What Non metahuman can beat Deathstroke?
" I think the Titans East arc showed that when he is being series he should be able to take Cass out "He didn't even fight her in the Titans East Arc, Rose did while Cass was drugged with some mind controlling serum. As for the dumbbell incident I didn't see him "toying around" with her at all. In fact just the opposite. He all but flat out admits he cant beat her without distracting/getting inside her head, or be taking her out from long range.
" @Gambler:In that same story arc he was owning her and Ravager at the same time along with Nightwing, and if were going by statements Cass has mentioned that Slade doesn't give it his all when he fights her "What? When did Slade own Rose, Nightwing, and Cass at the same time in Titans East? Cass was on his side, and after Robin freed her mind, Nightwing knocked her out to prevent her from killing Slade. Could you refresh my memory when exactly Slade owned those three?
lol come on dude, you're slanting the facts. Cass said one time that Slade was toying with her, and as the story unfolds we find out why. Slade was saving Cass for his daughter, which backfires and ends with Rose getting her throat cut. She's never said that Slade doesn't give it his all when he fights her.
" Wait a minute, I don't even remember Donna being in that story arc.... "She came when The Outsiders came to the call
Anyone in the Bat Family can beat Slade, and Slade can beat anyone in the Bat Family as well. It goes both ways, but there are other heroes that can beat him...Green Arrow for instance. Oliver Queen went to train under the same master that trained Slade, and has brought down Slade singlehandedly before. Slade had to threaten to take the life of Canary in order to stop GA so, yeah there are plenty of non meta's who can bring down Slade just in the DCU alone.
" In terms of H2H i'd put money on Cap or Blk Panther. Daredevil is underrated and also stand a fair chance. Would Blade be categorised as superhuman or...? "Panther can defeat him. Cap, unlikely. Daredevil would get dramatically curbstomped in a heartbeat.
" @omdway said:" In terms of H2H i'd put money on Cap or Blk Panther. Daredevil is underrated and also stand a fair chance. Would Blade be categorised as superhuman or...? "Panther can defeat him. Cap, unlikely. Daredevil would get dramatically curbstomped in a heartbeat. "
@Silver2467: Panther - Yes
Cap - Possibly
Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns.
@FinalStar86: I don't really remember, but I know it is near to when he proposes to Canary. Sorry wish I remembered more.
@Silver2467: Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns. "Panther- Yes.
Cap- Unlikely.
Daredevil- No way in the world. Deathstroke has clobbered BatMan, and Bats is superior to Daredevil in every way except senses. Deathstroke would demolish Daredevil.
@Son_of_Magnus said:
Saved her from what exactly? You make it sound as if she was seconds away from being killed. She tackled him, he rolled on top of her, and then Jericho stepped in." @Gambler: Ya and when she was freed from her mind control she went after Slade and was only saved when a Jericho controlled Inertia grabbed Slade. "
@Son_of_Magnus said:
It was only Nightwing, Donna Troy, Jerhico, and Ravanger. Lets not make it out as if he had just gone toe to toe with the Outsiders and Teen Titans. But anyway I think you missed the point. How or why she had a chance at a killing blow is moot. The point is in that story arc Cass and Deathstroke didn't have a legitimate fight :)" The only reason she had a chance for a killing blow was because Slade just single handily held off The Titans and Outsiders and was plotting his escape plan"
@Son_of_Magnus said:
Who said anything about her "Single handily taking him down" in Titans East? Again, she doesn't even fight him. She gets jobbed by Nightwing before anything happens. And yet we've seen Rose, Cass, David Cain, and Dick hang with Deathstroke by themselves so you figure it out lol" she did not even come close to single handily take him down. Even when Tim Dick Ravager Donna Troy and Jericho were involved it was not enough "
" @Silver2467 said:Most street levelers have held their own against Spidey, he holds back alot, is incompetent and can't fight for crap" @omdway said:@Silver2467: Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns. "" In terms of H2H i'd put money on Cap or Blk Panther. Daredevil is underrated and also stand a fair chance. Would Blade be categorised as superhuman or...? "Panther can defeat him. Cap, unlikely. Daredevil would get dramatically curbstomped in a heartbeat. "
@FinalStar86:
Although he didnt hold back against Electro in that Story arc where Aunt May got buried alive and he fights his way to the truth. But yeh he likes to web people up and jobs at times. He's so high and mighty.
