Wonder Woman vs Martian Manhunter
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Btw this has been done before.damn i searched it and nothing came up
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/martian-manhunter-vs-wonder-woman/380900/
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/wonder-woman-vs-martian-manhunter/558523/
@Bucketz said:Yea, its okay, the search function isn't always reliable.Btw this has been done before.damn i searched it and nothing came up
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/martian-manhunter-vs-wonder-woman/380900/
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/wonder-woman-vs-martian-manhunter/558523/
I'm pretty sure that decapitation is out. Wonder Woman's only chance is to get the lasso around him before he goes intangible. She's done it before. If she doesn't do that, I'm afraid she's hosed. Especially in scenario 2.
I know MM has more powers and i think he could definetly take this but is Diana still physicaly stronger than him?
@Switchdoctor: couldn't he just phase through the lasso if she got him?Not if the lasso is around him. If she manages that, then she can compel him to remain in his natural form.
Which, despite what a League of One would have you believe (a series that may or may not even be canon by the way), he retains his powers whether he reverts to his natural form or not. Half of his life on Mars was spent in his natural form, but his powers still operated. In his 1988 miniseries, H'ronmeer forced him into his natural state, and he still retained his powers. A possibly non-canon series that depicts the opposite of established facts, those facts being that his powers are active regardless of his physical form, does not overrule several other showings.@odinforce said:
@Switchdoctor: couldn't he just phase through the lasso if she got him?Not if the lasso is around him. If she manages that, then she can compel him to remain in his natural form.
You need to do better than that.
Edit: How would it even make sense for him to lose his powers in his natural form to begin with? If his powers are shut off in his natural form, then he would never be able to shape shift again...
Anyway, since this has been done before.....
@Bucketz said:
Btw this has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/martian-manhunter-vs-wonder-woman/380900/
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/wonder-woman-vs-martian-manhunter/558523/
@Thor's hammmer: i dont think so. isnt martian supposed to have equal strength to superman (or fairly around that)? and superman strength > wonder woman strength
I've heard the same but from what i've seen from both of them when compaared directly and indirectly she seems stronger.
@Switchdoctor said:Which, despite what a League of One would have you believe (a series that may or may not even be canon by the way), he retains his powers whether he reverts to his natural form or not.@odinforce said:
@Switchdoctor: couldn't he just phase through the lasso if she got him?Not if the lasso is around him. If she manages that, then she can compel him to remain in his natural form.
I never said that the lasso removed J'onn's powers, and neither did the comic. The lasso compelled him not to use them.
Half of his life on Mars was spent in his natural form, but his powers still operated.
Yes, but he didn't spend half his life with a magic lasso around him.
In his 1988 miniseries, H'ronmeer forced him into his natural state, and he still retained his powers.
H'ronmeer =/= Magic Lasso
A possibly non-canon series that depicts the opposite of established facts, those facts being that his powers are active regardless of his physical form, does not overrule several other showings.
Uh, how is this non-canon?
That certainly seemed to be the implication. On the page after the one you posted, it says that she forced him into his natural form to buy time wherein he would be incapable of offering resistance. Her exact words were, "Show me your true form," not, "Stop using your powers." If his form had nothing to do with his powers, then what was the point of changing him?I never said that the lasso removed J'onn's powers, and neither did the comic. The lasso compelled him not to use them.
H'ronmeer burning him > Magic lasso.H'ronmeer =/= Magic Lasso
I said it was possibly non-canon, and to answer your question, the same way Scary Monsters is only ambiguously canon. They have never been referenced in other material, and I have heard of them being cited as non-canon series. Furthermore, in other titles, characters have said that they have never seen the Manhunter in his true form before while in this series that happened.Uh, how is this non-canon?
I also have to question why this series would be used as an argument in the first place. This is the same series where Diana's strategy for beating Flash was to just to make him trip, when he has run on harsher terrains than a forest without blundering, not to mention that he has ran through forests without that happening before anyway. Characters lost about 100 IQ points for A League of One. It was fine as a story, but power-wise, it was pathetic.
