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#1 Edited by Lunacyde (18430 posts) - - Show Bio

A healing factor is a pretty awesome advantage Wolverine holds over many of his opponents. What would it be like if he ran a gauntlet against opponents who also shared an exact copy of his healing factor?

A very rich and powerful man bears a grudge against Wolverine.and will stop at nothing to see his lifeless corpse rotting in a roadside ditch. In order to make this dream a reality he has had his scientists create ten perfect clones of famous and powerful warriors. These clones have all the powers, skills, equipment, intellect, experience, training, etc of the originals as well as a healing factor on par with Wolverine's and they are without any opposition to fighting Wolverine and killing him. He will face each of them in succession with mere moments of rest. How long can he survive? Win can come by KO, Death, or Incapacitation.

1. Moon Knight Carbonadium Armor and Staff

2. Green Arrow - Sword, Bow, Trick Arrows

3. Punisher - Assault Rifle, Shotgun, Twin Beretta Pistols, Knives, Grenades

4. Daredevil - Adamantium Billy Clubs

5. Bucky Barnes - Captain America's Shield, Assault Rifle, Pistol, Combat Knife

6. Storm Shadow - Bow/Arrows, Twin Arashikage Swords, Combat Knife, Shurikens

7. Batman - Utility Belt

8.Captain America - Shield, Pistol

9. Snake-Eyes - Arashikage Sword, Uzi, Pistol, Grenades, Flash-bangs, Shurikens

10. Deathstroke - Prometheum Armor and Blade, Assault Rifle, Explosives

Setting:

#2 Edited by Scarbearer (726 posts) - - Show Bio

As much as I'd love to say that Ollie could stop him at number 2.... I think in this situation, Logan could clear up through 6 and get stopped at 7, though some of the fights along the way should be brutally awesome.

#3 Posted by Strider92 (16238 posts) - - Show Bio

Wolverine clears it. He still has a very big advantage with his adamantium skeleton. Deathstroke gives him the most challenge. If Logan didn't have his ada-skeleton he'd most likely stop at 6.

#4 Posted by dondave (35935 posts) - - Show Bio

Wolverine clears it. He still has a very big advantage with his adamantium skeleton. Deathstroke gives him the most challenge. If Logan didn't have his ada-skeleton he'd most likely stop at 6.

This

#5 Posted by Lunacyde (18430 posts) - - Show Bio

Logan can, and has been beaten. It's not as if his ada. skeleton makes him invulnerable. I think several of the levels are capable of stopping him, especially as worn down as he will be.

#6 Posted by Rasarima (371 posts) - - Show Bio

Stop at 4

Daredevil will kick the hell out of him

#7 Edited by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92 said:

Wolverine clears it. He still has a very big advantage with his adamantium skeleton. Deathstroke gives him the most challenge. If Logan didn't have his ada-skeleton he'd most likely stop at 6.

I think he can clear it because of his durability advantage based on what you said. His stamina is still ridiculous if you consider instances like the length of time fighting in Enemy of the State and the condition he was in to begin with, or his 17 hour fight with Omega Red+ death spores, he can keep trucking for awhile. And the longer he does fight, the more damage he soaks, and more taxed he gets, he will usually end up falling back on his skill more as well which would put him in a good spot too. I can however, see Storm Shadow, Snake-Eyes, or DS stopping him if they can stab his heart in pieces similar to how Kaine did, but they need to make sure they cleave it in two, not just simply thrust him through the organ which he has healed from before and continued to fight. But those guys have the best chance to end him due to speed, skill, and also the healing factor.

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#8 Posted by Strider92 (16238 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn: I do agree that they have a chance however they do not have the severe stat advantage Kaine had in that fight. Kaine's speed and strength was what allowed him to keep Wolverine on the ropes something the three you mentioned do not have in fact they are probably about Logan's equal in physical speed if not slightly slower so Logan should take a majority.

#9 Posted by Pokeysteve (8233 posts) - - Show Bio

Punisher can incapacitate him in round 3 if he plays his cards right.

#10 Edited by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92: I know full well Kaine is their physical superior. My point was that they have the best chances of stopping. They DO have enough speed and skill regardless to be able to tag Logan and get a win if that type of shot lands. I agreed with you that Logan can clear it based on his extreme durability advantage. But if he were to stop, I see it at one of those rounds based on the aforementioned statements.

