire idea of superheroes was created. His powers slowly evolved as time went on because writers (comics and radio) needed to keep putting him in greater situations in order to keep the character interesting and the stories exciting. But even writers that were part of DC and particularly Superman at the height of the Silver Age agree that they took his power levels too far and it was becoming near impossible to keep writing any significant challenges for the Man of Steel.

I don't understand why such high strength levels need to be the focus of Superman. He has superhuman speed (near par with the Flash and other speedsters), invulnerability (though I agree with @Nheritor that I think showing Superman with scars from his adventures is a great idea......if Lobdell hadn't just screw up the idea by just showing Superman at god-like levels of strength), superhuman endurance, flight, super hearing, microscopic vision, telescopic vision, x-ray vision, electromagnetic spectrum vision, heat vision, and an extreme healing factor if he does get hurt.............so why does he need to have the ability to lift a planet? His sum total of abilities already makes him the most powerful being on the planet even if he was only in the 100-200 ton range of strength (though how Martian Manhunter has been presented in the new 52 may put that in question.....though I don't see what Superman's strength is going to do when MM attacks him mentally.....which is one of the problems I have with the power depiction of the character). Even at that lower strength level he would still be stronger, faster, and tougher than any other hero on Earth. He can fight at any range. He can detect enemies before they even see him or find clues or hints even Batman's best equipment might not be able to. The guy is already a superman without needing to bench press planets.

The whole mental limiters thing is just dumb and made no sense when it was thought up and doesn't really make any sense today. I don't remember when DC specifically put this out though I do remember when he was fighting with the two Supergirls, when she was split by Luthor's black kryptonite into evil and slightly less annoying, that he didn't say anything about mental limiters but that Supergirl's show of greater strength was because she was using her full powers as a result of not knowing her exact limits whereas Superman knew how to control himself so well that he could vary his strength as needed. That makes a lot more sense than "mental limiters". You can crush a paper cup when you want to but don't crush an egg when you hold it because you can control your body. Just because Superman is more powerful doesn't mean he can't do the same exact thing. It has nothing to do with limiters and simply having the same muscle control everybody has.

As for taking away the "greatest detective" title from Batman.......well look at what Synder did with the Court of Owls arc. He gave us a story where Batman was completely blindsided (which we also got from Morrison in Batman R.I.P) and people absolutely loved it. It doesn't mean Batman still isn't the greatest detective, he is, but it doesn't mean he's godlike either. Limiting Superman to benching 200 tons or so doesn't stop making him Superman, it just presents an opportunity to put him up against opponents far stronger than him and requiring more than a right hook to do the job while still acknowleding that his full array of abilities make him Superman (and this isn't even getting into the personality and morality aspect of Superman) and not just his strength.

As was said by Superman himself in Justice League: Crisis on Two Earths (paraphrased of course) when the President chides him for being brave when he's bulletproof "I go up against people more powerful than me all the time". When a writers shows him lifting the planet Earth for 5 days straight I don't see how that can truly be possible without the enemy and stories being absurdly written.

@Miss_Garrick said:

@Guardiandevil83: Yeah, but still, it was cool before the betrayal craziness.

I agree. And I was a bit crossed with Hamilton, but it's not like you could blame him or the other humans in that universe. Imagine if actual ''Metas" existed. Can you say ''concentration camps?" I knew you could. lol

@ltbrd: Am i able to like this post?

@SandMan_ said:

Not sure if I feel the whole SA power levels thing...It worked for Prime...But for Supes...nawh...

people will always say that superman is overpowered. this is kind of boring, really. nobody has ever said that thor or silver surfer or majestic are overpowered and that being so strong would make them as bad characters. Superman HAS to be super-powerfull since he has got enemies like doomsday,darkseid,cyborg and helspont.that's it. untill he is strong but he has to struggle to pull out a win,i am fine with it.

@Imagine_Man15 ah yes you've mentioned that before. I'm cautiously optimistic about Lobdell after Superman 0. It was certainly better than all the other issues of Superman.

@Ravager4 It's your loss. He is Superman after all. It's kind of his catch that he's the most powerful being in the world. Some street level and lower tied characters aren't all that interesting as they fail to capture the epic sense of adventure Superman has.

