#251 Posted by SpaceBall98 (15 posts) - - Show Bio

It's inevitable that hulk will win no matter how much wisdom he might have of Solomon

#252 Posted by captain_marvel_red_cheese (7 posts) - - Show Bio

hulks dead before the battle started

#253 Posted by clemj (817 posts) - - Show Bio

it has been proveda countless number of times that: marvel>superman and superman>hulk(any versions)

#254 Edited by CaineShaw (22 posts) - - Show Bio

World Breaker Hulk, easy. He can destroy planets with his mere footsteps.

#255 Posted by Wardemon32 (4538 posts) - - Show Bio

World Break hulk. You guys are ridiculous sometimes. If this was "Hukl vs Shazam" or "Hulk vs Superman" you'd guys would be like "ehh it's like a tie or something" but they you put up World Breaker Hulk vs Captian Marvel and say Captain Marvel wins? I mean how much sense does that make?

#256 Edited by comic_book_fan (5931 posts) - - Show Bio

hulk wins

#257 Posted by TheDarkDaredevil (554 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk

#258 Posted by son_of_tomorrow (493 posts) - - Show Bio

@clemj said:

it has been proveda countless number of times that: marvel>superman and superman>hulk(any versions)

Where is that logic coming from? Captain marvel is not able to beat superman. I don't know what comics your reading, because in almost every single instant that they have fought, in every form of media captain marvel either loses, such as in clash of the titans in justice league, to him stalemating superman due to PIS. What don't you get about the fact that when it comes to fights like this superman just wins, simply because he's superman. when it comes down to it you might punk superman but he always wins in the end. So let's just leave superman out of this.

#259 Posted by GhostRavage (9432 posts) - - Show Bio

Stalemate... Billy Batson has NOTHING to harm World Breaker Hulk. But WBH will never land a hit on him anyways. They are not equal in strength... Actually WBH kills him if they go in a brawl... Same can be said about durability and regen factor... This Hulk has the physical advantage in every area besides speed and reaction speed. Stop the non-sense, Captain Marvel can't win here.

#260 Posted by spiderbuck (2452 posts) - - Show Bio

^ what he said.

#261 Edited by World_Breaker_Elmo (186 posts) - - Show Bio

@batman242 said:

@Theworldbreaker: Shazam has lifted an entire continent before, Superman pulled like 10+ planets and one time, Wonder Woman use to be stronger than Superman and she lifted the some planet before, Orion is on par with Superman.... other than the fact that he cant fly.

If we are going by silver age feats then I guess Billy has got this doesn't he?

As for recent pre-flashpoint continuity did Billy ever tackle someone on Worldbreaker's level? I ask because I am not too familiar.

If this is now Billy as Shazam(new52 ) does he even have enough feats to make any reasonable comparison?

#262 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

Stalemate... Billy Batson has NOTHING to harm World Breaker Hulk. But WBH will never land a hit on him anyways. They are not equal in strength... Actually WBH kills him if they go in a brawl... Same can be said about durability and regen factor... This Hulk has the physical advantage in every area besides speed and reaction speed. Stop the non-sense, Captain Marvel can't win here.

#263 Posted by JediXMan (31282 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain Marvel.

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#264 Posted by dondave (38891 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain Marvel

#265 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm quoting here but "Applying force to the space-time structure itself to prevent the Defenders from being absorbed into a fissure (Defenders #3)(with the size of the singularity estimated in about seven feets according to the Schwarzschild radius, then it's mass/gravitational attraction, by the equivalence principle, is thus equivalent to roughly two hundreds Earths),". I'd say that puts hulks strength in CM & Supermans level. The hulk bashing here is rampant as usual.

#266 Posted by logy5000 (6133 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk.

