Hmm, well seeing that Hank has a higher rated intelligence (Stark - 6; Pym - 7), and the fact that Hank created Ultron, i would have to go with Hank Pym on this one. Though, Stark has created many amazing things, i would have to say that Pym's feats of intellect outshine Stark's.
No, Stark is Smarter than Hank actually....remember the event where the cosmic entity come and promoted Hank as The Earth's scientist supreme, and Hank just ask why not Reed or Stark but Him....clearly this means Hank himself know very well that his intelligence is below this 2 men.
And I am sure Reed, Doom and Stark are the top 3 Smartest Men on Earth...as stated in Marvel Official Website.
Hmm, well seeing that Hank has a higher rated intelligence (Stark - 6; Pym - 7), and the fact that Hank created Ultron, i would have to go with Hank Pym on this one. Though, Stark has created many amazing things, i would have to say that Pym's feats of intellect outshine Stark's.
No, Stark is Smarter than Hank actually....remember the event where the cosmic entity come and promoted Hank as The Earth's scientist supreme, and Hank just ask why not Reed or Stark but Him....clearly this means Hank himself know very well that his intelligence is below this 2 men.
And I am sure Reed, Doom and Stark are the top 3 Smartest Men on Earth...as stated in Marvel Official Website.
More accurately, Eternity said that Reed was indeed the smartest and that Stark was "The Engineer" who uses science as a tool for his own purposes. He said Pym is "The Mage" who takes science to the point of being magic.(see below)
I didn't interpret those pages to say that Stark is smarter than Pym. Pym has always struggled with a bit of inferiority complex as it is, so no doubt he looks at himself as not as smart as Stark. To this point, on the previous page Eternity gives Pym a good ass-kicking him and tells him - if this is how you view the universe treats you, then that's how you will be treated, and only you can stop it.
But that doesn't mean that he isn't smarter than Stark. Tony tends to create technology into things that can be applied as a superhero and therefore are seen as more valuable in terms of a superhero's job.
Based on pure science and research, I would say Pym is smarter.
@drgnx: yeah, i guess it is. just checked that myself. But, i got the ratings from the '91 Marvel Universe card set. Has their ratings on the back of their individual cards. Im not saying this is a land-slide, or that Tony couldnt beat Hank in a fight with prep (w/o prep, Tony would destory Hank in a fight), im just saying that i think Hank Pym has a higher intellect than Tony Stark.
@nerdork: Ah, I'm not questioning them, its just I checked the site and Charles X has a 7 and Magneto has 6 vs Black panther having 5 and Peter having a 4, kind of surprised me.
But Charles had the same speed as Black widow but higher durability and Strength (matching black panther), so not sure where they get those from. I really went there to see if I could find separate stats for Hulk vs Bruce, couldn't find them so tried figure out what Marve's base human stats were, I expected Charles to be low and close to Bruce. Lesson learned; don't judge the disabled =(.
@drgnx: I would always question the ratings, to be honest. I have never really liked their system, as it seems to change so often, and never with any consistency. You were asking for base human stats...well, the Aunt May card (lol) has her at straight 2's for evrything but speed and strength, she is a 1 in those.
This is a battle of who has the biggest IQ and not who is the greatest scientist, so I say Tony Stark wins. (he has created super advanced suit of armor in a cave, with what he had).
This is a battle of who has the biggest IQ and not who is the greatest scientist, so I say Tony Stark wins. (he has created super advanced suit of armor in a cave, with what he had).
This is a battle of who has the biggest IQ and not who is the greatest scientist, so I say Tony Stark wins. (he has created super advanced suit of armor in a cave, with what he had).
