I suppose I will go first since you have some basic knowledge(powers, abilities, skills) and I have prep. Just bump this thread and I will make a post.
Honestly I can afford to go very scan lite seeing how most of my team is very well known on the vine, only unknown guy on my team is The New Silver Samurai.
Green Goblin(Norman Osborn): Leader
Norman Osborn THE TRUE GREEN GOBLIN, Aka The Goblin King is Spiderman's Greatest Foe & For Good Reason. His Goblin Serum gives him a number of superpowers, combined with his own personal genius, and Goblin Weapons: the Green Goblin is a force to be reckoned with.
Super Speed & Reflexes: Right Under Spiderman, But Able To Tag Fast Spiders
Fighting Skill: Tactical Weapons User & Skilled Brawler
Healing Factor: Just Above Spiderman Level, But, still low level healing. He can heal up from stab wounds, but massive damage will kill him.
Durability: Spiderman Level(Without His Armor)
Expert Marksmen: Able To Tag Spiders With His Array Of Weapons, despite the Spiders having the tactical advantage of Spider Sense(Precog).
Tactical Genius: Osborn has ran Hammer, Outsmarted Spiderman, Outsmarted The Avengers, Humiliated Luke Cage, and is one of the better tactical geniuses in the Marvel Universe. While way below Doom, Reed, and even Iron Man he still has had his moments especially during the Dark Reign storyline.
Scientific Genius: Below Spiderman & Doctor Octopus Level, but he is an excellent scientist in his own right. He is an expert in Chemistry, Robotics, and other fields.
Leadership: Lead Thunderbolts, Dark Avengers, Shield, and can pretty much convince any Supervillian to work with him, even helped form the Cabal with Dr. Doom.
Armor: Chain Mail Tunic; bullet proof, good against explosives & blunt force.
Goblin Glider: Can fly up to 90 mile per hour, at maximum speeds it has an hour worth of fuel. The Glider is full of weapons and can be remote controlled.
Razor Bats: Sharp bat like flying projectiles.
Pumpkin Bombs: Incendiary, Explosive, Hallucinogenic Gas, Etc.
Trick Gloves: Electric Blasts Of 10,00 Volts & Sparkle Spray.
Bag Of Tricks: Sonics, Explosive Flash Drives, Guns, Etc.
Most(if not all) of this info can be found in his Marvel Handbook Entries. I'll use scans when needed.
Gallery
The New Silver Samurai(Shingen Harada II): Air Support
Shingen Harada is the son of the original Silver Samurai.
This is really the only guy on my team I will start off with a decent amount of scans because he doesn't have any handy dandy marvel bio & even his wiki is terrible.
Shin is the illegitimate son of Keniuchio Harada and the heir of the Clan Yashida. He was also the boyfriend of Amiko, the foster daughter of Wolverine[1] At some point, he joined Kade Kilgore's Hellfire Academy[2]and partnered with Mystique in order to recruit the newly activated mutantIara Dos Santos(who soon after adopted the code-name Shark-Girl), unsuccessfully, after having battled both their target and Angel.[3] He doesn't have any Superpowers unlike his dad. Instead he uses his incredible wits, armor, and weapons.
Self Explanatory: Nanotech that hides his scent and sound.Carbondaium Armor, and Plasma Weapons(Although he seemed to give them more fancy weapons than he did). He seemed to just stick with his swords and blasters for the most part.Invisibility & Armor powered by an "Arc Reactor"
He built himself & the his Iron Hand very similar armor. Of course his is fully covered and his "Iron Hand" are only halfway covered. I'll show using his Invisibility in combat.
This was a cop who was also an old school Hand Ninja and was against what Sabertooth was doing with the Hand.Silver Samurai stays in Inviso Mode while cutting straight through the bone.No more arms.As you can see, this isn't some mere camo. He's completely invisible.Look at that face of shock and awe.
If you read this last panel, Creed mentions the Invisibility.
Carbonadium Armor: Carbonadium is a resilient, radioactive metal that is vastly stronger than steel, but more malleable and cheaper than Adamantium. Due to its malleability, carbonadium is less durable than True Adamantium, but still nearly indestructible. Carbonadium is highly radioactive and objects composed of it have proven to slow accelerated healing factors such as Wolverine's.
Cuts open a High Speed Bullet TrainAlso his Boots are magnetic and he was able to stand on top of a high speed bullet train with no problem, while it was in motion. Also take notice that the steel is several inches thick.
Wolverine's greatest enemy and one of the most dangerous street level CQC fighters on the Marvel roster.
Powers & Abilities:
Adamantium: Possibly strongest metal in the Marvel Universe and pretty much indestructible and unbreakable. Creed has an adamantium skeleton and claws that will help in battle.
Healing Factor: One of the better healing factors in Marvel. Below Wolverine level, but Creed can still shake off major damage to limbs, and major organs.
Super Senses: Night Vision, Infrared(Yep read the handbook), Super Smelling(Smelling things miles away), Super Hearing(Can hear light breathing in a cave at 200 feet away), etc.
Super Speed: Wolverine level.
Super Strength: Listed as a class 10. Around 2-5 tons.
Expert Melee Combat Fighter: Way below wolverine in knowledge of martial arts, but he is skilled enough to give Wolverine some amazing fights, as well as being able to trade/counter blows from skilled fighters like Psylocke.
Expert Tracker: Using his super senses and training Creed is an expert hunter and tracker.
Greed the Homunculus was given a second chance at life by his Father and placed in the body of a Prince of Xing: Ling Yoa. With Greed's Humonculi powers from the Philosopher Stone and Yao's fighting skill and Dragon Pulse abilities: Greedling is a force to be reckoned with. Also known as Greeling, but I prefer Greedling. Sounds better to me.
Powers & Abilities:
Enhanced Strength: Cracks concrete when he lands. Can physically grapple with a military utility truck moving at high speeds. Enough striking power to elbow slam down Gluttony(who appears to weigh over 300lbs or more).
Super Speed: Below King Bradley level, but more than enough speed to keep up with him and react to Bradley(someone who can slice/deflect machine gun bullets with his sword).
Ultimate Shield: Greed can cover his entire body in Carbon Fiber making his body incredibly tough. Greed can no sell an RPG with no damage, and bullets from machine guns and rifles do nothing, but bounce off.
Healing Factor: Incredible healing factor that can regenerate tissue with in seconds.
Dragon Pulse: A chi reading ability that allows him to detect human and non human life forms in a large range area.
Skilled Melee Fighter: Before his superpowered upgrade Ling was able to cross swords with King Bradley even though he was carrying his injured teammate. Greed has fought Bradley several times and fought him pretty well with mixed results(admittedly usually Brady would win).
You can look here and get a good idea of what you are dealing with here. It's a short video that shows him fighting a group of Central Soldiers. They shoot at him with their machine guns and rifles and he tanks an RPG and it doesn't even phase him.
XT-908 is OmniCorp's Mini Drone Plane. Here are the stats and features of my 4 fabulous Drones. I basically have a mini air-force. All of the info feature here is right off of OmniCorp's official website.
XT stands for “eXtreme-Tactics,” and the 908 lives the promise, delivering “clear skies” range of 45 continuous hours and 4,256 miles (6,849 km), with an operational altitude of over 55,000 ft. (16,764m).===================================================================
Operational Control
Fiber-optic sensors are controlled from ground station via D-band satellite data link for
beyond-line-of-sight operations. Crew (pilot plus two sensor operators) commands take 0.98 seconds to reach XT-908 at max range.======================================================================
Targeting
The Multi-spectral O-Targeting System includes variable aperture infrared cameras (low light/night) and UAV remote sensing functions for: gamma ray, biological, and chemical.
Built-in radar evasion comes standard.=======================================================================
Weapons
The XT-908 can be armed with a variety of weaponry, including tactical micro-missiles and 50-lb laser-guided surgical bomb units for pre-emptive “restraint” strikes. Weapons limit the XT’s range and maneuverability.=======================================================================
Bio-Specs
Responsiveness
Analysis of human heat signatures Intuitive read of pilot’s “touch”
Basically these guys are going to work as heavy bombardment. I'll be keeping their handguns, and other gear, but leaving out their other weapons in favor of heavy duty machine guns and mortar fire.
The M2 fires the devastating .50 BMG round out to an effective range of over a mile. The weapon can take on soft-skinned vehicles and light armor. It can punch through concrete walls and chew up a forest. Such firepower and reach makes it a favorite among Special Operations Forces (SOF) who need to be able to hit hard and fast. The weapon can be mounted on a vehicle, boat or aircraft or mounted on a tripod. Not only that, but I'll be using incendiary & armor piercing rounds.
Seems to take 2 men to operate each one of these. I will be using the 81MM rounds and have 2 of them. These weapons have a range of over 3.5 miles = 5700 meters.
Everyone on my team is a killer. Several of my characters have a clear Marvel connection and will have no problem following their charismatic leader(Osborn) into battle. Greed is a killer as well and even though he doesn't know the rest of my team they can talk for a few moments and Osborn will promise Greed some money and power. Greed is still greedy after-all and he will gladly accept the offer. Plus it's not like he wants to get killed by the other team. Osborn, SS, and Sabertooth have all been on villain teams so working with others is not a problem. Greedling worked with others in FMA so he can be a team player as well.
We may not know much from our limited knowledge, but what we do know is highly valuable. We know your team is a group of soldiers, mercs, shooters, and fighters. So we know you're probably carrying projectile weapons and we need to stay out of your range.
Our Navy Seal teams with help from Sabertooth & Greed will help the Seals set up their machine guns pointed through the windows of our original starting position building 15. They'll place the mortar fire weapons & team on the roof. Also both seal squads will prepare their weapons to fire. Creed & Greed will stay with the seals in building 15.
Our hackers will hack into Disney's entire control system and cameras. They start spying on your team and locate their positions. Also they will relay all of that info to the rest of the team.
SS will turn invisible and blow up the bridges on my side of the map that connect your side and my side. He and GG will prepare to fly over to your side when it's their turn. GG will hand SS 2 hallucination gas bombs.
My plan is very simple, whenever your team beings to go on the move. The drones will fly over and drop their payloads on top of you. If you take to the air; the Drones will see the Chiaturai or any of your team that rides in their flying chariots with their advanced radar long before any of your team sees them. They'll pluck them out of the sky with their missiles.
After that the Drones which will still be far out of your reach will follow your team around and continue to scan their location along with the tech team viewing you through cameras. The Seals will get firing solution info position wise from the Drones and the Tech team. Seals will begin firing the mortar rounds in the general direction your team is headed in.
Flying invisible SS will fly towards your team and drop his payload of the Hallucination Gas Bombs right on top of your team and follow up with some energy blasts. Then he will fly off back the base.
No one on your team outside of the Deathstrokes and Wesker are going to survive heavy bombing. And while your team may have incredible reaction time and large numbers, they are still going to get tagged my massive explosives & affected by the gas: shrapnel, blast waves, shock waves, fire & heat, and blast wind are all going to tear most of your team apart.
Anyone who survives the bombing and makes it across to try and attack my team from mid to close range(your two only real options). Will be shot at with the heavy duty machine guns that can shoot at them from over a mile away. Then if they still keep coming after being soften up Goblin, SS, Greed, and Sabertooth will clobber them.
Cool. Do you want an intro? I think you have most of my team down with "mercenary" and "soldier" tbh. I mean there's specific feats and stuff I can get into but that can be covered later. If need be, I'll put one up next post.
Rebuttal
Bombing 1: Drones Activated
My plan is very simple, whenever your team beings to go on the move. The drones will fly over and drop their payloads on top of you. If you take to the air; the Drones will see the Chiaturai or any of your team that rides in their flying chariots with their advanced radar long before any of your team sees them. They'll pluck them out of the sky with their missiles.
OK so first thing's first, I have to find out how long it will take your jets to reach my team. We're 3 miles apart and the official site you gave me says that max speed is 323.11 mph, which is 0.0897527778 miles per second. This means you'll get to us in about 33.42 seconds. So not fast enough to be effective and you'll see why.
First, my team is scattering of course since attacks from multiple sides are better than just grouping my team in one spot.
Second, There's these things called chaff grenades that will mess with your drone's targeting systems and may simply knock the drones out the sky. Best part? Snake has infinite of these thanks to his bandana and so does Big Boss thanks to Infinity Paint if we use gameplay. If not, then he still has some and Snake still has canon infinite ammo. Add in Snake's octocamo+invisibility and he can easily shoot said drones out of the sky if need be with his railgun.
Bombing 2: Mortar Rounds
After that the Drones which will still be far out of your reach will follow your team around and continue to scan their location along with the tech team viewing you through cameras. The Seals will get firing solution info position wise from the Drones and the Tech team. Seals will begin firing the mortar rounds in the general direction your team is headed in.
Problems with this are 4 fold.
1. We'll be split up as I said, so there's no general area where my team is, even if your scans were still in place. Chaff Grenades knock those out, so the seals will be going blind in every way.
2. Snake's invisible (and super stealthy), Big Boss is super stealthy, both have defeated the greatest snipers in battle which gives them the range battle. This ties in with 3 in that
3. Your Seals (along with the rest of your team) will be getting sniped by Snake and Big Boss. Obviously with them dead, the mortars are useless. Deathstroke also is great at sniping and will only add to that.
4. Many on my team have all survived 'general range' explosions, as in being close range to explosions. They've all been fine from it. Unless you hit dead on, which is impossible for reasons stated above, then the mortars aren't doing much to many on my team.
Bombing 3: Silver Samurai
Flying invisible SS will fly towards your team and drop his payload of the Hallucination Gas Bombs right on top of your team and follow up with some energy blasts. Then he will fly off back the base.
Same problems arise here that exist for the drones.
1. I'm not quite sure how fast you fly, but it should take you some time to reach us. By then we're split up and you can't exactly hit all my team at once. Especially given their different speed and stealth levels.
2. Chaff grenades might not throw off nanotech, but they should mess with any targeting systems, the cameras that make you invisible, and so on.
3. This leads to you getting potentially shot down or wounded by Snake's railgun and/or Volgin's lightning.
Finishing Moves:
No one on your team outside of the Deathstrokes and Wesker are going to survive heavy bombing. And while your team may have incredible reaction time and large numbers, they are still going to get tagged my massive explosives & affected by the gas: shrapnel, blast waves, shock waves, fire & heat, and blast wind are all going to tear most of your team apart.
Anyone who survives the bombing and makes it across to try and attack my team from mid to close range(your two only real options). Will be shot at with the heavy duty machine guns that can shoot at them from over a mile away. Then if they still keep coming after being soften up Goblin, SS, Greed, and Sabertooth will clobber them.
As I've detailed, the bombs won't be doing much to my team and likely won't even hit them. And as said, my team survive close proximity to explosions very often and end up just fine, so the incidental effects won't be doing much.
As for machine guns, as said, your team will be sniped by awesome snipers and of course, we have people with extreme aim like Ocelot, The Boss, Taskmaster, Deathstroke, and so on. Also everyone on my team has the stealth and speed to dodge multiple machine gun fire or to avoid the guns altogether.
As for being clobbered, taking on people like The Fear (faster than eyesight at least), Grey Fox (also invisible and 100+ tonner), Tengus (all block machine gun fire), and others like The Boss, Gene, and Solidus (who are on my team and are faster than eyesight by far and Solidus is fast enough to create flames at his feet by running), make Snake and Big Boss very capable of taking on the four members on your team. Add in Wesker's speed, Gene, The Boss, Ocelot (aim and CQC), Solidus, Taskmaster (taken on the likes of Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-Man, etc.), Deathstroke (very superhuman in durability, speed, strength, and skill), New 52 Deathstroke (MORE superhuman in durability, speed, and strength with lots of skill), Lady Shiva (the most skilled person in DC almost who's stomped very powerful opponents), Bane (also a skilled martial artist), Cassandra Cain (in some ways better than Lady Shiva), and Volgin (skill+durability+lightning), and it looks like a team full of people who can each possibly take on members of your team.
So it's essentially `17 on 4, with the 4 not having too many advantages over any of the 17. Add in stealth, weaponry, range/sniping, perfect teamwork, and strategy and the 4 go down.
Basics
1. As said, Snake and Big Boss will be countering your drones and tech with chaff grenades, and then getting in position to snipe via stealth. So will both Deathstrokes. Snake will be using his railgun. If need be, any of them can go closer and take out your team with multiple WP and Stun Grenades (Snake has infinite) and/or Deathstroke's promethium swords and helicopter oneshotting staff beams.
2. Revolver Ocelot, both Taskmasters, The Boss, Wesker, Lady Shiva, and Cassandra Cain will all use to stealth to traverse the map to get in range of your team. For Taskmasters, Boss, and Ocelot, that is merely the range of a gun, while Wesker, Shiva, and Cain is getting close to incapacitate. For reference, Shiva has disappeared from Robin 's sight, Cassy's a trained ninja, Taskmaster has snuck up on Deadpool, The Boss has snuck up on Big Boss, and Ocelot has used great stealth to disappear from Big Boss as well.
3. Bane, Liquid, Batwoman, Volgin, and Solidus will make their way over and be covered by my snipers if need be and begin the assault close range as well. Liquid will be using a Chitauri ship as he is an expert flyer and will be able to easily outmaneuver your drones (as he maneuvered jets in a helicopter).
4. The Chitauri ships will be launching an aerial assault on your team to keep them busy and possibly kill a few of them (the Seals for sure, likely Greed and Goblin as well since their weapons can keep MCU Hulk at bay). This combined with sniper support will bring the ambush/attack to your side instead.
5. Eventually it's Bane+Cassy Cain+Shiva+Wesker+Gene+Liquid+Taskmasters+Solidus+The Boss vs. your team in h2h2 with snipers and chitauri covering them. Some like Taskmaster, Solidus, and The Boss will start out shooting, but will stop when the gunfire becomes ineffective.
6. The combined assault of close+mid+aerial+sniping long range takes out your team.
Recap
Solid Snake: Using Chaff Grenades, turning invisible, sniping with railgun to take your team out and cover mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close.
Big Boss: Using Chaff Grenades, using stealth, sniping your team and covering mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close.
New 52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
Pre-52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
Taskmaster: Using Stealth to get to medium range and then unload with guns, then arrows, go Close Combat when needed. Wins/holds own via superior skill and great feats vs. Venom, Spider-Man, Iron Man, etc.
Udon Taskmaster: Using Stealth and Speed to get medium range and unload with guns and then blitzing in Close Combat.
Gene: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed/teleportation, his knives, and his ESP abilities.
The Boss: Getting close via stealth and ambushing. Then unloading infinitely on your team (with patriot gun) until only the bulletproof are left and/or other close combat needs support. Then going H2H.
Bane: Getting close range to engage in H2H.
Volgin: Getting close range for H2H and lightning action. Helps to definitely take down Silver Samurai, drones (along the way), Sabertooth (metal bones), and really any and everybody as lightning is powerful.
Lady Shiva: Using Stealth to get close, ambush, take down your team H2H due to taking on better/stronger/more durable people.
Cassandra Cain: Using stealth and speed to get close and ambush your team with extreme skill in H2H combat.
Wesker: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed and strength.
Batwoman: Getting Close and helping in H2H combat.
Solidus: Blitzing your team with sword and guns and superior speed.
Revolver Ocelot: Using Stealth to ambush your team and get the drop on them, killing them with gunfire and engaging in H2H if needed.
Chitauri: Aerial attacks and support, bombarding your team with weapon fire that momentarily stopped MCU Hulk.
Liquid Snake: Getting close via one of the Chitauri aerial ships as he is a master flyer, taking you down via aerial attacks.
So an all out assault.
Summary
1. My gear+plans to spread out+time it takes to execute your plan makes your bombarding drones plan useless and has them get shot out of the sky.
2. Bombs don't kill almost anyone in my team so the strategy was ineffective regardless
3. Snipers cover my team as we have people stealthing over to your side for an ambush. Guns and H2H attacks will take your team unawares, killing those that aren't bulletproof, if the snipers don't kill you first (especially dat railgun) and if the Chitauri ships and liquid don't put you away either.
4. Machine gun rounds mean nothing to my team's level of skill/reaction speed and we can all easily get around said guns as there are clear ways to your side.
5. Close range team+Volgin's lightning will take your team close range along with aerial support and snipers.
6. Snipers will take on your team at a little closer range with grenades+powerful tech and superior skill if it comes down to it.
7. We win due to numbers+skill+strategy+all out assault.
OK so first thing's first, I have to find out how long it will take your jets to reach my team. We're 3 miles apart and the official site you gave me says that max speed is 323.11 mph, which is 0.0897527778 miles per second. This means you'll get to us in about 33.42 seconds. So not fast enough to be effective and you'll see why.
You just explained why you would die and get blown up, my teams travel speed several times faster than any of your team members. Once again while your team has impressive reaction times, these are micro missiles and 50lb bombs these drones are dropping. Your team wouldn't be able get out of the way of all the different forms of damage these explosions are creating.
First, my team is scattering of course since attacks from multiple sides are better than just grouping my team in one spot.
Your team starts inside of a large building(Spaceship Earth/Building 1), as soon as they make it out, boom the drones would be near them ready to drop their payloads. You have 33 secs or less to make it out of the building and run as far as you can or take to the air and fly with your Chitarui. Either way Drones are gonna get you and blow you up.
Second, There's these things called chaff grenades that will mess with your drone's targeting systems and may simply knock the drones out the sky. Best part? Snake has infinite of these thanks to his bandana and so does Big Boss thanks to Infinity Paint if we use gameplay. If not, then he still has some and Snake still has canon infinite ammo. Add in Snake's octocamo+invisibility and he can easily shoot said drones out of the sky if need be with his railgun.
Chaff Grenades:
I already said my drones would fly thousands of feet into the air beyond your range. The drones are listed at an operational height of 55,000 feet. My drones could be up to 10 miles in the air. But, for the purpose of indulging this even if the Drones were let's say only 2,000 feet in the air, that's still 0.3 miles = 666 yards. Snake is going to toss Chaff Grenades into the air and actually expect to the little chaff's to hit something?
Chaff grenades disperse little metallic strips that hover over the air. This only works if the target is in the general area beneath or beside it. There are so many logical factors why this wouldn't work: gravity, wind, altitude, speed of my drones, etc.
OK, you only have standard gear for Snake, not game mechanics infinite ammo mode. Railgun isn't standard gear for Snake Darkraiden. Go ask any Metal Gear fan: Sirfizzwhizz, Nickzambuto, Beaconofstrength...
If you wanted the railgun you should have paid for it by buying it from the perk store. Same thing goes for Octocamo, pretty 99% sure his Octocamo suit is not standard gear. I've made a lot of Snake/Metal gear threads so I could learn about the characters, this stuff isn't standard gear mate. Non of this is even going down. Again, you can go contact any of the Snake experts on the vine and they will tell you.
Bombing 2: Mortar Rounds
Problems with this are 4 fold.
1. We'll be split up as I said, so there's no general area where my team is, even if your scans were still in place. Chaff Grenades knock those out, so the seals will be going blind in every way.
Splitting Up & Chaff:
I don't really care if your team splits up, that's a horrible plan really(weakening your forces). As you have already calculated they only have around 33 seconds to make something happen and split up. If they do I'll just hunt them down one by one and bomb them. Honestly gives me the advantage. I said general area, because I can't pretend like I have magical precog or to control your characters actions. I still know what direction any individual member is headed in as I can track them in several ways: Drone Radar, Cameras, Etc. Chaff grenades have already been addressed and logically this tactic has no logical basis for working as I explain above.
