@nickzambuto: Devil fruits are not supposed to abide by physics.Thats why when luffy was wet he managed to hit crocodile. If he can do that, then punching through spada would be easy if his body was moist.
Who said anything about physics? It's very simple really, up till that point, blood served to do nothing other than harden Crocodile's body, since it was made of sand, to make him tangible to Luffy could actually inflict damage. You're saying that in that instant, for no reason at all the rules were suddenly turned on their head and blood instead weakens and dissipates the sand? Where did you get such an idea from?
@nickzambuto: Simple explanation.Liquids such as water and blood only dampens Crocodiles' sand attacks and his body,solidifying the sand.The reason why it's so important was that without it, Luffy couldn't touch him as he would simply dodge it via logia.Besides that,Luffy still broke through 20 layers iirc of Bedrock and shook a city block from that attack.
I really don't know why people think Mountain level is even big in the HST anymore.Law cut up a mountain range in Punk Hazard,Chinjao, a fodder who didn't even get recognized in the Golden age(?), split the Ice Continent in 2, and Luffy almost destroying an island level object with his combination attack despite being nerfed badly by the Sea Water.
@nickzambuto: Simple explanation.Liquids such as water and blood only nullifies Crocodiles' sand attacks and his body through solidifying his body.The reason why it's so important was that without it, Luffy couldn't touch him as he would simply dodge it via logia.Besides that,Luffy still broke through 20 layers of Bedrock and shook a city block from that attack.
I don't understand what you're saying here? How does this mean Luffy's blood weakened the Desert Spada?
@nickzambuto: I said it incorrectly.I meant that he nullified Crocodile's logia.I reworded it differently.His sand attacks are already condensed with sand unlike his logia form.
I was also trying to explain it more clearly,but too late
@nickzambuto: I said it incorrectly.I meant that he nullified Crocodile's logia.I reworded it differently.His sand attacks are already condensed with sand unlike his logia form.
Yes, he nullified the logia, that's true. He made the sand a solid mass that he was able to hit, how does this nullify the feat? He still had to punch through a solid target.
@nickzambuto: Water doesn't necessarily harden sand though. It softens it.
Didn't you just say Devil Fruits don't need to follow physics?
It's very simple really, up till that point, blood served to do nothing other than harden Crocodile's body, since it was made of sand, to make him tangible to Luffy could actually inflict damage.
I know what i said, but from what im seeing you don't seem to understand that water negates DF powers. In Crocodile's case it negates his powers just by pure touch, which would explain why luffy can touch crocodile, and why luffy can punch through his sand attacks.
@nickzambuto: Water doesn't necessarily harden sand though. It softens it.
Didn't you just say Devil Fruits don't need to follow physics?
It's very simple really, up till that point, blood served to do nothing other than harden Crocodile's body, since it was made of sand, to make him tangible to Luffy could actually inflict damage.
I know what i said, but from what im seeing you don't seem to understand that water negates DF powers. In Crocodile's case it negates his powers just by pure touch, which would explain why luffy can touch crocodile, and why luffy can punch through his sand attacks.
He still had to punch through a solid target though. Desert Spada is solid, or at least solid enough to murder people and create mile deep chasms in the Earth. Luffy wasn't just shattering sand, he overpowered Crocodile's strongest attack. The mere presence of liquid doesn't make Crocodile completely useless, the blood would have done nothing to weaken his attack, other than possibly harden it more than it already was. You're wrong when you say water negates the Devil Fruit, the Devil Fruit is still in effect, it's just water's natural ability to harden sand at play. Therefore the Desert Spada wouldn't have been weakened by the blood because it's already solid.
@jashro44: Thank you, I understand now. The thing is, characters in One Piece don't have crazy energy blast attacks, they rely on regular punches and kicks, so yeah I'm gonna have to say Naruto does hold an edge in damage output. Where the One Piece characters edge it out is in stats and skill; pre-timeskip, Luffy while poisoned, dehydrated, bleeding out, and struggling to stand was able to punch through Crocodile's Desert Spada attack (which is powerful enough to create massive chasms reaching miles through the Earth), then put Crocodile himself through several feet of solid bedrock and launch him high enough into the sky that his body could be seen all throughout the country, lifting and destroying several houses and rupturing an entire city block in the process.
Now this is base strength Luffy. CP9 members like Blueno were able to literally stand still and let base Luffy wail on them with no injury. However, in Gear Second, Luffy was strong enough to oneshot Blueno after softening him up some.
And then on top of that, Gear Second Luffy was unable to deal damage to Pacifistas, however after the timeskip he can oneshot them.