Most of them have on panel stated measured IQ's. Stark and Peter Parker are 270, Parker was also once stated at 250. Reed doesn't have any from 616, but most of his counterparts are in the 270 range specifically 264 to 279. Banner was said to be immeasurable. Pym I believe was estimated at 190. That means without enhancements i.e. Reed using his powers to increase brain surface area and shortening receptor junctions to boost his intellect and thought speed, that in order of actual on panel stated intelligence the list is
Banner, Reed, Stark, Parker, then way down the line, Pym, and that isn't counting any of the other supergenius intellects like the Mad Thinker, Beast, T'Challa, etc.... Pym is a legit supergenius, but in a universe full of them, he really doesn't stand out much. Pym particles only take you so far. The primary reason he was selected as "scientist supreme" is because he had the time, and didn't have the attitude/hubris of the others. Just on science feats there are at least a dozen others not listed who have accomplished more than Pym. In spite of that, I still personally think that Pym should be about fifth on the list (not including villains).
@yodagod: Interesting, that order makes sense, but you put peter above pym? Doesn't pym spend more time working on science than Peter? I've not seen a lot of Peter's science feats, I know he has some though.
@drgnx: Peter Parker is a good deal more intelligent than like 99.9% of the people on Earth. His issue is, he's like 12 years old, and doesn't have a billion dollar funded lab to work in.
No, Stark is Smarter than Hank actually....remember the event where the cosmic entity come and promoted Hank as The Earth's scientist supreme, and Hank just ask why not Reed or Stark but Him....clearly this means Hank himself know very well that his intelligence is below this 2 men.
And I am sure Reed, Doom and Stark are the top 3 Smartest Men on Earth...as stated in Marvel Official Website.
More accurately, Eternity said that Reed was indeed the smartest and that Stark was "The Engineer" who uses science as a tool for his own purposes. He said Pym is "The Mage" who takes science to the point of being magic.(see below)
I didn't interpret those pages to say that Stark is smarter than Pym. Pym has always struggled with a bit of inferiority complex as it is, so no doubt he looks at himself as not as smart as Stark. To this point, on the previous page Eternity gives Pym a good ass-kicking him and tells him - if this is how you view the universe treats you, then that's how you will be treated, and only you can stop it.
But that doesn't mean that he isn't smarter than Stark. Tony tends to create technology into things that can be applied as a superhero and therefore are seen as more valuable in terms of a superhero's job.
Based on pure science and research, I would say Pym is smarter.
You can notice that the eternity said "as for your another point of reference" that means, the eternity knows that Stark is smarter than Hank, he didn't tell Hank that he is smarter than Stark, but instead, he explained to Hank that why is chosen to be Scientist Supreme instead of Reed and Stark.
If Hank is just below Reed, why the Eternity have to explain Stark's situation to Hank? It's because Stark and Reed are both smarter than Hank, and Hank himself noticed it too....but the Eternity needs to convince Hank why he is chosen. This is when the scenario in your real life might happen if your teacher try to convince you as the President of a Math Club instead of other 2 kids who are smarter than you. Logic Applied.
they both have different fields. but its hard to say
@yodagod: these IQ's are crazy and i would necessarily give them that much credit but i do hear what you are saying. We should aslo be careful in using the "supergenius" term to define these people as a super genius would be something that a normal man wouldnt be naturally capable of since its out of his jurisdiction to be super without help. but i might just be nitpicking at the words
Stark did manage to checkmate all 6 board of game with Reed, the arguably smartest man on Earth. Don't have scans that show Pym is able to doing that. Reed is very smart, but Stark did manage to checkmate all 6 board of Game?! And he is not pay his 100% attention as you can see he is talking with Reed throughout the Game. Beaten the Smartest man in chess is very impressive.Accept it.
I know you all might say that Reed may be new in Chess, but I have to say no....this is his hobby in his spare time, he played with Doom almost everytime,he they stalemate everytime too. Chess is his greatest challenge, only second to Science.
Eternity only acknowledged that Reed was smarter than him. His comments about Stark don't confirm that Stark is in fact more intelligent than Pym. Eternity talked about Stark to explain the differences in their scientific philosophies, not to say that Stark was smarter.
These are the 3 most intelligent men on Earth, not counting Doom. It makes 100% sense that Eternity would bring up other "candidates", to reassure Pym why he is being chosen. But still, Eternity did not confirm that Tony was smarter.