2. Snake's invisible (and super stealthy), Big Boss is super stealthy, both have defeated the greatest snipers in battle which gives them the range battle. This ties in with 3 in that
No, he's not invisible that's not standard gear, if you don't know you better ask somebody. His standard suit is the Sneaking Suit. As far as the snakes being super stealthy, even if they were invisible too, I have radar that would render it mute.
3. Your Seals (along with the rest of your team) will be getting sniped by Snake and Big Boss. Obviously with them dead, the mortars are useless. Deathstroke also is great at sniping and will only add to that.
So you're gonna snipe my team from miles away as Drones are hunting you down and motar fire is coming at you? :/ I need to print a Dextersinister was right Tshirt, good god are snipers are really getting overrated on the boards now a days. All of my main characters(outside of Goblin) can eat heavy duty fire arms for breakfast. Anyway all of your team has midrange weapons as to the size of the battlefield. Also they are going to have to gain a clear line of site. By the time all of that happens you're team will be dead.
4. Many on my team have all survived 'general range' explosions, as in being close range to explosions. They've all been fine from it. Unless you hit dead on, which is impossible for reasons stated above, then the mortars aren't doing much to many on my team.
I am very familiar with the majority of your team outside of the Slades and Wesker no they are not surviving general area explosions without clear context. A strong piece of shrapnel to a vital area would kill or critically injure the majority of them. Very few of your characters have above peak human durability, special armor, and/or healing factors to help them survive.
Bombing 3: Silver Samurai
Speed(Travel):
Same problems arise here that exist for the drones.
1. I'm not quite sure how fast you fly, but it should take you some time to reach us. By then we're split up and you can't exactly hit all my team at once. Especially given their different speed and stealth levels.
Fast enough to break the sound barrier and create the sonic boom affect even while busing through a solid ceiling.
Please pay close attention the rings(shock wave). He's breaking the speed of sound and traveling at Jet Speeds. They are called Jet Boots for a reason after all. I'll reach you in mere moments. SS will reach you in mere moments, drop the gas bombs and blast you, then return to base.
2. Chaff grenades might not throw off nanotech, but they should mess with any targeting systems, the cameras that make you invisible, and so on.
Again, so many logically reasons this is not going to work as I've been over this above. You're not hitting a target going faster than the speed of sound with the little chaff grenades that totally rely on me being in a general fixed location.
3. This leads to you getting potentially shot down or wounded by Snake's railgun and/or Volgin's lightning.
Railgun isn't standard gear. I don't know why you thought it was; there are tons of Snake fans on this site and tons of threads you could have gone to where no Snake fan brings up the Railgun as being standard. Volgin's attacks are electricity, not lighting. People have been chastised on the boards for saying this. Volgin doesn't have a whole lot of impressive targeting feats, he's not hitting something moving at the speed of sound. Also Volgin's attacks have limited range. Also how is Volgin hitting something invisible? Maybe snake has infrared or something, but Volgin doesn't.
You're team gets blasted into BBQ. Look below SS blasts can go AOE and effect a large area. He BBQ Wolverine(in Back In Japan) and none of your team has the feats to survive this kind of energy blasts.It's well with in the limits of tank busting, but his energy blasts work very well on organics as seen by feats. Wolverine even with his healing factor stayed burned up for several panels afterward.
Gallery
Finishing Moves:
You Die, Here's Why:
As I've detailed, the bombs won't be doing much to my team and likely won't even hit them. And as said, my team survive close proximity to explosions very often and end up just fine, so the incidental effects won't be doing much.
Your team wouldn't survive this type of bombing outside of the Slades and Wesker. They don't have the feats, the stats, the durability, the armor, or the healing factors outside of those 3 characters. Which is why you haven't shown any feats to this effect. Never mind that whatever scans/feat sighting you can do surviving a single explosion isn't any where near surviving repeated air-raids of massive bombing.
Let me explain what is happening below on the ground on your side of the map:
Drones fly in and drop their bombs, you say you split up that's fine they will hunt your team down one by one and drop the bombs in their general area.
Then mortar fire comes in adding more explosions.
Lastly the SS flies in and drops the gas bombs and his blasts as well.
Even if you split up, your forces are being hit with massive blast waves, shrapnel, heat & flames, shock waves, etc. Things are catching on fire, fragments are flying everywhere. It's getting messy down their and most of your team at this point is dead or massively injured.
All of your characters expect the Boss Unit are pretty well established on the vine, the majority of voters know what your characters can do. No one outside of the Slades & Wesker live through these air raids. They all die from massive amounts of trauma and they flat out don't have the feats to survive this. Not to mention you haven't even addressed the hallucinogenic gas bombs. Why? Because most of your team doesn't have a proper counter for this. Take a good look at the graph, that's what kind of massive damage is happening to your team.
As for machine guns, as said, your team will be sniped by awesome snipers and of course, we have people with extreme aim like Ocelot, The Boss, Taskmaster, Deathstroke, and so on. Also everyone on my team has the stealth and speed to dodge multiple machine gun fire or to avoid the guns altogether.
Again, you are going to snipe me from MILES AWAY? With no clear line of sight? :/
My machine guns on the other hand need no line of sight and have a range of over 1 mile long. They can get any and all targeting info from the Drones & Tech Team. These are simple and standard things you need to keep in mind while attacking. They can cut through steel and concrete and get to you. They can either shoot you or even if they miss every single shot this is still a form of Suppression Fire which will still keep your team(anyone who survives the bombings) pinned down and trapped in their positions slowing down any progress they try to make.
As for being clobbered, taking on people like The Fear (faster than eyesight at least), Grey Fox (also invisible and 100+ tonner), Tengus (all block machine gun fire), and others like The Boss, Gene, and Solidus (who are on my team and are faster than eyesight by far and Solidus is fast enough to create flames at his feet by running), make Snake and Big Boss very capable of taking on the four members on your team. Add in Wesker's speed, Gene, The Boss, Ocelot (aim and CQC), Solidus, Taskmaster (taken on the likes of Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-Man, etc.), Deathstroke (very superhuman in durability, speed, strength, and skill), New 52 Deathstroke (MORE superhuman in durability, speed, and strength with lots of skill), Lady Shiva (the most skilled person in DC almost who's stomped very powerful opponents), Bane (also a skilled martial artist), Cassandra Cain (in some ways better than Lady Shiva), and Volgin (skill+durability+lightning), and it looks like a team full of people who can each possibly take on members of your team.
So it's essentially `17 on 4, with the 4 not having too many advantages over any of the 17. Add in stealth, weaponry, range/sniping, perfect teamwork, and strategy and the 4 go down.
Yawn. You're just throwing out Big Names and hope that voters will be impressed. None of what you just brought up has anything to do with any of the Conditions of the Battlefield, The Present Tactical Situation, The Present Actions of Our Characters, and/or The Logical Chain of Events.None of your team would win any sort of 1 on 1 fight expect maybe Pre52 Deathstroke beating Greedling. But, that's a big maybe especially after he's already been worn down. Silver Samurai would have to stop flying around and literally stand their like a moron and take damage from your team. None of your team have the weapons, stats or gear to put down Sabertooth outside of your Slades. No one is beating GG in any serious Battleboard discussion. He can simply fly over them and hit them with everything in his Bag Of Tricks he always carries around: Gas Bombs, Sonic Frogs(yes silly, but true), blinding Sparklers, AOE Explosive Pumpkin Bombs, Electric Blasts, Razor Bats, Etc.
Amazing Spider-Man #180
Just in case you doubted the Frogs. He keeps all of these weird weapons in his pouch: Bag of Tricks. Evidence of that is back in the Handbook up top and has pictured below. I haven't even pulled some of his other armaments yet. He's Bag of Tricks is comparable to Batman's utility belt only GG is clearly meant for killing and therefore much more overall effective.
Your collection of 1 point wonders has no main enforcer to handle the tactics, weapons, and devices my team can rain down on them. Did you really think the ole lots of characters trick would work against a team that is vastly superior in a number of ways?
Basics
1. As said, Snake and Big Boss will be countering your drones and tech with chaff grenades, and then getting in position to snipe via stealth. So will both Deathstrokes. Snake will be using his railgun. If need be, any of them can go closer and take out your team with multiple WP and Stun Grenades (Snake has infinite) and/or Deathstroke's promethium swords and helicopter oneshotting staff beams.
Chaff Grenades again, clearly you didn't think this through: gravity, wind, speed, altitude, you are trying to toss small grenades upward to hit them with sprinkly metal strips that would be blown away by the speed of the Drones themselves, never mind you they are thousands of feet upward.
Railgun which you do not have and doesn't even need to be addressed.
Stroke: Sabertooth has an adamantium skeleton, and greed as ultimate shield. At most maybe slade can cut them a bit, but he can't cut through them with his Sword. His Staff is something either of them can tank and both of them have the healing feats to recover. It took a good size atomic blast from Sunfire to blow up SS armor. Nerfed down to the limits of Iron Man Missile hurting SS and your staff still wouldn't do much. Now in reality although Slade is a good shot, the fact is he doesn't have many actual targeting feats with the Staff and he would have to shoot SS while he is invisible and flying and blasting at him. Things are not looking good for Slade. GG can just fly above him and ignore him really or he he can fly around tossing weapons and stomp Slade.
SS vs Sunfire...you're gonna need some heavy duty blasts: Cyclops, Gambit level to take SS down. From Wolverine: Japan's Most Wanted.
Gallery
Slades die and they are outclassed this time around. Not that I even care about individual matchups as in team batttles indeiducal matchups way to often depend on characters haphazardly meeting on a battlefield when none of that is really guaranteed in these massive team battles. Stun Grenades?? You're severally underestimating my teams durability and overestimating your teams weaponry and the idea that they will even be able to hit them in the first place.
You're dealing with some serious dudes here on average Sabertooth can tank blasts from the likes of Boom Boom & Cyclops and get back up and continue fighting. Uncanny X-Men #328.
Gallery
None of the weapons options you have are going to get the job done when Sabertooth is shown here in these scans tanking a direct blast from a very angry Boom Boom. That's not a high feat by the way, that's what that dude Creed averages out in multiple comic appearances before he became Jobbertooth. Lucky for me the rules stat no Jobbering, No CIS, No Wis.
2. Revolver Ocelot, both Taskmasters, The Boss, Wesker, Lady Shiva, and Cassandra Cain will all use to stealth to traverse the map to get in range of your team. For Taskmasters, Boss, and Ocelot, that is merely the range of a gun, while Wesker, Shiva, and Cain is getting close to incapacitate. For reference, Shiva has disappeared from Robin 's sight, Cassy's a trained ninja, Taskmaster has snuck up on Deadpool, The Boss has snuck up on Big Boss, and Ocelot has used great stealth to disappear from Big Boss as well.
3. Bane, Liquid, Batwoman, Volgin, and Solidus will make their way over and be covered by my snipers if need be and begin the assault close range as well. Liquid will be using a Chitauri ship as he is an expert flyer and will be able to easily outmaneuver your drones (as he maneuvered jets in a helicopter).
Chitarui ships are extremely limited in speed and maneuverability. MCU Iron Man who's speeds and tactics are somewhat comparable to SS flew circles around them. MCU Hawkeye literally said they can't bank worth a damn(video clip here). Liquid isn't outmaneuvering anything. Bane, Batwoman, Volgin, Solidus, and really your entire team is slow in travel speed they'll be dead before they make it a so much as half a mile across the battle field, before they are blown up, gas bombed, blasted, or shot down by heavy duty machine guns.
In this case it doesn't matter how good of a pilot Liquid is, he isn't going to improve a inferior air ship like the Chitarui chariot. Drones >>>>>Chaituari = Which is why Drones cost more.
How are you(the rest of your team outside of Liquid) getting so close in to attack in the first place? I blew up all the bridges during prep on my side of the map. You either fly across like you had Liquid do(which is a death sentence due to Drones and SS , and Goblin being better at aerial combat). Or, you swim across: Dead in the water, since there are sharks. OR, you grapple across and there are a few direct moments where you are completely vulnerable to attack and making yourself a lot more noticeable while swinging around like Spiderman. None of these choices are great and they will all lead to you getting killed. But, you need to decide how all these CQC characters you have are getting in so close: fly, grapple, or swim.
4. The Chitauri ships will be launching an aerial assault on your team to keep them busy and possibly kill a few of them (the Seals for sure, likely Greed and Goblin as well since their weapons can keep MCU Hulk at bay). This combined with sniper support will bring the ambush/attack to your side instead.
And so my team is sitting on top of their hands while this is happening? You are massively overrating the Chitaruri weapons to a large degree and underestimating my team. Green Goblin has eaten pumpkin bombs from other goblins which are a lot better than Chirauri weapons. MCU Cap took a shot right in the feels from a Chitarui blaster and got right back up. MCU Cap is awesome, but he's way below healing and durability of my team. Nothing that can't even take down MCU Cap is going to even have any sort of overall affect on my team. Hulk was annoyed, let's not blow that out of proportion, besides the fact there were a lot more than 10 Aliens shooting at him(go back and watch the movie). None of the Chitarui have good targeting feats, 2 members of my team could fly and blitz them. The drones are smaller targets, faster, more maneuverable, and harder to hit. Go back and look at the stats, the Drones are 4 feet across. It's going to be hard as all get out to prove your main characters can land a single shot, more or less your fodder. Also they can simply outflank you since they can fly a lot higher and faster than anything the Chiratuiri have shown.
You're essentially trying to shoot down a 4 foot target that is moving over 300mph and is flying thousands of feet in the air, while you shoot upwards at it, while it's dropping bombs and fire missiles at you. If you want a general comparison for the level of difficulty of what you are trying to do, Star Wars pilots complained about trying to hit a pretty stationary target of 2 meters= 6 feet with computerized targeting & help from droids. Even for the likes of Deadshot & Punisher dude that's a ridiculously difficult thing that you are trying to attempt here. It's not even remotely plausible for your particular set of characters, besides that your weapons don't have that kind of range you would need to pull it off.
As far as killing the seals go, who cares, if you do ever kill them they would have already served their purpose by blowing most of your team up long before you could ever get near enough to even produce a feasible attack. The majority of your team only has midrange/close range ability. Those that have any sort of real long range weapon like a sniper rifle still need to take the time just to set up a clear shot, and a locate comfortable place in which to shoot from like a sniper's perch(and not risk being blown up by the bombing).
5. Eventually it's Bane+Cassy Cain+Shiva+Wesker+Gene+Liquid+Taskmasters+Solidus+The Boss vs. your team in h2h2 with snipers and chitauri covering them. Some like Taskmaster, Solidus, and The Boss will start out shooting, but will stop when the gunfire becomes ineffective.
Only H2H fighters on my team are Greed & Sabertooth, GG & SS are not going to even bother with fighting you in CQC. By the time any of your team could possibly reach me(which you failed to describe how in your post, since the bridges are out), all of your team expect Wesker and the Slades would be dead. If they make it across the get stomped down by characters with flat out better feats of Durability. Saberooth could one shot your any member of your team with his Adamantium claws(except Wesker) and rip their organs out. Seriously bullets and guns are meaningless here and your best weapon you thought you had(the Railgun), you're not even allowed to have...it's not standard gear. Go ask around and go read some good Snake Debates on the Vine.
6. The combined assault of close+mid+aerial+sniping long range takes out your team.
Not gonna happen for detailed reasons and logic that I just went over.
Recap
Solid Snake: Using Chaff Grenades, turning invisible, sniping with railgun to take your team out and cover mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close.
This recap is honestly repetitive towards your Basic Section Post.
CQC: Sabertooth or Greed Could Honestly Stomp Several Of These 1 Point Wonders At Once, especially after they are softened up from bombing and being hit with heavy duty artillery.
Big Boss: Using Chaff Grenades, using stealth, sniping your team and covering mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close.
So repetitive: Basics covered all this unless I missed something.
Chaff: Been there...done that.
Stealth: Non factor, I have too many ways of hunting you down and detecting you.
Sniping: Overrated on a battlefield where we start miles apart and buildings and cover are everywhere. It's almost like you think these snipers are Wesley or Cross from Wanted with the Fantasy sniper rifle and they are capable of weaving bullets through several miles of buildings and other objects in the battlefield.
New 52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be
If he makes it over, any member of my team will stomp him with superior combat feats. I can scan drop if necessary.
Pre-52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
Only character here by feats worth a damn in this situation, but he can't carry the water for most of your useless CQC/stealth guys.
Taskmaster: Using Stealth to get to medium range and then unload with guns, then arrows, go Close Combat when needed. Wins/holds own via superior skill and great feats vs. Venom, Spider-Man, Iron Man, etc.
Again, this is you throwing out some big names and not even recognizing the situation. The hell is taskmaster gonna do against Drones and characters that can fly(Goblin, SS). Sabertooth or Greedling would swat him down like a fly in CQC. Stealth means nothing here...Dragon's Pusle, Super Smelling & Hearing...Radar, yadahahahah.
Udon Taskmaster: Using Stealth and Speed to get medium range and unload with guns and then blitzing in Close Combat.
Good to see you are starting to realize how limited most of your characters are most of your posts in this section are about CQC, stealth, yadaayaaddh...oh and mid range weapons.
Gene: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed/teleportation, his knives, and his ESP abilities.
Zero Shift makes Gene tired if repeatedly used. Once again even you mention how close you have to get. My team especially Goblin have dealt with precogs. Anyway, this guy is yet another non factor that can't even deal with my Drones or being bombed. Goblin has dealt with Spiderman, Sabertooth has encountered Spiderman as well so it's not new territory for him. Also Greed has dealt with Bradley who has Ultimate Eye. Al of this adds up to his ESP not much of a factor here since my characters can compensate for it during combat. His knives are a joke...seriously you really think you are going to even make a scratch on Greed, Goblin, SS, and Sabertooth with some knives? Unless these knives of Gene's are made of adamantium or something, Gene is just another non factor/useless character you decided to put on your team.
The Boss: Getting close via stealth and ambushing. Then unloading infinitely on your team (with patriot gun) until only the bulletproof are left and/or other close combat needs support. Then going H2H.
Another character that tries to use stealth and needs to get close. Everyone on my team would laugh off the patriot gun due to armor and healing, only one it may damage is GG, and he's not going to be reachable due to being in the air by the time you would even make it over. Besides that The Boss dies and gets blown up like the majority of these characters you've yet to provided any evidence for tanking massive bombings.
Volgin: Getting close range for H2H and lightning action. Helps to definitely take down Silver Samurai, drones (along the way), Sabertooth (metal bones), and really any and everybody as lightning is powerful.
Hmm, Volgin can shoot and hit Drones thousands of miles in the air? Oh and it's not lighting, once again. Sabertooth is just going to let you repeatedly electrocute him and what not move out of the way? None of Sabertooth's teammates are going help? Volgin is going to target the invisible SS who is flying around blasting people? Volgin can survive the bombings? Nope , call out some feats and explain how they apply. You're remembering the part about the metal bones, but you ignore the part where Sabertooth has a healing factor can get back up and slit Voglin's throat. He has to get far too close to Creed which is very bad for him.
Lady Shiva: Using Stealth to get close, ambush, take down your team H2H due to taking on better/stronger/more durable people.
Bane and Lady Shiva are fodder in this battle, they have no range weapon, over rely on stealth and CQC, and could die from one good blast wave and some sharp pieces of shrapnel. I've already dealt with any and all stealth in a variety of ways: Radar, Super Smelling, Dragon's Pulse, Cameras....
Cassandra Cain: Using stealth and speed to get close and ambush your team with extreme skill in H2H combat.
Another member of the fodder depart as far as this particular battle is set up. She is a bad*** mother***** in most fights, but in this one she is very useless. She can't even avoid the bombs, blasts, and other attacks I've set in place. She would be dead before she ever got close, if not any member of my team is flat out better.
Wesker: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed and strength.
Wesker is so severely limited in what he can actually accomplish in this fight, the Drones will be seeing more actual combat than Wesker will in this situation. When my fodder is more useful than some of your best team members that's when you know you are in trouble. This is just a guy who can heal and punch stuff. I really don't care how bad ass Wesker is, he has no way of winning this fight for your team. At most all he can do is kill some seals, and fight Sabertooth or Greed before getting blasted by a Drone, SS, or GG. Honestly by the time he gets close, he'll already be softened up or dead. Pick one...
Batwoman: Getting Close and helping in H2H combat.
One of the few characters that actually have some good gear and are a decent gear user and you are forcing her into another CQC role. She's going to die like most of your team: getting bombed and blasted.
Solidus: Blitzing your team with sword and guns and superior speed.
And who do you think Solidius has superior speed to? The seals. Oh yeah, ok. Back this up claim with feat sighting. You're going to have to prove he has superior speed to any of my main characters whom most are Wolverine Level in Combat Speed, which is very good. And Considering Goblin is just below Spiderman in combat Speed, I find it hard to believe Solidius will be blitzing anyone here. Besides he dies in the bombing raids.
Revolver Ocelot: Using Stealth to ambush your team and get the drop on them, killing them with gunfire and engaging in H2H if needed.
Boy everyone on your team is getting the drop on mine in your mind and scenario. I must have 0 super senses or detection abilities on my team...oh wait. You're going to KILL Sabertooth(healing), GG(Armored), Greed(Ultimate Shield), and SS(Carbandium armored) with GUNS? :p You're funny. Did you really think you can ambush my team when they have 2 guys with amazing senses, we have Drone Radar, and out tech team is watching you and following along with the cameras the entire time?
Chitauri: Aerial attacks and support, bombarding your team with weapon fire that momentarily stopped MCU Hulk.
Wow, they went from keeping him at Bay, to stopping the Hulk. Hot damn. Seriously, go back and watch the movie. Even MCU cap could tank this form of attack. These Chiturai guys would be great against characters with low durability and no ability to return fire, but they won't do much for you here in this present situation.
One that probably doesn't even happen since your travel speed is so slow all of your characters would have died miles away and half of my team is still chilling at the base waiting to finish you off. Also you may have perfect teamwork, but you can't coordinate the sophisticated attack you are trying to unleash without basic communication tools like radio coms.
Summary: Redundancy
1. My gear+plans to spread out+time it takes to execute your plan makes your bombarding drones plan useless and has them get shot out of the sky.
You said yourself my first bomb wave was going to go down in a little over 33 secs..how is that a lot of time? The second wave comes right after with SS pushing Mach Speeds, dropping the gas bombs and blasting you. Again all of this is happening in seconds, it's going to take your team so incredibly long to reach my side of the battlefield SS could race back and forth a few times before most of your team would be in close range of us for the first time.
2. Bombs don't kill almost anyone in my team so the strategy was ineffective regardless
So, you think what your team is a bunch of 1 point Wolverines that can tank bombing and their health cannot be taxed. Hmm, interesting and a ridiculous notion. These are 50lb bombs, micro missiles, and 81mm mortar not just a few grenades being tossed about. Let's be real here, they are going to kill the majority of your team.
3. Snipers cover my team as we have people stealthing over to your side for an ambush. Guns and H2H attacks will take your team unawares, killing those that aren't bulletproof, if the snipers don't kill you first (especially dat railgun) and if the Chitauri ships and liquid don't put you away either.
