How omnipotent are celestials?

Are they capable of creating universes? Kill other space gods by thought? Always wondered what are their true powers.

How Omnipotent are they?

Create anything by thought, even adamantium?

This is not a battle. Celestials are not omnipotent in the slightest. They can't stalemate TOAA, for example.

@johnnyz256: That doesn't answer all my questions.

@sheryin1: A average Celestial is above Galactus level and high tiers are above Living Tribunal

Unless you count Tiamut as a equal of Fulcrum

I'm not an expert on the celestials, but I think they are capable of creating (and destroying) universes, quite possibly multiverses. Not sure what you mean by "space gods." The celestials can easily dispatch of the "god" Odin, for example, if they really want to.

Since the Silver Surfer is capable of matter manipulation, and the celestials are way above the Surfer, I think that they could manipulate matter. If they can create a universe then I've got to believe they can create adamantium. They cannot create absolutely anything, though. They can't create a being more powerful than themselves. No one can.

None of the Celestials are omnipotent.

There can only be one Omnipotent being in the multiverse, and that's The One Above All. There is a reason he's called that, because he's literally above everyone. You can't be equal to someone who's Omnipotent, therefore no Celestial can be Omnipotent. They're can be Neigh Omnipotent beings who have power closer to Omnipotence than other beings. Scathan, and the One Above All Celestial is provably the only ones that fit that position regarding Celestials. Yes the Celestials are capable of creating universes, but it most likely takes multiple of the no name ones to do so, and it's likely only the big ones like stated or Tiamut or Exitar and some others can do it alone. Celestials are pretty uber, I believe they are the most powerful space god race in marvel, and I believe they can make almost anything with a thought, but virtually not everything because that would mean the would have Ominpotence, so they have their limits, but Adamantium should be extremely easy for them to make. I hope that summed up you're questions.

*reads thread title, facepalms*

"How omnipotent" is a mutilation of the English language. There are no 'levels of omnipotence', you can either do anything or you can't.

Only batman is omnipotent....

#galactusrepellent

There are not degrees of Omnipotence. Either you are, or you aren't. Celestials aren't.

Title question answered.

None of them are omnipotent or even remotely close.

God no are you high?

Galactus after eating four planets had a hard time fighting a single Celestial.Scathan had beaten Protege with Living Tribunal powers.

Take about 4% omnipotence, 6% random powers, 55% tincan body, and 35% ego, you get a celestial.

@homicidalmaniac: You mean the Mad Celestials? It wasn't just one.

Scathan also snuck up on Protege and insta stole his powers. It wasn't a fight.

qfft

Celestials are semi-omnipotent

@zeroplus: No.

The Marvel Handbook stated in the Living Tribunal Bio that Scathan save LT from Protege IIRC.

Hey @killemall,don't you have the scan of this

There's no such thing. There are no degrees of omnipotence. Omnipotence is a binary state. You either are omnipotent or you are not.

Both "Omni" and "Semi" are Prefixes. Omni means "All". Semi means "Partially".

"How omnipotent are they" is not an accurate statement. Omnipotent means absolute power. The phrase should simply be: "How powerful are the Celestials?"

The examples you gave are not examples of omnipotence. Being capable of doing those things only proves that you are powerful - not omnipotent.

I think that near-omnipotent works in cases where a character is, for the most part, second only to characters who hold true omnipotence (Heart of the Universe, the Beyonder, Molecule Man, etc.). But I agree with you.

Well, pre retconned beyonder was a match imo to TOAA.

There is Nigh omnipotence

http://powerlisting.wikia.com/wiki/Nigh_Omnipotence

Which is just a way of saying something is really, really, really powerful...but still not ALL Powerful.

Yes i do, and its from 2006 LT bio which says Protege copied LT power and Scanthan saved the day.

And most importantly, while i can post the scan, its gonna cost you $100 :p

Do we have a deal? heheheh

Celestials are marvel character and in marvel there is a degree of omnipotency. Such is the weirdness of marvel actuality.