I'd have to give it to Tony. Yes, Hank might be smarter (that could be disputed to some degree as well), but Tony is, as Eternity even acknowledged, the Engineer, capable of shaping his world and destiny with his knowledge and scientific curiosity. He doesn't just do stuff for fun or intrigue, he does it and then makes it have purpose within the world, giving it a use, putting it to use in his armament or company, making it work within the system; he builds the system from which others thrive, to an extent.
Hank is more theoretical, Stark is more experimental. Theoretically speaking, Hank is quite possibly smarter than Stark; but Stark is likely much more practical and knows how things can work to his advantage.
@GodDamnIronMan: The main reasoning for Pym being smarter than Stark is Ultron, Pym Particles and I suppose creating Heaven, although I believe Reed also accomplished this.
I believe Pym also created the Infinite Avengers Mansion. I could be wrong on that one.
@xeon1cs: Ya, he did created the Mansion in Pocket dimension after the Secret Invasion...
And Honestly, what made Ultron so special? Hanks just copied his Brain into it, makes it think like he do....but all what happened later is just the self development of Ultron itself. It loses control from the inside.....that is not the purpose of why Hank created it...but in fact, it's the Downside feat of Hanks, the storyline shown that how Hank's mistake leads to so many trouble.
@GodDamnIronMan: Despite Ultron going wrong, it's creation was still a pretty big accomplishment in terms of robotics and artificial intelligence. Pym is basically a mad scientist, trying to be a hero.
@GodDamnIronMan: a pretty big accomplishment in terms of robotics and artificial intelligence.
that is the point, I would not say Pym is Smarter than Stark just based on what he had achieve in Science....in fact, "smart" is an ambiguous term, it took many aspect to be considered before we can judge it. Hank may be have an edge over Tony in AI , but Stark is still overall smarter, WHY? :
1)Stark runs an International Military Cooperation
2)He creates Tech for Heroes in daily basis
3)He has strong social skills
4) he is very cunning and manipulative (well, compared to Hanks of course)
5)He bang Hot Chicks
Hank on the other hand :
1)Not understand his own creation(pym particle) ,Reed did Understand more of it.
2)Created an AI, then goes wrong, and busted half of the Avengers...
3)Slapped his wife!
Obviously Stark is a more well-rounded kind of Genius, he good in Chess(better than Reed who>Hanks), Strong business and people skills (it took times to learn you know) ....I remember he once said during the Doomquest storyline...where he can choose to give his company to Doom to prevent disaster, cuz he can just build up the entire business empire in less than a month. The most important, He knows how to get laid!
Tony = Science + Cunning + Business + Social + Charismatic
Hank = Science
No doubt Hank is better scientist than Stark, but Stark is Smarter than Hank.
No, Stark is Smarter than Hank actually....remember the event where the cosmic entity come and promoted Hank as The Earth's scientist supreme, and Hank just ask why not Reed or Stark but Him....clearly this means Hank himself know very well that his intelligence is below this 2 men.
And I am sure Reed, Doom and Stark are the top 3 Smartest Men on Earth...as stated in Marvel Official Website.
More accurately, Eternity said that Reed was indeed the smartest and that Stark was "The Engineer" who uses science as a tool for his own purposes. He said Pym is "The Mage" who takes science to the point of being magic.(see below)
I didn't interpret those pages to say that Stark is smarter than Pym. Pym has always struggled with a bit of inferiority complex as it is, so no doubt he looks at himself as not as smart as Stark. To this point, on the previous page Eternity gives Pym a good ass-kicking him and tells him - if this is how you view the universe treats you, then that's how you will be treated, and only you can stop it.
But that doesn't mean that he isn't smarter than Stark. Tony tends to create technology into things that can be applied as a superhero and therefore are seen as more valuable in terms of a superhero's job.
Based on pure science and research, I would say Pym is smarter.
