What Non metahuman can beat Deathstroke?

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FinalStar86

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#201  Edited By FinalStar86
@Xi Felix: Well to be fair, Deadshot can tag just about anyone, even characters with superhuman speed
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Xi Felix

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#202  Edited By Xi Felix
@FinalStar86 said:
" @Xi Felix: Well to be fair, Deadshot can tag just about anyone, even characters with superhuman speed"

Right. I'm not saying I'd give him the majority over Slade, just that he(in fact) CAN beat him.
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The_Ghostshell

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#203  Edited By The_Ghostshell
@FinalStar86 said:
" I think the Titans East arc showed that when he is being series he should be able to take Cass out "
He didn't even fight her in the Titans East Arc, Rose did while Cass was drugged with some mind controlling serum. As for the dumbbell incident I didn't see him "toying around" with her at all. In fact just the opposite. He all but flat out admits he cant beat her without distracting/getting inside her head, or be taking her out from long range.
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omdway

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#204  Edited By omdway

In terms of H2H i'd put money on Cap or Blk Panther. 
 
Daredevil is underrated and also stand a fair chance.  Would Blade be categorised as superhuman or...? 
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FinalStar86

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#205  Edited By FinalStar86
@Gambler: I am pretty sure In that same story arc he was owning her and Ravager at the same time, and if were going by statements Cass has mentioned that Slade doesn't give it his all when he fights her
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The_Ghostshell

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#206  Edited By The_Ghostshell
@FinalStar86 said:
" @Gambler:In that same story arc he was owning her and Ravager at the same time along with Nightwing, and if were going by statements Cass has mentioned that Slade doesn't give it his all when he fights her "
What? When did Slade own Rose, Nightwing, and Cass at the same time in Titans East? Cass was on his side, and after Robin freed her mind, Nightwing knocked her out to prevent her from killing Slade. Could you refresh my memory when exactly Slade owned those three?
lol come on dude, you're slanting the facts. Cass said one time that Slade was toying with her, and as the story unfolds we find out why. Slade was saving Cass for his daughter, which backfires and ends with Rose getting her throat cut. She's never said that Slade doesn't give it his all when he fights her.
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Son_of_Magnus

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#207  Edited By Son_of_Magnus
@Gambler: Ya and when she was freed from her mind control she went after Slade and was only saved when a Jericho controlled Inertia grabbed Slade. The only reason she had a chance for a killing blow was because Slade just single handily held off The Titans and Outsiders and was plotting his escape plan she did not even come close to single handily take him down. Even when Tim Dick Ravager Donna Troy and Jericho were involved it was not enough
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Static Shock

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#208  Edited By Static Shock

I had a feeling someone was twisting things around.

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FinalStar86

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#209  Edited By FinalStar86

Wait a minute, I don't even remember Donna being in that story arc....

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Son_of_Magnus

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#210  Edited By Son_of_Magnus
@FinalStar86 said:
" Wait a minute, I don't even remember Donna being in that story arc.... "
She came when The Outsiders came to the call
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Nerveshatter

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#211  Edited By Nerveshatter

Is Moon Knight metahuman?

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Static Shock

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#212  Edited By Static Shock
@Nerveshatter: Nope. Not anymore.
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DreadPirateRemy

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#213  Edited By DreadPirateRemy

Anyone in the Bat Family can beat Slade, and Slade can beat anyone in the Bat Family as well. It goes both ways, but there are other heroes that can beat him...Green Arrow for instance. Oliver Queen went to train under the same master that trained Slade, and has brought down Slade singlehandedly before. Slade had to threaten to take the life of Canary in order to stop GA so, yeah there are plenty of non meta's who can bring down Slade just in the DCU alone.

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FinalStar86

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#214  Edited By FinalStar86
@DreadPirateRemy:Just curious but, can you name these issues that Green Arrow brought that Slade, I am interested in reading them.
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Static Shock

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#215  Edited By Static Shock
@DreadPirateRemy: Green Arrow only did it because he had a serious amount of prep. His office was rigged with traps, IIRC, and he was wearing special boots that enhanced his speed. It wasn't just the swordsmanship he gained from Natas that helped him win.
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omdway

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#216  Edited By omdway

Wesley "Wanted" Gibson snipes or curves the bullet.
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Silver2467

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#217  Edited By Silver2467
@omdway said:
" In terms of H2H i'd put money on Cap or Blk Panther.  Daredevil is underrated and also stand a fair chance.  Would Blade be categorised as superhuman or...?  "
Panther can defeat him. Cap, unlikely. Daredevil would get dramatically curbstomped in a heartbeat. 
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omdway

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#218  Edited By omdway
@Silver2467 said:
" @omdway said:
" In terms of H2H i'd put money on Cap or Blk Panther.  Daredevil is underrated and also stand a fair chance.  Would Blade be categorised as superhuman or...?  "
Panther can defeat him. Cap, unlikely. Daredevil would get dramatically curbstomped in a heartbeat.  "

@Silver2467:  Panther - Yes 
Cap - Possibly 
Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns.
 