@Silver2467:
Yeh i kno Bats got creamed TWICE in the same issue, but -- phooee...tbh Slade tagged the Flash thats all there is to it i suppose.
" @Static Shock: Not sure, but I know GA just gives up after seeing Canary almost get killed and says "Take me instead." I believe the Justice league flies in and saves the day, but Slade and Drakon escape because it was their planned ambush on GA and they had things set up to get away from the Justice League. Good times. I don't know the exact issue # but I know that GA proposes to Canary like right after. "That's GA 75
" Any martial artist taking Spider-Man in a physical fight shouldn't be used as a feat. "Why? Are you saying it's not legitimate, or are you saying it's just not impressive enough to be a feat?
" @omdway said:@Silver2467: Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns. "Panther- Yes. Cap- Unlikely. Daredevil- No way in the world. Deathstroke has clobbered BatMan, and Bats is superior to Daredevil in every way except senses. Deathstroke would demolish Daredevil. "
Didn't you tell me that during his first altercation with Deathstroke, Batman was still somewhat(physically) worn from a previous stroy arc?
" @Silver2467:Not impressive enough. Too many people below Spider-Man (Cap did it twice, Black Panther did it briefly, Shang Chi, classic Iron Fist, classic Moon Knight, Wolverine, Daredevil on several occasions, Kingpin, Punisher, etc) have given him problems in physical combat. I'm under the impression that any considerably-skilled fighter could give Spider-Man problems because he holds back against them. "Oh, okay. No, I agree with this. I've been arguing that with people for the past few weeks (after Dane proved me and Spidey 15 wrong on that). People tend to assume Spidey can just taken down anyone with less physical power than he can because "he can one-shot them." Problem is, that's not how he fights. He lacks skill, holds back, and goofs around too much. If he was bloodlusted and made full use of his speed and strength, then yes, I could see him defeat them. Otherwise, it could go either way, possibly, with a solid majority going to the martial artist.
Also, to add to your list, I believe Elektra has also. Could you not bring up Kingpin though? That guy's showings are more inconsistent than Sentry's (yeah, that's a little exaggerated). He's one guy I think SpiderMan legitimately should be able to defeat in an in character, straight fight (and my basis for that is not Back in Black).
" @Silver2467 said:I don't remember saying that." @omdway said:Didn't you tell me that during his first altercation with Deathstroke, Batman was still somewhat(physically) worn from a previous stroy arc? "@Silver2467: Panther - Yes Cap - Possibly Daredevil - likely he's so sensitive he would hear the shifting of DS's costume over his skin as soon as he began moving. DD has held his own gainst Spidey who moves at 34 or 37x speed of a normal man. Having echo-location is his equivalent to extraquick rxns. "Panther- Yes. Cap- Unlikely. Daredevil- No way in the world. Deathstroke has clobbered BatMan, and Bats is superior to Daredevil in every way except senses. Deathstroke would demolish Daredevil. "
" @Xi Felix: He looked fine to me, at the start of that story he was on top of a rooftop talking to Gordan, and I don't understand how one of his stories would of tied into Deathstroke's series "
No, I thought so as well, but(yesterday) when I was trying to make a case for Captain America being fully capable of beating Deathstroke, I made a point of factoring in Caps' supposed "unlimited stamina". Silver then proceeded to try to invalidate that point stating roughly the equivalent of "Batman wasn't fully recovered from 'some stroy arc or another', so stamina is by no means a deciding factor"(which in my opinion, based on the example provided by him, proves pretty much the exact opposite).
