She only needs to hold her breath while phasing through an object since there isnt any air in the objects she phases through. Who is it to say Kitty starts off the fight in phase state.... its a ping pong arguement lol
I recall there being a certain circumstance for that scenario (Astonishing X-men, yes?). Also, let's not assume she begins phased, nor Emma would begin in diamond form.
I recall there being a certain circumstance for that scenario (Astonishing X-men, yes?). Also, let's not assume she begins phased, nor Emma would begin in diamond form. "
Does the circumstance have a big part on Kitty sneak attacking Emma...?
Tactical Expert... With a Beam, that Can Push u far Away and will hurt a lot who has a Female TAnk if she wishes to be or can read minds... and is one of the best Manipulators ever
vs
a Savage Warrior Who has Healing Factor and Heightened senses who has a female that can "avoid" having her mind read and can phase to anywhere... now Logan isnt the Best Tactician or fighter as he once was... but he sure aint dumb...
all i can say is Good Fight...
i see Emma trying to Control Logan... but Kitty... getting in the way... but Cy is tryin to neutralize Kitty... But Kitty phases threw beams
Kitty Makes it to Emma... Emma worries about Kitty... Logan is free... and Cy and logan... get it on... *Pause*...
and i can keep on goin... its jus a good fight to me... i cant imagine a winner right now
"i dunno... Tactical Expert... With a Beam, that Can Push u far Away and will hurt a lot who has a Female TAnk if she wishes to be or can read minds... and is one of the best Manipulators ever vs a Savage Warrior Who has Healing Factor and Heightened senses who has a female that can "avoid" having her mind read and can phase to anywhere... now Logan isnt the Best Tactician or fighter as he once was... but he sure aint dumb... all i can say is Good Fight... i see Emma trying to Control Logan... but Kitty... getting in the way... but Cy is tryin to neutralize Kitty... But Kitty phases threw beams Kitty Makes it to Emma... Emma worries about Kitty... Logan is free... and Cy and logan... get it on... *Pause*... and i can keep on goin... its jus a good fight to me... i cant imagine a winner right now "
Kitty isn't immune to tp when phased, just resistant. Jean and Emma have both affected Kitty while phased before. Unless they start very close to each other, and Kitty begins phased, then Emma should end this very quickly. She has stopped Wolverine while fully feral before. Kitty did get the better of Emma in the instance above, but they were both being manipulated by Cassandra Nova at the time, and were both on the verge of complete mental breakdown, and Emma was using her tp to project an incredibly complex illusion into the minds of the entire team. And even if it takes Emma a few moments with Kitty and she can't focus on Wolverine, Cyke has beaten Logan enough times before that it shouldn't be a problem. He can certainly hold him off long enough for Emma to finish Kitty and then finish Logan as well.
"Kitty isn't immune to tp when phased, just resistant. Jean and Emma have both affected Kitty while phased before. Unless they start very close to each other, and Kitty begins phased, then Emma should end this very quickly. She has stopped Wolverine while fully feral before. Kitty did get the better of Emma in the instance above, but they were both being manipulated by Cassandra Nova at the time, and were both on the verge of complete mental breakdown, and Emma was using her tp to project an incredibly complex illusion into the minds of the entire team. And even if it takes Emma a few moments with Kitty and she can't focus on Wolverine, Cyke has beaten Logan enough times before that it shouldn't be a problem. He can certainly hold him off long enough for Emma to finish Kitty and then finish Logan as well. "
No one said anything about Kitty being "immune to tp"... And your tactic with Emma and Cyclops working together can easily be broken with Kitty easily seperating the two by phasing one of them in a secluded area of the mansion away from their given partner... overall i see that it make a great fight.
All four of them are some of the most powerful mutants *solo* so this is quite an interesting match up.
Some facts to consider;
Wolverine is one of the best h2h fighters in the MU and I've heard it said that within the X Men at least, Kitty isn't far behind him. However, Scott is no slouch and can certainly hold his own against either. When it comes to physical combat, Emma is the weakest link.
