Tien Shinhan vs. Frieza

Tien Shinhan, in the Buu Saga/End of DBZ

Frieza-saga Frieza, starting from first form but with ultimately no restrictions on powering up

In-character

No prep time; random encounter

Planet destruction disallowed for the sake of Tien being unable to breathe in space while Frieza can.

Victory by death only. If they both die, it's a tie.

Fight here:

Tien

I don't see why or how Tien is even matching Frieza.

Tien's only chance against Frieza is Neo Tri-Beaming him given how it locked Semi-Perfect Cell against his strength.

Though the move is still somewhat questionable against Frieza considering Cell wasn't even really hurt.

Tien inconvenienced cell with his tri-beam, he should beat frieza

Tien. Why, you ask? Because this.

Freeza turns Final Form and tears Tien in half.

I'm still not seeing the reasoning, Tien's Tri-beam requires him keeping a lock. So what's exactly stopping from him getting blitzed and beat down? The Tri-beam only worked on Cell because he had been distracted. This is hardly a reasoning for him hitting Frieza.

Frieza is a cocky SOB. He'd try tanking anything a human throws at him. He barely believes Saiyans are powerful, let alone humans.

Tien.

Tien was able to stall Semi-Perfect Cell. He beats Frieza.

I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS!!!!!!

Considering first form freeza killed gohan, see where I'm going with this

@saint_of_origin: He didn't seem to have that much trouble ending Vegeta, or trying to end Goku with his death beam in a quick and easy manner.

Actually Goku pretty easily deflected those in base. Tien can do the same. Tien's not one to mess around either, while Frieza is practically your basic "I'll brag because I don't see you as a threat" villain archetype.

@saint_of_origin: What shows that Tien could deflect those?

@wolfrazer: The fact that he's very clearly much stronger than base form Goku who deflected them?

@saint_of_origin: Proven where?

Tien uses his trump card and smashes Frieza.

@wolfrazer: He could stalemate Semi-Perfect Cell with his Tri Beam. We know strength in DBZ is based off of Ki. If Tien's most powerful Ki blasts are = to someone who fodderizes androids that fodderize super saiyans that fodderize Frieza, it's safe to assume he can win here.

Tien: the essence of DBZ PIS. Right below the Destructo Disc.

I'd back Tien, he was able to hold off semi perfect Cell, and redirect a blast shot by Buu.

@saint_of_origin: Because the Tri-Beam also drains his own life, I'm pretty sure as I recall it's an ability that is unique and supposed to be more powerful than it's user. It's not making Tien overall more powerful, it's just enabling him to do damage to his opponents which are way above his paygrade.

There's nothing to suggest that Tien would be capable of fighting Frieza, aside from this Tri-Beam thing which requires Frieza to just stand there and wait for it when he can easily just end Tien with a Death Beam as he prepares his attack.

@saint_of_origin: equal? It was literally doing 0 damage to cell. The only reason it kept cell down was because of the pushing power of kikoho (considering it's a kiai)

@wolfrazer: lol frieza has this thing where he lets his opponent hit first, all the time. frieza's just a respectable guy.

@iusemycajonas: He didn't stand there when Goku arrived, he just raised his finger and began blasting him.

@amendment50:

It was stated somewhere that tien is around ssj1 level

So tien should win with minor difficulty

Tien

Frieza

Iirc the Tribeam was tiring Tien after repeated use, and Cell was getting more annoyed than hurt. Granted, it's been a while since I've rewatched the fight

I think even 100% full power Frieza would get wiped by Buu saga Tien's Tri-Beam.

To put the Tri-Beam knocking Semi-Perfect Cell around feat into perspective, remember that in the Android saga when Piccolo was fighting Imperfect Cell just prior to him becoming Semi-Perfect Cell. Piccolo hit Cell head on with a charged up blast and it did nothing... and that was from Piccolo fused with Kami, against Imperfect Cell.

The Neo Tri-Beam is actually very quick to use and impacts instantly as far as I can tell. Tien was able to hit (and deflect) Super Buu's blast in mid air from a perpendicular angle.

Freeza is an afterthought to EoS characters. Not counting the eternal scrubs like Yajirobi.

Tien wins.

Frieza in a stomp. Tien's best feat is managing to stop Semi-Perfect Cell from moving with his Neo Tri Beam, which he uses his own life force to boost, and he still failed to actually harm Cell with it. Beyond that, he has nothing in terms of speed, strength, or durability to imply he could take Frieza.

