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#1 Edited by exodus0000000 (472 posts) - - Show Bio

Wolverine vs Guts (from Berserk manga)
 
We all know the beast, the man, the friend, the warrior, the soldier, the legend that is Wolverine.  His skill is unprecedented, his rage is unrivaled...UNTIL NOW!!! Honestly Guts is the manga incarnation of Logan.  The guy is wickedly skilled with a 7+ foot long sword along with other melee weapons.  He's basically haunted by demons every freakin night due to him being cursed during the Eclipse.  He defeats demi-gods, countless swordsmen, mid-high tier demons, and magic users.  He has also "recently" got his hands on a nifty demonic piece of armor that increases his prowess to the point where he can now somewhat effortlessly defeat said demi-gods...but at a very high price.  Guts is becoming more than just a mere man imo due to his excessive contacts with the demon/magic world, but that's just my opinion.  Who wins each scenario and why???



4 Scenarios:
1 - Bone Claw Wolverine vs Guts (without Beserker Armor)
2 - Adamantium Wolverine vs Guts (without Berserker Armor)
3 - Bone Claw Wolverine vs Guts (with Berserker Armor)
4 - Adamantium Wolverine vs Guts (with Berserker Armor)
#2 Posted by exodus0000000 (472 posts) - - Show Bio

anyone?

#3 Posted by SilverSentry (2481 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts
#4 Posted by exodus0000000 (472 posts) - - Show Bio

Why?

#5 Posted by geraldthesloth (33313 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts, he's extremely skilled and has what it takes to defeat wolverine.

#6 Posted by exodus0000000 (472 posts) - - Show Bio

Did you guys see the 4 different scenarios? I'm not disagreeing, just want to see who wins in each specific scenario for example:
 
1. Guts
2. Wolverine
3. Guts
4. Wolverine
 
or something to that effect.

#7 Posted by D3athstroke (3911 posts) - - Show Bio

I Really like Guts he is good Character and great Warrior 
I think That "Berserk" is great manga
But Wolverine will Cut his sword and Chop off his head in seconds

#8 Posted by geraldthesloth (33313 posts) - - Show Bio
@D3athstroke said:
" I Really like Guts he is good Character and great Warrior I think That "Berserk" is great manga But Wolverine will Cut his sword and Chop off his head in seconds "
Considering Guts is faster than Wolverine I find myself doubting that, not to mention he keeps extra tools besides his sword.
#9 Posted by D3athstroke (3911 posts) - - Show Bio
@geraldthesloth said:
" @D3athstroke said:
" I Really like Guts he is good Character and great Warrior I think That "Berserk" is great manga But Wolverine will Cut his sword and Chop off his head in seconds "
Considering Guts is faster than Wolverine I find myself doubting that, not to mention he keeps extra tools besides his sword. "
Arm Cannon ? )))
 
Wolverine is obviously faster Stronger smarter and more skilled than guts : )) 
#10 Edited by geraldthesloth (33313 posts) - - Show Bio
@D3athstroke: Arm Cannon, Auto Crossbow..There's a difference between a bullet and a canon sized projectile.
 
How is he faster,stronger,and more skilled than Guts?
#11 Edited by D3athstroke (3911 posts) - - Show Bio
@geraldthesloth said:

" @D3athstroke: Arm Cannon, Auto Crossbow..There's a difference between a bullet and a canon sized projectile. "

No no Don't get me wrong : )) 
I did not say that he can catch it ))
This scan just shows Wolverines Speed and Speed of his reaction ))
Also Guts Cannot cut through Adamantium so his Sword is useless ))
#12 Posted by exodus0000000 (472 posts) - - Show Bio

I honestly see both Logan's and Guts' skill and speed to be somewhat equal considering how it's mentioned many times throughout the Berserk manga that Guts can swing that huge blade so freakin fast that swarms of men/demons/creatures are decapitated instantly before they can even react.  I'd say Wolverine is stronger, but their fighting/combat experience may be equal.  I honestly can't give the nod to either of them in that department.  I just can't.  Wolverine fights mid-upper tier mutants/characters on a regular basis.  Guts takes on mid-upper tier demons/monsters on a regular basis.  Wolverine has fought highly skilled ninjas and other martial artists fairly frequently.  Guts has fought a rougue's gallery of demi-gods and come out on top (Nosferatu Zodd, dear God).  Although Guts has pretty much just "survived" against Zodd, but still that's a feat in itself for a human plus now he as access to the Berserker Armor.  I honestly believe that Zodd would give Logan a solid challenge...before his demon transformation.  So yeah I honestly say their skill/experience are equal.  Also Guts doesn't have the luxury of having a choice to either kill, or simply defeat his enemies...he HAS to rip thier f****** balls off.  Wolverine doesn't really have to kill most of his opponents, jut injure/knock em' senseless.  Just saying.  Beserk is ruthless.  Also in one of the scenarios Wolverine has bone claws and Guts is clad in the mystical/magical Beserker Armor so yeah.