Online
#267 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

Overpowering a field of energy endowed with sufficient power to change the orbit of a planet(Tales to Astonish #89) Hulk showed power to overcome a planet's kinetic energy, which is better than overcoming the force it has while it's just sitting there in its static state. It takes 632 quadrillion 850 trillion megatons(6.3285*10^17) just to stop the earth's orbit. Hulk overpowered energy that could not only stop a planet's orbit but reverse it as well, which means Hulk was able to put out even more power than that....hulk has destroyed a planet simply by clashing with red she hulk,,not even a direct hit, ill admit his combat speed isn't very high but fact remains his strength is incredible and on par with CM and hulk has shown good reaction time in the past as well,,TAS has some great scans of that. I taking hulk..I've never seen CM quake the east coast with mere footsteps,,and I'd like to here what CM would do to put hulk down,,if you say hulk can't hit him,,even though CM has been hit by bricks before and hulk has tagged quick silver,,CM can't put hulk down,,at best it's a stalemate since hulk supposedly can't hit him and I have doubts CM could put hulk down

#268 Posted by GhostRavage (9432 posts) - - Show Bio
#269 Posted by Dratini1331 (7040 posts) - - Show Bio

@bane_of_sith: How? How can he stop a planet? I'm not debating numbers, I'm just thinking about it from a theoretic standpoint. Like, the best he can do is punch the planet at the perfect time in a way such that he is opposite it's orbit, which is extremely infeasible and earth would still just spin out because it's still rotating. It's like trying to push a boat the opposite way while being in the boat. He shouldn't be able to in any imaginable way. Does he just like punch the planet?

I'm not concerned with the numbers, and I'm sure it could happen in the comics, but it's just, how? O.o

#270 Posted by GhostRavage (9432 posts) - - Show Bio

@dratini1331: Resisting a force that could move the planet, suggests that he has the force to move a planet... he's not saying he could move the planet but he has the strength to do so...

#271 Posted by Dratini1331 (7040 posts) - - Show Bio
#272 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

Actually I'd like to get some feats of CM's speed.

See, speed is nothing but applying the Square-Cube-Law to a given creature given you know the limits of its strength and its mass.

For WBH, the first is INCREDIBLY high. As @bane_of_sith said, Hulk has the strength to effortlessly move planets. The mass is high as well -shaking the Eastern Seaboard with a STEP means he'd have to have roughly the mass of a state. However, this is nothing when he has the proportionate strength to move millions of his mass, meaning that his leg strength is INCREDIBLY high.

Now, on an indestructible planet, this means that Hulk can leap into the air incredibly fast (not going to go into calcs but it's more than escape velocity mach 45 or so) and probably smack down Captain Marvel. He is at a disadvantage once IN the air since he can't fly, but on the ground there is no possible reason that he would be slow. He's tagged Quicksilver going at Mach 20.

But...what exactly are Captain Marvel's speed feats? He goes at Mach something all the time, sure, but how could he fly circles around WBH?

I'm giving it to WBH 10/10. CM could NEVER hurt him, and WBH could.

#273 Posted by MrPhoenix (354 posts) - - Show Bio

A lot of DC fans in this debate that don't understand what WB Hulk really is.

#274 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

@dratini1331: as ghostravage kindly pointed out I didn't state he actually stopped an planets orbit,,in a confrontation wi the stranger,,stranger tried to immobilize hulk with an energy ray of massive energy the direct quote is "the power in my command is not of the puny earth! The rays which engulf you contain the energy to change the orbit of a planet!" Hulks reply.."NOTHING STOPS HULK!!" Hope that clears it up :)

#275 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk has used a well timed leap at high speed to grab jack of hearts while flying,and he's tagged quicksilver,,he consistently has showed reaction timing for bullets,,on one occasion I recall a group of soldiers aiming at hulk and he moved so fast the soldiers described it as him vanishing before there eyes (something like that).. Hulk could certainly take this fight

#276 Posted by PowerHerc (85335 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain Marvel (Billy Batson) defeats World Breaker Hulk.

#277 Posted by Dratini1331 (7040 posts) - - Show Bio

@bane_of_sith: TY for clearing that up I was really confused for a little bit there.

#278 Posted by GhostRavage (9432 posts) - - Show Bio
#279 Posted by gav (1019 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not an expert on either of these guys, so folks who think WBH, provide some feats, and Captain Marvel folks, provide some feats. I'm curious exactly what each have done in and out of battle. Thank you.