All of this "Ambush" stuff truly ignores the very basics of what I presented to you in every-way. I already let you know from the get go about Sabertooth's Super Senses, Drone Radar, Tech Team Watching The Cameras, and Dragon's Pulse. Besides that your snipers can't shoot miles away, through all of the building and objects at Disney World Epcot. You don't have "Dat Railgun", it's Dat Non Standard Gear. Look at the photo below of Epcot. Do you see all the trees, buildings, and other crap you are claiming your snipers can shoot through? You must think your snipers can curve bullets. The Chitarui are laughable when compared to my drones and two flying characters. They would get blasted out of the sky. I doubt you could even state how fast the Chitaruiri Chariots really are. I could probably look it up for you, but that's not my job to establish, it's yours.
4. Machine gun rounds mean nothing to my team's level of skill/reaction speed and we can all easily get around said guns as there are clear ways to your side.
Who said your team was going to stand there like idiots and get shot? The heavy duty machine guns are useful because of what they do in combat. They are chewing up the scenery, blasting through wood, concrete, creating more confusion on your team, and sending fragments every which way. I don't even need a single bullet to hit you and I can do a lot to your team. Especially considering the fact that I am using incendiary and armor piercing rounds to do damage. Also keep in mind you will get continually bombed until we run out of mortar fire and the seals tend to pack heavy; I can show you some clips like this one. Also lets keep in mind your team will be occupied by other attacks, you team doesn't even know I have any of these guns or weapons in the first place. Seems very odd you are hinting at them actively avoiding them. That opens you up to being shot since you have most of your characters moving towards my base. Honestly that brings us to another very important point.
Why is Snake and your team even looking up for my drones and SS. All you know from your Basic Knowledge Pack is: Powers, Abilities, and Skills. You know nothing about my perks or my gear. Why is he and your other shooters looking for something they wouldn't know was there until after the bombs start dropping. Is he going to just be conveniently looking up and trying to randomly check the sky? Smells foul TBH. Doesn't seem to make sense based on the type of limited info you have. Also are you suggesting you are actively avoiding heavy duty machine guns you don't know are there and looking for Drones you don't know about?
5. Close range team+Volgin's lightning will take your team close range along with aerial support and snipers.
Stop calling it lighting. Glad you openly admit it's close range only. Snipers mean nothing, they can't shoot miles out. The reason I am strongly against calling it lighting is because natural lighting moves at Mach 5 and even the most strongest Metal Gear supporters suggested Volgins electrical attacks only move around the speed of bullets. At best, around Mach 2.
6. Snipers will take on your team at a little closer range with grenades+powerful tech and superior skill if it comes down to it.
What powerful tech? Where? Snipers aren't shooting miles out. Voters are probably exhausted reading basically 3 full length summaries: Basics, Recap, and Summary. This is all covering the same few points. Next time, please do keep it to one section. 3 full summaries is overkill.
7. We win due to numbers+skill+strategy+all out assault.
You die and get bombed in oblivion and lose to a team using superior fire power, tactics, strategy, weapons, and a team that makes the majority of your characters durability look laughable.
You're gonna have to bring it. I don't mind losing, but this isn't going to cut the mustard. You are an excellent debater at this point, but this team you have of 1 point wonders and only basically 2 useful characters(Deathstrokes) isn't going to make it far in this tourney. The strategy of stacking up a bunch of 1 pointers only works when you have a bunch of characters with really unique abilities and versatility. Instead this is a team has too many basic Solider, Mercs, Fighter, and Shooter characters. All of your characters have overlapping qualities giving them a very limited form of attacking and reacting to a variety of tactical situations. If you've noticed in my posts at this time, I'm not even being boastful nor arrogant when I honestly say: Drones Solo everyone, but Wesker & The Slades. The majority of your characters aren't very useful when it comes the mechanics of this particular battle: they either have very limited weaponry or they are just H2H fighters. Against flying characters, characters with massive healing factors, and Drones...that's not gonna work out for you at all.
You just explained why you would die and get blown up, my teams travel speed several times faster than any of your team members. Once again while your team has impressive reaction times, these are micro missiles and 50lb bombs these drones are dropping. Your team wouldn't be able get out of the way of all the different forms of damage these explosions are creating.
Your team starts inside of a large building(Spaceship Earth/Building 1), as soon as they make it out, boom the drones would be near them ready to drop their payloads. You have 33 secs or less to make it out of the building and run as far as you can or take to the air and fly with your Chitarui. Either way Drones are gonna get you and blow you up.
33 seconds is a lot of time Luke, you're underestimating that. My team are all superhuman, but even using Olympic numbers of (lowballing here) 10 m/s, they'd be getting 330 m away fro the building in all directions. Liquid would have plenty of time to mount a Chitauri airship and blow you out of the sky.
Chaff Grenades:
I already said my drones would fly thousands of feet into the air beyond your range. The drones are listed at an operational height of 55,000 feet. My drones could be up to 10 miles in the air. But, for the purpose of indulging this even if the Drones were let's say only 2,000 feet in the air, that's still 0.3 miles = 666 yards. Snake is going to toss Chaff Grenades into the air and actually expect to the little chaff's to hit something?
Chaff grenades disperse little metallic strips that hover over the air. This only works if the target is in the general area beneath or beside it. There are so many logical factors why this wouldn't work: gravity, wind, altitude, speed of my drones, etc.
Ok, a few things to address:
1. Snake can throw Chaff grenades up, about roughly 100ft in the air, which works better for hitting your drones
2. The chaff grenades' metal strips interfere mostly with the radar/targeting systems of your drones. It may not knock them out of the air, but it will stop you from being able to target my team. Remember, to properly target us, you have to make it through that haze of chaff/metal strips just to see us. This prevents you from blowing us up at all.
3. If you're that high in the air, it gives any and everyone on my team enough time to easily get out of dodge before your bombs drop. That's at least another 2-5 seconds. And as I'll show later, explosions don't do much to my team.
Infinite Ammo & Gear:
OK, you only have standard gear for Snake, not game mechanics infinite ammo mode. Railgun isn't standard gear for Snake Darkraiden. Go ask any Metal Gear fan: Sirfizzwhizz, Nickzambuto, Beaconofstrength...
If you wanted the railgun you should have paid for it by buying it from the perk store. Same thing goes for Octocamo, pretty 99% sure his Octocamo suit is not standard gear. I've made a lot of Snake/Metal gear threads so I could learn about the characters, this stuff isn't standard gear mate. Non of this is even going down. Again, you can go contact any of the Snake experts on the vine and they will tell you.
1. Infinite Ammo is standard gear for Snake and canon. Railgun is something he acquired later in MGS4 and there's no real reason he shouldn't have it, and Octocamo is literally his standard gear for an entire game, his most recent game. As long as he's had Octocamo, it's been standard gear.
The only one that might not be is the Railgun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJVHt3QIS0k
:18 seconds, Snake has infinite ammo via cutscene.
He had this and the stealth camo as his standard gear for the MGS2 mission.
Bombing 2: Mortar Rounds
Splitting Up & Chaff:
I don't really care if your team splits up, that's a horrible plan really(weakening your forces). As you have already calculated they only have around 33 seconds to make something happen and split up. If they do I'll just hunt them down one by one and bomb them. Honestly gives me the advantage. I said general area, because I can't pretend like I have magical precog or to control your characters actions. I still know what direction any individual member is headed in as I can track them in several ways: Drone Radar, Cameras, Etc. Chaff grenades have already been addressed and logically this tactic has no logical basis for working as I explain above.
1. I've explained how chaff grenades would throw off your targeting. This would subsequently throw off your tracking as your systems would have to wade through the chaff. It prevents you from even attempting to pick us off. Also you're still being hunted down by Liquid and taken out of the air by the likes of Deathstroke.
Stealthy Snake:
2. Snake's invisible (and super stealthy), Big Boss is super stealthy, both have defeated the greatest snipers in battle which gives them the range battle. This ties in with 3 in that
No, he's not invisible that's not standard gear, if you don't know you better ask somebody. His standard suit is the Sneaking Suit. As far as the snakes being super stealthy, even if they were invisible too, I have radar that would render it mute.
Snake got his stealth camo from MGS1, literally wore it up until MGS2 where it got damaged. That looks like standard gear to me. And radar is blocked by chaff grenade.
Sniping Me From Miles Away:
So you're gonna snipe my team from miles away as Drones are hunting you down and motar fire is coming at you? :/ I need to print a Dextersinister was right Tshirt, good god are snipers are getting overrated on the boards now a days. All of my main characters(outside of Goblin) can eat heavy duty fire arms for breakfast. Anyway all of your team has midrange weapons as to the size of the battlefield. Also they are going to have to gain a clear line of site. By the time all of that happens you're team will be dead.
No, your drones are being taken down first. The mortar fire doesn't really affect my snipers for various reasons (tanking explosions, they won't be seen by your soldiers, etc.)
And there's plenty of areas to get a clear line of sight.
And remember, Snake and Big Boss have defeated people with superhuman accuracy such as The End (who could sense anything in the forest and couldn't sense Big Boss sneaking up on him), and Sniper Wolf (who Snake beat in both a sniping battle and a real battle).
Explosions:
I am very familiar with the majority of your team outside of the Slades and Wesker no they are not surviving general area explosions without clear context. A strong piece of shrapnel to a vital area would kill or critically injure the majority of them. Very few of your characters have above peak human durability, special armor, and/or healing factors to help them survive.
Let's address them by person:
Liquid:
Check the wiki (I can show you videos and comic scans too, but you say you know metal gear so..):
http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/Liquid_Snake
The list of things Liquid has survived includes literal explosions from stinger missiles, being caught in the explosion of the Hind D when Snake took it out via missiles, being caught in the explosion of Metal Gear REX, a car crash, falls from great heights, etc.
Liquid's not dying to a mere explosion.
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Taskmaster:
He's taken venom blasts from Spider-Woman, RPG blasts due to his shield, all out punches from Spidey, and more. He too should be fine since he's not being directly hit by the explosion, only caught in the blast.
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Revolver Ocelot:
He's taken literal pounds of C4 exploding on him and gotten up afterwards.
https://youtu.be/c5F4VvnSATA?t=4m29s
That's the link to the video if you need it.
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Solid Snake:
He's been point blank range on Hind D missiles, barely dodging them, and the blast didn't move him. He's crawled through a literal microwave, tanked a tank shell to the chest, tanked the destruction of Metal Gears (at least 2 times).
He moves fast enough to cause fire trails on the ground, he can move out of the way of the explosion. Also in that same link, he literally jumps out of the way of an explosion at around 1:49, and is hit by one/is blown off the edge by another and is just fine a little later.
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Big Boss:
Part of his story is losing to Snake via flamethrower and being blown up. So he's been blown up before, doesn't stop him from coming back at the end of MGS4. This is also not mentioning taking things like 10 million volts of electricity and being thrown off of a bridge which give him inhuman durability.
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Volgin:
Takes several RPG rounds to the face via Naked Snake in the Shagohod ending battle. So he should be fine as well.
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Gene:
Moves fast enough to be considered teleportation and has displayed minor TK to KO a superhuman such as Null. The combination would allow him to survive the bombs. Plus his ESP precog powers.
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Batwoman:
Has a protective suit that's bulletproof and protects her from hits from Batman (cracked bazooka proof glass remember), and Killer Croc. So she should have some protection.
Bombing 3: Silver Samurai
Speed(Travel):
Fast enough to break the sound barrier and create the sonic boom affect even while busing through a solid ceiling.
Please pay close attention the rings(shock wave). He's breaking the speed of sound and traveling at Jet Speeds. They are called Jet Boots for a reason after all. I'll reach you in mere moments. SS will reach you in mere moments, drop the gas bombs and blast you, then return to base.
Do you have any other feats of that? We all know that visual cues like that can't be taken 100% serious in comics. Even at mach 1 speeds (330 m/s), that's 14-15 seconds to clear the 3 miles which still gives us enough time to split up and react. Given the stealth and speed my team members have displayed, you won't be gassing a lot of them.
Back to Chaff Things Up:
2. Chaff grenades might not throw off nanotech, but they should mess with any targeting systems, the cameras that make you invisible, and so on.
Again, so many logically reasons this is not going to work as I've been over this above. You're not hitting a target going faster than the speed of sound with the little chaff grenades that totally rely on me being in a general fixed location.
Again, we don't have to hit you to mess up your targeting systems. The Chaff will get in the way of said targeting system. And if you're flying close enough to us, your invisibility will be taken out as well.
Railgun You Don't Have:
3. This leads to you getting potentially shot down or wounded by Snake's railgun and/or Volgin's lightning.
Railgun isn't standard gear. I don't know why you thought it was; there are tons of Snake fans on this site and tons of threads you could have gone to where no Snake fan brings up the Railgun as being standard. Volgin's attacks are electricity, not lighting. People have been chastised on the boards for saying this. Volgin doesn't have a whole lot of impressive targeting feats, he's not hitting something moving at the speed of sound. Also Volgin's attacks have limited range. Also how is Volgin hitting something invisible? Maybe snake has infrared or something, but Volgin doesn't.
You're team gets blasted into BBQ. Look below SS blasts can go AOE and effect a large area. He BBQ Wolverine(in Back In Japan) and none of your team has the feats to survive this kind of energy blasts.It's well with in the limits of tank busting, but his energy blasts work very well on organics as seen by feats. Wolverine even with his healing factor stayed burned up for several panels afterward.
Railgun is gear Snake has after fighting Crying Wolf and it's a plot point that he uses it against Gekkos. It makes sense as standard gear. Regardless, infinite ammo + his other weapons should be enough.
Volgin doesn't have to attack a guy moving at the speed of sound as you won't be moving that fast. You have to stop to blast and shoot off your bombs. As for hitting something invisible, if you move as fast as you claim, the sonic boom will tip him off as will the actual blasts and bombs coming from your person. It's a dead give away of your location. Plus chaff should've already messed with your invisibility.
Those blasts were only enough to burn and char a human, which is actually below the types of explosions and RPG hits my team has tanked, Volgin especially. And that was point blank range with time to charge and hitting head on. Any and everyone on my team's dodging at least parts of that and we're not gonna let you charge it.
Plus I doubt Silver Samurai can use such blasts while airborne (and being airborne makes it much easier to dodge as well).
Finishing Moves:
You Die, Here's Why:
As I've detailed, the bombs won't be doing much to my team and likely won't even hit them. And as said, my team survive close proximity to explosions very often and end up just fine, so the incidental effects won't be doing much.
Your team wouldn't survive this type of bombing outside of the Slades and Wesker. They don't have the feats, the stats, the durability, the armor, or the healing factors outside of those 3 characters. Which is why you haven't shown any feats to this effect. Never mind that whatever scans/feat sighting you can do surviving a single explosion isn't any where near surviving repeated air-raids of massive bombing.
Let me explain what is happening below on the ground on your side of the map:
Drones fly in and drop their bombs, you say you split up that's fine they will hunt your team down one by one and drop the bombs in their general area.
Then mortar fire comes in adding more explosions.
Lastly the SS flies in and drops the gas bombs and his blasts as well.
Even if you split up, your forces are being hit with massive blast waves, shrapnel, heat & flames, shock waves, etc. Things are catching on fire, fragments are flying everywhere. It's getting messy down their and most of your team at this point is dead or massively injured.
All of your characters expect the Boss Unit are pretty well established on the vine, the majority of voters know what your characters can do. No one outside of the Slades & Wesker live through these air raids. They all die from massive amounts of trauma and they flat out don't have the feats to survive this. Not to mention you haven't even addressed the hallucinogenic gas bombs. Why? Because most of your team doesn't have a proper counter for this. Take a good look at the graph, that's what kind of massive damage is happening to your team.
Already shown we survive explosions without much problem and/or can escape them with ease. The missiles and drones are stopped via chaff grenades and they are taken down via Deathstroke's staffs, and Liquid+ other Chitauri airships.
Mortars also won't be hitting or hurting my team, and the soldiers won't be able to aim properly while getting killed/sniped/fired on by Liquid and the Chitauri.
Your plan gives us at least 33 seconds for the drones, maybe more since you've gone with hunting us down 1 by 1. So realistically anywhere from 5 minutes to an hour (depending on how persistent you are) especially with targeting being interfered with.
Then mortars take another few seconds and harm absolutely no one, and then 15 more seconds for Silver Samurai just to make it to us, assuming he can fly mach 1 (evidence besides one vague picture).
After all that commotion, explosions, etc. you've given my team (full of stealth experts) excellent cover and it's very likely you won't be able to find any of them, especially without being shot down by the either of the Deathstrokes (or the railgun if I have it).
Machine Guns:
Again, you are going to snipe me from MILES AWAY? With no clear line of sight? :/
My machine guns on the other hand need no line of sight and have a range of over 1 mile long. They can get any and all targeting info from the Drones & Tech Team. These are simple and standard things you need to keep in mind while attacking. They can cut through steel and concrete and get to you. They can either shoot you or even if they miss every single shot this is still a form of Suppression Fire which will still keep your team(anyone who survives the bombings) pinned down and trapped in their positions slowing down any progress they try to make.
No. We're getting in closer and you definitely need line of sight and/or targeting. All that info is destroyed by chaff grenades+stealth. The tech team and Drones won't be able to locate us. Then we show up at your location and kill you. And snipers snipe you.
1 Point Wonders:
Yawn. You're just throwing out Big Names and hope that voters will be impressed. None of what you just brought up has anything to do with any of the Conditions of the Battlefield, The Present Tactical Situation, The Present Actions of Our Characters, and/or The Logical Chain of Events.None of your team would win any sort of 1 on 1 fight expect maybe Pre52 Deathstroke beating Greedling. But, that's a big maybe especially after he's already been worn down. Silver Samurai would have to stop flying around and literally stand their like a moron and take damage from your team. None of your team have the weapons, stats or gear to put down Sabertooth outside of your Slades. No one is beating GG in any serious Battleboard discussion. He can simply fly over them and hit them with everything in his Bag Of Tricks he always carries around: Gas Bombs, Sonic Frogs(yes silly, but true), blinding Sparklers, AOE Explosive Pumpkin Bombs, Electric Blasts, Razor Bats, Etc.
Well yes it does, because I'm forcing a h2h situation as I've said. Silver Samurai, Goblin, Sabretooth will also have to deal with snipers. Goblin tries to fly like that and spread his back of tricks? Snake, Big Boss, Deathstrokes all snipe him.
And this is assuming you can survive a barrage of bullets from the likes of Taskmaster (expert marksman), The Boss, Solidus, and the airborne attack of Liquid Snake and the Chitauri. It's not just the h2h attack, but the combination.
As for gadgets, don't forget my team has some.
Batwoman has tasers, sonic weapons, flashbang weapons, batarangs, tranquilizers (elephant level), her python coil (gets stronger as you struggle), etc. that will greatly hurt your team, especially the likes of Sabretooth with super senses.
Volgin emits 10 million volts from his body, which should easily be enough to take down any member of your team as well.
As far as feats, Taskmaster has beaten people better than Sabretooth both physically and in skill (Venom, The Cat, entire teams of assassins, Avenger teams, etc.) and two of them could easily put Sabretooth down. A few arrows to the eyes could to the trick.
Wesker's fast enough to blitz Sabretooth and your team, Deathstroke has the gear to put him down (as well as superior durability and fighting skill), and Lady Shiv and Cassy are skilled enough as well.
While most of my team can't take most of your team on 1v1, it doesn't matter. It's 17v4 with some of the 17 giving long range and air support. So the minor advantages you had, no longer exist.
Basics
Chaff Grenades again, clearly you didn't think this through: gravity, wind, speed, altitude, you are trying to toss small grenades upward to hit them with sprinkly metal strips that would be blown away by the speed of the Drones themselves, never mind you they are thousands of feet upward.
Railgun which you do not have and doesn't even need to be addressed.
Stroke: Sabertooth has an adamantium skeleton, and greed as ultimate shield. At most maybe slade can cut them a bit, but he can't cut through them with his Sword. His Staff is something either of them can tank and both of them have the healing feats to recover. It took a good size atomic blast from Sunfire to blow up SS armor. Nerfed down to the limits of Iron Man Missile hurting SS and your staff still wouldn't do much. Now in reality although Slade is a good shot, the fact is he doesn't have many actual targeting feats with the Staff and he would have to shoot SS while he is invisible and flying and blasting at him. Things are not looking good for Slade. GG can just fly above him and ignore him really or he he can fly around tossing weapons and stomp Slade.
SS vs Sunfire...you're gonna need some heavy duty blasts: Cyclops, Gambit level to take SS down. From Wolverine: Japan's Most Wanted.
Slades die and they are outclassed this time around. Not that I even care about individual matchups as in team batttles indeiducal matchups way to often depend on characters haphazardly meeting on a battlefield when none of that is really guaranteed in these massive team battles. Stun Grenades?? You're severally underestimating my teams durability and overestimating your teams weaponry and the idea that they will even be able to hit them in the first place.
You're dealing with some serious dudes here on average Sabertooth can tank blasts from the likes of Boom Boom & Cyclops and get back up and continue fighting. Uncanny X-Men #328.
None of the weapons options you have are going to get the job done when Sabertooth is shown here in these scans tanking a direct blast from a very angry Boom Boom. That's not a high feat by the way, that's what that dude Creed averages out in multiple comic appearances before he became Jobbertooth. Lucky for me the rules stat no Jobbering, No CIS, No Wis.
Chaff grenades have already been explained. As has the Railgun.
Sabretooth was STILL taken down by Deadpool using nothing but guns despite his adamantium skeleton. It doesn't protect his brain and other organs from bullets and the like.
A bullet to the brain (especially several) still puts him down. As does several bullets to the heart, and so on.
As for hitting SS while invisible, Slade can feel the difference in the wind. He'll be fine. As for hurting SIlver Samurai, nothing in that scan shows the need for something huge to hurt him. He didn't tank anything, he was simply brought down by an explosion unless I'm seeing that wrong.
As for stun grenades, I'm talking about these:
http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/Stun_grenade
It's bright, loud, knocks out people if they're close, and with super senses, Sabretooth especially should be KO'd from one of these nonetheless, a constant barrage. It's not light weaponry and should throw off anyone on your team if they're close.
Stealth: Not Sneaking Up On Anybody
2. Revolver Ocelot, both Taskmasters, The Boss, Wesker, Lady Shiva, and Cassandra Cain will all use to stealth to traverse the map to get in range of your team. For Taskmasters, Boss, and Ocelot, that is merely the range of a gun, while Wesker, Shiva, and Cain is getting close to incapacitate. For reference, Shiva has disappeared from Robin 's sight, Cassy's a trained ninja, Taskmaster has snuck up on Deadpool, The Boss has snuck up on Big Boss, and Ocelot has used great stealth to disappear from Big Boss as well.
The tech is taken out via chaff grenades. Sabretooth's sense of smell shouldn't help him too much here with all the unfamiliar scents here as well as the fact that most of the people my team have snuck up on have some level of super smell as well. Plus he'll be too worried about being sniped and blown up by the Chitauir ships.
Too Slow & Can't Bank Worth a Pluck Nickel:
3. Bane, Liquid, Batwoman, Volgin, and Solidus will make their way over and be covered by my snipers if need be and begin the assault close range as well. Liquid will be using a Chitauri ship as he is an expert flyer and will be able to easily outmaneuver your drones (as he maneuvered jets in a helicopter).
Chitarui ships are extremely limited in speed and maneuverability. MCU Iron Man who's speeds and tactics are somewhat comparable to SS flew circles around them. MCU Hawkeye literally said they can't bank worth a damn(video clip here). Liquid isn't outmaneuvering anything. Bane, Batwoman, Volgin, Solidus, and really your entire team is slow in travel speed they'll be dead before they make it a so much as half a mile across the battle field, before they are blown up, gas bombed, blasted, or shot down by heavy duty machine guns.
