The Rogues vs The Fantastic Four

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Experio

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Rogues

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Saren

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@marionettegeist: Johns' run on Flash. Most of those scans are from the Rogue Profile: Mirror Master issue.

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Marionettegeist

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@saren: Thank-you. Guess I'll be checking that out then.

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dondave

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Rogues easy

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deactivated-57c7d84814d87

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@night4345: maybe but i think sue is the real threat,what is to stop her from turning self invisible and going from there?,her near- indestructible invisible force-fields has shown to block things like telepathy and telekinesis,her shields are powerfull enough to open a hole in a celestial's armour.her force fields are able to cut almost everything.she can do many things with her force fields even causing a object to explode.

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dondave

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dondave

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@chiq He can just send her into the Mirror Dimension

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comic_book_fan

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johnny destroys the freeze gun before it can be used by heating it up to fast melting it in.

reed figures out how mirror masters powers in seconds and tells sue to do her thing it would be a big task to block the light from all reflective surfaces but she could do it and she would only have to for a short time cause any of them could drop him in one shot without his power.

the rest wouldn't be much trouble ben probably solos the rest of them.

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XiiX

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Dredeuced

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johnny destroys the freeze gun before it can be used by heating it up to fast melting it in.

reed figures out how mirror masters powers in seconds and tells sue to do her thing it would be a big task to block the light from all reflective surfaces but she could do it and she would only have to for a short time cause any of them could drop him in one shot without his power.

the rest wouldn't be much trouble ben probably solos the rest of them.

Johnny's not faster on the draw than Cold. Cold's particularly renowned for his quick draw. He deals with the Flash.

Reed can figure it out in 2 seconds, doesn't really matter if Mirror Master just turns him into glass and he shatters before he gets done with his explanation. I'd also like to see Sue use her powers when she's blind, as Mirror Master has easily traveled into the reflection of someone's eyes and blinded them before. I'd also like to see Sue make the entire city of New York invisible. In which case Mirror Master just goes into the harbor or Hudson, ez pz.

Mirror Master wouldn't even be there by the time Reed finishes talking. How would Reed figure out his power? Presumably Mirror Master would have to start using his powers for that to happen, and by then he's not even there anymore. Mirror Master is seriously untouchable.

I'd like to see your reason as to why Ben can solo Madron.

The long and short of it is that MM solos, effortlessly, as was pointed out two years ago.

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comic_book_fan

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@xiix: no they don't it says the ff has basic knowledge on them the biggest threats are all tec based.

sue makes the ff invisible and makes the cloths of the rogues in visible they see all there weapons and torch melts them all mirror master tries his trick reed with basic knowledge including tec and powers of everyone has already had sue make sure no one here has a reflection then takes him down in one punch torch takes down heat wave and sue takes down weather wizard ben drops who ever is left this us cake for the ff maybe if they didn't have the knowledge of them it might be tough but with the knowledge reed gives the ff the perfect strategy to win they don't need prep or time to set anything up just time for sue and johnny to use there powers and knowledge to take down the proper targets first.

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Dredeuced

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@xiix: no they don't it says the ff has basic knowledge on them the biggest threats are all tec based.

sue makes the ff invisible and makes the cloths of the rogues in visible they see all there weapons and torch melts them all mirror master tries his trick reed with basic knowledge including tec and powers of everyone has already had sue make sure no one here has a reflection then takes him down in one punch torch takes down heat wave and sue takes down weather wizard ben drops who ever is left this us cake for the ff maybe if they didn't have the knowledge of them it might be tough but with the knowledge reed gives the ff the perfect strategy to win they don't need prep or time to set anything up just time for sue and johnny to use there powers and knowledge to take down the proper targets first.

I assume you think the Rogues just stand still and let the F4 do whatever they want instead of actually attempting to use their powers, then?

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reaverlation

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@comic_book_fan: No reason why MM shouldn't solo.He'd see the F4 in slow motion and can easily BFR to the mirrorverse.

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chiq

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@dondave: He can send Sue to the mirror dimension even if there is no reflection? if everything around her is invisible? reaction time aside. I confess i don't know the limits of sue's power as well. If sue makes the whole city or a big chunk of the environment invisible. MM can basically just teleport her there like a typical teleporter regardless of reflections or not?

Actually I'm more curious about a solo MM vs Sue Richards battle, since he likes shiny surfaces and she makes stuff non reflective. bubble to the brain vs transmute to glass etc...

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comic_book_fan

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@dredeuced: johnny is faster because cold has to think and point and johnny can just think and melt the gun or at least make it to hot to hold. they all already know mm needs reflection to use his powers it's in the setup for the fight they sue could stop any reflection at any time she could blind them all and close them in a force bubble that reflects the light and let johnny fry them all sue has the perfect power to stop mm and they all already have knowledge so he goes down.

hell beween sue and johnny's powers they couldn't even find the ff before most of them got knocked out.

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aquaman01

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@saren said:

@marionettegeist: Johns' run on Flash. Most of those scans are from the Rogue Profile: Mirror Master issue.

Why is he and Cold murdering people? I mean, it looks like Cold killed someone who had stolen his gun so I can understand that, but MM killing cops? Was that when he wasn't currently in the Rogues?

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Bones309

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Can Mirror Master effect someone who's invisible?

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comic_book_fan

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@bones309: no he uses reflection no reflection no dice which is why the ff can win this easily he is there biggest threat and sue can make him powerless and thanks to the setup everyone knows this sue takes him down with a thought torch and ben take down everyone else then the ff catch a movie.