You can notice that the eternity said "as for your another point of reference" that means, the eternity knows that Stark is smarter than Hank, he didn't tell Hank that he is smarter than Stark, but instead, he explained to Hank that why is chosen to be Scientist Supreme instead of Reed and Stark.
If Hank is just below Reed, why the Eternity have to explain Stark's situation to Hank? It's because Stark and Reed are both smarter than Hank, and Hank himself noticed it too....but the Eternity needs to convince Hank why he is chosen. This is when the scenario in your real life might happen if your teacher try to convince you as the President of a Math Club instead of other 2 kids who are smarter than you. Logic Applied.
@GodDamnIronMan said: make sense too, But I just very angry when people so determined to say Hank is smarter.
I responded to you're post mostly because I LOVED those panels and wanted to share them because I had one. No offense or personal attack is intended. But you will catch a lot of flack for posting things like above(bold) where you try to make factual statements and arguments based on huge leap in reasoning.
If you read what I said, I think Pym is smarter at pure science and research. But per the OP of who's IQ is higher, there's definitely a strong argument for Stark.
1. Reed claimed to know more about Pym Particles than Hank. Reeds a dick, this isn't really anything new.
2. Whether or not Ultron went wrong is irrelevant. It was an AI that evolved. One that Pym constructed. Plus Pym usually stops Ultron.
3. 100% irrelevant and completely taken out of context.
Hank is also a teacher/trainer for many upcoming Avengers. He broke into the Baxter Building with no issues.
As for Tony Stark:
1. He doesn't even run Stark Industries 90% of the time.
2. Hank has done the same.
3. I don't see how this is relevant.
4. Reed isn't cunning or manipulative, is Tony smarter than him? That's not really a valid characteristic. Tony is also overly confident and cocky.
5. Implying Stark has ever been with a woman more attractive than Janet or Tigra.
Tony beating Reed in chess is to be expected. Reed isn't a strategist. That doesn't make Tony overall more intellectual than Reed by any means. Hank has led a team as well, it's not like he's unfamiliar with strategy and tactics. Peter Parker could have a multi-billion dollar corporation in a month if he just mass-marketed his tech. So could Hank Pym. They don't though.
EDIT: I suppose if you're going to deduct points from Pym for slapping Janet, with no context. Then I suppose we should deduct points from Stark for apparently not being smart enough to NOT be an alcoholic.
I just want to bring Stan Lee here to clarify this....I wanted it so bad. But you can just refer to Marvel official Website , it stated :
Tony Stark : " One of the 3 Smartest "...what does that mean? we know Reed is one of them easily, Doom after sure (he is a human even though he is not a superhero, but the statement just stated "3 Smartest Men")...which mean Tony is the 3rd.
Basically it breaks down to this. Tony has more feats. Hank has bigger feats. Hank has his helmet to control insects (which is on par with any of a thousand comic inventions), Pym particles (which he never fully understood and which caused damage to nearly everyone using them), and he created Ultron (who was unstable and went rogue as a direct result of using his own brainwaves as a pattern, and incidentally was not even the first fully functional AI in Marvel. Several predate Ultron, most notably the first Human Torch). All of his subsequent inventions and the bulk of his work was directly related to Pym Particles. It was guns to use Pym Particles as a weapon, or developing the Mansion, etc, but still all just variations and uses of Pym particles. Tony is not without errors and duplications either. But at least he does branch in to different arenas. He of course has the Iron Man armor (along with dozens of subsequent variations and upgrades, none of which seem to get around problems like being stolen, being able to be hacked from the outside, or being shut down by simple EMP's), he has a whole host of weapons and vehicles, he has a variety of advancements in energy (and though they've been adapted in other ways, most were developed for his armor), he created the satellite to deal with WWH, he was able to split the Phoenix Force...actually the more you break it down, the worse they both look.
It was always heavily implied tonys smarter than hank not to mention tonys more resourceful with his knowledge and has beater feats tonys fought gods with his knowledge hank wouldn't be my go to guy if i needed a genius it would deffo be tony or reed
Log in to comment