#13 Posted by geraldthesloth (33313 posts) - - Show Bio
@D3athstroke: Besides the fact regular swords have pierced his skin.
#14 Posted by Tesseract (872 posts) - - Show Bio
@D3athstroke said:
" @geraldthesloth said:
" @D3athstroke said:
" I Really like Guts he is good Character and great Warrior I think That "Berserk" is great manga But Wolverine will Cut his sword and Chop off his head in seconds "
Considering Guts is faster than Wolverine I find myself doubting that, not to mention he keeps extra tools besides his sword. "
Arm Cannon ? )))
Wolverine is obviously faster Stronger smarter and more skilled than guts : ))  "
That's not canon...it's from Wolverine Darkness crossover...
#15 Posted by SlimJ87D (9657 posts) - - Show Bio

bump

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#16 Edited by SlimJ87D (9657 posts) - - Show Bio

 Here are some skill feats of Guts.  
 

Defeats this guy that has incredible agility and fighting skill.


 

 EDIT: Well I just made a long post of Gut's fight with Zodd... but the forum deleted it because of flood protection! Waste of 10 minutes...
 

Gut's vs Zodd second encounter.

Zodd is super humanly fast. He has fought and killed 300 men in one battle, literally. Guts manages to fight his human form to the point where he breaks Zodd's sword and Zodd turns into his true form. In the original Japanese kanji, Rickert comments that he can't even see the sword fight happening at one point. It's obvious that Rickert begins to follow the sword fight once they start flipping around the battlefield instead of just swinging and trading sword blows. Gut's sword is a 300lb slab of iron that has absorbed 100s of demons blood reinforcing it and making it a lot stronger.  


 

Because I got screwed, I don't feel like reposting the images all over again. Please read from page 50 to page 75 where the fight pretty much ends. 

http://www.mangareader.net/96-1142-50/berserk/chapter-22.html
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#17 Edited by AnnoyedImmortalSpirit (768 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts all 4 rounds...

He regularly kills enemies on another level than Logan!!(Apostles)

We are talking about monsters with instant hf, superstrenght, usually gigantic, sometimes able to fly or with indestructable armor, and one of them even had supersonic speed!!

It would be a good fight but Wolverine has no chance

#18 Posted by InFamous_Wolf (973 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts all 4 rounds...

He regularly kills enemies on another level than Logan!!(Apostles)

We are talking about monsters with instant hf, superstrenght, usually gigantic, sometimes able to fly or with indestructable armor, and one of them even had supersonic speed!!

It would be a good fight but Wolverine has no chance

Guts can cut through adamantium....

#19 Edited by AnnoyedImmortalSpirit (768 posts) - - Show Bio
@infamous_wolf said:

@annoyedimmortalspirit said:

Guts all 4 rounds...

He regularly kills enemies on another level than Logan!!(Apostles)

We are talking about monsters with instant hf, superstrenght, usually gigantic, sometimes able to fly or with indestructable armor, and one of them even had supersonic speed!!

It would be a good fight but Wolverine has no chance

Guts can cut through adamantium....

No, he would just KO him with the sword and put an arrow in his eyeball, he usually does this kind of stuff to kill armored demons and such...

EDIT: correction, he usually cuts through normal steel armors like nothing, i was referring to those Apostles that posses some seemingly indestructible body parts, if there's any weak spot he would locate it and exploit it

#20 Posted by Superbot400 (420 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts all 4 rounds...

He regularly kills enemies on another level than Logan!!(Apostles)

We are talking about monsters with instant hf, superstrenght, usually gigantic, sometimes able to fly or with indestructable armor, and one of them even had supersonic speed!!