In this case it doesn't matter how good of a pilot Liquid is, he isn't going to improve a inferior air ship like the Chitarui chariot. Drones >>>>>Chaituari = Which is why Drones cost more.
Yeah but so are helicopters. They're not know for their swift movement and banking around tight corners, but Liquid still took out two F-16s with one. His level of piloting is exactly the kind that's good enough to turn an inferior airship into a winning one. He's done it before, he'll do it again.
I've already explained how bombs won't do much to the people you named, and at least 3 of them are bulletproof (Solidus due to the suit, plus he literally deflects machine gun fire with his sword, Volgin as he's RPG proof, Batwoman's suit is literally bulletproof
How are you getting near me:
How are you(the rest of your team outside of Liquid) getting so close in to attack in the first place? I blew up all the bridges during prep on my side of the map. You either fly across like you had Liquid do(which is a death sentence due to Drones and SS , and Goblin being better at aerial combat). Or, you swim across: Dead in the water, since there are sharks. OR, you grapple across and there are a few direct moments where you are completely vulnerable to attack and making yourself a lot more noticeable while swinging around like Spiderman. None of these choices are great and they will all lead to you getting killed. But, you need to decide how all these CQC characters you have are getting in so close: fly, grapple, or swim.
1. Ok, first of all, Liquid flying towards you is not a death sentence. As proven before, he's by far the best aerial combatant here and has survived his vessel exploding and crashing before. It might give him minor injuries if that.
2. Look at this picture I'm posting. The red show areas on the left I can swim across with ease. That small part of water either isn't part of the lake and thus has no sharks in it, or has a miniscule amount since the rest of the sharks need to be spread out.
3. Also in the picture, the yellow shows similar water on the other side. And finally, the strips of purple show areas where jumping and/or grappling across are such short distances, it's not even a threat to us.
Chitarui Fodder & Sniping Drones:
And so my team is sitting on top of their hands while this is happening? You are massively overrating the Chitaruri weapons to a large degree and underestimating my team. Green Goblin has eaten pumpkin bombs from other goblins which are a lot better than Chirauri weapons. MCU Cap took a shot right in the feels from a Chitarui blaster and got right back up. MCU Cap is awesome, but he's way below healing and durability of my team. Nothing that can't even take down MCU Cap is going to even have any sort of overall affect on my team. Hulk was annoyed, let's not blow that out of proportion, besides the fact there were a lot more than 10 Aliens shooting at him(go back and watch the movie). None of the Chitarui have good targeting feats, 2 members of my team could fly and blitz them. The drones are smaller targets, faster, more maneuverable, and harder to hit. Go back and look at the stats, the Drones are 4 feet across. It's going to be hard as all get out to prove your main characters can land a single shot, more or less your fodder. Also they can simply outflank you since they can fly a lot higher and faster than anything the Chiratuiri have shown.
You're essentially trying to shoot down a 4 foot target that is moving over 300mph and is flying thousands of feet in the air, while you shoot upwards at it, while it's dropping bombs and fire missiles at you. If you want a general comparison for the level of difficulty of what you are trying to do, Star Wars pilots complained about trying to hit a pretty stationary target of 2 meters= 6 feet with computerized targeting & help from droids. Even for the likes of Deadshot & Punisher dude that's a ridiculously difficult thing that you are trying to attempt here. It's not even remotely plausible for your particular set of characters, besides that your weapons don't have that kind of range you would need to pull it off.
Ok, first: let's look at that Cap scene again. He's hit and goes down, stays down from just one blast. While he's not more durable than your team, he's close to as durable given the things he's tanked (including bullets) without flinching. Enough of those is putting down anyone on your team and even just one is stunning them.
And if you look at this Iron Man scene, two blasts throw him off balance and knock him off his feet. And he is more durable than your team.
Same Iron Man who took fallout from nukes and giant explosions and Thor's hits btw.
As for hitting the drones, 4 feet is pretty small, but given Liquid's skill, I see him taking the drones on. Plus the drones have limited ammo, so as long as Liquid can dodge their attacks, and he can, they should soon become pretty useless. Star Wars pilots have no relevance to this fight and most seemed to suck tbh. But that's neither here or there.
Seals:
As far as killing the seals go, who cares, if you do ever kill them they would have already served their purpose by blowing most of your team up by the team long before you could ever get near enough to even produce a feasible attack. The majority of your team only has midrange/close range ability. Those that have any sort of real long range weapon like a sniper rifle still need to take the time just to set up a clear shot, and a locate comfortable place in which to shoot from like a sniper's perch(and not risk being blown up by the bombing).
Nope. The seals would be killed before being able to harm anyone on my team. As shown already, they can't hurt anyone on my team if they tried.
Only H2H fighters on my team are Greed & Sabertooth, GG & SS are not going to even bother with fighting you in CQC. By the time any of your team could possibly reach me(which you failed to describe how in your post, since the bridges are out), all of your team expect Wesker and the Slades would be dead. If they make it across the get stomped down by characters with flat out better feats of Durability. Saberooth could one shot your any member of your team with his Adamantium claws(except Wesker) and rip their organs out. Seriously bullets and guns are meaningless here and your best weapon you thought you had(the Railgun), you're not even allowed to have...it's not standard gear. Go ask around and go read some good Snake Debates on the Vine.
I've already proven why my team won't be dead by this time. As for SS and GG not being CQC, that causes them to be sniped and hit by aerial attacks.
Sabretooth isn't oneshotting anyone. He rarely if ever guts someone with his claws and has proven to have difficulty getting past tranquilizers and bullets. Add on snipers (who can take him out btw), aerial attacks, flashbangs, etc. and he's down very easily.
Already explained why Snake's railgun would be standard gear, but he doesn't need it, a simple sniper rifle would suffice.
SS is the only one who could likely survive sniping, but attacks from the Chitauri and Deathstroke's staff among other weapons (Volgin's lightning-er electricity for example, and Lady Shiva who's taken down such advanced armor...with a stick, Solidus's high frequency blade) will eventually take him down.
Also I'm just gonna mention that you showed SS going H2H or at least close combat many times, more than he's gone aerial (against a none aerial opponent). I see no reason he wouldn't do so here, but it makes no difference.
Recap:
Solid Snake: Using Chaff Grenades, turning invisible, sniping with railgun sniper rifle apparently to take your team out and cover mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close. Survives explosions due to stealth+feats.
Big Boss: Using Chaff Grenades, using stealth, sniping your team and covering mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close. Survives explosions due to stealth+feats.
New 52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
Pre-52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
Taskmaster: Using Stealth to get to medium range and then unload with guns, then arrows, go Close Combat when needed. Wins/holds own via superior skill and great feats vs. Venom, Spider-Man, Iron Man, etc. Has tanked enough to survive explosions. Speed and stealth help to avoid brunt of explosions.
Udon Taskmaster: Using Stealth and Speed to get medium range and unload with guns and then blitzing in Close Combat. Same as above with explosions.
Gene: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed/teleportation, his knives, and his ESP abilities. Uses speed/teleportation to avoid explosions.
The Boss: Getting close via stealth and ambushing. Then unloading infinitely on your team (with patriot gun) until only the bulletproof are left and/or other close combat needs support. Then going H2H.
Bane: Getting close range to engage in H2H. Surviving explosions due to speed+feats.
Volgin: Getting close range for H2H and lightning action. Helps to definitely take down Silver Samurai, drones (along the way), Sabertooth (metal bones), and really any and everybody as lightning 10 million volts is powerful. Survives explosions due to durability feats.
Lady Shiva: Using Stealth to get close, ambush, take down your team H2H due to taking on better/stronger/more durable people. Speed/disappearing feats allows her to avoid all explosions/attacks.
Cassandra Cain: Using stealth and speed to get close and ambush your team with extreme skill in H2H combat. Surviving explosions due to speed+feats.
Wesker: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed and strength.
Batwoman: Getting Close and helping in H2H combat, also using gadgets when need be. Suit protects her from bullets and the like.
Solidus: Blitzing your team with sword and guns and superior speed. Uses speed to get past explosions.
Revolver Ocelot: Using Stealth to ambush your team and get the drop on them, killing them with gunfire and engaging in H2H if needed. Survives explosions via feats.
Chitauri: Aerial attacks and support, bombarding your team with weapon fire that momentarily stopped MCU Hulk, took down MCU Cap America and MCU Iron Man.
Liquid Snake: Getting close via one of the Chitauri aerial ships as he is a master flyer, taking you down via aerial attacks.
Summary
1. My gear+plans to spread out+time it takes to execute your plan makes your bombarding drones plan useless and has them get shot out of the sky and bombs easily avoided.
2. Bombs don't kill almost anyone in my team so the strategy was ineffective regardless. I've proven this with a large section explaining and showing why.
3. Snipers cover my team as we have people stealthing over to your side for an ambush. Guns and H2H attacks will take your team unawares killing those that aren't bulletproof, if the snipers don't kill you first and if the Chitauri ships and Liquid don't put you away either. Not t mention various gadgets from Batwoman.
4. Machine gun rounds mean nothing to my team's level of skill/reaction speed and we can all easily get around said guns as there are clear ways to your side. Some of us are even bulletproof.
5. Close range team+Volgin's lightning electricity will take your team close range along with aerial support and snipers.
6. Snipers will take on your team at a little closer range with grenades+powerful tech and superior skill if it comes down to it.
7. We win due to numbers+skill+strategy+all out assault.
Voters Can Ignore My F***ed Up Math....My Apologizes.
33 seconds is a lot of time Luke, you're underestimating that. My team are all superhuman, but even using Olympic numbers of (lowballing here) 10 m/s, they'd be getting 330 m away fro the building in all directions. Liquid would have plenty of time to mount a Chitauri airship and blow you out of the sky.
??? What makes you think you can travel that fast and that far in 33 secs. You've got some fuzzy math. Even if I believed you then check your own math mate: 330m(A number you seemingly pulled out of thin air) is only around 0.2 miles. That's not very far when we are 3 miles away homie. Also use logic, you are headed towards me, meaning you are helping cut the distance between the drones and your team. You're only quicken your death. Only a few members of your team are actually what qualifies as comicbook superhuman(Wesker, Volgin, Slades) the mass majority: even Batgirl, and the Snakes are comicbook peak human. Show me some travel speed feats for your team. Chitarui airship is so slow and so whack when it comes what it can do in the air. I already showed you Hawkeye say flat it they can't bank(maneuver) worth a damn. Nobody is using Olympic numbers, standard Superhumans like Captain America can only travel at running speeds of around 30mph. You're basically suggesting that your team can run 100 meters per sec(100m/s x 33sec = 330meters) ? :/ Dude that's like what? 223MPH? Boy oh boy oh boy... So you basically are claiming your entire team can run as fast as muscle cars? Or as fast as Spiderman can webswing?
1. Snake can throw Chaff grenades up, about roughly 100ft in the air, which works better for hitting your drones
2. The chaff grenades' metal strips interfere mostly with the radar/targeting systems of your drones. It may not knock them out of the air, but it will stop you from being able to target my team. Remember, to properly target us, you have to make it through that haze of chaff/metal strips just to see us. This prevents you from blowing us up at all.
3. If you're that high in the air, it gives any and everyone on my team enough time to easily get out of dodge before your bombs drop. That's at least another 2-5 seconds. And as I'll show later, explosions don't do much to my team.
1. You just explained why it wouldn't work. If you can only throw it 100 feet in the air, then why would it be affecting my drones which are thousands of feet in the air.
2. Yes the Chaff Grenades affect the general area, but here are some problems with your line of thinking. First: why is Snake attacking Drones he has no reason to EXPECT in the first place? Does Snake have Precog? Future Sight? Can Snake see into the future and know what gear my team has? Second: The metal strips only can affect the electronics that are in its dispersal pattern. Third: You said yourself(repeatedly) your team was going to scatter and split up. Only snake & boss would have said Chaff Grenades, so they cannot cover several square miles to protect their teammates from being hit. Fourth: My team can still see you in the cameras and rely that info to our Drones. Even if your Chaffs worked perfectly the bombs and missiles would still get to you. And of course the obvious fact the Chaff metal stripes would dissipate very quickly in an open battlefield.
3. Your acting as if, A. You're Team Already knows about the bombs is preparing to doge them, B. Bombs & 50lb Bombs traveling at the rate of gravity are slow, C. Your entire team is going to dodge massive explosions, shockwaves, heat & flames, etc when they won't even be expecting an air raid in the first place. They have no logical basis or reason to. They get blown to bits and hit with several different forms of damage caused from massive bombing.
1. Infinite Ammo is standard gear for Snake and canon. Railgun is something he acquired later in MGS4 and there's no real reason he shouldn't have it, and Octocamo is literally his standard gear for an entire game, his most recent game. As long as he's had Octocamo, it's been standard gear.
The only one that might not be is the Railgun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJVHt3QIS0k
:18 seconds, Snake has infinite ammo via cutscene.
He had this and the stealth camo as his standard gear for the MGS2 mission.
Darkraiden, I can already tell you didn't head my advice and ask the Snake experts: Nickzambuto, Sirfizzwhizz, and Beaconofstrength as to what is standard gear. Common sense should tell you Snake is going to be walking around with a large Railgun in any random encounter. It would hamper his own stealth(sans game mechanics storage). Octocamo is not standard, and neither are Railguns. Seriously Infinite Ammo? Does Snake have some sort of Magical Storage Device where he keeps all of these bullets? Video Game characters already have to take way too much **** on this site and you're abuse of power ups acquired during games and game mechanics is setting them back. Go talk to the Snake Experts. I'm not BSing you go look at some of Nickzambuto's CAVS or Sirfizzwhizz's for Standard Gear for Snakes. I've seen a lot of Snake threads, and Octocamo and Railgun never come up as standard gear.
Bombing 2: Mortar Rounds
Splitting Up & Chaff:
1. I've explained how chaff grenades would throw off your targeting. This would subsequently throw off your tracking as your systems would have to wade through the chaff. It prevents you from even attempting to pick us off. Also you're still being hunted down by Liquid and taken out of the air by the likes of Deathstroke.
Already discussed the Chaff Grenades above and why that tactic wouldn't work. You can't spread your Chaff Grenades through several square miles of the battle field and protect a team that you commanded to split up. Deathstroke doesn't have the range and feats to pick off drones. Chitari Chariots have a clear lack of definition of on their speed(because you never have shown any feats to establish it).
Stealthy Snake:
Snake got his stealth camo from MGS1, literally wore it up until MGS2 where it got damaged. That looks like standard gear to me. And radar is blocked by chaff grenade.
Getting Gear & Power Ups from Game Play does not make it standard.....
@lukehero: Snake doesn't really have "standard" gear since his usual MO is going in completely naked and procuring everything on sight (there can be no traces of the government's involvement left behind, hence Snake can take no government equipment). If we're talking "standard" gear, then Snake shouldn't have anything besides a basic Sneaking Suit and a pack of cigarettes.
What Snake has is "basic" gear. Again in Metal Gear, all your equipment is to be procured on sight, but there are certain items of basic, trademark equipment that would be considered Snake's standard gear, that doesn't include the crazy things like the Railgun. If I had to specify gear for Snake, I would say his Shadow Moses Sneaking Suit, SOCOM pistol, some kind of assault rifle, stinger missiles, C4, and a pack of smokes.
EDIT: Oh and a cardboard box obviously.
So no you wouldn't have the railgun or ocotocamo.
Sniping Me From Miles Away:
No, your drones are being taken down first. The mortar fire doesn't really affect my snipers for various reasons (tanking explosions, they won't be seen by your soldiers, etc.)
And there's plenty of areas to get a clear line of sight.
And remember, Snake and Big Boss have defeated people with superhuman accuracy such as The End (who could sense anything in the forest and couldn't sense Big Boss sneaking up on him), and Sniper Wolf (who Snake beat in both a sniping battle and a real battle).
:/ Your Chitarui Warriors with no clear definition of speed and a major lack of being able to maneuverability are going to shoot down drones traveling at over 300mph. Man oh man, show me some shooting feats for these Chitarui. We must have been watching 2 different movies during Avengers. The motar fire does affect your snipers if they take the time to try and set up a shot, then my team can target them: radar & cameras. We will see and detect where you are and take you down.Clear Line Of Sight: Dude where? You are ignoring the entire landscape of the map, did you not watch the video above or look at the picture I just showed you of the landscape: Trees, Building, Stands, Etc. Yes, but I can see you right on camera and detect your chi(Dragon Pulse). It seems you are ignoring these factors. Puls SS has thermal imaging. We are going around in circles at this point and you're not presenting anything in the way of evidence to support your claims much. Snakes still have scent and still can be detected through Dragon's Pulse.
Explosions:
Let's address them by person:
Liquid:
Check the wiki (I can show you videos and comic scans too, but you say you know metal gear so..):
http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/Liquid_Snake
The list of things Liquid has survived includes literal explosions from stinger missiles, being caught in the explosion of the Hind D when Snake took it out via missiles, being caught in the explosion of Metal Gear REX, a car crash, falls from great heights, etc.
Liquid's not dying to a mere explosion.
You're using a wiki as your strongest form of evidence: ;( . Again that is does not show any form of context as to what was happening: did the explosion fragment, how close was he to said explosion, was it followed up by other explosions, did he get caught in the blast wave or did he move out of the way. You're wiki is missing a lot, and people hate wiki debaters. If you have proof then show it; you've of all people at this point would be screaming for scans.
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Taskmaster:
He's taken venom blasts from Spider-Woman, RPG blasts due to his shield, all out punches from Spidey, and more. He too should be fine since he's not being directly hit by the explosion, only caught in the blast.
Spiderwoman(Jessica Drew) is not explosive damage that is a bio blast, seeing how she has taken down more durable characters with her bio blasts I would have to see the context of said feat. Yes an RPG Blast due to his shield...you just explained why that doesn't apply to the current situation. His shield cannot protect him from every angle, from every piece of shrapnel, and fragmentation, and from every single blast wave/shock wave. Spidey holds back, if Spiderman took the gloves off and was no morals, he has more than enough strength to literally knock Taskmasters head off. Also taking blunt force damage from a character that always holds back against characters below his Tier level has nothing to do with explosive damage, shrapnel, fragments, shockwaves, blastwaves, etc.
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Revolver Ocelot:
He's taken literal pounds of C4 exploding on him and gotten up afterwards.
https://youtu.be/c5F4VvnSATA?t=4m29s
That's the link to the video if you need it.
So we are going to ignore the part where there is clearly no shrapnel or fragmentation here, or the fact that the C4 blows him back into a wall where he yelps in pain. You think this is evidence of him being able to tank multiple bomb raids? I see this as clear evidence that one single explosion knocked him down and hurt him.
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Solid Snake:
He's been point blank range on Hind D missiles, barely dodging them, and the blast didn't move him. He's crawled through a literal microwave, tanked a tank shell to the chest, tanked the destruction of Metal Gears (at least 2 times).
Explosions don't hurt him much either.
Microwave damage is radiation Raiden, what does that have to do with shrapnel, fragmentation, heat & fire damage, etc. It's almost like you think these characters can't be worn down. Even Wolverine's healing factor can be taxed by multiple blast waves. As far as the Hind D missile goes, unless you show me the context I'm not gonna comment. What I will question is: what does that have to do with shrapnel and fragments hitting Snake in vital areas pericing his flesh, and heat & flames burning him up? That shows he can handle being near 1 or 2 explosions not that he can survive multiple bombing raids.
That shows that Nicka Bane jumping the hell out of the way, not tanking the damage that multiple Bombings create. Even if freaking Batman with his armor on took an explosion to the face it would hurt him. You are at this point suggestion all of your characters have nigh invincibility to the types of explosion damage multiple large 50lb bombs, 80mm mortar fire, and micro missiles would create. This is getting silly, but let's go on down the list.
That's not tanking an explosions that's Batgirl getting the hell out of the way because she knows she can't survive that type of damage. Her appearing as a blur to a bunch of mooks has nothing to do with her escaping the path of bombs, missiles, and mortar fire she would never be expecting in the first place. It's like you think your entire team has Jedi Knight force senses and they know what type of danger and from what direction it's coming from. She gets bomb and dies like the majority of your team.
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Solidus Snake:
He moves fast enough to cause fire trails on the ground, he can move out of the way of the explosion. Also in that same link, he literally jumps out of the way of an explosion at around 1:49, and is hit by one/is blown off the edge by another and is just fine a little later.
Now this video actually looks very impressive. But, this is still based on the idea that your characters all know about the incoming explosives, what direction they are coming from, how many drones/bombs/mortar/SS flying in to get you and where they will fire at all times. So this feat still falls flat. Only 1 character on your team has ESP and since you split your entire team up without radio coms he cannot possibly warn all of his teammates of any danger his precog abilities may pick up. Not to mention this shows a character getting the hell out of the way of an explosion not tanking multiple bombing. It's like you think your characters are God Mode Wolverine.
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Big Boss:
Part of his story is losing to Snake via flamethrower and being blown up. So he's been blown up before, doesn't stop him from coming back at the end of MGS4. This is also not mentioning taking things like 10 million volts of electricity and being thrown off of a bridge which give him inhuman durability.
So you just explained your character can be hurt by a Handmade Flamethrower(which I don't know if that may be a lowball to your own character), then you come back and you're claiming he can tank multiple bombing raids. That makes absolutely no sense on your part. The Bridge feat seems impressive, but that still doesn't cover fragments/shrapnel/blaswaves/etc or give the context as to whether or not Big Boss was critically injured after said Bridge Feat.
---
Volgin:
Takes several RPG rounds to the face via Naked Snake in the Shagohod ending battle. So he should be fine as well.
Yes, Volgin is very impressive. Problem with the RPG round is that it falls into game mechanics, but I will correct myself after going back and checking and I forget he tanked a building busting explosion. So you can add The Slades, Wesker, and Volgin are the other ones making it across. What I will add to this though is that Volgin like any other street lever here can be worn down and taxed. Even when he makes it over he will not be at 100% and neither will his teammates. (Apologies to DarkRaiden and any Metal Gear Fans about any incorrect comments I made about Volgin's durability).
The fact remains when he makes it across with the few others they can still be manhandle and my team has ways of by passing their durability: Adamantium, Sonics, Gas Bombs, Etc.
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Gene:
Moves fast enough to be considered teleportation and has displayed minor TK to KO a superhuman such as Null. The combination would allow him to survive the bombs. Plus his ESP precog powers.
That doesn't help him tank everything, maybe he dodges a few here and there, but that doesn't give him any sort of blanket immunity to massive bomb waves. Also that still doesn't deal with things like the Gas Bombs SS is dropping down on your team.
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Batwoman:
Has a protective suit that's bulletproof and protects her from hits from Batman (cracked bazooka proof glass remember), and Killer Croc. So she should have some protection.
That's blunt force, not explosive, flame & heat, fragments, shrapnel, blast-waves, etc. Context of the Batman fight? Batman was swinging for the fences? Trying his hardest to what? Kill Kate and not holding back? Uh Huh.
Bombing 3: Silver Samurai
Speed(Travel):
Do you have any other feats of that? We all know that visual cues like that can't be taken 100% serious in comics. Even at mach 1 speeds (330 m/s), that's 14-15 seconds to clear the 3 miles which still gives us enough time to split up and react. Given the stealth and speed my team members have displayed, you won't be gassing a lot of them.
