How often has flash survived getting to speed force without much damage. Besides Odin has teleportation he can simply come back to the dimension to fight flash. Also i dont think flash or zoom could KO Odin. The thing i see here often is zoom having unlimited speed and thats not true. I strongly think Odin can tank a massive amount of punches from either flash or zoom. Besides the fight is in character, when was the last time flash started a fight with million punches ??
Odin and Thor floating above the battlefield should give Odin enough time to pull off the W.
@Super_SoldierXII said:
@difficlus: Well, as I intimated, just because it's part and parcel of a character's powerset, does not means he will meet with equal success against any and all adversaries. It's within Wolverine's established powerset to be able to cut through anything. And yet the question is often raised. He has not cut Colossus (outside of Hellverine) and so it remains debatable for some whether or not he could. It is within Emma's powerset to be able to read minds, and yet against certain opponents she has proven incapable of doing so. Had she never run into Hulk, had Hulk never had to fend off a telepath, we would all be stating how much hogwash WWHulk running through the X-Men would be ... yet he did it. Turns out he's TP resistant for whatever reason (citing 'rage' or whatever the writer wishes to conjure up as a reason really). Same could be done for Superman getting his speed drained. Perhaps it would not work on a Kryptonian under the effects of a yellow sun for whatever reason the writer's imagination wishes to conjure up. So unless it actually happens against that character, whether or not it can be done to said character has not been established as canon and is therefore debatable. You're now telling me Wally has done it to Supes. Fine then. The point is moot. Case closed. Superman is screwed.
Just because speed steal works against Superman does not equate to success against a Skyfather level character like Odin. Also I don't agree that his recent near-draw against Galactus was PIS. I'm perusing my copy of Journey Into Mystery #513 where according to Surfer "Forces powerful enough to rock our entire continuum are in conflict"...So. yeah. I'm assuming Odin is not going to be susceptible to speed steal and will squash the speedsters
I have read most of Thor issues, thanks to Czarny_Samuels and endless debate with him, and i have never seen Odin do anything remotely close to stealing speed. However what i do know is Odin can banish powerful individuals to other dimensions simply by wishing so, like he did to Surtur, someone's how's actually faster than him. Odin hasnt shown the ability to manipulate time either but King Thor has (but this took place in a future universe dont know if this is cannon to 616 universe).
I still think Odin can beat Zoom and Flash but definitely not by stealing their speed but probably by destroying the planet or stopping time and banishing them.
Odin and Thor floating above the battlefield should give Odin enough time to pull off the W.
Just because speed steal works against Superman does not equate to success against a Skyfather level character like Odin. Also I don't agree that his recent near-draw against Galactus was PIS. I'm perusing my copy of Journey Into Mystery #513 where according to Surfer "Forces powerful enough to rock our entire continuum are in conflict"...So. yeah. I'm assuming Odin is not going to be susceptible to speed steal and will squash the speedsters
Well technically flash can conjure a ladder made of pure speed force to hit them however i have only seen flash do this once and to someone who was just a little higher than a giant building, don’t know if that would work on someone high above in the sky and definitely don’t think it’s something flash does in character either.
Why not, it’s not like Sky fathers have any speed steal resistance. Also it was interesting the person pointing out Wolverine cutting colossus is debatable when wolverine was able to plunge his claws rather easily inside gladiator and make him bleed who's a lot more durable. That is not the only instance, wolverine was able to cut Trion Juggernaut too, of course that didn’t stop juggernaut but if he can do it to Trion i don’t see why he couldn’t do it to someone like Colossus when Trion is many time more powerful.
Now things about hulk, because of his rage he has TP resistance. Void had the same thing. What makes you think a sky father would have telepathic resistance?
Thor's hammer is made with Odin's power and is pretty powerful still that did not stop juggernaut from stealing its momentum and using it against Thor. If juggernaut can do it to the hammer which itself is powered by same powers as Odin, albeit in less quantity, i don’t see why it wouldnt work on Odin.
