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#1 Edited by nickthedevil (11610 posts) - - Show Bio

The Rogues: Captain Cold, Mirror Master, Trickster, Weather Wizard, Heatwave

Vs

(Earth 616) The Fantastic Four: Mr. Fantastic, Sue Storm, Johnny Storm, And the Thing.

no gear for the Fantastic four, but all the usual equipment for the rogues.

Random encounter on the streets of New York BUT both teams have basic knowledge on each other & Morals ON

Starting 50 feet away from each other

Who would win and why?

Fantastic Four
#2 Posted by jashro44 (19757 posts) - - Show Bio

Interesting...I don't know much about the rouges (so this comment might be wrong in a lot of ways) but I think Sue is probably the best chance for the fantastic four. I think the rouges need to take her down quickly.

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#3 Posted by BringnIt (3809 posts) - - Show Bio

Cosmic control rod?

#4 Posted by nickthedevil (11610 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44: @BringnIt: edited OP

#5 Posted by Montaq (932 posts) - - Show Bio

The FF have dealt with worse but still an awesome fight

#6 Posted by Video_Martian (5645 posts) - - Show Bio

Fantastic Four wins (barely...)

#7 Posted by Saren (25313 posts) - - Show Bio

Mirror Master solos. I say this in almost every Rogues thread. But he does here, they have no way of even touching him.

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#8 Posted by Dex_Starr (4772 posts) - - Show Bio

The Rogues slaughter them

#9 Posted by ClarkWayne (248 posts) - - Show Bio

The Rogues win. Captain cold freezes both Mr. Fantastic and Human Torch. Mirror master takes care of the rest!

#10 Posted by Illuminatus (9497 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah, Mirror Master is a beast.

#11 Posted by batkevin74 (10423 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickthedevil: I think the Rogues take this. Thing would charge in which he may catch the Trickster but that's a maybe. He's pretty much invulnerable to the heat, cold & lightning but Mirror Master would own him. Torch beats Heatwave but Captain Cold beats Torch. The only real trouble would be in a prolonged battle Reed will work out a plan. If the Rogues strike hard and first then they win. Anything longer than 10minutes they're beaten by Reed's brain

@ClarkWayne @Dex_Starr Agreed

#12 Posted by notquitevarsity (157 posts) - - Show Bio

I guess i don't know as much about the rogues as I thought I did. How exactly would they win here? While the FF probably couldn't touch Mirror Master, I just don't see a way he could hurt Ben or Johnny.

Plus Johnny could easily take out Heatwave, and probably burn Captain Cold's ice too. Trickster is a non issue, and Sue or Reed could handle Weather Wizard.

I go with the Fantastic Four

#13 Posted by JediXMan (29654 posts) - - Show Bio

I'll say Rogues.

#14 Posted by Saren (25313 posts) - - Show Bio

@notquitevarsity said:

I guess i don't know as much about the rogues as I thought I did. How exactly would they win here? While the FF probably couldn't touch Mirror Master, I just don't see a way he could hurt Ben or Johnny.

Plus Johnny could easily take out Heatwave, and probably burn Captain Cold's ice too. Trickster is a non issue, and Sue or Reed could handle Weather Wizard.

I go with the Fantastic Four

He could turn them into glass and watch them shatter:

Or kill their reflections (though this is more likely to happen with Johnny rather than Ben):

Or just trap the whole team in a mirror dimension and call it a day.

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#15 Posted by The Man of Yesteryear (5502 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think any of them could withstand absolute zero, except maybe Sue...but Mirror Master would handle her rather easily.

#16 Posted by notquitevarsity (157 posts) - - Show Bio

@CitizenBane: touche. I'm changing my vote

Mirror Master Solos

#17 Posted by Billy Batson (57784 posts) - - Show Bio

Rogues.
BB

#18 Posted by Deadcool (6809 posts) - - Show Bio

The FF have no weapons?!!! AGAINST THE ROGUES?!!! How the hell is that a good Idea?

Reed with prep-time would kill them without even trying...