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#11 Posted by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio

He gets beaten down by Daredevil.

#12 Posted by TDK_1997 (14648 posts) - - Show Bio

Wolverine clears this.

#13 Posted by Strider92 (16238 posts) - - Show Bio
#14 Posted by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio

@tdk_1997: How? Hell, several of these people would beat Wolverine without a healing factor.

#15 Edited by ULTRAstarkiller (6097 posts) - - Show Bio

Stops at seven and if he did make it to Deathstroke he stomps him.

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#16 Edited by Strider92 (16238 posts) - - Show Bio

@tdk_1997: How? Hell, several of these people would beat Wolverine without a healing factor.

This should be interesting......Who pray tell out of the characters listed can beat Logan without a healing factor?

#17 Posted by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio

Deathstroke, Daredevil, Batman, and if Ennis is writing, Punisher.

#18 Posted by Strider92 (16238 posts) - - Show Bio

@thebourneposter: If Ennis writing anyone beats Wolverine but that does not make it a legit showing on either said character or Logan's part since Ennis openly admits to not liking Wolverine and making him job on almost any chance he gets. None of the characters you've listed would take a majority against Wolverine without a healing factor.

#19 Posted by laflux (14990 posts) - - Show Bio

@thebourneposter: If Ennis writing anyone beats Wolverine but that does not make it a legit showing on either said character or Logan's part since Ennis openly admits to not liking Wolverine and making him job on almost any chance he gets. None of the characters you've listed would take a majority against Wolverine without a healing factor.

Okay @super_soldierxii spot messing with Strider's account :P

#20 Posted by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92:

Deathstroke: He is faster and stronger. The promethium blade could not be cut by adamantium, and the claws would have trouble piercing the armor. Deathstroke could kill him with a sword through the eye (repeatedly) or use the explosives to do this.

1761706-the_punisher_v4_35___confederacy_of_dunces_03___16_super.jpg

Daredevil: Blow to the throat, and it's over. Just because you don't like the writer doesn't invalidate the feat.

Batman: Has plenty of gadgets to give him the edge, as well as slightly more skilled, and from the feats I've seen, stronger and faster.

Punisher: This is probably the least likely.

#21 Posted by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: You said spot instead of stop. You have disgraced yourself further!!

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#22 Posted by Hyperlight (5687 posts) - - Show Bio

wolverine is physically superior to everyone here except for moon knight ( if he is the fist of khonshu and has his strength) and deathstroke ( who is a 3 tonner i believe)

i like he stops at deathstroke

#23 Posted by laflux (14990 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: You said spot instead of stop. You have disgraced yourself further!!

*commits seppuku*

#24 Edited by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: NUUUUU! I was just gonna cut off one finger instead!

On topic- Prometheum can be broken. Lex in a weakened powersuit snapped it. It may hold up for a bit against his claws, but neither the suit or blade are fullproof here and something that can't be gotten around. So because something is printed, we can't ignore writer bias, but we can ignore context and consistency and now Batman is faster and stronger than Wolverine? I didn't know Batman was almost as fast as Spider-Man and Gorgon and was capable of knocking out guys like Roughhouse with his fists.

By that logic, Hulk should be beaten by snakes. Deathstroke>>>>Flash. And Bruce almost rips his arm out of place trying to deadlift 650 pounds. Peak human my butt.

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#25 Edited by MonsterStomp (16681 posts) - - Show Bio

Dare Devil will wreck him if he keeps his distance. If he does pass DD, SS could take him in a good fight.

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#26 Edited by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@thebourneposter said:

@strider92:

Deathstroke: He is faster and stronger. The promethium blade could not be cut by adamantium, and the claws would have trouble piercing the armor. Deathstroke could kill him with a sword through the eye (repeatedly) or use the explosives to do this.

1761706-the_punisher_v4_35___confederacy_of_dunces_03___16_super.jpg

Daredevil: Blow to the throat, and it's over. Just because you don't like the writer doesn't invalidate the feat.

Batman: Has plenty of gadgets to give him the edge, as well as slightly more skilled, and from the feats I've seen, stronger and faster.

Punisher: This is probably the least likely.

What invalidates the feat, is the fact Ennis was writing, yes, but this coupled with the dozens of other feats that contradict the low showing, wherein Wolverine's had his throat slit, torn out, pierced, shot and still kept on fighting.