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DreadPirateRemy

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#219  Edited By DreadPirateRemy
@Static Shock:  I also talking about when GA fought him and Drakon within the factory and started fighting too random for Slade to handle. Therefore Slade had to take Canary hostage because he was fearful of losing again. And he was not wearing speed boots, just boots that made him able to walk on the glue. 
 
@FinalStar86:  I don't really remember, but I know it is near to when he proposes to Canary. Sorry wish I remembered more.
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omdway

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#220  Edited By omdway

Jet Li with or without the power derived from being one of the Last Two in the Multiverse.  But probably safer to utilise it, yes?
LoL
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Silver2467

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#221  Edited By Silver2467
@omdway said: 
@Silver2467:  Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns.   "
Panther- Yes.  
Cap- Unlikely. 
Daredevil- No way in the world. Deathstroke has clobbered BatMan, and Bats is superior to Daredevil in every way except senses. Deathstroke would demolish Daredevil. 
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Static Shock

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#222  Edited By Static Shock
@DreadPirateRemy: Damn! What issue was that!? :D
 

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#223  Edited By The_Ghostshell

 
@Son_of_Magnus said:

" @Gambler: Ya and when she was freed from her mind control she went after Slade and was only saved when a Jericho controlled Inertia grabbed Slade.  "

Saved her from what exactly? You make it sound as if she was seconds away from being killed. She tackled him, he rolled on top of her, and then Jericho stepped in.
 
  
@Son_of_Magnus said:

" The only reason she had a chance for a killing blow was because Slade just single handily held off The Titans and Outsiders and was plotting his escape plan"

  It was only Nightwing, Donna Troy, Jerhico, and Ravanger. Lets not make it out as if he had just gone toe to toe with the Outsiders and Teen Titans. But anyway I think you missed the point. How or why she had a chance at a killing blow is moot. The point is in that story arc Cass and Deathstroke didn't have a legitimate fight :)


@Son_of_Magnus said:

" she did not even come close to single handily take him down. Even when Tim Dick Ravager Donna Troy and Jericho were involved it was not enough "

Who said anything about her "Single handily taking him down" in Titans East? Again, she doesn't even fight him. She gets jobbed by Nightwing before anything happens. And yet we've seen Rose, Cass, David Cain, and Dick hang with Deathstroke by themselves so you figure it out lol
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FinalStar86

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#224  Edited By FinalStar86
@omdway said:
" @Silver2467 said:
" @omdway said:
" In terms of H2H i'd put money on Cap or Blk Panther.  Daredevil is underrated and also stand a fair chance.  Would Blade be categorised as superhuman or...?  "
Panther can defeat him. Cap, unlikely. Daredevil would get dramatically curbstomped in a heartbeat.  "
@Silver2467:  Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns.   "
Most street levelers have held their own against Spidey, he holds back alot, is incompetent and can't fight for crap
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Static Shock

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#225  Edited By Static Shock

Any martial artist taking Spider-Man in a physical fight shouldn't be used as a feat.

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#226  Edited By DreadPirateRemy
@Static Shock: Not sure, but I know GA just gives up after seeing Canary almost get killed and says "Take me instead." I believe the Justice league flies in and saves the day, but Slade and Drakon escape because it was their planned ambush on GA and they had things set up to get away from the Justice League. Good times. I don't know the exact issue # but I know that GA proposes to Canary like right after.
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Static Shock

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#227  Edited By Static Shock
@DreadPirateRemy: Aight. Thanks.
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omdway

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#228  Edited By omdway

@FinalStar86: 
Although he didnt hold back against Electro in that Story arc where Aunt May got buried alive and he fights his way to the truth. But yeh he likes to web people up and jobs at times. He's so high and mighty.  

@Silver2467:

Yeh i kno Bats got creamed TWICE in the same issue, but -- phooee...tbh Slade tagged the Flash thats all there is to it i suppose. 