#280 Posted by Bane_of_sith (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

@gav: if u scan up the page I've posted some strength feats that IMO are on par if not greater than any CM or superman feats of strength and some other stuff

#281 Edited by GhostRavage (9432 posts) - - Show Bio

@gav said:

I'm not an expert on either of these guys, so folks who think WBH, provide some feats, and Captain Marvel folks, provide some feats. I'm curious exactly what each have done in and out of battle. Thank you.

Well... We've only manage to see WBH 3 times in the entire Pak saga. SO he doesn't have a bunch of feats but these clearly lets assumption take its place.

This is WBH tearing the East Coast with a mere foot step.
Clashing with an amped Red She Hulk...>>
<<... End in blowing the planet along with the moon. Disintegrating 2 beings equal to Savage Hulk and 1 on par with Surfer.
Just by summoning its power he almost erased the entire west side of Las Vegas.

And ultimately, he says this in "The heart of the Monster" ...

SO! He was holding back when he was tearing apart the East Coast just by walking and when he almost erased the West Side of Las Vegas.

Hope this helped clear your mind.

#282 Posted by Moonman78 (1726 posts) - - Show Bio

I think the scans help, cap is better off trying to battle normal savage hulk than any of hulks upgrades

#283 Posted by gav (1019 posts) - - Show Bio

Thanks for scans, anyone have showing CM's power?

#284 Posted by dum529001 (1658 posts) - - Show Bio

@ghostravage:

These are the other times Hulk went "World breaker":

Savage Hulk vs Skaar, from Skaar: Son of Hulk #12:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129577-7722170100-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129580-2944203650-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129581-5688004687-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129582-7514921568-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129583-0743707542-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129585-0127939463-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129587-1345179983-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129588-8700233830-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129589-0163856761-Hulkv.jpg

World War Hulk (Worldbreaker) vs Skaar, from Incredible Hulk #610-11:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129612-4786747204-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129615-3474199315-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129616-3133275105-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129618-9456008111-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129619-9144513931-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129621-7254530423-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129624-0788630877-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129626-4948405739-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129627-4027334116-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129629-9277811171-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129634-3610442526-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129636-9483035850-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129637-6997298452-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129638-7207322649-Hulkv.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/136540/3129640-9510349266-Hulkv.jpg

#285 Edited by GhostRavage (9432 posts) - - Show Bio

@dum529001: Awesome scans but sadly, they don't show WBH state. Good stuff though.

#286 Edited by World_Breaker_Elmo (186 posts) - - Show Bio

I am still unclear as to what era Billy Batson we are dealing with. Maybe I missed a follow up post detailing that?

As for this match up I must restate my previous post:

If we are going by silver age feats then I guess Billy has got this doesn't he?

As for recent pre-flashpoint continuity did Billy ever tackle someone on Worldbreaker's level? I ask because I am not too familiar.

If this is now Billy as Shazam(new52 ) does he even have enough feats to make any reasonable comparison?

Of the three I would need some clarification regarding the overall level of SA Billy's feats. If they were on par with SA Superman as some suggest then of course he should be able to overwhelm the Hulk. However, if his feats were high-end only when the writer could not be bothered with writing a creative resolution to a story then even this era of feats is suspect.

In the post-crisis/pre-flashpoint era could someone briefly explain if Billy ever faced opponents with WBH's degree of durability, aggressiveness, and perpetually scaling strength?

As for this new "Shazam Captain Marvel" all I have seen so far is him being smacked in the mouth by Adam. I have not read anything since that encounter however.

#287 Edited by Soothing_Sounds (1718 posts) - - Show Bio

@world_breaker_elmo: Pretty sure we're talking about Post-crisis Shazam. WBHulk should take this, i would like to see some feats of Captain Marvel though. I've never seen feats that put him on even Supes level.

#288 Posted by GhostRavage (9432 posts) - - Show Bio

@world_breaker_elmo: Pretty sure we're talking about Post-crisis Shazam. WBHulk should take this, i would like to see some feats of Captain Marvel though. I've never seen feats that put him on even Supes level.

I agree... I've never seen any Billy Batson feat to put him on the same level as Superman. However, i've seen Superman losing to both Billy and Adam. With this said, i think it was plot manipulation due to Superman having way better feats than Captain Marvel overall...