This is kind of silly with the lasso thing he would just dodge it or maybe shoot it with his martian vision. MM would take this it would be hard but he would. He would just poor on the vision until she gets close then put 1 of his hands into a liquid and then put it down her throat as he punches her in the head (not the tiara).
This is kind of silly with the lasso thing he would just dodge it or maybe shoot it with his martian vision.Well, dodging it was not really the problem. He was unaware Wonder Woman intended to attack him; so that is more understandable. What lacks sense is his impotence while wrapped in it. Besides, there are examples like this that contradict it.
@Switchdoctor said:That certainly seemed to be the implication. On the page after the one you posted, it says that she forced him into his natural form to buy time wherein he would be incapable of offering resistance. Her exact words were, "Show me your true form," not, "Stop using your powers." If his form had nothing to do with his powers, then what was the point of changing him?I never said that the lasso removed J'onn's powers, and neither did the comic. The lasso compelled him not to use them.
H'ronmeer burning him > Magic lasso.H'ronmeer =/= Magic Lasso
I said it was possibly non-canon, and to answer your question, the same way Scary Monsters is only ambiguously canon. They have never been referenced in other material, and I have heard of them being cited as non-canon series. Furthermore, in other titles, characters have said that they have never seen the Manhunter in his true form before while in this series that happened. I also have to question why this series would be used as an argument in the first place. This is the same series where Diana's strategy for beating Flash was to just to make him trip, when he has run on harsher terrains than a forest without blundering, not to mention that he has ran through forests without that happening before anyway. Characters lost about 100 IQ points for A League of One. It was fine as a story, but power-wise, it was pathetic.Uh, how is this non-canon?
Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?
Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?He can switch between them.
@Switchdoctor said:I didn't ask if he could switch between solid or phased, I asked what his true form was.Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?He can switch between them.
@Silver2467 said:If you mean whether he would more commonly be tangible or intangible while in this form, probably tangible, but that holds for anything. He could turn into a mouse and render himself intangible and then tangible again. His natural form has nothing to do with tangibility, and to be honest, neither does any other shape he chooses to act in.@Switchdoctor said:I didn't ask if he could switch between solid or phased, I asked what his true form was.Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?He can switch between them.
What does this have to do with the discussion?
@Switchdoctor said:I think you know exaclty what this has to do with this discussion, because you keep trying to skirt around the issue with a lot of verbose tangents. J'onn in his natural form is tangible, therefore susceptible to being snagged by the lasso.@Silver2467 said:If you mean whether he would more commonly be tangible or intangible while in this form, probably tangible, but that holds for anything. He could turn into a mouse and render himself intangible and then tangible again. His natural form has nothing to do with tangibility, and to be honest, neither does any other shape he chooses to act in. What does this have to do with the discussion?@Switchdoctor said:I didn't ask if he could switch between solid or phased, I asked what his true form was.Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?He can switch between them.
@Silver2467 said:Just for the sake of humoring your strawman argument, obviously he would be wrapped in the lasso considering he was already tangible when she tried that. This does not detract from the fact that he could just turn intangible on the fly regardless of what form he was in.@Switchdoctor said:I think you know exaclty what this has to do with this discussion, because you keep trying to skirt around the issue with a lot of verbose tangents. J'onn in his natural form is tangible, therefore susceptible to being snagged by the lasso.@Silver2467 said:If you mean whether he would more commonly be tangible or intangible while in this form, probably tangible, but that holds for anything. He could turn into a mouse and render himself intangible and then tangible again. His natural form has nothing to do with tangibility, and to be honest, neither does any other shape he chooses to act in. What does this have to do with the discussion?@Switchdoctor said:I didn't ask if he could switch between solid or phased, I asked what his true form was.Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?He can switch between them.
This is accomplishing nothing. The canonicity of the comic is debatable, the showing is circumstantial to him being unaware that she wanted to attack him, and even if she could revert him to his normal form, he could still just turn intangible or melt out of the lasso.