#19 Posted by TDK_1997 (14468 posts) - - Show Bio

Mirror Master stomps alone

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#20 Posted by nickthedevil (11610 posts) - - Show Bio

Thats what i was afraid of. I gave the rogues mirror mastor as their answer to Sue Storm and her shields, but if i were to take him out, then the FF would take this. And i was hesitant to add the Top. Lolol

#21 Posted by HolySerpent (12462 posts) - - Show Bio

Rouges

#22 Posted by cosmicallyaware1 (4266 posts) - - Show Bio

I am impressed by the scans of Mirror Master's feats, didn't know he was so bad-ass. But seriously guys....this is the FF. the teams that fights groups like : the frightful four, inhumans, srull armies, THE CELESTIALS, etc...... on a regular basis. while the rouges are a big deal in the dcu, not in marvel territory. I mean, c'mon....spidey solos teams tougher than this (sinister six).......so the FF? this isn't even worth their time.

#23 Posted by Saren (25313 posts) - - Show Bio

@cosmicallyaware1 said:

I am impressed by the scans of Mirror Master's feats, didn't know he was so bad-ass. But seriously guys....this is the FF. the teams that fights groups like : the frightful four, inhumans, srull armies, THE CELESTIALS, etc...... on a regular basis. while the rouges are a big deal in the dcu, not in marvel territory. I mean, c'mon....spidey solos teams tougher than this (sinister six).......so the FF? this isn't even worth their time.

All with prep. And that's ABC logic, the Rogues fight the Flash, who'd solo a non-prepped FF too. And Spidey couldn't beat the Rogues either, he'd die horribly.

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#24 Posted by cosmicallyaware1 (4266 posts) - - Show Bio

@CitizenBane: I very much respect your opinion, but in this instance i strongly disagree.

#25 Posted by Saren (25313 posts) - - Show Bio

@cosmicallyaware1 said:

@CitizenBane: I very much respect your opinion, but in this instance i strongly disagree.

Can I ask why? The FF could certainly win with prep, but in random encounters without prep, what have they done to make you think they could beat the Rogues?

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#26 Posted by The Stegman (23160 posts) - - Show Bio
@CitizenBane:  
 


@cosmicallyaware1 said:

@CitizenBane: I very much respect your opinion, but in this instance i strongly disagree.

Can I ask why? The FF could certainly win with prep, but in random encounters without prep, what have they done to make you think they could beat the Rogues?

The correct answer, is nothing.
#27 Posted by Dex_Starr (4772 posts) - - Show Bio

@cosmicallyaware1 said:

@CitizenBane: I very much respect your opinion, but in this instance i strongly disagree.

You don't have to agree with him, but he's still right

#28 Posted by Lunacyde (17961 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm late to the party but Rogues win.

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#29 Posted by GrandSymbiote94 (11523 posts) - - Show Bio
@cosmicallyaware1 said:
I am impressed by the scans of Mirror Master's feats, didn't know he was so bad-ass. But seriously guys....this is the FF. the teams that fights groups like : the frightful four, inhumans, srull armies, THE CELESTIALS, etc...... on a regular basis. while the rouges are a big deal in the dcu, not in marvel territory. I mean, c'mon....spidey solos teams tougher than this (sinister six).......so the FF? this isn't even worth their time.
TBH The Rogues stomp the S6.
#30 Posted by nickthedevil (11610 posts) - - Show Bio

^^^ agreed. The S6 were neer competent enough to beginnwith, much less utilized team work like the rogues, and their powerset doesnt match at all with the rogues.

#31 Posted by Manchine (3987 posts) - - Show Bio

@Montaq said:

The FF have dealt with worse but still an awesome fight

#32 Posted by thanobomb1124 (2010 posts) - - Show Bio

Wow was not aware that Mirror master Was that powerful

#33 Posted by cosmicallyaware1 (4266 posts) - - Show Bio

ok. I stand corrected. I have done some research, re-read the OP, and I am now in agreeance that the Rouges take this. sorry FF.