It would be a good fight but Wolverine has no chance

The same could be said about Wolverine too about the enemies that Wolverine fights, but I think Beserker Guts beats Wolverine. I think Wolverine with adamantium has a shot at beating Guts without his crazy armor.

#21 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts wins round 3, but Wolvie takes the others. Guts is just a dude, Logan is faster than he is.

#22 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (16721 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts should be able to KO logan. Main thing he needs to know is adamantium indestructible-cut-through-anything properties.

Guts is just a dude

Guts stopped being 'just a dude' after that fight with zodd..

#23 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: I guess that's fair, but Logan would just shred his sword and then shred him.

#24 Posted by SleightOfHand (32 posts) - - Show Bio

Logan might have shot in scenario 2. For the others, Guts takes it.

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#26 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari: I don't think you can prove that Guts' sword will have more effect on Logan. It harms demons, why would it harm him? And he is fast enough. Look at the scan above you. He caught a bullet. Guts could catch a bullet, or do anything close to that. Also, even if guts was on equal speed levels with Wolverine, he could regen off most of the wounds inflicted. It's not like Guts could just run up and chop Logan in half, he's too fast for that. I see it them sparring with Logan healing and Guts not until Logan can get inside his guard and chop him up.

#27 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio
@romulusaugustus said:

@uberhikari: I don't think you can prove that Guts' sword will have more effect on Logan. It harms demons, why would it harm him? And he is fast enough. Look at the scan above you. He caught a bullet. Guts could catch a bullet, or do anything close to that. Also, even if guts was on equal speed levels with Wolverine, he could regen off most of the wounds inflicted. It's not like Guts could just run up and chop Logan in half, he's too fast for that. I see it them sparring with Logan healing and Guts not until Logan can get inside his guard and chop him up.

The sword was not designed to kill demons; it started out as a normal sword, although it's 300 pounds. Guts can use it on anything just like a regular sword, however, as it became infused with spiritual energy it started harming the soul of its targets in addition to cutting them physically. That's just the way the sword works and I don't see why Logan would be immune to that.

Second, as somebody has pointed out, that scan of Wolverine catching a bullet is not canon. But even if it was Guts is still faster than Logan because he's pushing hypersonic speed. Look at the scans posted above. And that doesn't take into account Guts's fight with Serpico or his Berserker armor.

Third, Guts doesn't have to kill Wolverine he could simply K.O. him, which he has more than enough strength to do. If the conditions for defeat were that Guts had to kill Wolverine then the fight would be fundamentally unfair because Wolverine can't die. Moreover, Wolverine isn't regenerating from damage done to his soul.\

Edit: Just to clarify something, in Berserk demons are actual physical beings. They can be cut physically just like humans.

#28 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

@uberhikari: I'm aware of the backstory, I read the entire series a few weeks back. He is nowhere near hypersonic. You realize that he was relatively comparable to Serpico in that duel right? Granted, Serpico lost, but he's a regular guy. Talented, but normal. Also, Guts couldn't KO wolverine. If he punches him, he hits his Adamantium skull and breaks his hand.

Also, the Swords effects on the soul haven't been shown to effect combat.

#29 Edited by uberhikari (2474 posts) - - Show Bio

@romulusaugustus said:

@uberhikari: I'm aware of the backstory, I read the entire series a few weeks back. He is nowhere near hypersonic. You realize that he was relatively comparable to Serpico in that duel right? Granted, Serpico lost, but he's a regular guy. Talented, but normal. Also, Guts couldn't KO wolverine. If he punches him, he hits his Adamantium skull and breaks his hand.

Also, the Swords effects on the soul haven't been shown to effect combat.

Saying Serpico is a normal human being is like saying Guts is a normal human being. It's nonsensical. Serpico has superhuman speed just like Guts, if he didn't he would have been cut to pieces 1 second into the fight. Guts has killed 100 soldiers simultaneously without rest in 1 night but Serpico almost dueled Guts to a draw. So, saying Serpico is normal is low-balling to the extreme. Furthermore, Guts is hypersonic in the Berserker Armor. If you've really read the manga you would know this.

Second, who said Guts would have to punch him? Hitting him with the flat part of a 300 pound sword at supersonic speed would do it. Or cannonballs to the face. Moreover, why wouldn't Guts' striking strength be enough to KO Wolverine? Guts breaks his hand? Adamantium isn't a get out of jail free card, you can't just arbitrarily invoke it without justification. If Guts has enough striking strength to KO Wolverine, then Wolverine gets KO'd; it's as simple as that.