" @FinalStar86 said:No, you're misquoting me. I said that in Knightfall, BatMan had fought for days on end. My point in saying that is that stamina isn't going to be the deciding factor. Bats could keep going for days if need be. Thus, your argument about Cap having an endurance advantage against Deathstroke is not true.No, I thought so as well, but(yesterday) when I was trying to make a case for Captain America being fully capable of beating Deathstroke, I made a point of factoring in Caps' supposed "unlimited stamina". Silver then proceeded to try to invalidate that point stating roughly the equivalent of "Batman wasn't fully recovered from 'some stroy arc or another', so stamina is by no means a deciding factor"(which in my opinion, based on the example provided by him, proves pretty much the exact opposite). "" @Xi Felix: He looked fine to me, at the start of that story he was on top of a rooftop talking to Gordan, and I don't understand how one of his stories would of tied into Deathstroke's series "
(Cap did it twice, Black Panther did it briefly, Shang Chi, classic Iron Fist, classic Moon Knight, Wolverine, Daredevil on several occasions, Kingpin, Punisher, etc)
Cap is acceptable.
BP only manage to land one hit and spidey wasn't trying to fight at all.
Spidey was doing well against Shang chi until spidey stopped fighting to show him he is a good guy i think.
Classic iron fist never beaten him. Spidey has done better than him in both of their fights. I have scans if you want.
Moon Knight never beaten him, spidey was trying to figure something and he didn;t have his mind in the battle and none of them was having the edge over the other,i have scans too.
Wolverine, yes he beaten him but also spideydo it too.
The only time where DD actually beaten it was when spidey was mad and he was fighting sloppier than ever. In other fights only humiliated him and also spidey did it too.
Kingpin shouldn't even been mentioned imo.
Punisher lost to spidey too.
Do't get me wrong,i agree spidey can do bad against martial artists. I'm just trying to make clear somethings.
=]
" @Silver2467: Ah, I see(I misunderstood then. My fault). Well then I guess that leaves us back at square "Deathstroke is more enhanced than Cap/No they're about equal". Nevermind then. "It's fine. And we can agree to disagree about the enhancement part. That's what I've already done with Static.
" @Silver2467: What's inconsistent about Kingpin? He's given trouble to Daredevil, Captain America, Punisher, and the like? Why shouldn't he be mentioned? "He almost broke Frank in half one time, even when Frank was armed with a knife
Well the reason I brought it up(the factor of stamina), was from my(admittedly vague understanding) that it is an asset that can lend to endurance; I.E. when someone takes a punch, avoids a punch, or is engaged in high octane movement, their stamina fades, and thus their overall defense(mainly reactionary speed) faulters. At least that's how I postulated the scenario: Batman's stamina is great, but not inexhaustable(while Steve's is), so over the course of a fight his defense would wane, even if extremely slowly or gradually, while Cap's would not(which would allow him to duck, dodge, and otherwise avoid offensive without virtually any wear at all or detriment to his overall performance. At this point though, I do think I'm considering this too much outside of the realm of comic books, hahahahaha).
" @FinalStar86: Well the reason I brought it up(the factor of stamina), was from my(admittedly vague understanding) that it is an asset that can lend to endurance; I.E. when someone takes a punch, avoids a punch, or is engaged in high octane movement, their stamina fades, and thus their overall defense(mainly reactionary speed) faulters. At least that's how I postulated the scenario. "No, it's a fair assessment, but based on BatMan and Cap's stamina, it lacks significance for the sake of this fight. The reason for that is while Cap has greater stamina than BatMan, Bats gone for days without rest. Now, if the fight lasted for 2 or 3 days, then Cap's stamina as opposed to Bats' would be a factor. But the fight would never last that long anyway. It's a good point, but it has to be put in context. And in the context of this fight, it's not legit.
Sorry if I keep going on about this. I just wanted to make that clear (even though I'm aware you've already acknowledged my point).
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