However stealing speed to win a battle isn’t something flash does in character. Also the ability to manipulate time and banish people to other dimension would work regardless of how slow Odin is. I am still saying Odin win, although thor would get screwed, i dont agree that speed steal wouldnt work on Odin if Flash tried to do so.
No, but with Odin Force he could just wish that to happen and it will happen
Come on man even you gotta admit that sounds like an extremely iffy argument. I know he has been said to be omnipotent as often as hulk has been said to be strongest there is but unless we see him do anything remotely close to stealing speed that doesnt qualify as a strong argument.
Dont get me wrong i am not saying Zoom or flash wins, i have been debating against them.
No, but with Odin Force he could just wish that to happen and it will happen
Come on man even you gotta admit that sounds like an extremely iffy argument. I know he has been said to be omnipotent as often as hulk has been said to be strongest there is but unless we see him do anything remotely close to stealing speed that doesnt qualify as a strong argument.
Dont get me wrong i am not saying Zoom or flash wins, i have been debating against them.
You are right, but if you are capable of reconstructing buildings and moons, turning Loki into tree, holding your own against Galactus, creating new worlds with your mind alone, bringing dead people back to life, making someone immortal, taking away the soul of Mephisto, stealing speed shouldn't be a problem right?
@Rasarima: With morals off Wally ( or any speedster that has control over the Speedforce ), can beat Thor pretty easily. The Speed Force is overpowered, he can just turn Thor into a statue and be done with it.
@Rasarima: With morals off Wally ( or any speedster that has control over the Speedforce ), can beat Thor pretty easily. The Speed Force is overpowered, he can just turn Thor into a statue and be done with it.
No he cant...otherwise he would do it with others...
You are saying that he can turn superman into a statue with morals off? or Darkside?....not a single writer out there would do it, just for the sake of the character.
I love the flash, he is one of my favorite heros, but i respect what he can and what he CANT do....he is not unbeatable. he is a human that think and move at ligthspeed, but unless you take feats like the "infinit mass punch" in consideration, he can NOT beat Thor.
Respect the man and his history plz! he have done so much and suffer, loss and pain! With this kind of power that your guys are giving to him he is a god and not CLOSE to the red and yellow man that we read every issue.@Billy Batson said:
@Rasarima said:
WOW! You guys are putting the FLASH in the league of THOR?
Geezus... fans are strange people...
What should be the problem? The Flash is fully capable of battling against Thor. BB
Battling? yes Deadpool, IronFist, Spiderman, The BlueBeetle, Gladiator, and so on can also.....winning is a complete other thing...
@Rasarima: There's no need to post that kind of thing. He's not trolling, he's just saying the truth, Thor is considerably slower than Flash, Wally could probably hit Thor a lot of times before he could react, same would happen to Superman. That is all with morals, without morals he can just use the IMP, which killed a white martian in one hit, or he could just use speed steal which he can and has done before, including against Superman.
Flash beats Thor if Thor fights like a brawler using no magic and Flash fights totally out of character by opening with a blitz
I think under normal battle conditions in comicvine the fight would be very very close, the biggest problem Flash has is 'in-character' he's cocky and true to his statistics he's got ZERO DURABILITY
Thor doesn't really have a true weakness, maybe Thor's "I'm gonna brawl with the bad guy" "and think later on and only use my magic whenever all my team mates are almost dead"...maybe this 'in-character' is a specific weakness
but Zoom and Odin are two totally different levels
Odin can make himself big as a house, bigger than mountians, bigger than Galactus, Celestials and even a planet
Zoom might be fast but he's still an insect to Odin
One gets KO'ed and almost killed whenever someone chucks a pole
The other guy is a Skyfather, takes Galaxy busting shots, can create life, wipe out souls, warp reality, gets in a telepathic fight with Galactus, swats away planets
Then undoes said damage, wipes everyone's memory, the works:
creates them a new star, planet and Asgard, even a jail to hold Thor in.
Odin has feats that shame even Pre Crisis Darkseid
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