Seeing as how you have no evidence to claim otherwise it's almost bafling you would be trying to nitpick a character you know nothing about. They are jet boots, he's moving at jet speeds(FOGHORN). If you want a another speed feat I suppose I will indulge you. Below he catches up with an angry Sunfire that was attempting to escape with Logan during Japan's Most Wanted. Actually visual cues are fine and daddny as long as they go hand in hand with the characters other feats, gear, and capabilities. Again Jet Boots = Jet Speeds. What's the problem? You are completely ignoring things here: Thermal Imaging. How does your stealth even come into play when my tech team can see you on the cameras? And rely that info to SS. You're team isn't that fast in travel speed, you're math on that subject was hilarious. You seem to be pulling your speed feats on travel from out of thin air without displaying a single feat for any of your characters travel speed, yet you dare question mine: BAD FORM.
Again, we don't have to hit you to mess up your targeting systems. The Chaff will get in the way of said targeting system. And if you're flying close enough to us, your invisibility will be taken out as well.
Even if I believed this premise(which I don't as I explain above why). Why is Snake throwing around Chaff Grenades at drones he can't see and has no reason to expect. Snake must be able to see the future. Also once again you are covering several square miles in chaff grenades: you clearly didn't think this plan through. You split your team up Raiden, how is Snake covering the vast area of the battle field in Chaff Grenades. :/
Railgun is gear Snake has after fighting Crying Wolf and it's a plot point that he uses it against Gekkos. It makes sense as standard gear. Regardless, infinite ammo + his other weapons should be enough.
Snake does not have the railgun, none of the best Snake debaters never bring it up as "basic gear" for snake. Stop it. If Snake fans are reading this they are either laughing or crying at how poorly you are debating with these AMAZING Metal Gear characters. Infinite Ammo? How is this Nicka Snake carrying Infinite Ammo(cause game mechanics). That's so silly and insanely ridiculous you would be laughed off the boards for pulling this kind of stunt in a random thread. =====================================================================
Volgin doesn't have to attack a guy moving at the speed of sound as you won't be moving that fast. You have to stop to blast and shoot off your bombs. As for hitting something invisible, if you move as fast as you claim, the sonic boom will tip him off as will the actual blasts and bombs coming from your person. It's a dead give away of your location. Plus chaff should've already messed with your invisibility.
Actually I don't have to stop I can just fly around and do it. I already showed you a scan of him fighting Angel. Also something as simply as timing a bomb drop the bones bare basics of what a typical street level solider can do. You are obfuscating the facts and present situation because you have no defense or counter for Hallucinogenic Gas Bombs. You have no real counter to it so instead you are trying to find a loop hole out of it. It's a very poor debating tatic more to the point you can't back up a single claim of what you have stated because you don't have any truly impressive targeting feats for Volgin. Volgin is an actually decent shot and I could probably point out a few feats here and there I found in my resaearch, but then again all that is your job to establish about your character, not mine. If he did have to stop so what? He can't see me. Volgin can target people from sound alone: Who the hell do you think Volgin is Deadshot shooting blindfolded? I am as fast as I claim. Show we proof that SS is not.
How the hell would Volgin even hear the sonic boom when I just showed you solid lock stock and barrel proof the nanotech scrubs his sound. I showed you that in my intro, again you're just flat out ignoring things.
Those blasts were only enough to burn and char a human, which is actually below the types of explosions and RPG hits my team has tanked, Volgin especially. And that was point blank range with time to charge and hitting head on. Any and everyone on my team's dodging at least parts of that and we're not gonna let you charge it.
Oh Gawd, now you are reaching, I just showed you someone who BBQed freaking Wolverine with a single energy blast and now you say Wolverine is just a mere human. Man oh man, this is getting funny. You've improved as a debater as of late, but you're really screwing the pooch here. Why are they doding his blasts, they can't see him, they don't know he is coming,
Plus I doubt Silver Samurai can use such blasts while airborne (and being airborne makes it much easier to dodge as well).
Shows Scan of SS shooting Angel while they are both flying around through the air, Raiden response: I doubt SS can use such blasts while airborne. Raiden did you fall asleep during my intro?
Finishing Moves:
You Die, Here's Why:
Already shown we survive explosions without much problem and/or can escape them with ease. The missiles and drones are stopped via chaff grenades and they are taken down via Deathstroke's staffs, and Liquid+ other Chitauri airships.
No, what you showed was a bunch of mother fluffers getting the hell out of the way from explosions: as it stands only Wesker, Slades, and Volgin can tank massive explosions. All of your other characters would die or be seriously injured from massive bombings. Chaf grenades aren't doing **** and you gave Snake 0 provocation for even starting to suddenly throw around Chaff grenades when he has no idea Drones are coming. At this point Snake is a Jedi from your point of view and has force senses. Show me Deathstroke hitting a moving target at high speeds that is thousands of feet in the air with his Staff. Oh and he needs precog to know the Drones are coming for the first Bomb Wave. The chitarui ships are laughable when compared to my team of flying characters & drones, as Hawkeye explained.
Mortars also won't be hitting or hurting my team, and the soldiers won't be able to aim properly while getting killed/sniped/fired on by Liquid and the Chitauri.
So, you can curve bullets through a battlefield full of obstacles like Wesley from Wanted, and Grifter from Wildstorm. Damn, you got some BAMF for a few points. :/ Motars can't hit or aim why? Oh yeah your Chitaruit are going to fly blitz across the battlefield and my team of flying guys are going to do nothing, but sit back and let you shoot at them. You haven't presented a single targeting feat for the Chitauri, your ships are not going to reach us, Drones blow you out of the sky, and SS or Goblin could solo your entire fleet of fodder(they are called fodder for a reason).
Your plan gives us at least 33 seconds for the drones, maybe more since you've gone with hunting us down 1 by 1. So realistically anywhere from 5 minutes to an hour (depending on how persistent you are) especially with targeting being interfered with.
An hour? You are once again pulling fuzzy math from out of thin air like a magician. How do you figure it's going to take that long where I have presented several forms of detection and I know where you are at all times? My targeting isn't being interfered with if you really think Solid Snake can cover a entire battlefield with chaff grenades in 33 secs, you must think he's kid flash. This is getting bad. You're not backing up your claims, you pull math from seemingly no where, and even if I go along with it your team is getting killed anyway.
Then mortars take another few seconds and harm absolutely no one, and then 15 more seconds for Silver Samurai just to make it to us, assuming he can fly mach 1 (evidence besides one vague picture).
A VAUGE picture? Dude what? I showed you a scan that was clear as morning day. Do I need to post an entire comic issue? Mach 1? No. Your lowballing a character you haven't even read a single issue of. This is silly man. So 80mm motor rounds are not going to hurt a single member of your team. Damn, dat durability though. You are really overhyping your characters. I know what direction you are headed in. I noticed you have completely ignored the fact my tech team can see you on camera and tell the mortar team where to point and shoot. You don't even have basic targeting info and a line of sight.
After all that commotion, explosions, etc. you've given my team (full of stealth experts) excellent cover and it's very likely you won't be able to find any of them, especially without being shot down by the either of the Deathstrokes (or the railgun if I have it).
Excellent Cover how? From being blown to bits? Sabertooth can smell you, Drone Radar, Tech Team on the Cameras, Dragon's Pulse. I see you are truly ignoring all of this now. I can track you down with thermal imagining and drone radar and rain down hell on you.
We are beating a dead horse at this point: No line of sight, No Rail Gun.
No. We're getting in closer and you definitely need line of sight and/or targeting. All that info is destroyed by chaff grenades+stealth. The tech team and Drones won't be able to locate us. Then we show up at your location and kill you. And snipers snipe you.
Chaff Grenades are doing all the work for your team here, jeez. Already explained why this would not work. Beating a dead horse. Yeah my team is dumb, flatfooted, and has no super senses, or Dragon's Pulse apparently. I have so many ways of detecting you it's not even funny. You're snipers cannot curve bullets through a clogged battlefield. Your sniper idea is grossly silly. Go back and watch the video of the battlefield.
Well yes it does, because I'm forcing a h2h situation as I've said. Silver Samurai, Goblin, Sabretooth will also have to deal with snipers. Goblin tries to fly like that and spread his back of tricks? Snake, Big Boss, Deathstrokes all snipe him.
You're not forcing anything. The team doesn't give a damn if the soldiers die, only one on the team with an once of humanity is Greedling. Deal with the snipers that can curve bullets across a clogged battlfield. Uh Huh. You are ignoring the fact that everyone of my main characters can eat bullets outside of Goblin. And Goblin isn't just going to sit their and let you shoot at him, plus his chain mail armor can handle a good number of shots. Also the tech team is watching you the entire time. Also the heavy duty machine guns that can shoot over a mile across are firing back at you.
And this is assuming you can survive a barrage of bullets from the likes of Taskmaster (expert marksman), The Boss, Solidus, and the airborne attack of Liquid Snake and the Chitauri. It's not just the h2h attack, but the combination.
Who cares they are still bullets:
SS(Cardbandium Armor, only 2nd to Adamantium)
Greedling: Ultimate Shield, tanks machine gun and rifle fire like it's nothing
Sabertooth: Healing Factor, Admantium Skeleton
GG: Chain Mail Armor, Flying
It's a silly attack for you to mention after I tell you and prove to you most of my team can eat bullets and then you bring up bullets again. I point out where MCU Cap who is way below my team is pretty much everything that matters when it comes to durability, tanked a Chiarui blast to the guy and then you ignore this and say they my team will be taken down by such weapons. I explain how the Chiraturi flying chariots have a hard to time maneuvering and you think you can blow my much more air combat ready team & Drones out of the sky. Liquid is in a inferior air ship and he is going to be blown out of the air.
Batwoman has tasers, sonic weapons, flashbang weapons, batarangs, tranquilizers(elephant level), herpython coil (gets stronger as you struggle), etc. that will greatly hurt your team, especially the likes of Sabretooth with super senses.
Batwoman dies in the bombing. Batwoman is slow, lacks feats where she is using these weapons on fast characters, and you are now retroactively changing your strategy now that I pointed out how poorly you were using Batwoman. Your original post says & I quote: "Batwoman: Getting Close and helping in H2H combat.". Now you are saying she is using her gadgets. Amazing how that played out only after I told you how awful you were using Batwoman by pigeonholing her into yet another CQC situation(which would favor my team).
Tasers: ....Lowballing my teams durability if you think that's gonna work. Ignoring their healing.
Sonic Weapons: I notice that device is radio controlled, my tech team could turn it off. Before you say they wouldn't recognize it keep in mind they are getting battlefield into from several sources: cameras, drones, eyes on the ground, etc. GG is a tech genius as well and Felicity has hacked into radio controlled sources before like she had to do vs the Clock King.
Python Coil: Anyone on my team is good enough to cut through it, and she would't be fast enough to tag them with it.
Flashbangs: You can't be serious, flash bangs are not going to cut the mustard not to mention how dangerously close Kate would have to get to use such a device.
Tranqs: Useful on Sabertooth, that's about it, the tranqs wouldn't pierce characters who are armored like GG, SS, and Greedling Raiden...Also again she hasn't tagged anyone as fast as Sabertooth on a consistent basis with such a weapon.
Volgin emits 10 million volts from his body, which should easily be enough to take down any member of your team as well.
So we are going to ignore healing factors and durability for my team. Show/site some impressive targeting feats for Volgin. Volgin has limited range. Creed has tanked worse than anything you could actually show Volgin doing. Also I doubt Volgin has every fried someone with an actual way of healing from damage. Down below is SS getting shocked from a blast from Life Seed Angel. You can see his entire skeleton getting light up like an Xray. I doubt Volgin has ever taken anyone down with my teams impressive durability. More over I see you still have not shown or sited a single targeting feat for Volgin.
Here is Creed in the Sabertooth Special: In The Red Zone:
Sabertooth while soaking wet in a sewer, grabs a large electrical wire and uses his claws to electrocute Caliban, while Caliban is in the water. Creed can tank electrical damage just fine.
The only person on the team that this sort of attack maybe affect is GG. And you didn't send him after GG, you sent Volgin to try and mess with Creed and SS because you thought that fact they had metal was somehow going to help you. It's not. They tank the damage and keep chucking and slit Volgin's throat.
As far as feats, Taskmaster has beaten people better than Sabretooth both physically and in skill (Venom, The Cat, entire teams of assassins, Avenger teams, etc.) and two of them could easily put Sabretooth down. A few arrows to the eyes could to the trick.
If you really think that Taskmaster in a serious battle board discussion would beat Creed & of all people Matt Gargan Venom you need a serious reality check. I don't care what happened in Secret Avengers(the fight you are refereeing to), Taskmaster tanking on Venom is a VERY HIGH feat for Taskmaster and a lowball to Matt Gargan Venom who is physically on par with his opposite Anti Venom. You really think in a serious discussion Taskmaster is going to beat up an entire squad of decent Avengers? Go make a thread and see if you don't get flagged and the thread gets locked within a few mins.
In what sort of ludicrous world do you think Taskmasters physicals are superior to Creed? Creed outclasses him in strength, speed, reaction times, healing, and durability.
Freaking Arrows? Taskmaster has **** loads of cool gear and you are using his weakest ones: freaking Arrows?(Go read a GhostRavage debate). You are sentencing Taskmaster to his death just as you are doing with most of your team by using poor thought out straightest. I have a bullet timer in Creed and he would laugh at the type of piercing damage an Arrow would cause. I'm sure Creed is just going to stand their flat footed while Taskmaster tries an ill conceived attempt at trying to shoot arrows in Creed's eyes. Taskmaster carries everything from high explosives, to poison darts, etc and you are trying to use freaking Arrows. Please do not try to retroactively change your strategies mid debate like you tried with Batwoman after I point our your characters own gear and your poor misuse of it. Besides that Tony would die in the massive bomb raids.
Wesker's fast enough to blitz Sabretooth and your team, Deathstroke has the gear to put him down (as well as superior durability and fighting skill), and Lady Shiv and Cassy are skilled enough as well.
Blitz creed how? At times Creed has outreached and outreached Logan. You are making some strong claims here and you need to do something to back it up. You can see in the scans below(I don't remember this particular Issue). These scans are borrowed from a Comicstooge CAV vs Ilikeswords.Deathstroke blasting staff and overall weaponry aren't going to get the job done especially since you didn't bring up the fact instead of trying to simply use his staff he could have been shooting promethium bullets. Don't try to bring that up now that I have pointed it out for you. Lady Shiv and Cassy and Wesker would be hit by the drones along with the rest of your CQC solider squad. Only Wesker, Volgin, and Slades are making it across a bombing raid like the one I would be laying down.
While most of my team can't take most of your team on 1v1, it doesn't matter. It's 17v4 with some of the 17 giving long range and air support. So the minor advantages you had, no longer exist.
I have massive advantages; flying, bombing, tech team, dragon pusle, super smelling, drones, gadgets, etc. You have done nothing to negate that; poorly thought out plans like trying to cover a multi square mile battlefield in chaff grenades, and trying to set ambushing on characters that can obviously detect you, and trying to take down bullet proof characters with guns are not going to cut the mustard.
Basics
Chaff Me & Railgun:
Chaff grenades have already been explained. As has the Railgun.
Chaff Grenades are a down right ridiculously strategy considering all of the factors. I see you also continue to ignore the part of WHY SNAKE is using these Chaff Grenades in the first place, when he has no idea these Drones are coming. Again Snake is a Jedi Knight huh? You don't have the Railgun, snake fans already will know this.
Sabretooth was STILL taken down by Deadpool using nothing but guns despite his adamantium skeleton. It doesn't protect his brain and other organs from bullets and the like.
A bullet to the brain (especially several) still puts him down. As does several bullets to the heart, and so on.
1. You don't have Deadpool on your freaking team, why bring up something another character can do, when you cannot perform that function. Deadpool is an expert at fighting guys like Sabertooth and Wolverine he knows all of their weaknesses and ins & outs, your team only has basic info and knows nothing about the weakness of Sabertooth. The comparison rings so hallow it's embarrassing, further more Creed can tank headshots.
2. No, Sabertooth can survive massive organ damage and shots to the head. You are straight bull**** right now Dakrraiden. Outside of the fact that Sabertooth has an Adamtaium skeleton and it would take the perfect angled shot just to shoot him in the brain, he can also heal up from such damage. Don't get me wrong Sabertooth healing factor can get taxed like anybody else, but you don't have the weaponry to do so because you went the cheap route and tried piling up a bunch of 1 point wonders instead of spending some points and getting some solid projection like Gambit, Cyclops, or Cardiac.
I believe this is from X-Men Origins: Sabertooth(Scans from Comicstooge).
Here you can see Creed recovering from a head-shot very quickly. Your guns and arrows aren't going to do jack squat. By the way this is before Creed's upgrades and adamantium.
Gallery
This is from Wolverine & The X-Men #8 2011:
Sabertooth gets stabbed right in the freaking heart and he just stands there and smiles. He's not going down to the type of weak tactics and weapons you are trying to employ. Don't get me wrong, his healing can get taxed, but you're gonna need some adamantium claws, a lightsaber, Gorgon's Magical Swords, some Cyclops energy beams, or something like that to take him down. Basically you would need some sort of bad*** weaponry you clearly don't have. Again you are gonna fail here because you went the cheap route with your character picks and instead of focusing on damage output you focused on large numbers which can be cut down by Drones & bombing and characters with clearly Superior abilities and powers.
As for hitting SS while invisible, Slade can feel the difference in the wind. He'll be fine. As for hurting SIlver Samurai, nothing in that scan shows the need for something huge to hurt him. He didn't tank anything, he was simply brought down by an explosion unless I'm seeing that wrong.
I don't care how if he can feel the difference in the wind, explain exactly how that feat applies to the current situation & actions of our characters? Slade is just standing there in a calm safe area of a Graveyard. There are no massive bombing going on to distract him and hold his attention, there are no drones flying around attacking him, there is no invisible guy in this scan. This sort of approach to a battle would only seemingly work if it were a 1 on 1 fight and the battlefield itself was calm and not being air-raided. SS will blast him he will die. So you are ignoring all info and scans I have giving you on SS and his armor. Hmmm.
The explosion did affect his armor, the point is that even after that he was able to recover and fly home. Read here, after the fight with Sunfire SS returned home, meaning he took an atomic blast from Sunfire and was able to fly back to base. Again, do I have to drop a full comic for you to get the picture? Also see the scan above where he tanks a blast from Life Seed Angel.
It's bright, loud, knocks out people if they're close, and with super senses, Sabretooth especially should be KO'd from one of these nonetheless, a constant barrage. It's not light weaponry and should throw off anyone on your team if they're close.
The fact that you really think this is a viable option is amazing. You have snake and others sniping, and now you are going to what have him throw said stun grenade across the battlefield. The fact that you posted a wiki link instead of siting a feat for said grenade is also terrible. You think a grenade that is essentially a diverge tactic Flashbang is going to KO freaking Sabertooth. WOW, OH WOW. Show me & the voters said grenade knocking someone as durable as Sabertooth out. Sabertooth has tanked TK blasts from an angry Jean Grey and you think a simple Stun Grenade is going to KO him? LOW LOW BALLING. SS & Goblin are flying, he's not throwing that up in the air and timing it just right as the conveniently pass him by. Xing ninjas like Ling Yao have been taught to fight in complete darkness if something blinded him he would ignore it and keep fighting.
Sabertooth Special: In The Red Zone:
Here is Creed, he gets hit with several TK blasts from a very pissed off Phoenix Jean Grey and then he tanks 2 blasts right to the face/eyes from a POED Cyclops. Not only can he steal see and keep on fighting the fact that he could recover speaks to his level of supreme durability over anyone on your team. The very inane idea that Creed is going to be KOED by freaking Flashbang stun grenades is supremely far fetched and ridiculous. As you can see in the scans despite the fact that Cyclops made Creeds eyes bleed by blasting him right in his face, he is able to get up and run away from the X-men.
Gallery
To steal a line from Dextersinister: "You treat my attacks like waterballons"(80mm mortar rounds, 50lb pounds, micro missiles, shrapnel, fragments, heat & flames, blaswaves, shockwaves, etc....But, you expect my team to be KO by mere Flash Bangs. So, sad it's funny.
The tech is taken out via chaff grenades. Sabretooth's sense of smell shouldn't help him too much here with all the unfamiliar scents here as well as the fact that most of the people my team have snuck up on have some level of super smell as well. Plus he'll be too worried about being sniped and blown up by the Chitauir ships.
........Any unfamiliar scent means it's someone on your team as he would have already smelled everyone on my team because they were together during prep. That's such a poor excuse. This post doesn't even address Dragon's Pulse. You going for the ole plug up one leak and ignore the others trick and hope the voters don't take notice bit. Chaff grenade strategy is null and void, ignores the size and scope of the battlefield, logic, and the fact that I can view you on cameras. Why is he worried about Chitauiri fodder with no reasonable shooting feats of any kind that have weapons that MCU Cap took to the gut and recovered from? :/ As far as your team sneaking up on being with super smell this ignores the any context as to what else was going on, and if they had other info on the whereabouts of said stealth guys/girls and if they were expecting an attack from said stealth person. It all adds up to a bunch of nothing and your entire ill concocted idea still ignores DRAGON's PULSE & CAMERAS.
Yeah but so are helicopters. They're not know for their swift movement and banking around tight corners, but Liquid still took out two F-16s with one. His level of piloting is exactly the kind that's good enough to turn an inferior airship into a winning one. He's done it before, he'll do it again.
Let me get this straight you think a modern military helicopter sucks, so that's ABCDEFG whatever Liquid can do in a helicopter he can do in a Charuti airship a ship where you have not defined it's speed and basic capabilities because you did no such research on said ship. That's not gonna fly, what you did is the text book definition of ABC logic.
I've already explained how bombs won't do much to the people you named, and at least 3 of them are bulletproof (Solidus due to the suit, plus he literally deflects machine gun fire with his sword, Volgin as he's RPG proof, Batwoman's suit is literally bulletproof
He's face isn't covered, Kate's suit can be warn down and taxed, besides the fact that being bullet proof doesn't give blanket immunity to explosive damage and shrapnel, and other things. Not only that, but in your scan Batwoman is being shot with small handguns, not .50 BMG ROUNDS that are ARMOR PIERCING & INCENDIARY. Solidus face isn't covered and his suit can be taxed as well. Volgin isn't RPG proof, that was honestly game mechanizes, besides that's an explosion, not a .50BMG rounds repeatably hitting his face or body. If Volgin makes it across he still gets his head cutoff and you've continued to ignore the gas bombs because you have no counter.
1. Ok, first of all, Liquid flying towards you is not a death sentence. As proven before, he's by far the best aerial combatant here and has survived his vessel exploding and crashing before. It might give him minor injuries if that.
Surviving something isn't the same as being injured and popping back up again and healing up; only a handful of your characters have healing factors and they are no where on the same level as Sabertooth and Greed who can regenerate tissue in secs. Also you've done nothing, but set up liquid for failure and you've done nothing to set up what your flying Chiaurit Chariots can actually do and define their actual abilities. He's not tanking micro missles and falling to his death, and then being shot at by the heavy duty machine guns that are yes(are also on my drones), watch the trailer video here.
Greed regenerate an entire top half of his head. Can your characters do this? NOPE.
2. Look at this picture I'm posting. The red show areas on the left I can swim across with ease. That small part of water either isn't part of the lake and thus has no sharks in it, or has a miniscule amount since the rest of the sharks need to be spread out.