Wolverine has to get close to Scott to do damage yet Scott can hit him from a distance. However, it all depends on whether Logan can dodge the attack or how fast it takes him to heal from it. Morally, Scott should be less willing to hurt Logan than Logan is to hurt him however, I can see it being the other way round and Scott using it as a way to vent all that pent up rage and Logan being a little squeemish about hurting a guy who he obviously has some respect for.
Kitty has the advantage over all of them except possibly Emma and that depends on how resistant she is to Emma's telepathy (something which changes depending on who is writing.) Scott can't hurt her as long as she stays phased and if Logan goes beserker, the worst she'd end up with is a bad case of nausea and dizziness.
Kitty's phasing is probably the best weapon her team has as is the case with Emma's telepathy. Being a level 10 telepath or whatever, I'm inclined to say that Emma has what it takes to get inside Kitty's mind, granted if Pryde doesn't manage to spring a surprise attack on her (which with her intelligence, resourcefulness and plain old sneakiness is also a possible outcome)
As with above, I can see Emma and Kitty's morals being reversed. Emma seems quite fond of Kitty whereas Kitty, at least once upon a time, claimed that Emma was her very own personification of evil. I can definitely see Emma holding back somewhat but I think if it comes to life and death, she would do what it takes to win.
So there are too many variables to come to any certain outcome, but since one of Kitty's weakness is psionic attacks and Emma is one of the best telepaths, my gut tells me that she at least would take the majority.
Though it'll depends on how things go, Emma could create illusions to distract Kitty, then at the same time psi-blast her mind, with Cyclops taking on Wolverine. Though Emma could take out Wolverine as Adamantium can't cut through Emma's diamond skin, proven from Daken when he asked her to go flesh so he can cut her. Though it would be hard to determine depending on who strikes first, but my guts says Emma was strike, as her telepathy is immense and strikes at top speed, while Cyclops try to blast Wolverine.
Truthfully, both Wolverine and Kitty have TP resistant and when Kitty is in phase state, she is completely immune to TP due to her not being present and Wolverine due to the Weapon X implants. So, Emma is nearly pointless. Only diamond form which Kitty could grab her heart in phase state and cause Cyke to surrender.
But that still leaves the question of how long would it take Emma to get into Kitty's mind?
Apparently, at one point, Jean Grey (who outclasses Emma in terms of telepathic skill) couldn't grab on to Kitty's mind. Does anyone know if this is true? I know writing is inconsistant at best but it would help in giving us a means of comparison.
"Though Emma could take out Wolverine as Adamantium can't cut through Emma's diamond skin, proven from Daken when he asked her to go flesh so he can cut her"
Daken's claws aren't adamantium. They are ferrous in nature but nowhere as strong as Logan's. And I see absolutely no reason why Logan's shouldn't be able to cut through Emma's diamond form.
Cyclops has shown that Wolverine can cause him to lose his cool, causing him to panic. Wolverine also has an extremely high resistance to telepathy of Emma's level.
Kitty has already kicked Emma's trash like nobody's business.
" @erik: that fight was hands-down one of my favorite moments in Whedon's run "
That entire series by Whedon was pure gold. I still read it. Cyclops was suddenly awesome in that series. "
I still read it, too. I find that almost anything by Whedon is pure gold (Firefly, how I love Nathan Fillion, and Dr. Horrible's Sing Along Blog) I was excited for the Avengers film before but when I found out that Joss was directing that made it sooo much better.
Hmm Wolverine has to resist for a second until Kitty phases him to making him even a higher invulnerable to psi, once that happens cyclops is dead. once cyc is dead emma goes diamond both logan and kitty wait her out and then boom either she gets pulled into the ground or trys her telepathy and bamn head lopped off by logan. Both kitty and logan have shown resistance to telepathy. They may not be 100 persent resistant but I believe enough to buy time.
I suppose if Jubilee were there, she could just blind everyone into submission with her awsum ability to burn peoples retinas out of their eyesockets. *eyeroll*
Wolverine is Marvel's golden boy. Speaks for itself.
Emma is one of the most skilled telepaths in the world.