Third, Guts' sword hasn't been shown to affect combat? Oh you mean like when Guts was in the troll cave and Slan (a member of the God Hand) made a body out of troll intestines and Guts was actually able to injure her astral body? You said you read the manga, right? You don't remember this? Again, if Wolverine gets cut by Guts it's pretty much game over.

Edit: Here's the scans from Guts's fight with Slan

As you can see, Guts fires a cannonball at her but it has no effect. Then Skull Knight tells Guts that his sword would be more effective. Skull Knight states, "With that sword of yours it's possible. It has been forged by the curses of its thousands of victims. Take that sword and impale her." And when Guts impales Slan her body instantly dissolves.

#30 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (16721 posts) - - Show Bio

@romulusaugustus said:

@uberhikari: I don't think you can prove that Guts' sword will have more effect on Logan. It harms demons, why would it harm him? And he is fast enough. Look at the scan above you. He caught a bullet. Guts could catch a bullet, or do anything close to that.

He should be able to. iirc the rings of that kunshan leader were near-invisible with speed. And guts caught them. Maybe they are not bullet speed, but that was very early in the series for Guts. Current Guts, or at least berserker armor guts should be able to replicate the feat. @slimj87d: do you still have the scans from that fight, or is my memory betraying me?

#31 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

Slan is a demon, therefore the blade affects her that way. I've said this multiple times during this exchange.

I've read the entire manga, and never have I seen Guts even come close to breaking the sound barrier. Either you're exaggerating or the meaning of that word has changed. That fact alone breaks your argument.

Logan has taken bullets to the head, and Guts doesn't have striking force greater than what Wolvie has taken. I'll include some strength and speed feats, because I realize that this is all blather without them :P

Example of wolverine dodging bullets, I have a more recent one if this is too dated.

Takes a flying supersonic jet to the back...... And lets himself in.... Durability.

Standing on the surface of the sun, healing all the while, and just marginally being overwhelmed. If he can take the sun, he can handle an arm cannon.

Taking gunfire from a high caliber handgun without skipping a beat.

Wolverine is too much for Guts to handle in every department. the strength speed and healing together are too much.

#32 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: The throwing rings? No arm can match a handgun in power, although that was a cool fight :D

#33 Edited by those_eyes (5946 posts) - - Show Bio

guts will ko him.

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#34 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (16721 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: The throwing rings? No arm can match a handgun in power, although that was a cool fight :D

It can in fiction..

Have you seen monkey D. Garp (one piece) btw?

#35 Posted by Theorder14 (1446 posts) - - Show Bio

Guts pwns

#36 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio
#37 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (16721 posts) - - Show Bio

@romulusaugustus: Well, it's quite fun to read. But garp throws around canonballs at speeds faster than actual canons, and rayleigh throws bullets/stones fast enough to destroy canon balls :o

#38 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: Huh. Have you seen the anime version of that fight with the Kushan assassin? His blades are quick, but clearly visible.

#39 Edited by Super_SoldierXII (6239 posts) - - Show Bio

Wolverine takes this.

One's of Guts' greater feats was fighting and defeating 100 swordsmen at once. (But with difficulty. Considerable difficulty). That feat made him legendary. For Wolverine, cutting through scores of cannon fodder like that is par for the course.

I think a fight with Bone Wolverine could go either way (especially with the armor) due to decapitation and dismemberment being an option for victory ... but the metal makes Wolverine a very bad match for Guts. With it, Logan's soaked sword strikes from Skaar wielding a bigger blade and with far, far more power behind the swings. Likewise, a superhuman alien race designed to wipe out Earth's superhero population couldn't drop Wolverine with swords bigger than Guts' own (they pierced him straight through his core with a blade far larger and longer than Logan's body, then chopped at his neck and still, Wolverine didn't drop).

Then there's battles with Silver Samurai, battles Wolverine has won at will despite the damage he soaks. Harada is fast enough to deflect multiple bullets with his sword, and has even split a bullet with a sword swipe. So lets not undermine his abilities with a blade whence compared to Guts' own.

Point being, Wolverine can take the damage Guts can lay down. Whereas it's only a matter of a clean claw swipe before Guts goes down.