Celestials, much like Cosmic Cube beings are minor omnipotents, as weird as it may sounds its true for marvel definiation of omnipotent as opposed to dictionary defination.

"By the macrocosmic scale of which such things are measured, they are but minor omnipotents small in power and slight in age."

There is also the whole idea of level of infinity

@killemall said:

@homicidalmaniac said:

The Marvel Handbook stated in the Living Tribunal Bio that Scathan save LT from Protege IIRC.

Hey @killemall,don't you have the scan of this

Yes i do, and its from 2006 LT bio which says Protege copied LT power and Scanthan saved the day.

And most importantly, while i can post the scan, its gonna cost you $100 :p

Do we have a deal? heheheh

@shawnbaby said:

There's no such thing. There are no degrees of omnipotence.

Celestials are marvel character and in marvel there is a degree of omnipotency. Such is the weirdness of marvel actuality.

Celestials, much like Cosmic Cube beings are minor omnipotents, as weird as it may sounds its true for marvel definiation of omnipotent as opposed to dictionary defination.

"By the macrocosmic scale of which such things are measured, they are but minor omnipotents small in power and slight in age."

There is also the whole idea of level of infinity

By that same Logic, Odin is also "Omnipotent"

@shawnbaby: That's what i wanted to say, but maybe i didn't use the proper word

Yes he is.

But rather than saying Odin is omnipotent, according to the way marvel presents, defines and uses the terms, in marvel actuality, Odin is one of the minor omnipotents, on one ladder of infinity, alongside Celestials, Eternity, Living Tribunal and perhaps TOAA, while all being omnipotents, the rest being at least a whole class of infinity above the others.

Galactus can take four celestials. Celestials are very overrated.

$100!!!!!!You sir are yo crazy

No. If I recall right he beat one. Others went megazord and one-shotted him.

There is only one All-Powerful Being in the Marvel Omniverse. TOAA is the Only Actual Omnipotent. I won't argue the semantics of who "Marvel considers" omnipotent...Marvel changes their mind on that every couple weeks.

@homicidalmaniac said:

$100!!!!!!You sir are yo crazy

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@killemall: gotta love how these supremely powerful cosmic entities are just standing on nothingness within one universe or another, not to knock the imagination/creativity of some writers, but beings like celestial, monitors, etc likely would have a more unique, inconceivable type form. But as I type this I realize how absurd I sound

@drmantistoboggan: Well for a universe thats up to its neck with supremely powerful cosmic entities, some of whom dont appear or even get mentioned beyond a story arc or two, things like that happens quite often :p

You guys should stop applying logic to Omnipotence. Omnipotence itself is inherently illogical. For instance, can an omnipotent character create other omnipotents? Of course he can, he's omnipotent! And thus, TOAA created a bunch of Omnipotent celestials, who are totally omnipotent, just like all these other weaker and stronger omnipotents, because it's a logicless buzzword meant to describe a powerset that has no creative limit for the writer. Voila!

@killemall: if such things were actually in existence, I'm sure they would be incomprehensible based on how much raw power they would possess. Probably wouldn't even have a form conceivable to the standard human mind.

If these came into existence, I'm pretty sure we'd actually need superheroes... I volunteer to be thor/superman, I'd even gladly take a much lesser role like Spider-Man/deathstroke. Sign me up!

@drmantistoboggan: I know but when you have so many omnipotents people run out of ideas. Shuma Gorath, an old near omnipotent character created, is a formless void who chooses to appear as a giant Octopus. Galactus appears to everyone in differnet from, LT takes form based on where he is going, Phoenix appears as a flaming bird, Goblin Force appears as a Dark Raven, but after a while i think the writer went, well f*&k this, lets just have everyone look like human , simply because we can.

@thundergodswrath: Are Celestial able to kill humans, mutants or any other superhuman with just thinking about it.

@killemall: I'm with you there, like I said those beings are just things we wouldn't be able to imagine so they make them semi-relatable

But on topic, marvel U varies from reality, in that some beings can have some sorta limited levels of omnipotence, but celestials have a very small percentage of that compared to TOAA. Wouldn't make sense to make them anywhere close to TOAA cause nothing should be challenging it or the presence.