Tien was fast enough to dodge Buu's Human Extinction Attack and was durable enough to survive the epic thrashing he and the other Z Fighters got from the Cell Juniors.

Tien. Frieza goes for a monologue and BAM, tri-beam to the face.

Don't consider Buu's attack to be a quantifiable speed feat, as there's no indication that any of the other Z fighters would've been incapable of dodging it either. Tien's the only person with any training that was on Earth at that time, who could even sense that an attack such as that was coming. Obviously regular people were all going to die.

All the Z Fighters survived the Cell Junior's attack, so that proves nothing, as they were all still extremely outmatched, from Vegeta and Piccolo down to Krillin. Tien's entire involvment in that encounter was getting kicked around. The Cell Jrs. very clearly weren't going for the kill with anyone involved. Compare it to Vegeta on Namek getting kicked around and toyed with by Frieza. He survived numerous hits, didn't place him at Frieza's level.

Tien

That's true and I understand your point about it not being quantifiable, the problem is that even if the other Z Fighters had been present and had also dodged the attack that doesn't mean it was easy to dodge or that the characters at their Frieza saga levels could have also dodged it. All the Z Fighters had grown significantly in power since the Frieza saga.

Frieza was at the base level of his final form when he beat down Vegeta, Vegeta wasn't on Frieza's level but how big do you think the gap was at that point? Cell Juniors were certainly far more powerful than full power Frieza, the fact that the Z Fighters survived the Cell Jr's attack should show you that their durability had improved dramatically. IIRC when Cell told the Cell Juniors to attack the Z Fighters he specifically stated he didn't care if they killed them or not.

I specifically recall Goku saying that Frieza was pretty much canon fodder and that he'd be a good training exercise for Trunks and Goten. Tien realistically should stomp.

Im going to say Tien

And in turn it also doesn't mean that they couldn't have dodged it at their Frieza Saga levels.

Yet the Cell Jr.s didn't kill them when they were clearly capable of doing so, unless you're going to argue that the Z Fighters were surviving because of how strong they were, when none of them were capable of taking on the androids earlier either. Same with Tien getting knocked out by Super Buu in the last saga as well. He survived, doesn't mean that it was because of some great durability, it means Buu didn't bother to kill him, as he easily could have. Seeing as how Frieza goes on to have that entire conversation with Goku about using power percentages, and that Frieza was stomping Goku once he moved up to using 50%, and Goku in turn was drastically stronger than Vegeta, the gap between Frieza and Vegeta was extremely vast on Namek. Frieza could have killed Vegeta at anytime, as seen by when he finally did and his later fight with Goku. He simply wasn't to cause Vegeta pain, which is why he only used his fists, while still taking everything Vegeta had and not being damaged once.

Think Tien's Tri-Beam gives him the victory here.

Indeed you have very valid points, it still seems heavy-handed to claim Frieza stomps, all things considered.

@bluejay4: I specifically recall gotten trunks being able to stomp turn into the ground

@fiendish I'm honestly just inclined to believe that for everyone in the group not counting the Saiyans and Piccolo, for whom we know for a fact just how much they improved. The rest have no feats outside of getting knocked around and eventually disappearing from fights altogether. Tien's Neo Tri Beam move against Cell is perhaps the greatest showing from a regular Z Fighter after the Frieza Saga, but it also happens to drain his life force at the same time and didn't actually damage the person it was used against.

I have to go with Frieza. Tien's tri beam has not been shown to do any actual damage to the characters it's been used against; it simply pisses them off. I accept that the human characters like tien managed to increase their power levels after the namek saga, but I really can't quantify where they are. Once going ssj became fashionable, the human characters lost all value, and I honestly don't think that even in the buu saga any of them achieves frieza's level. I suppose Frieza would continue to get pushed back by the tri beam until tien exhausts himself, then he could kill tien at his leisure.

I would think Tien is at least comparable to base Goku. The gap probably isn't any wider then it was at the 23ed Budokai; at best it might be as close as the 22nd Budokai. When Dr. Gero fired his photon beams at Goku, Tien was standing right next to him and dodged at the same time. Goku reacting to the photon beams was extremely close but Tien kept up with him, and at that point, Goku was much stronger than when he fought Freeza. I'd say Tien vs 100% Freeza is a pretty even fight.