#289 Edited by World_Breaker_Elmo (186 posts) - - Show Bio

@soothing_sounds said:

@world_breaker_elmo: Pretty sure we're talking about Post-crisis Shazam. WBHulk should take this, i would like to see some feats of Captain Marvel though. I've never seen feats that put him on even Supes level.

I agree... I've never seen any Billy Batson feat to put him on the same level as Superman. However, i've seen Superman losing to both Billy and Adam. With this said, i think it was plot manipulation due to Superman having way better feats than Captain Marvel overall...

I see a lot of people who constantly bring up those various arm wrestling matches between Superman and Billy as some sort of proof of their being physical equals. Problem I have with this, and this goes along with my agreeing to your assessment that plot manipulation has been used, is that outside of these "matches" Billy has never performed any physical feats on a consistent basis compared to Superman.

Please don't take this as me trashing Captain Marvel/Shazam but DC has always seemed comfortable having Billy stand in the shadow of Superman, both in feats and exposure. I hope Billy gets much better treatment in the DCnU!

#290 Edited by Jraerni_shazam (21 posts) - - Show Bio

Zues alone took down hulk nuff said

#291 Edited by Cor_Tsar (1255 posts) - - Show Bio

@jraerni_shazam: What? Are you insinuating that Captain Marvel is as strong or powerful as Zeus? Plus that wasn't WBHulk or a few Gods would've been disintegrated in the battle.

#292 Posted by Jraerni_shazam (21 posts) - - Show Bio

@cor_tsar: well yes I am if you knew shazam the Z stands for the power of zues so wouldn't that mean he's as powerful and H is strength of Hercules and hurcs stronger then his old man

#293 Posted by eternityx (2819 posts) - - Show Bio

@cor_tsar: well yes I am if you knew shazam the Z stands for the power of zues so wouldn't that mean he's as powerful and H is strength of Hercules and hurcs stronger then his old man

No... just no...

Anyway World Breaker Hulk takes this.

#294 Posted by Frozen (16241 posts) - - Show Bio
Online
#295 Posted by Hulkman123 (1761 posts) - - Show Bio

WB Hulk without much difficulty.

#296 Posted by Wolverine08 (45544 posts) - - Show Bio

Let's calculate Hulk's speed!

Online
#297 Edited by Stefano (351 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain marvel! He is just as strong, if not stronger, faster, has magic and the wisdom of Solomon

#298 Posted by Experio (17156 posts) - - Show Bio

#299 Edited by dum529001 (1658 posts) - - Show Bio

@wolverine08 said:

Let's calculate Hulk's speed!

producing tens of megatons of force with a punch, like 16 megatons, is the same as accelerating a billion tons of earth at 24 times the speed of sound.

Hulk being the smaller object, would being giving the same force, but be moving at greater speed.

That's one basic example of Hulk power. Obviously, the Hulk is way more powerful than that.

Another example of power is his jumping abilty. No mattter how strong you are, you need great speed to cover vast distances before the gravity of earth pulls you down.

The basis of Hulk's power is gamma rays. That's energy that comes from vibrating very fast.

The speed at which electromagnetic waves go in the horizontal direction isn't what gives them their great power. The mass of the wave is so tiny that the speed means nothing, even going at lightspeed.

Gamma waves are transverse waves, like all other elecetromagnetic raditaion. Their maximum power is not determined by how fast they move in the horizontal direction, but on how fast they shake up and down. The true power of the wave does not move in the same direction that it makes its long distance travels.

Hulk physical power is gamma rays, which is electromagnetic field that vibrates super-fast. So fast do these waves vibrate that they give off energy that is equaivalent to a great many tiny masses each individually moving at light-speed. Combine those masses and speeds and see what you get. The perdpendicular oscsillation of a gamma ray is so fast that an electromagnetic wave travels no more than picometer in its horizontal motion within the same moment one oscillation has been completed in the perpendicular direction.

Large quantities of gamma rays are emitted by the sun and gamm ray bursts can light up a universe and outshine all other stars for a brief time.

#300 Posted by Experio (17156 posts) - - Show Bio

Hulk!