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SirNickTheEpic

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Torch solo's they need water to live he dehydrates them and they have blood he boils it. Then supernova

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@saren said:

@marionettegeist: Johns' run on Flash. Most of those scans are from the Rogue Profile: Mirror Master issue.

Why is he and Cold murdering people? I mean, it looks like Cold killed someone who had stolen his gun so I can understand that, but MM killing cops? Was that when he wasn't currently in the Rogues?

Mirror Master was hyped up on Cocaine a LOT during that run - Cold beat the crap out of him once he found out & to reinforce the no drugs rule. The people that MM was killing we're FBI agent's sent by James Jesse the original Trickster - these events took place shortly before the Rogues War.

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aquaman01

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@aquaman01 said:

@saren said:

@marionettegeist: Johns' run on Flash. Most of those scans are from the Rogue Profile: Mirror Master issue.

Why is he and Cold murdering people? I mean, it looks like Cold killed someone who had stolen his gun so I can understand that, but MM killing cops? Was that when he wasn't currently in the Rogues?

Mirror Master was hyped up on Cocaine a LOT during that run - Cold beat the crap out of him once he found out & to reinforce the no drugs rule. The people that MM was killing we're FBI agent's sent by James Jesse the original Trickster - these events took place shortly before the Rogues War.

Thanks. :)

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godzilla44

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Rouges Stomp Hard

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DemonKnights

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Rogues

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Mythologico4

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#74  Edited By Mythologico4

Correct me if I'm wrong, as I do not have a lot of knowledge about The Rogues, but if Invisible Woman turns the FF invisible, wouldn't that basically negate Mirror Master? He wouldn't be able to kill their reflections, since invisible things do not have reflections, as he wouldn't know where they are, therefore could not attack them. Can MM transport into Sue's shields if they are already up?

If Sue turns the FF invisible, could she then use her force fields to make The Rogues blind, or cause suffocation or even an heart attack? After all, she has used her fields in such ways before. Or maybe couldn't she (while FF invisible) shield herself, Thing and Reed while Johnny goes nova? She has done that before either.

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Jacthripper

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FF wins, biggest reason being sue, MM can't touch her if she's invisible and she just cuts off their oxygen until they are KO'ed

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DemonKnights

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Biggest stomp

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TheTrueBarryAllen

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@jacthripper: Sue can't do anything if MM takes the Rogues into the Mirror World - then they wait there until Sue becomes visible again - Rogues then pop out & bring em down.

Mirror Master can also lure the FF into the open with his illusions / duplicates - the FF won't know they've attacked a fake until they've made their move & it's too late.

FF cannot win this battle unless they have prep.

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DemonKnights

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@jacthripper: cold could tag her. All he has to do is freer everywhere in their direction.

Mirror master could just evade thru a mirror and wait for her to be visible.

Weather wizard can kick up dirt with winds making her visible. Or make ice and make her footsteps visible, Or he can make it rain and make her sellouts visible.

Point is, she won't be invisible forever. Meanwhile this is in character. Its a stomp in rogues favr

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comic_book_fan

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ff win mirror master needs reflections to manipulate to be effective he needs his enemies to have reflections to be effective against them and his allies to have reflections for his power to work sue can make everyone in this fight invisible means no reflection means no way for him to attack or escape a simple hit will take him down any of them could knock him out after this captain cold can't stop ben johnny or sue with his gun the best he could do is stun them ben and johnny have been frozen to absolute zero and kept fighting the rest are cake.

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linsanel_Doctor

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#80  Edited By linsanel_Doctor

I'd side with the Rogues. Invisible Woman is the only real threat... but I mean the Rogues have many ways to kill the FF

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comic_book_fan

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#81  Edited By comic_book_fan
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linsanel_Doctor

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#82  Edited By linsanel_Doctor
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comic_book_fan

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#83  Edited By comic_book_fan
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linsanel_Doctor

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@comic_book_fan: I'm tempted to say you haven't looked at those respect threads.

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AlphaQ

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Feats for Reed?

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comic_book_fan

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@linsanel_doctor: iam tempted to think you have nothing other than what i already addressed.

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linsanel_Doctor

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@comic_book_fan: You didn't provide anything other than bs. Mirror Master could solo these fools quite easily.

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comic_book_fan

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@linsanel_doctor: no sue could make them all invisible taking away their reflections leaving him practically powerless then drop him with oneshot.

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linsanel_Doctor

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@linsanel_doctor: no sue could make them all invisible taking away their reflections leaving him practically powerless then drop him with oneshot.

You're putting a lot of faith in that invisible, no reflection crap...

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comic_book_fan

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@linsanel_doctor: yeah because mirror master depends on reflections and sue has the perfect power to counter his

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Nite_Nite

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Sue wouldn't know that. Didn't read op cuz it's an old thread and am assuming there's no prior knowledge

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Crimz

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Mirror Master vs Invisible Woman looks like a pretty good match-up. One of the very few fights where Sue's invisibility is more important than her forcefields.

For those who don't know:

  • She can use invisibility and forcefields a the same time
  • She can make anything invisible

I don't know about her range, wiki says 40,000 cubic feet, I don't know how to visualize that. In comics she made a energy field visible that was this size:

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

It definitely won't be a stomp for either team, especially since both have a basic knowledge of each other in the match.

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hiddenforce

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Sue solos

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Yassassin

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MM solos.