Can Naruto punch at this level? The video also shows Luffy dodging laser beams via precognition. In Gear Second, CP9 members couldn't dodge his punches because he was too fast, even though the weakest member could react to lightning (not dodge, just react). Can Naruto move that fast?
No problem.
If you want punching feats specifically I'll have to see if I can find some but here is a feat from part one (Naruto at his weakest basically) stopping a very large snake):
Gallery
Narutos most famous strength feat is probably tossing pains rhino (He's much stronger here than he was in the snake feat but he is also much weaker in this showing in comparison to current naruto):
Gallery
A few things to keep in mind is that he grabbed it by the tip of the horn and away from its center of gravity which would make tossing it a lot harder. Also its very important to note this is a much weaker version of naruto than the current one. He's had like a few power ups since this feat was achieved so he is a lot stronger now. At the time he also couldn't control the nine tails so he only had access to his sage mode strength. Just to show the size of the rhino:
Gallery
First image we see the size of the rhino in comparison to one of the toads
We see one of the toads in comparison to a landscape (its towering over trees)
Is mostly just there to show you the size of all the toads side by side. And notice the little dot standing on the orange toad is naruto.
Now with his tailed beast mode he was strong enough to hold open the jaws of 4 tails for a while:
Gallery
Now keep in mind he couldn't blend his sage chakra and tailed beast chakra at the time because the nine tails wasn't letting him. Now him and the nine tails are friends and the nine tails allows naruto to blend his sage chakra with his tailed beast chakra. So I guess you can combined the strength of KCM Naruto and Sage mode naruto to get the strength of current naruto.
All though there is even more. He's had a power up even beyond that and he seems to be connected to all nine tailed beasts. And he's even shown the ability to amp his strength even further:
Gallery
So I think Naruto has the strength to contend at least. All though blunt force is useless on Luffy right? All though he doesn't do well against cutting damage? If thats the case i imagine naruto can still one shot him. His rasanshurikens aren't always in the form of orbs. Here he uses one to cut down the god tree (note how he doesn't have his tailed beast cloak up so he probably isn't at full power when he does this):
Gallery
Heres the size of the tree naruto cut in comparison to might guys daytime tiger:
And here is guys day time tigers shockwave in comparison to an island:
As for Naruto's speed, might guy was able to punch so fast he created fire from his taijutsu (which is hand to hand combat in the narutoverse) so that would make him mach 30. Naruto is canonically faster than Guy and IIRC he moved faster than 6th gate guy can see when he deflected some bijuu bombs so he's fast. I'd need to double check though. And it might also be worth noting that was before his power up. I can get scans later but I'm tired right now. All though keep in mind in addition to naruto's speed he has shadow clones so they need to be way faster than naruto.
As I mentioned above here is might guys daytime tiger:
Gallery
Now here is how Madara with the ten tails fares against guys punch in comparison to current naruto punching Kaguya (who is suppose to be more powerful than Madara). Admittedly Naruto did surprise Kaguya on the previous page which is why he landed the attack but it still seemed to have more of an effect than guys daytime tiger did on Madara (for the record she wasn't knocked out but I think it hurt her at least). Madara seems to handle the day time tiger pretty easily. He might have blocked it with his staff partially but not sure if the staff really helps since 8th gate guy was able to hurt him despite blocking the attack with his staff as well:
Gallery
All though as I said above Naruto can use stabbing damage to take out Luffy. I doubt he's tanked that level of cutting damage if what I hear about Luffy is accurate.
@jashro44: Thank you, I understand now. The thing is, characters in One Piece don't have crazy energy blast attacks, they rely on regular punches and kicks, so yeah I'm gonna have to say Naruto does hold an edge in damage output. Where the One Piece characters edge it out is in stats and skill; pre-timeskip, Luffy while poisoned, dehydrated, bleeding out, and struggling to stand was able to punch through Crocodile's Desert Spada attack (which is powerful enough to create massive chasms reaching miles through the Earth), then put Crocodile himself through several feet of solid bedrock and launch him high enough into the sky that his body could be seen all throughout the country, lifting and destroying several houses and rupturing an entire city block in the process.
Now this is base strength Luffy. CP9 members like Blueno were able to literally stand still and let base Luffy wail on them with no injury. However, in Gear Second, Luffy was strong enough to oneshot Blueno after softening him up some.
And then on top of that, Gear Second Luffy was unable to deal damage to Pacifistas, however after the timeskip he can oneshot them.
Can Naruto punch at this level? The video also shows Luffy dodging laser beams via precognition. In Gear Second, CP9 members couldn't dodge his punches because he was too fast, even though the weakest member could react to lightning (not dodge, just react). Can Naruto move that fast?