Scott is a tactical genius with many years of experience behind him and eye blasts that could oh, I know, actually burn peoples retinas out of their eyesockets
Kitty can make herself untouchable. Untouchable (in most cases) means undefeatable. Therefore, untouchable means pretty damn powerful.
i think kitty and wolverine win. cyclops really can't do any damage to kitty and wolvie will heal. so he is pretty much useless. and kitty resisted the shadow king who i am pretty sure is more powerful than emma. besides with two highliy resistant people emma would probably be in her diamond form. cyke and emma lose.
on the astonish fight, what stopped emma from mindraping kitty when she was behind the mirror? nothing, wolverine is resistant to tp, but he is not inmune
also it has been said that kitty cannot phase organs out of people, because she would need to rip the organ out so that it is no longer attached to the body to phase it out and also by solidifiying her hand inside the body she may lose her hand aswell, anyway even if she could without losing her hand how would she if emmas heart is diamond? (that was proven in the comic where kitty is going to exchange sabretooth for jubilee who is being held by caliban, she also said that she would phase her hand into sabretooths head and that she wouldnt mind losing that hand if it would stop him)
Emma doesn't bleed in diamond form, doesn't need to eat, breathe, drink or sleep. Even if it was possible Kitty could phase Emma's diamond heart out I doubt it would do anything.
Emma's telepathy beats Wolverine - Kitty's phasing makes her invulnerable to telepathy Emma will need to go into diamond form to protect herself from Kitty - This greatly ruins her telepathy, meaning Logan can attack her (adamantium > diamond) Scott would need to defend Emma - Wolverine's shown incredible agility more than capable of dodging his blasts - If he tries his 'lawn-mower', Kitty will phase Logan through it
I'm going with Wolverine and Kitty Pryde. Great battle, nonetheless!
Kitty has been affected by telepathy when phased by both Emma and Jean. If Kitty was truly immune then Emma should have been able to link Kitty and Colossus when she was stuck in perma-phase. Wolverine has also been affected by Emma's telepathy in multiple occasions in the past and Cyclops has also been able to tag Wolverine on a consistent basis too.
I'd lean towards team 2 but Kitty and Wolverine's showing against telepaths and a few showings against Cyke show that a case could be made for team 1 I guess.
Good battle. I see a decent shots and advantages for both teams (especially BFR via Kitty of if they can get into melee range of Scott & Emma), but I think the slight edge goes to Cyclops and Emma. Instead of a flat out TP assault, Emma can still create illusions in Logan (i.e. - Kitty is Scott and smells like him too) and Kitty's (i.e. - make her believe she needs to be solid to save Scott) minds to throw them off balance or position them to be taken out by Cyclop's from range.
Good battle. I see a decent shots and advantages for both teams (especially BFR via Kitty of if they can get into melee range of Scott & Emma), but I think the slight edge goes to Cyclops and Emma. Instead of a flat out TP assault, Emma can still create illusions in Logan (i.e. - Kitty is Scott and smells like him too) and Kitty's (i.e. - make her believe she needs to be solid to save Scott) minds to throw them off balance or position them to be taken out by Cyclop's from range.
You know considering I'm one of the biggest Emma fans on the site and the starter of her cult group even before the raindrops made one for Storm, I always over look and forget about the illusions. She also said it was easier to make them than a flat out TP assault like in her fight with Shaw since a he was resisting a mindrape. I'm more of a psi-bolt, mind blast kind of person but still shame on me.
Good battle. I see a decent shots and advantages for both teams (especially BFR via Kitty of if they can get into melee range of Scott & Emma), but I think the slight edge goes to Cyclops and Emma. Instead of a flat out TP assault, Emma can still create illusions in Logan (i.e. - Kitty is Scott and smells like him too) and Kitty's (i.e. - make her believe she needs to be solid to save Scott) minds to throw them off balance or position them to be taken out by Cyclop's from range.
You know considering I'm one of the biggest Emma fans on the site and the starter of her cult group even before the raindrops made one for Storm, I always over look and forget about the illusions. She also said it was easier to make them than a flat out TP assault like in her fight with Shaw since a he was resisting a mindrape. I'm more of a psi-bolt, mind blast kind of person but still shame on me.
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