That's literally water under the bridge. The entire body of water is connected. :/ If you swim across you are shark food. The sharks would smell any and all blood in the water Further more I noticed you only marked the bridges on the back half of my side of the map and ignored all of the ones in front that I would have also blown up. In fact swimming is your worst option since as soon as you go into the water your team is completely vulnerable and GG & SS can blast the water. And before you think the water would somehow protect you explosions in water are actually a lot worse than anywhere else. You just sent whoever was in the water to their deaths.
3. Also in the picture, the yellow shows similar water on the other side. And finally, the strips of purple show areas where jumping and/or grappling across are such short distances, it's not even a threat to us.
Water under the bridge. This is a large lake, but it is connected. If you want to do some research it's called the Epcot World Showcase Lagoon. And that is literally water under the bridge. If you grapple you will be shot down by machine guns, and since none of you are Spiderman I doubt you could all repeatably grapple and not be shot by a single large caliber round. Either that or we blow you up: SS, Drones, Goblin = Game, Set, Match.
Again, water under the bridge. The entire body of water is connected. You're going to have to make it past the first set of blown bridges down by the Odyssey center and then the ones a bit higher up(the ones you marked). See down below how I cut the map. All bridges in this picture have been blown. Even something as simple as getting close to me is going to be very difficult for your team specially when we consider the fact that very few of them actual have grapple guns listed as standard gear. Bane and Shiva, The Boss Unit, Wesker, Voglin...hell I'm not sure the Slades carry grapple guns: Maybe Pre 52. Also if you place Volgin in the water, Water + Electricity = very bad things happen to Volgin. It's going to take your team a while to grapple across due to the fact they would have to share grapples. Really does anyone on your team outside of the Female Bats have grapple guns/repelling equipment?
And yes you could try and pass through the trees in Mexico to try and bypass the first set of blown bridges, but then some mortar fire in the woods would create large amounts of sharpnel and debris: another doomed to fail plan that would literally blow up in your face.
Ok, first: let's look at that Cap scene again. He's hit and goes down, stays down from just one blast. While he's not more durable than your team, he's close to as durable given the things he's tanked (including bullets) without flinching. Enough of those is putting down anyone on your team and even just one is stunning them.
You seriously think MCU cap is anywhere on the level of any of my characters you've been ignoring all feats and context. You're ignoring the part where Cap gets right back the freak up with a little arm lift from thor huh? MCU Cap's healing is so beneath Creed & Greed...Dude.
And if you look at this Iron Man scene, two blasts throw him off balance and knock him off his feet. And he is more durable than your team.Same Iron Man who took fallout from nukes and giant explosions and Thor's hits btw.
Now you're lowballing & highaballing MCU Ironman's durability at the same time(impressive) and missing all context. The dude had already been fighting for hours, his suit was running low on energy, and he had just busted through a GIANT Chitarui Battle Whale/Leviathan. His suit was already taxed to a large degree way before that scene, you can see as much if you back up the video Raiden. MCU Iron Man tanking the fallout from a NUKE? No, all of the damage from said Nuke in Avengers was taken in by the ship and sucked into space as the wormhole closed. None of the blast affected him in anyway, you can clearly see that in the movie.
As for hitting the drones, 4 feet is pretty small, but given Liquid's skill, I see him taking the drones on. Plus the drones have limited ammo, so as long as Liquid can dodge their attacks, and he can, they should soon become pretty useless. Star Wars pilots have no relevance to this fight and most seemed to suck tbh. But that's neither here or there.
Star Wars pilots do not suck; Jesus Christ do some research. Yes they are revelant and I explained at length why. You are just ignoring this because you have no counter or rebuttal for the facts I laid out. The drones are very small and thin and can turn on a dime as you see in the video clip. The drones have multiple laser guided micro missiles, one would be enough to take out a single Chitarui ship which were getting blown apart by Hawkeye's explosive arrows. You must think Liquid is Deadshot, Grifter, or Wesley....Even for one of them this is difficult shot.
Liquid dies and you've doomed him with your course of actions.
Nope. The seals would be killed before being able to harm anyone on my team. As shown already, they can't hurt anyone on my team if they tried.
So you are going to attack seals miles away before they can launch their attacks. Jesus Raiden. You've already admitted in your posts most of your posts most of your guys have to get close. Oh that's right you think you can shoot across a miles long battlefield and through trees, buildings, stands, and other objects and then hit a seal. Good to see all of your characters can shoot like the Fraternity.
I've already proven why my team won't be dead by this time. As for SS and GG not being CQC, that causes them to be sniped and hit by aerial attacks.
What you've shown is that you have the ridiculous idea your group of mostly peak humans can't be taxed or injured. You are basically highballing them to a ridiculous degree and you show an overall lack of understanding of their base limitations. Yes because you can snipe across the battlefield like Cross or Welsey, gotcha.
Sabretooth isn't oneshotting anyone. He rarely if ever guts someone with his claws and has proven to have difficulty getting past tranquilizers and bullets. Add on snipers (who can take him out btw), aerial attacks, flashbangs, etc. and he's down very easily.
Yes he can, raley guts someone? Are you reading the same comics I am? You mean like he's gutted dozens of people and characters, like he once gutted Pyslocke? :/ Tranqs are the only things that would due something, everything else you have is basically a joke. Snipers shooting with no line of sight, amazing. Yes, he can oneshot most of your team and Sabertooth guts, slices, and dices people all of the time. He's claws are his main weapon, duh.
Already explained why Snake's railgun would be standard gear, but he doesn't need it, a simple sniper rifle would suffice.
No you don't have the rail gun. No a sniper rifle isn't going 3 miles and past objects in the battlefield and then hitting a target: Can YOU CURVE BULLETS? Bullets can't hurt anyone on my team outside of GG and he can take a good number of them. Plus we are not a bunch of mooks who are gonna stand their and get shot, plus all of your shooters are getting bombed into the stoneage.
SS is the only one who could likely survive sniping, but attacks from the Chitauri and Deathstroke's staff among other weapons (Volgin's lightning-er electricity for example, and Lady Shiva who's taken down such advanced armor...with a stick, Solidus's high frequency blade) will eventually take him down.
So, we are gonna ignore the fact Sabertooth can heal up and tank damange, and Greedling has Ultimate Shield. You know I noticed that you have not once dealt with Ultimate shield at all. You have Deathstrokes sniping, and if they comes close they are getting taken out quickly by superior characters. Solidius high frequency blade is a good option, but not for Adamantium laced bones or Carbanium Armor. Wolverine had to super heat his claws just to cut through SS. Wolverine: Japan's most wanted...Seriously if adamantium needs to be amped just to cut through, your weapons aren't getting it. Good to see you admit it's not true lighting.
Also I'm just gonna mention that you showed SS going H2H or at least close combat many times, more than he's gone aerial (against a none aerial opponent). I see no reason he wouldn't do so here, but it makes no difference.
Bringing this up is pretty asinine, you don't control the actions of my characters Darkraiden, I do. I just can't do anything out of character: like having a good guy kill a baby. SS knows how to use tactics and strategy and the only reason he fights CQC is when he has to or if it's Wolverine(due to a personal vendetta. Anyway, you don't tell my characters what to do, I do.
Recap:
Solid Snake: Using Chaff Grenades, turning invisible, sniping with railgun sniper rifle apparently to take your team out and cover mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close. Survives explosions due to stealth+feats.
WP would be a good option if I didn't have 2 armored characters and 2 characters with healing factors. Stun grenades are embarrassing, chaff idea has been torn apart, CQC wouldn't be viable against flying characters, and most of your guys outside the few I named wouldn't survive massive bombing. You don't have railgun, good to see you crossed it out. You don't have Octocamo, you can cross that out too. Sniping across a clogged battlefield...so silly.
Big Boss: Using Chaff Grenades, using stealth, sniping your team and covering mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close. Survives explosions due to stealth+feats.
No to all of this, for reasons I've already gotten into.
New 52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
New 52 DS is not faster, stronger, or more durable than anyone on my team. He is skilled though, but I don't think it really matters when he is outclassed in every other important area. More sniping....You're not shooting across a clogged battlefield man. Not miles away...
Pre-52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be
No to sniping across the battlefield, no no no...Superior to who? The seals? Cause everyone else is ranked higher than him in the food change of characters. He is very skilled though, maybe he could beat Greedling 1 vs 1. He still gonna get bombed and taxed and if you gets close my other characters will finish him off.
Taskmaster: Using Stealth to get to medium range and then unload with guns, then arrows, go Close Combat when needed. Wins/holds own via superior skill and great feats vs. Venom, Spider-Man, Iron Man, etc. Has tanked enough to survive explosions. Speed and stealth help to avoid brunt of explosions.
Yes because by battleboard logic Taskmaster would go 5/10 with Spiderman, Iron Man, and Matt Gargan Venom. Yes, of course(sarcasm). You've pigeon hold so many of your best characters into basic army sniper roles when most of my characters can eat bullets and 2 of them can just heal up. Arrows...slow weak arrow, not even a viable option here.
Udon Taskmaster: Using Stealth and Speed to get medium range and unload with guns and then blitzing in Close Combat. Same as above with explosions.
Again pigeon holing a great character into a basic sniper role. You're doing a horrible job of showing what these characters could be doing. Udon Taskmaster's suit has so much versatility; Spiderman Webbing, Wolverine Claws, Energy Projection, Energy Shields, etc and all you got is making him do CQC kung fu and shooting. Don't try to retroactively change tactics mid debate like with Batwoman now that I've pointed this out.
Gene: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed/teleportation, his knives, and his ESP abilities. Uses speed/teleportation to avoid explosions.
He's not blitzing **** and using his Zero Shift repeatedly ability tires him out. I see you ignored this statement and didn't rebut. Yes knives..knives...Against the likes of my team.
The Boss: Getting close via stealth and ambushing. Then unloading infinitely on your team (with patriot gun) until only the bulletproof are left and/or other close combat needs support. Then going H2H.
Infite Ammo is game mechanics man , you're not ambushing anyone as I've consistently explained: Cameras, Drones, Dragon Pulse, Supersmelling...well 2 are solidly bulletproof, and Sabertooth can tank and heal. GG can just avoid the gun fire with speed and his goblin glider.
Volgin: Getting close range for H2H and lightning action. Helps to definitely take down Silver Samurai, drones (along the way), Sabertooth (metal bones), and really any and everybody aslightning 10 million volts is powerful. Survives explosions due to durability feats.
But, we both know Volgin is more powerful than a 17 dollar stun gun, so just feat sight, Be nice to see or hear about some feats from Volgin.
And I already showed SS and Sabertooth being shocked above. Both could tank what Volgin is dishing out and then stomp him by slicing off his head: Laser Sword & Adamantium.
Lady Shiva: Using Stealth to get close, ambush, take down your team H2H due to taking on better/stronger/more durable people. Speed/disappearing feats allows her to avoid all explosions/attacks.
Fodder Shiva is going to die in the explosions. Another characters that can just do CQC and nothing else in this fight.
Cassandra Cain: Using stealth and speed to get close and ambush your team with extreme skill in H2H combat. Surviving explosions due to speed+feats.
She didn't tank an explosion in that scan, she moved out the way and why she is durable, she has clear limitations and caps on her abilities. She dies in the bombing.
Wesker: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed and strength.
Too many CQC characters that can do nothing vs flying characters, and drones. He survives the bombing, but we can tax him and he won't arrive on our side at 100%. Then we finish him off. Cutting off his head should work.
Batwoman: Getting Close and helping in H2H combat, also using gadgets when need be. Suit protects her from bullets and the like.
Now using gadgets I had to remind you about. Totally jumping to a new strategy only after your opponent points out how poorly you were using Batwoman. Kate dies in the bombings.
Revolver Ocelot: Using Stealth to ambush your team and get the drop on them, killing them with gunfire and engaging in H2H if needed. Survives explosions via feats.
Trying to out stealth characters who have a guy on the team that can sense people through chi like abilities and a guy that can smell them coming, and cameras, and drone radar...He got knocked down by the explosion you showed in your video. He dies in the bombings.
Chitauri: Aerial attacks and support, bombarding your team with weapon fire that momentarily stopped MCU Hulk, took down MCU Cap America and MCU Iron Man.
You would have thought the Chitauiti straight bent the Avengers over and won the fight instead of getting fodderized by the likes of MCU BW, and MCU Hawkeye. You're ships suck, and the chitauri have no shooting feats. I've seen people on the vine make arguments that CW Arrow would solo a couple of these guys whether they were flying or not. Everything you said here is basically a lie: they didn't stop the Hulk--he was just annoyed, they didn't take down MCU cap--he got back up, and they damn sure didn't stop Iron Man he was already taxed for several different reasons as I explained above. Try not to make things up about a movie everyone on the vine has seen multiple times.
Liquid Snake: Getting close via one of the Chitauri aerial ships as he is a master flyer, taking you down via aerial attacks.
Liquid gets blown out of the sky, you haven't even established any facts what so ever on them.
Also you're ignoring entire sections of my posts....
Summary: Redundancy
You went over all of these points already....There is a clear difference between being thorough and repeating the same points over and over again.
1. My gear+plans to spread out+time it takes to execute your plan makes your bombarding drones plan useless and has them get shot out of the sky and bombs easily avoided.
Snake: Kid Flash & Big Boss: Speedball are going to cover the entire battlefield in chaff grenades before my drones reaches your team in 33 secs that you yourself calculated. Also they have future sight so they know about my drones although your basic knowledge only covers: Powers, Abilities, and Skills. Not perks and not gear.
2. Bombs don't kill almost anyone in my team so the strategy was ineffective regardless. I've proven this with a large section explaining and showing why.
Of course you see voter Raiden's team has explosive immunity and they can tank multiple explosions, shrapnel, fragments, blastwaves, shockwaves...none of that will hurt Raiden's team at all. **** the Powerrangers, Raiden's team b****hes.
3. Snipers cover my team as we have people stealthing over to your side for an ambush. Guns and H2H attacks will take your team unawares killing those that aren't bulletproof, if the snipers don't kill you first and if the Chitauri ships and Liquid don't put you away either. Not t mention various gadgets from Batwoman.
This just ignores everything I've already been over last 2 posts: sniping miles across, ambushing a group that can detect you, Chitauir ships getting blown up, and now using the gadgets all of a sudden after I point them out to you. :/
4. Machine gun rounds mean nothing to my team's level of skill/reaction speed and we can all easily get around said guns as there are clear ways to your side. Some of us are even bulletproof.
Bulletproof against small arms fire not huge .50 BMG rounds that can cover person's hand. Again a single bullet doesn't even have to hit you to create a bunch of debris that would. Already been over this, but you totally ignored that point. You've skipped over several entire sections I typed out and broke down.
7. We win due to numbers+skill+strategy+all out assault.
You lose because I have drones, flying characters, better damage output, and flat out a better team. Also remember the part where I explained that you can't coordinate a massive and complex assault even with perfect teamwork? Because you split your team up and they don't have any way to communicate with each other? Yeah another section of writing you totally skipped.
We need to go to votes, really really bad. Your ideas here are poorly thought out and many of them are basically silly. Any awesome character you did have you pigenholed them into the roles of CQC and Shooter. You could have been a lot more creative in how you used your characters, but you went for trying to snipe miles away with a battlefield that is clogged with buildings,trees, and other things. This was not a good debate on your part and frankly disappointing.
??? What makes you think you can travel that fast and that far in 33 secs. You've got some fuzzy math. Even if I believed you then check your own math mate: 330m(A number you seemingly pulled out of thin air) is only around 0.2 miles. That's not very far when we are 3 miles away homie. Also use logic, you are headed towards me, meaning you are helping cut the distance between the drones and your team. You're only quicken your death. Only a few members of your team are actually what qualifies as comicbook superhuman(Wesker, Volgin, Slades) the mass majority: even Batgirl, and the Snakes are comicbook peak human. Show me some travel speed feats for your team. Chitarui airship is so slow and so whack when it comes what it can do in the air. I already showed you Hawkeye say flat it they can't bank(maneuver) worth a damn. Nobody is using Olympic numbers, standard Superhumans like Captain America can only travel at running speeds of around 30mph. You're basically suggesting that your team can run 100 meters per sec(100m/s x 33sec = 330meters) ? :/ Dude that's like what? 223MPH? Boy oh boy oh boy... So you basically are claiming your entire team can run as fast as muscle cars? Or as fast as Spiderman can webswing?
I said ten meters per second aka 10 m/s aka 22.34 mph as in less than the 30 mph you just claimed. 33x10 = 330. Let's get that clear. 100 m/s would be 3300 m which is almost two miles. And that was lowballing as Usain Bolt moves at 10.43 m/s, but it's not that big of a deal so I lowballed myself.
But seriously, you're putting an extra 0 on there for me. I'd love it, but I never claimed that.
As for heading towards you, let's address that and why it's not beneficial towards you.
1. My people are spreading out so they're harder to hit at once. That's .2 miles in random direction.
2. Stealth combined with movement and the lack of cameras that will be found in forest type areas will block most of my team from the drones' view, meaning no bombing or targeting.
3. Chaff as discussed before, throws off targeting systems.
Chaffing That ****:
1. You just explained why it wouldn't work. If you can only throw it 100 feet in the air, then why would it be affecting my drones which are thousands of feet in the air.
2. Yes the Chaff Grenades affect the general area, but here are some problems with your line of thinking. First: why is Snake attacking Drones he has no reason to EXPECT in the first place? Does Snake have Precog? Future Sight? Can Snake see into the future and know what gear my team has? Second: The metal strips only can affect the electronics that are in its dispersal pattern. Third: You said yourself(repeatedly) your team was going to scatter and split up. Only snake & boss would have said Chaff Grenades, so they cannot cover several square miles to protect their teammates from being hit. Fourth: My team can still see you in the cameras and rely that info to our Drones. Even if your Chaffs worked perfectly the bombs and missiles would still get to you. And of course the obvious fact the Chaff metal stripes would dissipate very quickly in an open battlefield.
3. Your acting as if, A. You're Team Already knows about the bombs is preparing to doge them, B. Bombs & 50lb Bombs traveling at the rate of gravity are slow, C. Your entire team is going to dodge massive explosions, shockwaves, heat & flames, etc when they won't even be expecting an air raid in the first place. They have no logical basis or reason to. They get blown to bits and hit with several different forms of damage caused from massive bombing.
1. Well no, you ignored the rest of the explanation. The 100ft still blocks targeting and the like because it can't reach me due to the chaff cloud. I agree it won't be knocking the drones out the sky, but targeting's going out of whack.
2. Snake and Big Boss will be covering themselves yeah. They don't need to due to stealth, but they will. Chaff also blocks cameras (and there won't be many cameras in the area we have to go to get to your side and/or snipe), and the rest of my team is fine due to speed, durability, and stealth as I explained before. Snake and Big Boss know about the drones due to basic knowledge.
3. Covered by basic info. We know you have drones that bomb people. We'll be expecting (and likely hearing/feeling) them.
Infinite Ammo & Gear:
Darkraiden, I can already tell you didn't head my advice and ask the Snake experts: Nickzambuto, Sirfizzwhizz, and Beaconofstrength as to what is standard gear. Common sense should tell you Snake is going to be walking around with a large Railgun in any random encounter. It would hamper his own stealth(sans game mechanics storage). Octocamo is not standard, and neither are Railguns. Seriously Infinite Ammo? Does Snake have some sort of Magical Storage Device where he keeps all of these bullets? Video Game characters already have to take way too much **** on this site and you're abuse of power ups acquired during games and game mechanics is setting them back. Go talk to the Snake Experts. I'm not BSing you go look at some of Nickzambuto's CAVS or Sirfizzwhizz's for Standard Gear for Snakes. I've seen a lot of Snake threads, and Octocamo and Railgun never come up as standard gear.
Luke, you've probably seen me in threads long enough to know that I don't give a damn about what others say. That's simply their opinion. I've seen the CAVs. I disagree.
Octocamo is the definition of standard gear. It's what he wore multiple time through countless attempted missions until the microwave fried it. Railgun is specifically mentioned to be used as part of the plot multiple times. I consider those standard. Infinite ammo has special properties as it has it's own custcene. I don't know where he's storing it, but he has it.
Also since you're asking for feats, I'll go ahead and return the favor and ask for feats from these drones. You're basically using the equivalent of a wiki yourself. So as of now, featless as these drones are, you're not bombing anyone.
Bombing 2: Mortar Rounds
Splitting Up & Chaff:
Already discussed the Chaff Grenades above and why that tactic wouldn't work. You can't spread your Chaff Grenades through several square miles of the battle field and protect a team that you commanded to split up. Deathstroke doesn't have the range and feats to pick off drones. Chitari Chariots have a clear lack of definition of on their speed(because you never have shown any feats to establish it).
I've explained why Chaff will work and why the rest of my team doesn't need it. Chitauri chariots speed feats, hey if you want em, I'll provide.
Stealthy Snake:
Snake got his stealth camo from MGS1, literally wore it up until MGS2 where it got damaged. That looks like standard gear to me. And radar is blocked by chaff grenade.
Getting Gear & Power Ups from Game Play does not make it standard.....
@lukehero: Snake doesn't really have "standard" gear since his usual MO is going in completely naked and procuring everything on sight (there can be no traces of the government's involvement left behind, hence Snake can take no government equipment). If we're talking "standard" gear, then Snake shouldn't have anything besides a basic Sneaking Suit and a pack of cigarettes.
What Snake has is "basic" gear. Again in Metal Gear, all your equipment is to be procured on sight, but there are certain items of basic, trademark equipment that would be considered Snake's standard gear, that doesn't include the crazy things like the Railgun. If I had to specify gear for Snake, I would say his Shadow Moses Sneaking Suit, SOCOM pistol, some kind of assault rifle, stinger missiles, C4, and a pack of smokes.
EDIT: Oh and a cardboard box obviously.
So no you wouldn't have the railgun or ocotocamo.
That's nice for nick, but I'd include octocamo and railgun given it's his standard gear for his most recent game and worn the entire game from start to finish. Railgun is picked up later.
And I'm not talking getting gear from powerups. Snake canonically starts the cutscenes of MGS2 with infinite ammo and stealth camo (invisibility). That means it's what he wears to a mission. It's standard gear.
Sniping Me From Miles Away:
No, your drones are being taken down first. The mortar fire doesn't really affect my snipers for various reasons (tanking explosions, they won't be seen by your soldiers, etc.)
And there's plenty of areas to get a clear line of sight.
And remember, Snake and Big Boss have defeated people with superhuman accuracy such as The End (who could sense anything in the forest and couldn't sense Big Boss sneaking up on him), and Sniper Wolf (who Snake beat in both a sniping battle and a real battle).
:/ Your Chitarui Warriors with no clear definition of speed and a major lack of being able to maneuverability are going to shoot down drones traveling at over 300mph. Man oh man, show me some shooting feats for these Chitarui. We must have been watching 2 different movies during Avengers. The motar fire does affect your snipers if they take the time to try and set up a shot, then my team can target them: radar & cameras. We will see and detect where you are and take you down.Clear Line Of Sight: Dude where? You are ignoring the entire landscape of the map, did you not watch the video above or look at the picture I just showed you of the landscape: Trees, Building, Stands, Etc. Yes, but I can see you right on camera and detect your chi(Dragon Pulse). It seems you are ignoring these factors. Puls SS has thermal imaging. We are going around in circles at this point and you're not presenting anything in the way of evidence to support your claims much. Snakes still have scent and still can be detected through Dragon's Pulse.