@Switchdoctor said:? On the contrary. He would not be able to go intangible at all because the lasso is compelling him to show Wonder Woman his true form. His true form is tangible. J'onn would be SOL.@Silver2467 said:Just for the sake of humoring your strawman argument, obviously he would be wrapped in the lasso considering he was already tangible when she tried that. This does not detract from the fact that he could just turn intangible on the fly regardless of what form he was in.@Switchdoctor said:I think you know exaclty what this has to do with this discussion, because you keep trying to skirt around the issue with a lot of verbose tangents. J'onn in his natural form is tangible, therefore susceptible to being snagged by the lasso.@Silver2467 said:If you mean whether he would more commonly be tangible or intangible while in this form, probably tangible, but that holds for anything. He could turn into a mouse and render himself intangible and then tangible again. His natural form has nothing to do with tangibility, and to be honest, neither does any other shape he chooses to act in. What does this have to do with the discussion?@Switchdoctor said:I didn't ask if he could switch between solid or phased, I asked what his true form was.Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?He can switch between them.
I would love to see how you intend to substantiate this. When has Martian shape changing been reliant or in any way related to intangibility? Because he has turned intangible while in his true form. And if he is forced by the lasso to show her his true form, what does that have to do with tangibility anyway? Would that not be more respective of invisibility? LOL.@Silver2467 said:
? On the contrary. He would not be able to go intangible at all because the lasso is compelling him to show Wonder Woman his true form. His true form is tangible. J'onn would be SOL.@Switchdoctor said:
Just for the sake of humoring your strawman argument, obviously he would be wrapped in the lasso considering he was already tangible when she tried that. This does not detract from the fact that he could just turn intangible on the fly regardless of what form he was in.@Silver2467 said:
@Switchdoctor said:I think you know exaclty what this has to do with this discussion, because you keep trying to skirt around the issue with a lot of verbose tangents. J'onn in his natural form is tangible, therefore susceptible to being snagged by the lasso.@Silver2467 said:If you mean whether he would more commonly be tangible or intangible while in this form, probably tangible, but that holds for anything. He could turn into a mouse and render himself intangible and then tangible again. His natural form has nothing to do with tangibility, and to be honest, neither does any other shape he chooses to act in. What does this have to do with the discussion?@Switchdoctor said:I didn't ask if he could switch between solid or phased, I asked what his true form was.Answer me this Silver. When J'onn is in his true form, is he phased or is he solid?He can switch between them.
Let's examine what the comic actually said. It lists the Martian's powers of shape shifting and telepathy as notable threats to Diana. It never references intangibility, invisibility, heat vision, or any other capabilities. She somehow meant to deprive him of utilization of those two powers, according to the narration, by compelling him to shift into his natural physical form. No mention of intangibility anywhere in this sequence. So your idea that he has no intangibility because he has to demonstrate his true shape is a false premise on your part to try to affirm your desired consequent, not to mention the fact that she said, "Show me your true form," implicating visibility not tangibility, and tangibility has nothing to do with visibility anyway. Martian forms have never been defined as tangible or intangible and made obsolete or altered if intangibility is used, thus making your entire point complete nonsense from the start. On to the next page, it says that Diana has only a few seconds to BFR him using the Watchtower teleporters. Ascertaining a few seconds without his usage of shape shifting and telepathy is hardly proof that she could beat him. It just means she could have a few seconds to throw as powerful a barrage as she can to hopefully incapacitate him before he recovers. This is improbable considering that he was caught off guard by his own trust for her whereas he would be prepared for a fight in this thread and because the canonicity of A League of One is suspect. In a real fight, he could evade the toss of her lasso or just turn intangible to allow it to pass through him. He could also render himself invisible to make sure she could never land it on him in the first place. As for his ability to beat her, he could grow extra limbs to fight her straightforwardly; phase his hand into her head and pull out her brain (he could do this if he was bloodlusted); combine usage of strength, speed, and heat vision to KO her; or just use telepathy.
You are grasping at straws.
@Static Shock said:
Anyway, since this has been done before.....
@Bucketz said:Btw this has been done before.
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/martian-manhunter-vs-wonder-woman/380900/
http://www.comicvine.com/forums/battles/7/wonder-woman-vs-martian-manhunter/558523/
thanks static
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