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#40 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Wolverine takes this.

One's of Guts' greater feats was fighting and defeating 100 swordsmen at once. (But with difficulty. Considerable difficulty). That feat made him legendary. For Wolverine, cutting through scores of cannon fodder like that is par for the course.

What are you talking about?

Beating a 100 fodder soldiers <<<<<<<<< Killing Apostles.

Just saying, it is nowhere his greatest feat, more like a lesser feat.

Also what can Wolverine do against Soul Rape?

#41 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: It has never been shown that the sword has any adverse affect on humans. Also, if you'll look at my scans, wolverine can dodge bullets, stand on the surface of the sun, and be rear ended by a supersonic jet. Guts can do.... NONE of those.

#42 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@romulusaugustus said:

@cadencev2: It has never been shown that the sword has any adverse affect on humans. Also, if you'll look at my scans, wolverine can dodge bullets, stand on the surface of the sun, and be rear ended by a supersonic jet. Guts can do.... NONE of those.

Stand on the surface of the sun... you think I should take you seriously? LOL. A Nuke did this to wolverine lol.

The sun is millions of Nukes in one ball of gas.

By your logic, Wolverine can beat Thor, Silver Surfer, Sentry, ect. I mean wow.

Also bullet dodging, big deal. Punisher can dodge bullets.

#43 Posted by Wolverine08 (41098 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2:

Stand on the surface of the sun... you think I should take you seriously?

He's referring to the finale of Grant Morrison's Planet X storyline where James momentarily stood by the sun with the Phoenix carrying him away. He healed relatively quickly, but was just having a little delay in healing his eyes.

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#44 Edited by Super_SoldierXII (6239 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2 said:

@super_soldierxii said:

Wolverine takes this.

One's of Guts' greater feats was fighting and defeating 100 swordsmen at once. (But with difficulty. Considerable difficulty). That feat made him legendary. For Wolverine, cutting through scores of cannon fodder like that is par for the course.

What are you talking about?

Beating a 100 fodder soldiers <<<<<<<<< Killing Apostles.

Just saying, it is nowhere his greatest feat, more like a lesser feat.

Also what can Wolverine do against Soul Rape?

If you say so.

Re-watch the episode where he does defeat the soldiers then come back and try telling me it didn't kick his ass and he didn't struggle to get it done. Heck, another of his accomplishments is defeating Bazuso who everyone is intimated against because he managed to kill 30 men at once (another "yawn" feat for Wolverine). He even almost lost that fight.

He's reputed to be the most skilled swordsman of his time - but he's still human with human stats (until "somewhat" enhanced by Berserker armor and his sword).

The Dragonslayer blade won't do diddly to adamantium. The inverse won't hold true.

Apostles are not Wolverine's league. Not even close.

And, what about "Soul Rape"?

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#45 Posted by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: When did I say Wolverine can beat any of those people? That's preposterous. Look at the scans, he can be reduced to a skeleton and comes back. Gut's doesn't have the power to keep him down. Even if Logan's offense is inferior to Guts', his regeneration and durability would wear the Black Swordsman out.

#46 Posted by ThatGuyWithHeadPhones (10874 posts) - - Show Bio

100 men slayer Guts is sooooooooooooooo below current Guts that the fact that people are bringing up is disturbing to me. Hell 1 year after the 100 men thing Guts becomes stronger and is able to kill 40+ men with no form of difficulty.

And this Guts would be nothing but one shot material to the current Guts.

#47 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2:

Stand on the surface of the sun... you think I should take you seriously?

He's referring to the finale of Grant Morrison's Planet X storyline where James momentarily stood by the sun with the Phoenix carrying him away. He healed relatively quickly, but was just having a little delay in healing his eyes.

That I can believe.

#48 Edited by RomulusAugustus (270 posts) - - Show Bio
#49 Posted by Cjdavis103 (9048 posts) - - Show Bio

@annoyedimmortalspirit: how is he going to get past an industry table skeleton ? I see guts taking Bone wolverine and that is it

#50 Posted by SlimJ87D (9657 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: they are in my guts posts I'm not on a PC right now sorry.

Guts swinging a 300 lb sword at blitzing speed will cut lots of flesh off of wolverine, these aren't simple bullets these are chunks of muscle gone and severe blunt force trauma, wolverine will bleed out and pass out for 10 seconds that grants a win.

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