No, Liquid will be shooting down the drones, the Chitauri are for your team more. Chitauri will help by firing at them, but Liquid will be taking them down.
Radar and cameras won't see my guys due to chaff and due to cameras not being in the area and/or being taken out.
No I didn't watch the video, didn't know it was required.
Octocamo stops radar and thermal sensing btw.
Explosions:
So my people escaping from explosions i kinda my entire point. They escape from explosions without harm from all the surrounding effects. Given that you won't have clear vision of us and that we all have basic info and superhuman reaction speeds, we'll be dodging any and all explosions. And the ones I showed can tank them head on.
Bombing 3: Silver Samurai
Seeing as how you have no evidence to claim otherwise it's almost bafling you would be trying to nitpick a character you know nothing about. They are jet boots, he's moving at jet speeds(FOGHORN). If you want a another speed feat I suppose I will indulge you. Below he catches up with an angry Sunfire that was attempting to escape with Logan during Japan's Most Wanted. Actually visual cues are fine and daddny as long as they go hand in hand with the characters other feats, gear, and capabilities. Again Jet Boots = Jet Speeds. What's the problem? You are completely ignoring things here: Thermal Imaging. How does your stealth even come into play when my tech team can see you on the cameras? And rely that info to SS. You're team isn't that fast in travel speed, you're math on that subject was hilarious. You seem to be pulling your speed feats on travel from out of thin air without displaying a single feat for any of your characters travel speed, yet you dare question mine: BAD FORM.
You insult my math when you're the one wrong. Tsk tsk, that's a violation Luke. 3 more and you have to forfeit out of shame.
Regarding Silver Samurai's speed, the fact that I don't know him is why I question the feat. Almost every character has one or even a few feats that stand far above the rest and will almost never be emulated again.Those are high end feats and in this case, the feat isn't even clear. I just want a semi-clear feat of how fast he moves. Keeping up with Sunfire...I don't know anything about Sunfire or Angel (that's who that is right?) as far as travel speed so those feats mean nothing to me. I just want a clear feat. Really.
Chaff grenade point has been covered so I won't quote it.
Snake does not have the railgun, none of the best Snake debaters never bring it up as "basic gear" for snake. Stop it. If Snake fans are reading this they are either laughing or crying at how poorly you are debating with these AMAZING Metal Gear characters. Infinite Ammo? How is this Nicka Snake carrying Infinite Ammo(cause game mechanics). That's so silly and insanely ridiculous you would be laughed off the boards for pulling this kind of stunt in a random thread.
Best debaters is an opinion and right now you're invoking the Appeal to Popularity fallacy. Just because a lot of people that are deemed as good Snake debaters think something, doesn't make it true. I've stated my reasons why Snake would have the Railgun and infinite ammo and need neither of them for my plan. Sniping still works, as does 15 stun grenades (if we use game mechanics since it's based on weight and all) to your face. Or even just 1 or a few.
Actually I don't have to stop I can just fly around and do it. I already showed you a scan of him fighting Angel. Also something as simply as timing a bomb drop the bones bare basics of what a typical street level solider can do. You are obfuscating the facts and present situation because you have no defense or counter for Hallucinogenic Gas Bombs. You have no real counter to it so instead you are trying to find a loop hole out of it. It's a very poor debating tatic more to the point you can't back up a single claim of what you have stated because you don't have any truly impressive targeting feats for Volgin. Volgin is an actually decent shot and I could probably point out a few feats here and there I found in my resaearch, but then again all that is your job to establish about your character, not mine. If he did have to stop so what? He can't see me. Volgin can target people from sound alone: Who the hell do you think Volgin is Deadshot shooting blindfolded? I am as fast as I claim. Show we proof that SS is not.
Timing a bomb drop leaves many things to chance and allows a lot of variables to come into play. For instance, we'll just see the bomb drop and move before it gets to us. Simple as that. Again, in the same way that normal people can attack randomly in a direction that a projectile came from, so can Volgin. Not saying he'll be 100% accurate, but if he hits SS, he's done.
Simple as.
How the hell would Volgin even hear the sonic boom when I just showed you solid lock stock and barrel proof the nanotech scrubs his sound. I showed you that in my intro, again you're just flat out ignoring things.
Because the sonic boom wouldn't be his sound it's the wind around him. Nothing was said about that. The same way the window still made a 'crash' sound in the scan you posted. It only makes his actual movements quiet if that.
Oh Gawd, now you are reaching, I just showed you someone who BBQed freaking Wolverine with a single energy blast and now you say Wolverine is just a mere human. Man oh man, this is getting funny. You've improved as a debater as of late, but you're really screwing the pooch here. Why are they doding his blasts, they can't see him, they don't know he is coming,
Luke, let's be real here. Wolverine has human durability on everything outside of his bones. His healing factor makes up for it, but never has he shown different. Fire burns him, knives cut and stab him, bullets penetrate him. I'll give him blunt durability, but I've never seen anything not having to do with his skeletal structure indicate that he has above peak human durability.
Shows Scan of SS shooting Angel while they are both flying around through the air, Raiden response: I doubt SS can use such blasts while airborne. Raiden did you fall asleep during my intro?
Correction, SS is stopped mid air to do that. I simply meant that he couldn't be blitzing and shooting at the same time. And to my other point, he takes time to charge it. Easy dodge for my team.
Finishing Moves
You Die, Here's Why:
No, what you showed was a bunch of mother fluffers getting the hell out of the way from explosions: as it stands only Wesker, Slades, and Volgin can tank massive explosions. All of your other characters would die or be seriously injured from massive bombings. Chaf grenades aren't doing **** and you gave Snake 0 provocation for even starting to suddenly throw around Chaff grenades when he has no idea Drones are coming. At this point Snake is a Jedi from your point of view and has force senses. Show me Deathstroke hitting a moving target at high speeds that is thousands of feet in the air with his Staff. Oh and he needs precog to know the Drones are coming for the first Bomb Wave. The chitarui ships are laughable when compared to my team of flying characters & drones, as Hawkeye explained.
Getting out of the way from explosions is a good way to survive them. The best way actually. And I still need those feats from the drones.
Snake and basic info has been explained.
Deathstroke feats will be with the rest of them. I'll have a feats section. Precog? No just tactical and logical mind+basic info. He knows you have drones. Hawkeye is not an authority on Chitarui ships. He also has better aim than most characters period and definitely more than anyone on your team. So it's irrelevant. Remember the rest of the team were asking him for tips/help.
So, you can curve bullets through a battlefield full of obstacles like Wesley from Wanted, and Grifter from Wildstorm. Damn, you got some BAMF for a few points. :/ Motars can't hit or aim why? Oh yeah your Chitaruit are going to fly blitz across the battlefield and my team of flying guys are going to do nothing, but sit back and let you shoot at them. You haven't presented a single targeting feat for the Chitauri, your ships are not going to reach us, Drones blow you out of the sky, and SS or Goblin could solo your entire fleet of fodder(they are called fodder for a reason).
Mortars can't hit me because they don't know where we are. Without a location, you can't hit someone with a bomb. Feats will be in feats section. (Feats gonna feats).
An hour? You are once again pulling fuzzy math from out of thin air like a magician. How do you figure it's going to take that long where I have presented several forms of detection and I know where you are at all times? My targeting isn't being interfered with if you really think Solid Snake can cover a entire battlefield with chaff grenades in 33 secs, you must think he's kid flash. This is getting bad. You're not backing up your claims, you pull math from seemingly no where, and even if I go along with it your team is getting killed anyway.
The hours was the lowball, why not use the 5 minutes? It's like you deliberately pull out the worst that you see and debate that. Regardless, Snake's not covering the field in chaff grenades, only himself. Stealth+chaff+cameras not catching everything+cameras can be easily taken out+basic info = my team not being seen.
Excellent Cover how? From being blown to bits? Sabertooth can smell you, Drone Radar, Tech Team on the Cameras, Dragon's Pulse. I see you are truly ignoring all of this now. I can track you down with thermal imagining and drone radar and rain down hell on you.
We are beating a dead horse at this point: No line of sight, No Rail Gun.
Thermal imaging, blocked by Octocamo. Excellent cover, the smoke and debris man. It blocks cameras from seeing us for as long as you bomb. It allows us to get away. That's it. Drone radar and all tech is messed up by chaff. Clear line of sight can be gotten at any time. Climbing up in a tree, staying on my side and hiding somewhere, etc. You're in an explicit location and according to your plan your team always returns or stays there.
Who cares they are still bullets:
SS(Cardbandium Armor, only 2nd to Adamantium)
Greedling: Ultimate Shield, tanks machine gun and rifle fire like it's nothing
Sabertooth: Healing Factor, Admantium Skeleton
GG: Chain Mail Armor, Flying
It's a silly attack for you to mention after I tell you and prove to you most of my team can eat bullets and then you bring up bullets again. I point out where MCU Cap who is way below my team is pretty much everything that matters when it comes to durability, tanked a Chiarui blast to the guy and then you ignore this and say they my team will be taken down by such weapons. I explain how the Chiraturi flying chariots have a hard to time maneuvering and you think you can blow my much more air combat ready team & Drones out of the sky. Liquid is in a inferior air ship and he is going to be blown out of the air.
The last 2 are put down by headshots. The first two, especially Greedling is taken out by Chitauri weapons (they took out Iron Man). Not to mention that sniper shots are >>>machine gun fire in penetration and that Slade has been known to carry heavier guns. I like how you bring up the Cap feat but ignore the Iron Man and Hulk ones.
SS will be taken down physically as Wolverine looks like he took him down with an elbow to the face. Either way, with the rest of your team gone, Chitauri can focus fire, we can H2H him or stun him or tranq him or Slade can cut or staff blast him. Doesn't really matter. Either way you go down.
Gadgets:
Batwoman dies in the bombing. Batwoman is slow, lacks feats where she is using these weapons on fast characters, and you are now retroactively changing your strategy now that I pointed out how poorly you were using Batwoman. Your original post says & I quote: "Batwoman: Getting Close and helping in H2H combat.". Now you are saying she is using her gadgets. Amazing how that played out only after I told you how awful you were using Batwoman by pigeonholing her into yet another CQC situation(which would favor my team).
Tasers: ....Lowballing my teams durability if you think that's gonna work. Ignoring their healing.
Sonic Weapons: I notice that device is radio controlled, my tech team could turn it off. Before you say they wouldn't recognize it keep in mind they are getting battlefield into from several sources: cameras, drones, eyes on the ground, etc. GG is a tech genius as well and Felicity has hacked into radio controlled sources before like she had to do vs the Clock King.
Python Coil: Anyone on my team is good enough to cut through it, and she would't be fast enough to tag them with it.
Flashbangs: You can't be serious, flash bangs are not going to cut the mustard not to mention how dangerously close Kate would have to get to use such a device.
Tranqs: Useful on Sabertooth, that's about it, the tranqs wouldn't pierce characters who are armored like GG, SS, and Greedling Raiden...Also again she hasn't tagged anyone as fast as Sabertooth on a consistent basis with such a weapon.
No change. Literally all of those gadgets are used in H2H combat and involve her getting close. There was no change.
Tasers hurt SS, GG, and even stun the likes of Sabretooth and Greedling, not supposed to put them down. Your tech team can't put it down before it starts and that gives my team a huge opening to attack. See: Pied Piper almost killing Barry and them being helpless to do anything about it. Your tech team is good, but nowhere near that good. They need time. And time is precious.
Flashbangs are also distractions, Python coils hold your team and puts them in a position where they can't cut it, GG and Sabretooth both get tranq'ed. GG can easily be headshotted.
And she doesn't need feats tot tag Sabretooth since she has 12+ other people also fighting with her and Sabretooth and your team being subdued by Sniper fire.
So we are going to ignore healing factors and durability for my team. Show/site some impressive targeting feats for Volgin. Volgin has limited range. Creed has tanked worse than anything you could actually show Volgin doing. Also I doubt Volgin has every fried someone with an actual way of healing from damage. Down below is SS getting shocked from a blast from Life Seed Angel. You can see his entire skeleton getting light up like an Xray. I doubt Volgin has ever taken anyone down with my teams impressive durability. More over I see you still have not shown or sited a single targeting feat for Volgin.
No. 10 million volts is 10 million volts.
See Batwoman's tagging for why Volgin doesn't really need targeting feats seeing as he has many distractions and people around him attacking you and sniping you, including speedsters like Gene and Wesker.
None of your feats are close to 10 million volts. Especially not sustained.
The Amazing Taskmaster:
As far as feats, Taskmaster has beaten people better than Sabretooth both physically and in skill (Venom, The Cat, entire teams of assassins, Avenger teams, etc.) and two of them could easily put Sabretooth down. A few arrows to the eyes could to the trick.
If you really think that Taskmaster in a serious battle board discussion would beat Creed & of all people Matt Gargan Venom you need a serious reality check. I don't care what happened in Secret Avengers(the fight you are refereeing to), Taskmaster tanking on Venom is a VERY HIGH feat for Taskmaster and a lowball to Matt Gargan Venom who is physically on par with his opposite Anti Venom. You really think in a serious discussion Taskmaster is going to beat up an entire squad of decent Avengers? Go make a thread and see if you don't get flagged and the thread gets locked within a few mins.
In what sort of ludicrous world do you think Taskmasters physicals are superior to Creed? Creed outclasses him in strength, speed, reaction times, healing, and durability.
Freaking Arrows? Taskmaster has **** loads of cool gear and you are using his weakest ones: freaking Arrows?(Go read a GhostRavage debate). You are sentencing Taskmaster to his death just as you are doing with most of your team by using poor thought out straightest. I have a bullet timer in Creed and he would laugh at the type of piercing damage an Arrow would cause. I'm sure Creed is just going to stand their flat footed while Taskmaster tries an ill conceived attempt at trying to shoot arrows in Creed's eyes. Taskmaster carries everything from high explosives, to poison darts, etc and you are trying to use freaking Arrows. Please do not try to retroactively change your strategies mid debate like you tried with Batwoman after I point our your characters own gear and your poor misuse of it. Besides that Tony would die in the massive bomb raids.
Note: I didn't say Taskmaster is physically superior to Creed. I said he beat people who were superior. As in Spider-Man, Venom, a bunch of people with giant/growth powers, Avengers teams, Iron Man a few times, etc. You can say it's high end, but it's consistent.
Arrows are for long range. You know that, I know that. And Taskmaster and others (like Bullseye who is a skillset he has) has hit other bullet timers like Wolverine and Deadpool with arrows.
Taskmaster will go in with his sword and shield later, the arrows are for long range until he runs out.
Wesker:
Blitz creed how? At times Creed has outreached and outreached Logan. You are making some strong claims here and you need to do something to back it up. You can see in the scans below(I don't remember this particular Issue). These scans are borrowed from a Comicstooge CAV vs Ilikeswords.Deathstroke blasting staff and overall weaponry aren't going to get the job done especially since you didn't bring up the fact instead of trying to simply use his staff he could have been shooting promethium bullets. Don't try to bring that up now that I have pointed it out for you. Lady Shiv and Cassy and Wesker would be hit by the drones along with the rest of your CQC solider squad. Only Wesker, Volgin, and Slades are making it across a bombing raid like the one I would be laying down.
Because...Wesker is faster than Wolverine. Pretty obvious what I was implying.
Deathstroke's sword will be enough. His helicopter busting staff will be enough, and even normal bullets will be enough.
And ironically, 2 Slades, Wesker, and Volgin would still be enough to take your team down with ease.
Basics
Sabertooth:
Sabretooth was STILL taken down by Deadpool using nothing but guns despite his adamantium skeleton. It doesn't protect his brain and other organs from bullets and the like.
A bullet to the brain (especially several) still puts him down. As does several bullets to the heart, and so on.
1. You don't have Deadpool on your freaking team, why bring up something another character can do, when you cannot perform that function. Deadpool is an expert at fighting guys like Sabertooth and Wolverine he knows all of their weaknesses and ins & outs, your team only has basic info and knows nothing about the weakness of Sabertooth. The comparison rings so hallow it's embarrassing, further more Creed can tank headshots.
2. No, Sabertooth can survive massive organ damage and shots to the head. You are straight bull**** right now Dakrraiden. Outside of the fact that Sabertooth has an Adamtaium skeleton and it would take the perfect angled shot just to shoot him in the brain, he can also heal up from such damage. Don't get me wrong Sabertooth healing factor can get taxed like anybody else, but you don't have the weaponry to do so because you went the cheap route and tried piling up a bunch of 1 point wonders instead of spending some points and getting some solid projection like Gambit, Cyclops, or Cardiac.
I believe this is from X-Men Origins: Sabertooth(Scans from Comicstooge).
Here you can see Creed recovering from a head-shot very quickly. Your guns and arrows aren't going to do jack squat. By the way this is before Creed's upgrades and adamantium.
This is from Wolverine & The X-Men #8 2011:
Sabertooth gets stabbed right in the freaking heart and he just stands there and smiles. He's not going down to the type of weak tactics and weapons you are trying to employ. Don't get me wrong, his healing can get taxed, but you're gonna need some adamantium claws, a lightsaber, Gorgon's Magical Swords, some Cyclops energy beams, or something like that to take him down. Basically you would need some sort of bad*** weaponry you clearly don't have. Again you are gonna fail here because you went the cheap route with your character picks and instead of focusing on damage output you focused on large numbers which can be cut down by Drones & bombing and characters with clearly Superior abilities and powers.
Those are high end feats. He's been taken out by less. And Sniper rounds hit way harder than normal handguns. You know this, I know this. Deadpool was brought up because he only used guns. He didn't aim special, he just shot Sabretooth lots of times and won. We can do the same. Plus we have people just as skilled if not more.
Silver Samurai:
As for hitting SS while invisible, Slade can feel the difference in the wind. He'll be fine. As for hurting SIlver Samurai, nothing in that scan shows the need for something huge to hurt him. He didn't tank anything, he was simply brought down by an explosion unless I'm seeing that wrong.
I don't care how if he can feel the difference in the wind, explain exactly how that feat applies to the current situation & actions of our characters? Slade is just standing there in a calm safe area of a Graveyard. There are no massive bombing going on to distract him and hold his attention, there are no drones flying around attacking him, there is no invisible guy in this scan. This sort of approach to a battle would only seemingly work if it were a 1 on 1 fight and the battlefield itself was calm and not being air-raided. SS will blast him he will die. So you are ignoring all info and scans I have giving you on SS and his armor. Hmmm.
The explosion did affect his armor, the point is that even after that he was able to recover and fly home. Read here, after the fight with Sunfire SS returned home, meaning he took an atomic blast from Sunfire and was able to fly back to base. Again, do I have to drop a full comic for you to get the picture? Also see the scan above where he tanks a blast from Life Seed Angel.
See I have no knowledge on Silver Samurai. Nor Life Seed Angel nor Sunfire. So nothing about this is impressive to me. Feeling the difference in the air just means Slade can feel and dodge fast and invisible attacks.
You've yet to show the drones in action so...until then, no bombing. And I've already explained how that bombing is moot.
Sissy Grenades/Stun Grenades:
As for stun grenades, I'm talking about these:
http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/Stun_grenade
It's bright, loud, knocks out people if they're close, and with super senses, Sabretooth especially should be KO'd from one of these nonetheless, a constant barrage. It's not light weaponry and should throw off anyone on your team if they're close.
The fact that you really think this is a viable option is amazing. You have snake and others sniping, and now you are going to what have him throw said stun grenade across the battlefield. The fact that you posted a wiki link instead of siting a feat for said grenade is also terrible. You think a grenade that is essentially a diverge tactic Flashbang is going to KO freaking Sabertooth. WOW, OH WOW. Show me & the voters said grenade knocking someone as durable as Sabertooth out. Sabertooth has tanked TK blasts from an angry Jean Grey and you think a simple Stun Grenade is going to KO him? LOW LOW BALLING. SS & Goblin are flying, he's not throwing that up in the air and timing it just right as the conveniently pass him by. Xing ninjas like Ling Yao have been taught to fight in complete darkness if something blinded him he would ignore it and keep fighting.
Sabertooth Special: In The Red Zone:
Here is Creed, he gets hit with several TK blasts from a very pissed off Phoenix Jean Grey and then he tanks 2 blasts right to the face/eyes from a POED Cyclops. Not only can he steal see and keep on fighting the fact that he could recover speaks to his level of supreme durability over anyone on your team. The very inane idea that Creed is going to be KOED by freaking Flashbang stun grenades is supremely far fetched and ridiculous. As you can see in the scans despite the fact that Cyclops made Creeds eyes bleed by blasting him right in his face, he is able to get up and run away from the X-men.
Stun Grenades are real life things. I was just giving you the stats. All feats will be gameplay, they simply KO soldiers when thrown. No video needs to be wasted.
And to clarify:
1. Snake will only be throwing the stun grenade if/when sniping is no longer effective. He will be getting close to battle you in close combat with guns and other gear. He's not throwing it across a battlefield. You're purposely misinterpreting my argument.
2. Stun grenades have NOTHING to do with durability. They affect ears and eyes. That's it. It's not force. It's not an attack on the body. It's an attack on the senses. Sabretooth has advanced senses. Thus they will have a greater effect. It's simple math.
Too Slow & Can't Bank Worth a Pluck Nickel:
Let me get this straight you think a modern military helicopter sucks, so that's ABCDEFG whatever Liquid can do in a helicopter he can do in a Charuti airship a ship where you have not defined it's speed and basic capabilities because you did no such research on said ship. That's not gonna fly, what you did is the text book definition of ABC logic.
It originated from the 1960s and 70s, not exactly modern. And yeah, Chitauri tech is likely better than a helicopter in the air. There was no ABC logic. Simply this:
Liquid has shown skill maneuvering around much faster and better targets in aerial combat with an inferior airship. He's in the same situation here except there are no pilots on the other end.
I think that makes perfect sense with no ABC involved.
Da Map: Electric Bagaloo
2. Look at this picture I'm posting. The red show areas on the left I can swim across with ease. That small part of water either isn't part of the lake and thus has no sharks in it, or has a miniscule amount since the rest of the sharks need to be spread out.
That's literally water under the bridge. The entire body of water is connected. :/ If you swim across you are shark food. The sharks would smell any and all blood in the water Further more I noticed you only marked the bridges on the back half of my side of the map and ignored all of the ones in front that I would have also blown up. In fact swimming is your worst option since as soon as you go into the water your team is completely vulnerable and GG & SS can blast the water. And before you think the water would somehow protect you explosions in water are actually a lot worse than anywhere else. You just sent whoever was in the water to their deaths.
Da Map Returns: Grappling Death Rises
3. Also in the picture, the yellow shows similar water on the other side. And finally, the strips of purple show areas where jumping and/or grappling across are such short distances, it's not even a threat to us.
Water under the bridge. This is a large lake, but it is connected. If you want to do some research it's called the Epcot World Showcase Lagoon. And that is literally water under the bridge. If you grapple you will be shot down by machine guns, and since none of you are Spiderman I doubt you could all repeatably grapple and not be shot by a single large caliber round. Either that or we blow you up: SS, Drones, Goblin = Game, Set, Match.
Again, water under the bridge. The entire body of water is connected. You're going to have to make it past the first set of blown bridges down by the Odyssey center and then the ones a bit higher up(the ones you marked). See down below how I cut the map. All bridges in this picture have been blown. Even something as simple as getting close to me is going to be very difficult for your team specially when we consider the fact that very few of them actual have grapple guns listed as standard gear. Bane and Shiva, The Boss Unit, Wesker, Voglin...hell I'm not sure the Slades carry grapple guns: Maybe Pre 52. Also if you place Volgin in the water, Water + Electricity = very bad things happen to Volgin. It's going to take your team a while to grapple across due to the fact they would have to share grapples. Really does anyone on your team outside of the Female Bats have grapple guns/repelling equipment?