Additionally, Wolverine realizes they have healing factors, and he won't be pulling his punches anymore. That, and his enhanced senses should cue him into the fact he's fighting genetically altered clones.

Not saying he clears this just yet ... but he certainly gets by Daredevil with 'relative' ease, Batman with difficulty (due to utilities more than anything else) and he walks through Punisher more readily than his son Daken did.

C'mon now ...

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#27 Posted by laflux (14990 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: NUUUUU! I was just gonna cut off one finger instead!

On topic- Prometheum can be broken. Lex in a weakened powersuit snapped it. It may hold up for a bit against his claws, but neither the suit or blade are fullproof here and something that can't be gotten around. So because something is printed, we can't ignore writer bias, but we can ignore context and consistency and now Batman is faster and stronger than Wolverine? I didn't know Batman was almost as fast as Spider-Man and Gorgon and was capable of knocking out guys like Roughhouse with his fists.

By that logic, Deathstroke>>>>Flash. And Bruce almost rips his arm out of place trying to deadlift 650 pounds. Peak human my butt.

I think everyone knows how I feel about Gorgon, but even I don't attribute feats to him that he hasn't done (For the record, I think that apart from healing, Strength is the only thing Gorgon is probably equivalent to Logan in).

Just a friendly correction :P

And Oh, it turns out that rich and powerful man from the OP gave me a healing factor too, so I survived >:DD

#28 Edited by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: Daredevil is literally superior to Wolverine in every category in this fight.

#29 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

Dare Devil will wreck him if he keeps his distance. If he does pass DD, SS could take him in a good fight.

DD doesn't have the damage output to "wreck" him. DD's main damage output is blunt force. Adamantium skeleton and healing factor will make those billy clubs tickle. Wolverine's every bit the fighter DD is, but I'll take six twelve inch long claws over a couple sticks any day ... especially against an enhanced mutant who's notorious for soaking Hulk level blunt force.

@laflux

And careful now, poor @strider92 might take exception to that! I know I would.

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#30 Edited by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: I know he is superior in virtually every stat. My point was Logan was still capable of a handful of blows on Shishido so he isn't THAT much above him to where he is untouchable. Same with Spider-Man to degree they were fighting that one time even though I agree Spider-Man is indeed faster than Wolverine. If you put Bruce in the same situations, what Wolverine did are things Batman isn't capable of doing.

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#31 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: Daredevil is literally superior to Wolverine in every category in this fight.

No he literally is not. With 'radar' sense being the only exception. Though Logan's enhanced senses make it a moot point pretty much.

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#32 Posted by MonsterStomp (16681 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: DD is capable of taking down reinforced steel vaults with his billy clubs, which is more resistant to inertia than Wolverine is. The difference between Hulk and DD is that DD actually uses his brain in a fight and Wolverine has been taken out by lesser people than Hulk.

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#33 Posted by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: Show me Wolverine dodging bullets, benching up to 1500 lbs, bending steel bars, ect. And for Daredevil, show me Wolverine flipping an armored limo, bending steel bar, or throwing a billy club through a window that withstood a rocket launcher blast.

#34 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: DD is capable of taking down reinforced steel vaults with his billy clubs, which is more resistant to inertia than Wolverine is. The difference between Hulk and DD is that DD actually uses his brain in a fight and Wolverine has been taken out by lesser people than Hulk.

Steel vaults don't hit back.

Wolverine's punched through steel using a casual backhand. Steel is not impressive.

I admit DD can hit the 'sweet' spots, and in so doing 'hurt' Wolverine. But put him down? Nah. More likely the inverse happens as twelve inch claws through the noggin is far more convincing ..

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#35 Edited by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@thebourneposter said:

@super_soldierxii: Show me Wolverine dodging bullets, benching up to 1500 lbs, bending steel bars, ect. And for Daredevil, show me Wolverine flipping an armored limo, bending steel bar, or throwing a billy club through a window that withstood a rocket launcher blast.

Lol.

You're kidding right? Wolverine's dodged bullets to the extent he actually impressed DD himself in so doing. Don't believe me?

Wolverine doesn't always do so, because he doesn't have to. He can tank dozens of rounds without fault. And has done so on many occasions. He has also dodged them aplenty.

Flipping a limo ... you have no idea Wolverine's strength levels do you? DD is vastly inferior to Wolverine in the physicals department (OK, Murdock is taller, and less hairy, I'll give him that). DD's strength feats date back to the 80's for the most part. DD handling a 400lbs barbell like a bo stick and flipping a limo are largely delegated to WIS status these days. But I can give you those. As Wolverine's feats far, far outshine regardless.