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FinalStar86

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#229  Edited By FinalStar86
@DreadPirateRemy said:
" @Static Shock: Not sure, but I know GA just gives up after seeing Canary almost get killed and says "Take me instead." I believe the Justice league flies in and saves the day, but Slade and Drakon escape because it was their planned ambush on GA and they had things set up to get away from the Justice League. Good times. I don't know the exact issue # but I know that GA proposes to Canary like right after. "
That's GA 75
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Static Shock

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#230  Edited By Static Shock
@FinalStar86: Which volume?
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#231  Edited By Silver2467
@Static Shock said:
" Any martial artist taking Spider-Man in a physical fight shouldn't be used as a feat. "
Why? Are you saying it's not legitimate, or are you saying it's just not impressive enough to be a feat?
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FinalStar86

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#232  Edited By FinalStar86
@Static Shock said:
" @FinalStar86: Which volume? "
Third
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#233  Edited By Static Shock
@Silver2467:Not impressive enough. Too many people below Spider-Man (Cap did it twice, Black Panther did it briefly, Shang Chi, classic Iron Fist, classic Moon Knight, Wolverine, Daredevil on several occasions, Kingpin, Punisher, etc) have given him problems in physical combat. I'm under the impression that any considerably-skilled fighter could give Spider-Man problems because he holds back against them.
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#234  Edited By Static Shock
@FinalStar86: Thanks.
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Xi Felix

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#235  Edited By Xi Felix
@Silver2467 said:
" @omdway said: 
@Silver2467:  Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns.   "
Panther- Yes.  Cap- Unlikely. Daredevil- No way in the world. Deathstroke has clobbered BatMan, and Bats is superior to Daredevil in every way except senses. Deathstroke would demolish Daredevil.  "

Didn't you tell me that during his first altercation with Deathstroke, Batman was still somewhat(physically) worn from a previous stroy arc?
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FinalStar86

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#236  Edited By FinalStar86
@Xi Felix: He looked fine to me, at the start of that story he was on top of a rooftop talking to Gordan, and I don't understand how one of his stories would of tied into Deathstroke's series
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Silver2467

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#237  Edited By Silver2467
@Static Shock said:
" @Silver2467:Not impressive enough. Too many people below Spider-Man (Cap did it twice, Black Panther did it briefly, Shang Chi, classic Iron Fist, classic Moon Knight, Wolverine, Daredevil on several occasions, Kingpin, Punisher, etc) have given him problems in physical combat. I'm under the impression that any considerably-skilled fighter could give Spider-Man problems because he holds back against them. "
Oh, okay. No, I agree with this. I've been arguing that with people for the past few weeks (after Dane proved me and Spidey 15 wrong on that). People tend to assume Spidey can just taken down anyone with less physical power than he can because "he can one-shot them." Problem is, that's not how he fights. He lacks skill, holds back, and goofs around too much. If he was bloodlusted and made full use of his speed and strength, then yes, I could see him defeat them. Otherwise, it could go either way, possibly, with a solid majority going to the martial artist. 
 
Also, to add to your list, I believe Elektra has also. Could you not bring up Kingpin though? That guy's showings are more inconsistent than Sentry's (yeah, that's a little exaggerated). He's one guy I think SpiderMan legitimately should be able to defeat in an in character, straight fight (and my basis for that is not Back in Black). 
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Silver2467

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#238  Edited By Silver2467
@Xi Felix said:
" @Silver2467 said:
" @omdway said: 
@Silver2467:  Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns.   "
Panther- Yes.  Cap- Unlikely. Daredevil- No way in the world. Deathstroke has clobbered BatMan, and Bats is superior to Daredevil in every way except senses. Deathstroke would demolish Daredevil.  "
Didn't you tell me that during his first altercation with Deathstroke, Batman was still somewhat(physically) worn from a previous stroy arc? "  
I don't remember saying that. 
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Xi Felix

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#239  Edited By Xi Felix
@FinalStar86 said:

" @Xi Felix: He looked fine to me, at the start of that story he was on top of a rooftop talking to Gordan, and I don't understand how one of his stories would of tied into Deathstroke's series "


No, I thought so as well, but(yesterday) when I was trying to make a case for Captain America being fully capable of beating Deathstroke, I made a point of factoring in Caps' supposed "unlimited stamina". Silver then proceeded to try to invalidate that point stating roughly the equivalent of "Batman wasn't fully recovered from 'some stroy arc or another', so stamina is by no means a deciding factor"(which in my opinion, based on the example provided by him, proves pretty much the exact opposite).
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FinalStar86

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#240  Edited By FinalStar86
@Xi Felix: Alot of us find that questionable since characters with regeneration factors can tire.  Static showed that handbook entry, I can't disprove it so I'm not going to try but I agree that I don't think stamina is going to be a big factor here.  Someone is probably going to get KO'd or escape before they get worn down from fatigue
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#241  Edited By omdway
@Xi Felix:
Not me. But he was worn out because DS had beat on him earlier when he was at full strength. LoL. Suck to be Bats. Haha. 
 
A good fight would be Prometheus v. DS.  
 