I wanna see a really low level character hit with an amp that puts them almost above a celestial level just to see how it would play out

@drmantistoboggan: Peter was given the power of Beyonder for a microsecond, and during that microsecond shaped the entire universe to his whim so that everything was perfect for him until he had to give it up. Might've been a what if or whatever but it's a pretty funny little scene.

@dredeuced: do you have a scan of that? I believe you, just sounds pretty cool, wanna see how that was cause Peter was always one of my favorite marvel characters. I had to give up a lot of titles a good while ago so I haven't read much marvel in the past decade or so, if it's prior to that then I just must have missed it

@drmantistoboggan: Killemall was the one who originally showed me the scans, I'll go see if I can dig em up

Edit: Here we go, found the post for you to view at your leisure: http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles-7/post-retcon-molecule-man-vs-classic-ion-741214/?page=1#js-message-8850470

I still don't believe that though, yes he should be close, but come on they wouldn't give him the name "The One Above All" if he has equals or superiors now would they?

I would say maybe, but not beings like Legion, Scarlet Witch, Franklin Richards,ect.

Celestials serve the fulcrum, so nowhere near omnipotent but really powerful

That is the theory, but you should look into Beyonder, his feats are pretty crazy ,and easily at TOAA's level.

I have, and possibly.

I think the correct term would be went all Voltron on Galactus butt.

Omnipotence is just a projected concept, an idea so to speak, in fiction it can exist as far a reader or viewer either choosing to accept its validity as an idea or taking what is being offered as implicitly true. However the nature of fictional characters is that all fictional characters are omnipotent, as they are only limited by the creators imagination, and or the readers imagination/ability to comprehend what is offered by the creator. How we apply the definition of omnipotence can be relative as well. To an ant, humans can do anything and everything to a scale behind their comprehension, we are all powerful, in a way we could be said to be omnipotent and it would be valid. Except we can't do anything and everything we want so easy, and we aren't all powerful. In fiction many characters can also be assorted as omnipotent relative to us, but then seem incredibly lacking when compared to another character. Compare an ant to Punisher to Odin to Eternity to Living Tribunal. That also being said there are ways even us humble humans can reduce the idea of omnipotence by applying logic. This is a good reason why the TOAA character is as much a meta character breaking the forth wall as far as being a representative of real life writers/Jack Kirby as much as a fictional character that a reader is suppose to not realize is winking/nodding at us the reader.

Speaking of Jack Kirby well, he of course created the Celestials, as well as say Galactus. He created the Celestials after he left Marvel and went to DC where he created the New Gods and Darkseid and a reason why Kirby went to DC was because he wanted to create new characters, new stories, new mythology, which he couldn't at Marvel. Cooly enough though he did end up getting to return to Marvel to create new characters and stories implementing his ideas he always wanted to, and the Celestials, Eternals and Deviants were the result. Personally I tend to think Kirby wanted Celestials to be individually as powerful as Galactus, regardless of how writers after him treated and depicted the characters. The other thing about the Celestials though are that they are meant to be pretty mysterious and cryptic. They have these specific roles and a structure to them, and its basically a type of curiosity. They are also based off many of Erich von Däniken's ideas (don't actually take those ideas as legit though, our pseudo science) oh and they are of course having their names taken from mythology as well.

Tiamut the Communicator the Dreamer eventually was rewarded by the Fulcrum for rising above its purpose, which implies that Celestials for the most part are slaves to their nature and follow a plan laid out and lack a quality to break from that, a quality Tiamut didn't lack and thus. The parable here is probably that us readers should you know, question our purpose and be critically minded, since we to in many ways are slaves to our nature as well. So we share some with the Celestials, and neither of us are really omnipotent. That being said I do think they can create adamantium by thought, but not everything. Wold have to define universe precisely but sounds a bit too much to me. Given they have alt reality versions of themselves creating universes gets tricky, but maybe pocket realities or pocket universes. They generally seem more interested in tampering than creating.