I'm loving this!!! I believe Superman really needs to be reestablished as one of DC's strongest. i feel like he has been taking the back seat a lot while green lantern and batman and or flash get all the shine. Everyone before was disappointed cause they believed that new 52 supes was weaker then pre 52. Why is it a problem now that he is stronger? I feel people need a reminder of who superman is. Maybe this is there way of doing that. I mean isn't that the reason why scott and jim are doing man of steel? Superman needs this in my opinion.

@DChero said:

I'm loving this!!! I believe Superman really needs to be reestablished as one of DC's strongest. i feel like he has been taking the back seat a lot while green lantern and batman and or flash get all the shine. Everyone before was disappointed cause they believed that new 52 supes was weaker then pre 52. Why is it a problem now that he is stronger? I feel people need a reminder of who superman is. Maybe this is there way of doing that. I mean isn't that the reason why scott and jim are doing man of steel? Superman needs this in my opinion.

yeah people are never going to be happy with anything. o well.... Im happy with this new upcoming supes.

This is Rubbish. That is all.

I feel like this is adding to the pissing contest between Marvel and DC. One thing I've liked about the New 52 is it seemed like DC gave that up and went back to telling cool stories, but then I see this. I hate seeing frames in comics that do nothing but show how strong Captain America's shield is, or how fast Flash can run, just tell good stories

I'm loving the artwork. I have always been a superman fan and this comic is getting pretty good.

Must try and get this one.

Itd be funny if she was some kinda spy or something and she was lying to him about the amount he was lifting and one day something happened that made him need to lift that kinda weight and he was all "No need for backup,I got this" and then got squashed

So yea Bench Pressing Earth's Weight for 5days with a lack of Vitamin Sun?? Not Cool. I was starting to Think New 52 wasn't as Strong as the old Superman but doesn't this basically put him back to Silver Age or Golden Age strenght Levels. Didn't Helspoint pimp smack him to the moons surfaces and rattle his brain....I don't like this depiction of his strength they could have made him bench press the moons weight or something...It's not believable...

This is Rubbish. That is all.

I can't wait. Even though I hated Lobdell on Teen Titans, I feel like he may be just the guy for Superman. *knock on wood* 
 
People accuse him of being very '90s, but I actually always felt that for Superman, that was one of the best eras for the character. As long as its not too outlandishly '90s with names like "Bonesmasher" (who was recently just introduced in Superboy by Defalco, ugh) or "Crushface", but just has a somewhat retro feel to it, it should be good. 
 
EDIT: I also love how Clark's so excited at the fact that he sweat. It just shows how much he actually considers himself (or at least wants to consider himself) as human.

@Zeeguy91: This is purely a personal thing, but my favorite version of the character was the post-crisis John Byrne incarnation. He had limits that were more....umm...workable?

I'm not saying he should be brought back down to Byrne levels. I get that he needs to be the most powerful guy in comics, powerful enough to fly wherever he wants and do whatever he wants. Fly to Antarctica and back, lift and use giant keys, turn tornadoes inside-out, catch falling aircraft, the works. That could done while still stipulating a more plausible power level. He doesn't have to underpowered, he can still be insanely powerful and believable at the same time.

Say, Supes could barely.....just barely....if he pushes himself to the EXTREME and exhausts all his reserves....nudge the moon out of orbit (and then nudge it back). And then he and Superboy/girl/dog could play catch with a decent sized asteroid. That is still a very high level of power. Quite ridiculous, in fact. People might still have trouble believing it. But it wouldn't insult anyone's intelligence. At least not as much as this.

This is a little too far. Benching the equivalent of the planet for five days, to extract a single drop of sweat? Does Scott Lobdell even know what the Earth is? How old does he think we are? 7?

He could have tailored the new Superman's strength to fit the world, and the people he interacts with, better. This seems like he just looked up a fact on Wikipedia and said, "My Sooperman can lift THAAAAAAT much". It's just bad writing, and seems to be setting itself up for yet another retcon, sooner or later.

Basically, at these levels, he needs to be super-ultra-extra careful about how he exhales in the company of mere mortals, lest his breath vaporise them. And God forbid he ever sneezes. Want to massacre the Justice League? Screw exotic weapons, just blow some pepper up Supe's nose! Job done!

It's just annoying, that's all.