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#36 Posted by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio
#37 Edited by BigCimmerian (8007 posts) - - Show Bio

@strider92:

Deathstroke: He is faster and stronger. The promethium blade could not be cut by adamantium, and the claws would have trouble piercing the armor. Deathstroke could kill him with a sword through the eye (repeatedly) or use the explosives to do this.

1761706-the_punisher_v4_35___confederacy_of_dunces_03___16_super.jpg

Daredevil: Blow to the throat, and it's over. Just because you don't like the writer doesn't invalidate the feat.

Batman: Has plenty of gadgets to give him the edge, as well as slightly more skilled, and from the feats I've seen, stronger and faster.

Punisher: This is probably the least likely.

Wolverine wins against Batman and Daredevil, he's much stronger and faster than they are, and probably more skilled, but he will lose against Slade.

#38 Posted by MonsterStomp (16681 posts) - - Show Bio

@monsterstomp said:

@super_soldierxii: DD is capable of taking down reinforced steel vaults with his billy clubs, which is more resistant to inertia than Wolverine is. The difference between Hulk and DD is that DD actually uses his brain in a fight and Wolverine has been taken out by lesser people than Hulk.

Steel vaults don't hit back.

Wolverine's punched through steel using a casual backhand. Steel is not impressive.

I admit DD can hit the 'sweet' spots, and in so doing 'hurt' Wolverine. But put him down? Nah. More likely the inverse happens as twelve inch claws through the noggin is far more convincing ..

Hence why I said if DD can keep a distance. Ok maybe I exaggerated with the 'wreck'.

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#39 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: And those feats are........?

For me to know, and you to Google. ;P

They are common knowledge. As such, I don't feel the burden of proof rests on me - and I've posted them a plethora of times in a multitude of debates, and they can be found in countless other threads. Quite frankly, I'm tired of doing so again and again when a simple perusal of any Wolverine respect thread should be plenty enough to educate. Of those who've posted in here thus far, I know at least seven of them are aware of at least a dozen of said feats.

In short, do your own homework. Better yet, pick up a few classic Wolverine reads and enjoy. Wolverine's stats are low level superhuman. DD is peak human. End of story.

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#40 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii said:

@monsterstomp said:

@super_soldierxii: DD is capable of taking down reinforced steel vaults with his billy clubs, which is more resistant to inertia than Wolverine is. The difference between Hulk and DD is that DD actually uses his brain in a fight and Wolverine has been taken out by lesser people than Hulk.

Steel vaults don't hit back.

Wolverine's punched through steel using a casual backhand. Steel is not impressive.

I admit DD can hit the 'sweet' spots, and in so doing 'hurt' Wolverine. But put him down? Nah. More likely the inverse happens as twelve inch claws through the noggin is far more convincing ..

Hence why I said if DD can keep a distance. Ok maybe I exaggerated with the 'wreck'.

He can keep his distance I guess ... but do you think throwing a billy club will hurt a man who soaks ballistics that leave holes the size of footballs in his core? Additionally, Wolverine's been shown able to consistently jump upwards to 20 - 30 feet (most often highlighted when he fights sentinels) and is extremely fast and agile enough in his own right. Can't fathom any way DD will win by simply keeping his distance against a superhuman mutant who will be quickly closing said distance (there are feats wherein he's closed a 20 foot gap instantaneously).

Wolverine is bad fight for DD. With, or without a healing factor.

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#41 Edited by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: Sorry, it does. If you make a claim (e.g, Wolverine is physically superior to Daredevil/Batman) than you post evidencing backing it up. If you can't, then I assume that DD and Batman are stronger since you gave no counter to my strength feats. I did my homework, and can't find a single legitimate bullet timing feat or strength feats past Batman/DD.

#42 Posted by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

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#44 Edited by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

@thebourneposter: Still can't deadlift 630 pounds. You know, one of the lifts that allows for some of the heaviest weights to be lifted in standard weight lifting, right?

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#45 Edited by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii:

Sorry, it does. If you make a claim (e.g, Wolverine is physically superior to Daredevil/Batman) than you post evidencing backing it up. If you can't, then I assume that DD and Batman are stronger since you gave no counter to my strength feats. I did my homework, and can't find a single legitimate bullet timing feat or strength feats past Batman/DD.