No problem.
If you want punching feats specifically I'll have to see if I can find some but here is a feat from part one (Naruto at his weakest basically) stopping a very large snake):
Gallery
Narutos most famous strength feat is probably tossing pains rhino (He's much stronger here than he was in the snake feat but he is also much weaker in this showing in comparison to current naruto):
Gallery
A few things to keep in mind is that he grabbed it by the tip of the horn and away from its center of gravity which would make tossing it a lot harder. Also its very important to note this is a much weaker version of naruto than the current one. He's had like a few power ups since this feat was achieved so he is a lot stronger now. At the time he also couldn't control the nine tails so he only had access to his sage mode strength. Just to show the size of the rhino:
Gallery
First image we see the size of the rhino in comparison to one of the toads
We see one of the toads in comparison to a landscape (its towering over trees)
Is mostly just there to show you the size of all the toads side by side. And notice the little dot standing on the orange toad is naruto.
Now with his tailed beast mode he was strong enough to hold open the jaws of 4 tails for a while:
Gallery
Now keep in mind he couldn't blend his sage chakra and tailed beast chakra at the time because the nine tails wasn't letting him. Now him and the nine tails are friends and the nine tails allows naruto to blend his sage chakra with his tailed beast chakra. So I guess you can combined the strength of KCM Naruto and Sage mode naruto to get the strength of current naruto.
All though there is even more. He's had a power up even beyond that and he seems to be connected to all nine tailed beasts. And he's even shown the ability to amp his strength even further:
Gallery
So I think Naruto has the strength to contend at least. All though blunt force is useless on Luffy right? All though he doesn't do well against cutting damage? If thats the case i imagine naruto can still one shot him. His rasanshurikens aren't always in the form of orbs. Here he uses one to cut down the god tree (note how he doesn't have his tailed beast cloak up so he probably isn't at full power when he does this):
Gallery
Heres the size of the tree naruto cut in comparison to might guys daytime tiger:
And here is guys day time tigers shockwave in comparison to an island:
As for Naruto's speed, might guy was able to punch so fast he created fire from his taijutsu (which is hand to hand combat in the narutoverse) so that would make him mach 30. Naruto is canonically faster than Guy and IIRC he moved faster than 6th gate guy can see when he deflected some bijuu bombs so he's fast. I'd need to double check though. And it might also be worth noting that was before his power up. I can get scans later but I'm tired right now. All though keep in mind in addition to naruto's speed he has shadow clones so they need to be way faster than naruto.
As I mentioned above here is might guys daytime tiger:
Gallery
Now here is how Madara with the ten tails fares against guys punch in comparison to current naruto punching Kaguya (who is suppose to be more powerful than Madara). Admittedly Naruto did surprise Kaguya on the previous page which is why he landed the attack but it still seemed to have more of an effect than guys daytime tiger did on Madara (for the record she wasn't knocked out but I think it hurt her at least). Madara seems to handle the day time tiger pretty easily. He might have blocked it with his staff partially but not sure if the staff really helps since 8th gate guy was able to hurt him despite blocking the attack with his staff as well:
Gallery
All though as I said above Naruto can use stabbing damage to take out Luffy. I doubt he's tanked that level of cutting damage if what I hear about Luffy is accurate.
Nobody can say naruto doesn't solo after reading all this.
@jashro44: Thank you, I understand now. The thing is, characters in One Piece don't have crazy energy blast attacks, they rely on regular punches and kicks, so yeah I'm gonna have to say Naruto does hold an edge in damage output. Where the One Piece characters edge it out is in stats and skill; pre-timeskip, Luffy while poisoned, dehydrated, bleeding out, and struggling to stand was able to punch through Crocodile's Desert Spada attack (which is powerful enough to create massive chasms reaching miles through the Earth), then put Crocodile himself through several feet of solid bedrock and launch him high enough into the sky that his body could be seen all throughout the country, lifting and destroying several houses and rupturing an entire city block in the process.
Now this is base strength Luffy. CP9 members like Blueno were able to literally stand still and let base Luffy wail on them with no injury. However, in Gear Second, Luffy was strong enough to oneshot Blueno after softening him up some.
And then on top of that, Gear Second Luffy was unable to deal damage to Pacifistas, however after the timeskip he can oneshot them.
Can Naruto punch at this level? The video also shows Luffy dodging laser beams via precognition. In Gear Second, CP9 members couldn't dodge his punches because he was too fast, even though the weakest member could react to lightning (not dodge, just react). Can Naruto move that fast?