But anyway im out for the night Peace!!
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#242  Edited By Static Shock
@Silver2467: What's inconsistent about Kingpin? He's given trouble to Daredevil, Captain America, Punisher, and the like? Why shouldn't he be mentioned?
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#243  Edited By Silver2467
@Xi Felix said:
" @FinalStar86 said:

" @Xi Felix: He looked fine to me, at the start of that story he was on top of a rooftop talking to Gordan, and I don't understand how one of his stories would of tied into Deathstroke's series "

No, I thought so as well, but(yesterday) when I was trying to make a case for Captain America being fully capable of beating Deathstroke, I made a point of factoring in Caps' supposed "unlimited stamina". Silver then proceeded to try to invalidate that point stating roughly the equivalent of "Batman wasn't fully recovered from 'some stroy arc or another', so stamina is by no means a deciding factor"(which in my opinion, based on the example provided by him, proves pretty much the exact opposite). "
No, you're misquoting me. I said that in Knightfall, BatMan had fought for days on end. My point in saying that is that stamina isn't going to be the deciding factor. Bats could keep going for days if need be. Thus, your argument about Cap having an endurance advantage against Deathstroke is not true. 
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spidey 15

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#244  Edited By spidey 15
@Static Shock: 

(Cap did it twice, Black Panther did it briefly, Shang Chi, classic Iron Fist, classic Moon Knight, Wolverine, Daredevil on several occasions, Kingpin, Punisher, etc)
 


Cap is acceptable.
BP only manage to land one hit and spidey wasn't trying to fight at all.
Spidey was doing well against Shang chi until spidey stopped fighting to show him he is a good guy i think.
Classic iron fist never beaten him. Spidey has done better than him in both of their fights. I have scans if you want.
Moon Knight never beaten him, spidey was trying to figure something and he didn;t have his mind in the battle and none of them was having the edge over the other,i have scans too.
Wolverine, yes he beaten him but also spideydo it too.
The only time where DD actually beaten it was when spidey was mad and he was fighting sloppier than ever. In other fights only humiliated him and also spidey did it too.
Kingpin shouldn't even been mentioned imo.
Punisher lost to spidey too.
 
Do't get me wrong,i agree spidey can do bad against martial artists. I'm just trying to make clear somethings. 
=]
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#245  Edited By Xi Felix
@Silver2467: 
 
 Ah, I see(I misunderstood then. My fault). Well then I guess that leaves us back at square "Deathstroke is more enhanced than Cap/No they're about equal". Nevermind then.
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#246  Edited By Silver2467
@Xi Felix said:
" @Silver2467:   Ah, I see(I misunderstood then. My fault). Well then I guess that leaves us back at square "Deathstroke is more enhanced than Cap/No they're about equal". Nevermind then. "
It's fine. And we can agree to disagree about the enhancement part. That's what I've already done with Static. 
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FinalStar86

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#247  Edited By FinalStar86
@Static Shock said:
" @Silver2467: What's inconsistent about Kingpin? He's given trouble to Daredevil, Captain America, Punisher, and the like? Why shouldn't he be mentioned? "
He almost broke Frank in half one time, even when Frank was armed with a knife
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Xi Felix

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#248  Edited By Xi Felix
@FinalStar86: 
 
Well the reason I brought it up(the factor of stamina), was from my(admittedly vague understanding) that it is an asset that can lend to endurance; I.E. when someone takes a punch, avoids a punch, or is engaged in high octane movement, their stamina fades, and thus their overall defense(mainly reactionary speed) faulters. At least that's how I postulated the scenario: Batman's stamina is great, but not inexhaustable(while Steve's is), so over the course of a fight his defense would wane, even if extremely slowly or gradually, while Cap's would not(which would allow him to duck, dodge, and otherwise avoid offensive without virtually any wear at all or detriment to his overall performance. At this point though, I do think I'm considering this too much outside of the realm of comic books, hahahahaha).
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#249  Edited By Static Shock
@spidey 15: You misunderstand me. I said that they have given him problems, not that they've all beaten him. Whether they have won or lost against him is besides the point. I don't know why Kingpin shouldn't be mentioned. Anyway, post the Iron Fist scans. I was under the impression that he beat Spidey in one of them.
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Silver2467

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#250  Edited By Silver2467
@Xi Felix said:
" @FinalStar86:  Well the reason I brought it up(the factor of stamina), was from my(admittedly vague understanding) that it is an asset that can lend to endurance; I.E. when someone takes a punch, avoids a punch, or is engaged in high octane movement, their stamina fades, and thus their overall defense(mainly reactionary speed) faulters. At least that's how I postulated the scenario. "
No, it's a fair assessment, but based on BatMan and Cap's stamina, it lacks significance for the sake of this fight. The reason for that is while Cap has greater stamina than BatMan, Bats gone for days without rest. Now, if the fight lasted for 2 or 3 days, then Cap's stamina as opposed to Bats' would be a factor. But the fight would never last that long anyway. It's a good point, but it has to be put in context. And in the context of this fight, it's not legit. 
 
Sorry if I keep going on about this. I just wanted to make that clear (even though I'm aware you've already acknowledged my point).