That's utterly ridiculous. Sharks aren't reaching us in the few seconds it takes to get across. And you're not gunning us down with machine guns from miles away with no knowledge on where we are. You have normal soldiers. Not super soldiers like I do. Normal soldiers that can even die to normal people/terrorists/untrained people. Soldiers that are literal fodder that the likes of Snake and Wesker and Slade and EVERYONE ON MY TEAM destroy on a daily basis.
Plus you didn't account for my stealth.
Nuke Level Iron Man:
And if you look at this Iron Man scene, two blasts throw him off balance and knock him off his feet. And he is more durable than your team.Same Iron Man who took fallout from nukes and giant explosions and Thor's hits btw.
Now you're lowballing & highaballing MCU Ironman's durability at the same time(impressive) and missing all context. The dude had already been fighting for hours, his suit was running low on energy, and he had just busted through a GIANT Chitarui Battle Whale/Leviathan. His suit was already taxed to a large degree way before that scene, you can see as much if you back up the video Raiden. MCU Iron Man tanking the fallout from a NUKE? No, all of the damage from said Nuke in Avengers was taken in by the ship and sucked into space as the wormhole closed. None of the blast affected him in anyway, you can clearly see that in the movie.
Well no, the blast is what carried him out of the portal. So he had to take something. Also Iron Man's durability has never been tied to his power supply. He's fallen great heights and tanked many things even when out of power.
Recap:
Solid Snake: Using Chaff Grenades, turning invisible, sniping with railgun sniper rifle apparently to take your team out and cover mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close. Survives explosions due to stealth+feats.
Big Boss: Using Chaff Grenades, using stealth, sniping your team and covering mine. Using stun, chaff, wp grenades and CQC if need to get close. Survives explosions due to stealth+feats.
New 52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
Pre-52 Deathstroke: Getting in position to snipe and help cover my team. Decimating your team with superior speed, strength, durability, and skill plus his powerful weapons if need be.
Taskmaster: Using Stealth to get to medium range and then unload with guns, then arrows, go Close Combat when needed. Wins/holds own via superior skill and great feats vs. Venom, Spider-Man, Iron Man, etc. Has tanked enough to survive explosions. Speed and stealth help to avoid brunt of explosions.
Udon Taskmaster: Using Stealth and Speed to get medium range and unload with guns and then blitzing in Close Combat. Same as above with explosions.
Gene: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed/teleportation, his knives, and his ESP abilities. Uses speed/teleportation to avoid explosions.
The Boss: Getting close via stealth and ambushing. Then unloading infinitely on your team (with patriot gun) until only the bulletproof are left and/or other close combat needs support. Then going H2H.
Bane: Getting close range to engage in H2H. Surviving explosions due to speed+feats.
Volgin: Getting close range for H2H and lightning action. Helps to definitely take down Silver Samurai, drones (along the way), Sabertooth (metal bones), and really any and everybody as lightning 10 million volts is powerful. Survives explosions due to durability feats.
Lady Shiva: Using Stealth to get close, ambush, take down your team H2H due to taking on better/stronger/more durable people. Speed/disappearing feats allows her to avoid all explosions/attacks.
Cassandra Cain: Using stealth and speed to get close and ambush your team with extreme skill in H2H combat. Surviving explosions due to speed+feats.
Wesker: Getting close and blitzing your team with extreme speed and strength.
Batwoman: Getting Close and helping in H2H combat, also using gadgets when need be. Suit protects her from bullets and the like.
Solidus: Blitzing your team with sword and guns and superior speed. Uses speed to get past explosions.
Revolver Ocelot: Using Stealth to ambush your team and get the drop on them, killing them with gunfire and engaging in H2H if needed. Survives explosions via feats.
Chitauri: Aerial attacks and support, bombarding your team with weapon fire that momentarily stopped MCU Hulk, took down MCU Cap America and MCU Iron Man.
Liquid Snake: Getting close via one of the Chitauri aerial ships as he is a master flyer, taking you down via aerial attacks.
1. My gear+plans to spread out+time it takes to execute your plan makes your bombarding drones plan useless and has them get shot out of the sky and bombs easily avoided.
2. Bombs don't kill almost anyone in my team so the strategy was ineffective regardless. I've proven this with a large section explaining and showing why.
3. Snipers cover my team as we have people stealthing over to your side for an ambush. Guns and H2H attacks will take your team unawares killing those that aren't bulletproof, if the snipers don't kill you first and if the Chitauri ships and Liquid don't put you away either. Not t mention various gadgets from Batwoman.
4. Machine gun rounds mean nothing to my team's level of skill/reaction speed and we can all easily get around said guns as there are clear ways to your side. Some of us are even bulletproof.
5. Close range team+Volgin's electricity will take your team close range along with aerial support and snipers.
6. Snipers will take on your team at a little closer range with grenades+powerful tech and superior skill if it comes down to it.
7. We win due to numbers+skill+strategy+all out assault.
@darkraiden: Only a few things I will say is yes I f***ed up on the math.(probably sleepy) My apologizes(That's egg on my face). The drones are not feat-less and that's not a wiki website I am using that the offical Omi Corp site made by the movie company itself, it's no different from using a DC Fact File or a Marvel Handbook.
Says Sony Pictures at the bottom, they made the site, and there is nothing wrong with using it.
Basic Knowledge does not cover Perks & Gear:
Perks:
Perfect Teamwork (6)
Basic info(Powers, Abilities, Skills) (3)
5 Chitauri(Flying Chariots) 1
You have no reason to know about the Drones and My Gear including the tech team watching the cameras, SS Gear, the Bombs, and the Navy Seals.
Voters can ignore my math, but the fact is you're still not explaining as to WHY Snake is using the Chaff Grenades in the first place. Or, WHY your team is running around trying to avoid Drones and Bombs they don't know are coming. You're focusing on my screwed up math, but you have yet to show reasoning as to why Snake & Boss are going to prepare for Drones when they don't know about them & why they are going to try to avoid cameras when they know nothing about my tech team. It still seems like your team as ESP. And I'm not talking about that weak sauce ESP that Gene has, it's like your team has full fledged see into the future Precog like they know every move and detial of my team.
1. My people are spreading out so they're harder to hit at once. That's .2 miles in random direction.
They are all moving forward, not very random. I have radar that can scan them and I'm watching them on cameras. And I already said I would hunt them down 1 by 1.
Stun Grenades: You were talking like these stun grenades were all powerful, while you down talk 50lb bombs and 80mm mortar fire Raiden. Yes Stun Grenades are in real life and they have failed to KO real people, so what makes you think they would KO sabertooth? Because he has super senses? That's idiotic. So any time Sabertooth or any other character with super senses hears a loud boom and sees a flash on the battlefield = it's lights out? GTFO outta here. That's why I asked for feats, because you were talking like these stun grenades were powerful than anything else on the battlefield.
PS: Those are not high feats for Sabertooth. There was a time when Sabertooth Healing Factor was > Logan's and Logan said so himself. Sabertooth would never fall to ordinary bullets without pis or context it's a low ball. You can finish editing in what you need to, as long you don't bring up any new issues I'm ready for votes.
You seriously don't know who Sunfire is? :/ Life seed is the opposite amp to Death Seed from Apocalypse. Down below is Wolverine saying Sabertooth's healing is better.
Honestly I am baffled at your low balling of Sabertooth and I wonder exactly what Sabertooth vs Deadpool fight you are taking about where he dropped Sabertooth with just bullets under real context. Cause this is the Saberooth I have the one with his upgrades, written properly with no jobbering, and adamantium. Down below he takes a few rounds to the chest and just stands their and smiles back at Deadpool. That's a low moment for Deadpools healing, but you can ignore that because Deadpool's healing was acting wonky. The point is none of your team is dropping Sabertooth with just guns.
Again, these are not high feats, this is par for the case for guys like Sabertooth, Deadpool, and Wolverine.
PS: Now I remeber what fight you are referencing: Sabertooth vs Deadpool Part 2.
It happens in Cable & Deadpool #41. You saying that deadpool won the fight and took down creed with bullets are both flat out lies. First of all Creed didn't have Adamantium in this fight so most of this isn't even applicable. You can check the scans below. Deadpool gets the drop on creed by parachuting in. He shoots Creed a bunch of times and Creed smiles and says "MY TURN". Notice during the fight Deadpool cuts Creeds bones. Keep in mind Domino was even worried Deadpool needed help and mentions to Cable someone needs to go back to help. Cable even says Creed cannot be killed by conventional means: Like Bullets & Arrows. Cable TK tosses Creed into the ocean and after all of that Creed still survives. No one on your team is taken out Sabertooth with freaking bullets and saying Deadpool won this fight is a lie.
Your Feats Section:
That's just massive scan blasting and the main feats that I requested were Chitarui air speed feats & I mentioned feats for Volgin(specifically electrocuting characters with healing factors and superhuman durability), which people have seen the movie. I ask could you define the exact speed. Most of the other scans people have seen and many of them don't even apply to the battle.
The drones are not feat-less and that's not a wiki website I am using that the offical Omi Corp site made by the movie company itself, it's no different from using a DC Fact File or a Marvel Handbook.
Basic Knowledge does not cover Perks & Gear:
Perks:
Perfect Teamwork (6)
Basic info(Powers, Abilities, Skills) (3)
5 Chitauri(Flying Chariots) 1
You have no reason to know about the Drones and My Gear including the tech team watching the cameras, SS Gear, the Bombs, and the Navy Seals.
Yeah, using a marvel or dc handbook isn't acceptable to substitute for feats. Especially as it's by a company that is known for...not so good products that don't work the way they're supposed to work (Sony AND the Robocop company with the machine that can't climb stairs). Until feats are shown, the drones don't have anything that can be used against my team.
As for Basic Info, it would be assumed that it would tell me who is on your team which would include the drones and the tech team. Not knowing perks would extend to things like you having prep or extra knowledge or extra powers. IMO. But regardless,
Snake and Big Boss have radars, Batwoman has sensors in her cowl, etc. So we'd still know the drones are coming.
Stun Grenades
Stun Grenades: You were talking like these stun grenades were all powerful, while you down talk 50lb bombs and 80mm mortar fire Raiden. Yes Stun Grenades are in real life and they have failed to KO real people, so what makes you think they would KO sabertooth? Because he has super senses? That's idiotic. So any time Sabertooth or any other character with super senses hears a loud boom and sees a flash on the battlefield = it's lights out? GTFO outta here. That's why I asked for feats, because you were talking like these stun grenades were powerful than anything else on the battlefield.
Yes, stun grenades will affect Sabretooth more due to his higher senses. That's always been the case. It's why Grey Hulk's thunderclap affects most people, but nearly killed Wolverine. Because of his hearing. It's pretty obvious. And it's not just one stun grenade, but 15-20 at a time. At the least, Sabretooth is deafened and blinded. And thus he's dead (from my assault).
Sabretooth
Those are not high feats for Sabertooth. There was a time when Sabertooth Healing Factor was > Logan's and Logan said so himself. Sabertooth would never fall to ordinary bullets without pis or context it's a low ball. You can finish editing in what you need to, as long you don't bring up any new issues I'm ready for votes.
I disagree. He's been taken out by much less just as often, if not more.
Not saying he's a lightweight, just that it doesn't ALWAYS take a headshot/decapitation/heartshot supreme to take down Sabretooth. He's been taken down by martial artists such as Iron Fist, choked out by Luke Cage, and bullets and tasers have affected him as seen above.
People on my team should be able to take him on for many reasons.
Deathstroke Pre-52: As seen in the feat section, he's taken on more skilled people with pre-cog, faster and stronger people like Donna Troy, and if you know his history, like Flash, Kid Flash, Impulse, and Starfire.
Deathstroke New 52: He's taken on the likes of Hawkman and Lobo, also shown in the feat sections.
Taskmaster: Has great skill, has taken on the likes of Spider-Man, Ms. Marvel, Giant Man, Venom, Daken, Iron Man, and others that would be considered above Sabretooth. Also his explosive arrows and stealth would help greatly here too to wound and disorientate Sabretooth.
Udon Taskmaster: Literally just Taskmaster but faster and has more feats taking on Iron Man. Has blitzed bullet timers and catchers. Caught bullets, etc.
Solid Snake: Has taken tank shell attacks, has stealthed entire armies of superhumans, can go invisible with tech, has stun grenades, infinite ammo, great H2H skills, has dodged rail guns, taken on people like Vamp (near Spider-Man speed and agility), Grey Fox (100 tonner who turns invisible with speed), Solidus Snake, and so on. Has survived too much for Sabretooth to put him down, is more skilled than him, and has the weapons to put Sabretooth down.
Big Boss: Has blitzed Snake, taken on people with super powers as well as entire Metal Gears, and people with extreme super speed like the Boss, The Fear, and Gene. Also has extreme stealth and durability to take anything from him.
Gene: Blitzes Big Boss, has ESP to KO superhumans in one hit, can teleport.
Wesker: Moves super fast in short bursts, tanks attacks that deal more damage than Sabretooth, heals as well.
The Boss: Blitzes Big Boss, has infinite ammo, no reload gun, super strength (can carry her gun with one arm as well as Davy Crockett nukes), is more skilled.
Volgin: Survives RPGs and building busting explosions, has 10 million volts flowing through his body (most Tasers don't surpass 50,000 and Sabretooth was taken out by one), and has punched harder than RPGs.
Ocelot: Blitzed Snake, matched Big Boss, Shot entire room of trained soldiers before they can touch the trigger, has survived pounds of C4 exploding on him, has great stealth abilities, and master accuracy with his guns.
Batwoman: Has tasers, sonic weaponry, flashbangs, a suit to protect her, great skill, and tranqs.
Solidus: Has enhancement suit, fast enough to easily deflect machine gun fire, moves fast enough to light ground on fire, takes down Metal Gears easily
Lady Shiva: Too skilled, has stealth, has taken on stronger, body reading, knows pressure points and nerve strikes
Cassandra Cain: See Lady Shiva but with more super strength, more speed, more durability.
Add all these together with Snake, Big Boss, and Deathstroke's sniping, and Ocelot and Boss shooting and so on, and Sabretooth isn't much of a threat. Green Goblin and Greedling get taken down the same, and Silver Samurai by the heavier hitters+gadgets+electricity+Chitauri.
I'll admit, I was wrong about the Deadpool fight. He kept Sabretooth at bay, but didn't put him down and then ran out of bullets (though I don't have to worry about that).
Feats
That's just massive scan blasting and the main feats that I requested were Chitarui air speed feats & I mentioned feats for Volgin(specifically electrocuting characters with healing factors and superhuman durability), which people have seen the movie. I ask could you define the exact speed. Most of the other scans people have seen and many of them don't even apply to the battle.
The scans were to back up my statements and counter some of yours (Batwoman is slow, people don't have stealth, etc.
I showed Volgin's punching power to be >>>RPGs and that he has 10 million volts flowing through his body. I don't have to show him electrocuting someone with a healing factor,r ather you have to show your people surviving 10 million volts.
As for Chitauri, I showed them busting cars, flying through the city and streets in seconds, tanking their own weapons (that oneshotted the likes of cap, cars, parts of buildings, and had huge explosions, and two shotted Iron Man), hitting fast targets (Iron Man and Chitauri ships), and that their flurry attack is very effective. With Liquid at the helm, your featless drones won't stand much of a chance as they're slower than Iron Man and Chitauri even if we use your numbers.
Silver Samurai, Green Goblin, Sabretooth, and Greedling would all be taken out by Chitauri weapons as shown.
Things to Consider:
1. Sabretooth has shown to be affected by sniper shots, tranqs, and bullets. My team has snipers, infinite ammo guns, and many accurate shooters taking him down along with tasers, electricity from Volgin, and other gadgets from Batwoman
2. Green Goblin getting sniped by my team. They've reacted to bullets, bullet timers, railguns, and other fast people/attacks. This should allow them to tag the likes of him, Greedling, and Sabretooth especially when they're distracted and fighting my h2h team, dodging bullets, and Chitauri airships
3. Chitauri ships have shown fire power and accuracy to take out people faster and more durable than his team and Liquid improves them with his skill with airships (taking out F16s with a Helicopter)
4. My team has shown the durability and speed to dodge any bombs and mortars
5. Drones have no feats to say that they can hurt my team, that they work, how they work, or anything like that. only statements. Either way, chaff and Chitauri ships take them down as stealth and speed avoids them.
6. It's 17 on 4 with 4 of my team being superhuman snipers with superhuman reaction speeds, and the other 12 being superhuman in strength, skill, durability, and speed (some more than others such as the Boss, Volgin, Wesker, Solidus, Ocelot, and Cassandra Cain).
7. My numbers+assault+aerial assault has not been sufficiently countered as it's attacks from all angles (long range, the air, mid range (via bullets), and close range.
Summary
1. My gear+plans to spread out+time it takes to execute your plan makes your bombarding drones plan useless and has them get shot out of the sky and bombs easily avoided.
2. Bombs don't kill almost anyone in my team so the strategy was ineffective regardless. I've proven this with a large section explaining and showing why.
3. Snipers cover my team as we have people stealthing over to your side for an ambush. Guns and H2H attacks will take your team unawares killing those that aren't bulletproof, if the snipers don't kill you first and if the Chitauri ships and Liquid don't put you away either. Not t mention various gadgets from Batwoman.
4. Machine gun rounds mean nothing to my team's level of skill/reaction speed and we can all easily get around said guns as there are clear ways to your side. Some of us are even bulletproof.
5. Close range team+Volgin's electricity will take your team close range along with aerial support and snipers.
6. Snipers will take on your team at a little closer range with grenades+powerful tech and superior skill if it comes down to it.
7. We win due to numbers+skill+strategy+all out assault.
It was close, but I just felt like DRs plan would be the more likely one to come to fruition. Plus the standard gear argument irked me, Octocamo and Railgun were added in MGS4 as plot, not just for game mechanics, overall Better strategy and numbers won it.
I still feel like allowing Soldiers to have things outside of stuff they would realisticly be able to carry on there body (Mortars, Browning Machine guns, etc), shouldn't really be allowed. They honestly shouldn't be packing firepower outside assualt rifles, and sniper rifles. However, since this IS allowed, I won't let it effect my vote.
I must give credit to DarkRaiden for stepping up his formatting, It makes the debate a lot better and easier to read.
===========
I feel like while DarkRaiden didn't nessecarily provide proof that he could detect the bombs, I feel like he proved that most of his team outside a couple should survive the initial onslaught with minor to moderate injurys, atleast slowing there advance. However I do believe that while trying to target Silver Samurai with chaffs, They may unintentionally block themselves with chaff smoke. Slightly delaying the bombardment of the Drones, but if I'm reading it right, The clouds would be stationary and once they move out from under them, the Drones can then just target them then using the laser guidance.
I believe LukeHero's Seals would of already of done their jobs by even more constant bombardment, due to the fact that I don't believe DarkRaiden's team would realisticly of already Usain Bolt'd out the place despite not talking strats with his team. However, the same could be said for Silver Samurai.
I feel like while the OctoCamo is standard gear, I feel like the Railgun wasn't, and if it was, Snake would of been priced more because of it. However, I feel like Luke lost a couple of points referring other people's debates instead of self proving it.
I don't think Stun Grenades were as big a deal as DarkRaiden made them out to be, if so, every one with enhanced hearing would be down and out every time someone threw a stun grenade.
I feel as though LukeHero's team would eventually overwhelm DarkRaiden's despite the numbers, If they focus the named characters first, the mortar squad has time to attack and vice versa. Since they are split up, LukeHero's team can just take them out in different intervals instead of 17v4 at the same time.
My vote goes to @lukehero, but I'm surprised in DarkRaiden, He showed a step up in his debating this time.
Will vote when I get to my computer, but I'll give my thoughts really quick: DR had a monsterous character advantage (Gene bundled in a pack for 1 point is outrageous, since he alone could beat Vamp. Solidus was also extremely cheap), but LukeHero had a big strategy advantage. Both sides had some misconceptions on the other team, but I thought it was a good debate; can't wait to give my full thoughts on this later.
Also, Luke, next time, to avoid confusion, specify what gear the Snakes have; they really don't have any 'standard' gear.
@beaconofstrength: Yes thank you, I see that needs to be done. I thought it was common knowledge on what was his "basic gear layout" allowed on battle boards for the sake of debate, but apparently some people will take something and run away with it.
Anyway, I'm voting for @lukehero. I thought his strategy was more thought out, where Raiden was forced to have to just adapt to whatever Luke threw at him. I also liked the real world examples of how explosions work to better explain how they would hurt Raiden's team, even if they weren't able to lock on to their exact position. Plus, the Flash team would be able to relay the position of any non-invisible character to the drones or gunman.
@lukehero: I don't think DR was abusing that, since the rail gun was as standard as a majority of Snake's gear (the rail gun was actually a plot, and canon weapon Snake carried with him, too), but something like that needs to be specified before hand. Snake carried very different gear in every game.
Also, I'm not sure if you know this or not, but the Patriot having infinite ammo and shots, and Solid Snake's 'infinite ammo bandana' are actually canon to the story. Just pointing that out for future discussion, and just so you know.
@beaconofstrength: Ah OK, thank you. Not sure I would have allowed such things had I been fore warned about them when it comes to infinite ammo. Also I've seen people mention the railgun in other threads where Snake has standard gear. But, I honestly feel my team would win regardless. Thank you for clearing things up.
@oceanmaster21: Thank you, but could you leave a small detailed reason as Eyedcyou and Precrisisbadrock did.
@eyedcyou: Thank you for the vote. And the break down.
@wyldsong: Thank you, if you could elaborate a bit more latter on I would appreciate it. If you can't get to it until later that is of course understandable as it's early in the morning(like 4:30am for me at least).
@wyldsong: Thank you, if you could elaborate a bit more latter on I would appreciate it. If you can't get to it until later that is of course understandable as it's early in the morning(like 4:30am for me at least).
Same time for me here as well. At work right now...
Raiden I don't feel had very feasible counters for your strategy/setup (like bomb detection), and you were the one basically leading the debate as it were, keeping your opponent on the defensive for most of the bout. Not sure my tired brain can come up with much more right now=)
@wyldsong: Thank you, if you could elaborate a bit more latter on I would appreciate it. If you can't get to it until later that is of course understandable as it's early in the morning(like 4:30am for me at least).
Same time for me here as well. At work right now...
Raiden I don't feel had very feasible counters for your strategy/setup (like bomb detection), and you were the one basically leading the debate as it were, keeping your opponent on the defensive for most of the bout. Not sure my tired brain can come up with much more right now=)
@wyldsong: Thank you, if you could elaborate a bit more latter on I would appreciate it. If you can't get to it until later that is of course understandable as it's early in the morning(like 4:30am for me at least).
Same time for me here as well. At work right now...
Raiden I don't feel had very feasible counters for your strategy/setup (like bomb detection), and you were the one basically leading the debate as it were, keeping your opponent on the defensive for most of the bout. Not sure my tired brain can come up with much more right now=)
Where do you work so late/early?
My main job, I work for the Fire Department as a paramedic. My side job, I do radio ops and ambulance routing for the fire department (which is what I am doing right now).
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