No problem.
If you want punching feats specifically I'll have to see if I can find some but here is a feat from part one (Naruto at his weakest basically) stopping a very large snake):
Gallery
Narutos most famous strength feat is probably tossing pains rhino (He's much stronger here than he was in the snake feat but he is also much weaker in this showing in comparison to current naruto):
Gallery
A few things to keep in mind is that he grabbed it by the tip of the horn and away from its center of gravity which would make tossing it a lot harder. Also its very important to note this is a much weaker version of naruto than the current one. He's had like a few power ups since this feat was achieved so he is a lot stronger now. At the time he also couldn't control the nine tails so he only had access to his sage mode strength. Just to show the size of the rhino:
Gallery
First image we see the size of the rhino in comparison to one of the toads
We see one of the toads in comparison to a landscape (its towering over trees)
Is mostly just there to show you the size of all the toads side by side. And notice the little dot standing on the orange toad is naruto.
Now with his tailed beast mode he was strong enough to hold open the jaws of 4 tails for a while:
Gallery
Now keep in mind he couldn't blend his sage chakra and tailed beast chakra at the time because the nine tails wasn't letting him. Now him and the nine tails are friends and the nine tails allows naruto to blend his sage chakra with his tailed beast chakra. So I guess you can combined the strength of KCM Naruto and Sage mode naruto to get the strength of current naruto.
All though there is even more. He's had a power up even beyond that and he seems to be connected to all nine tailed beasts. And he's even shown the ability to amp his strength even further:
Gallery
So I think Naruto has the strength to contend at least. All though blunt force is useless on Luffy right? All though he doesn't do well against cutting damage? If thats the case i imagine naruto can still one shot him. His rasanshurikens aren't always in the form of orbs. Here he uses one to cut down the god tree (note how he doesn't have his tailed beast cloak up so he probably isn't at full power when he does this):
Gallery
Heres the size of the tree naruto cut in comparison to might guys daytime tiger:
And here is guys day time tigers shockwave in comparison to an island:
As for Naruto's speed, might guy was able to punch so fast he created fire from his taijutsu (which is hand to hand combat in the narutoverse) so that would make him mach 30. Naruto is canonically faster than Guy and IIRC he moved faster than 6th gate guy can see when he deflected some bijuu bombs so he's fast. I'd need to double check though. And it might also be worth noting that was before his power up. I can get scans later but I'm tired right now. All though keep in mind in addition to naruto's speed he has shadow clones so they need to be way faster than naruto.
As I mentioned above here is might guys daytime tiger:
Gallery
Now here is how Madara with the ten tails fares against guys punch in comparison to current naruto punching Kaguya (who is suppose to be more powerful than Madara). Admittedly Naruto did surprise Kaguya on the previous page which is why he landed the attack but it still seemed to have more of an effect than guys daytime tiger did on Madara (for the record she wasn't knocked out but I think it hurt her at least). Madara seems to handle the day time tiger pretty easily. He might have blocked it with his staff partially but not sure if the staff really helps since 8th gate guy was able to hurt him despite blocking the attack with his staff as well:
Gallery
All though as I said above Naruto can use stabbing damage to take out Luffy. I doubt he's tanked that level of cutting damage if what I hear about Luffy is accurate.
Nobody can say naruto doesn't solo after reading all this.
I'm kind of iffy on Naruto soloing the entire crew by himself, but it's feasible for him to win. He's a master of deception at this point, and the Straw Hats have no idea how his powers work. He has nigh-unlimited healing potential at this point, so even if Robin manages to snap his neck, I think it's very possible he would just heal from it.
Also, he's currently the fastest man in the world in his own universe, which is saying a lot. He isn't getting speedblitzed, and Observation Haki is no good if the Straw Hats can't keep up with his speed.
Really, the only threat is the Monster Trio, so OP might as well made the thread about the three of them vs Naruto. Current Naruto has the abilities of all 9 tailed beasts and is able to add their natures to his Rasenshuriken. I can also see him immobilizing Sanji with the Harem Jutsu.
If he gets desperate, he can always use a Tailed Beast Bomb to nuke them all to hell. If summons don't count as outside interference, he can use those too.
@nickzambuto: He actually can. The only threats are the Monster Trio. Naruto isn't a basic ninja with no experience. They wouldn't know how to fight Naruto first off.
Second, Naruto has so much in his damn arsenal. The Straw Hats are basically fighting a one man army.
What does that even mean? None of the Straw Hats are basic pirates either.
they arent too smart. Straw hats have a lot of stupidity even namis kinda dumb sometimes
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