Sorry. It doesn't. If I state Superman can fly, and someone asks me to prove it, I can justifiably state "read some Superman before you try to debate against the character".

So, yeah, read some Wolverine before decrying with any authority how superior Daredevil is to him in every which way. Rubbish.

You clearly know little to nothing about the character you are so blithely denouncing as 'weaker' in stats to the likes of Batman and Daredevil. That's tantamount to me stating Wolverine is physically superior stat-wise to Spider-Man.

But here's the DD pick, just because I have it readily on hand;

http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/2002/ddbulletdodgekh3.jpghttp://img141.imageshack.us/img141/51/ddbulletdodge2kw2.jpg

Cheers.

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#46 Posted by Moonman78 (1726 posts) - - Show Bio

On his a plus game wolverine barely beats batman but is done at captain America after a long enough fight. Dd and moon knight would have good chances to beat him early but they probably wont

#47 Posted by TheBournePoster (575 posts) - - Show Bio
#48 Edited by God_Spawn (37563 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: Hey, SS, remember the time Deathstroke's enhancements won him over Batman? But remember the time Batman was punching through bazooka proof glass, bracing a thousand pound ceiling that was still closing in on him, and lifting totem poles with a broken leg? I do.

Remember the time Wolverine and Sabretooth were running around Havok so fast they were moving like blurs? Or fighting with Sabretooth so fast that even Psylocke could hardly register their minds? Or when he made Spider-Man believe he was faster in a fight where Spider-Man even considered killing him? Or that one time he was able to tag Gorgon, you know, the one guy who is capable of slicing soldiers to ribbons before they realize what is happening and sliced Yo-Yo's hands off whom just happens to be a legit speedster? Or how about doing Batman's famous disappearing trick to Nightcrawler, a bulletdodger himself, and disappearing around Nuke with just some random bushes around? Or do you remember the time he was snapping raptors' necks, KOing Roughhouse, hitting people through vaulted doors and concrete, supporting a little over half a dozen men on one arm and throwing them through walls and holding elevators full of people by the cable with one hand while dangling from another cable with the other? Or how about the times he was throwing motorcycles and dumpsters with one hand like soft balls?

Me neither.

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#49 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

Oh please. The Batman pics are not wholly more impressive at all. They're ordinary. He's not even dodging in the multiples. You want dodging bullets or reflecting / deflecting them? Wolverine's done both. Decide which we're showing here ...

Though I do admit, DD's radar sense make his avoidance capabilities superhuman and able to hang on Wolverine's level. I know of a few more feats where he deflects, and redirects bullets. And those feats are impressive. But beyond Wolverine's ken? Not even close.

Show Batman or DD with combat reflexes fast enough to do this;

http://img507.imageshack.us/img507/2959/wolverine40pe3.jpghttp://img507.imageshack.us/img507/7945/wolverine41gz4.jpg

Along with the skill and precision it would take, and we'll reopen the discussion.

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#50 Posted by Super_SoldierXII (6219 posts) - - Show Bio

@super_soldierxii: Hey, SS, remember the time Deathstroke's enhancements won him over Batman? But remember the time Batman was punching through bazooka proof glass, bracing a thousand pound ceiling that was still closing in on him, and lifting totem poles with a broken leg? I do.

Remember the time Wolverine and Sabretooth were running around Havok so fast they were moving like blurs? Or fighting with Sabretooth so fast that even Psylocke could hardly register their minds? Or when he made Spider-Man believe he was faster in a fight where Spider-Man even considered killing him? Or that one time he was able to tag Gorgon, you know, the one guy who is capable of slicing soldiers to ribbons before they realize what is happening and sliced Yo-Yo's hands off whom just happens to be a legit speedster? Or how about doing Batman's famous disappearing trick to Nightcrawler, a bulletdodger himself, and disappearing around Nuke with just some random bushes around? Or do you remember the time he was snapping raptors' necks, KOing Roughhouse, hitting people through vaulted doors and concrete, supporting a little over half a dozen men on one arm and throwing them through walls and holding elevators full of people by the cable with one hand while dangling from another cable with the other? Or how about the times he was throwing motorcycles and dumpsters with one hand like soft balls?

Me neither.

Dammit!! You're getting ahead of me again! Can't you let me play with prey just a little bit? :P

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