#34 Posted by RyuHayabusa (2019 posts) - - Show Bio

Rogues

#35 Posted by NEEK_03 (1200 posts) - - Show Bio

Mirror master can get through sue's shields?. couldnt she just make a force field in him and expand it before he even acted?

#36 Posted by Saren (25313 posts) - - Show Bio

@NEEK_03 said:

Mirror master can get through sue's shields?. couldnt she just make a force field in him and expand it before he even acted?

How does she do that when he's simply not there? He can make an endless supply of hologram dupes while he himself is in a mirror dimension safe from any harm.

He can get past her and her team's defenses by distracting them with mirror dimension versions of themselves:

As for whether he could get past her shields, he could conceivably strike at her even if her shield is up by breaching her mirror image's shield, since he's shown that he can control the reality on the other side of the glass.

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#37 Posted by NEEK_03 (1200 posts) - - Show Bio

@CitizenBane: what if she isnt near any glass? or anything that gives a reflection. say for instance she is flying.

#38 Posted by Illuminatus (9497 posts) - - Show Bio
@NEEK_03 said:

@CitizenBane: what if she isnt near any glass? or anything that gives a reflection. say for instance she is flying.

They're fighting in the streets of New York City. Mirror Master would have a field day in a place like NYC.
#39 Posted by Saren (25313 posts) - - Show Bio

@NEEK_03: In New York? There are thousands of reflective surfaces everywhere around. From hot dog stands to skyscrapers.

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#40 Posted by Dflash29 (91 posts) - - Show Bio

The rouges will win this one

mostly because of mirror master and his abilities to kill there mirror selves or trap them in mirrors

and captain cold gun and absolute zero

others are needed too though

#41 Posted by jayskee (1905 posts) - - Show Bio

Rogues

#42 Posted by DedmanWalkin (2598 posts) - - Show Bio

Captain Cold could also solo here. He is one of the fastest guns in comics and his guns shoot absolute zero. Johnny will rush them as he always does and get frozen solid. Thing will also rush and get frozen solid. Sue will protect her and Reed with a forcefield but Cold will just encase them in Absolute Zero ice which will still kill both of them.

Mirror Master could not kill all of their mirror selves as Thing and Torch would be too durable/hot to kill.

#43 Posted by ClarkWayne (248 posts) - - Show Bio
#44 Edited by chiq (1911 posts) - - Show Bio

What happens if Sue turns every reflective surface invisible? Can she do that a big chunk of the city? Would that negate MM

#45 Posted by HeraldofGanthet (3247 posts) - - Show Bio

@chiq:

What happens if Sue turns every reflective surface invisible?

An admirable tactic. If she can think fast enough to do so before her throat gets slit...

Can she do that a big chunk of the city?

I'm unsure of the maximum range of her invisibility "aura". She very well could, I just don't personally know if that's an option that's on the table for her and/or how much ground she could envelope with her power to make things disappear.

Would that negate MM

Hardly. With Weather Wizard here, he could easily whip up a maelstrom of dust and debris that would quickly reveal their locations. At that point, even the reflections on their collective eyeballs would be enough to end them all. Quickly.

#46 Posted by comic_book_fan (5297 posts) - - Show Bio

fantastic 4 easily.

#47 Posted by reaverlation (14106 posts) - - Show Bio

Rogues

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#48 Posted by Saren (25313 posts) - - Show Bio

Rogues stomp.

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#49 Posted by Night4345 (2316 posts) - - Show Bio

Why was this bumped? The Rogues stomp easily

#50 Edited by Marionettegeist (1912 posts) - - Show Bio

@saren said:

@notquitevarsity said:

I guess i don't know as much about the rogues as I thought I did. How exactly would they win here? While the FF probably couldn't touch Mirror Master, I just don't see a way he could hurt Ben or Johnny.

Plus Johnny could easily take out Heatwave, and probably burn Captain Cold's ice too. Trickster is a non issue, and Sue or Reed could handle Weather Wizard.

I go with the Fantastic Four

He could turn them into glass and watch them shatter:

Or kill their reflections (though this is more likely to happen with Johnny rather than Ben):

Or just trap the whole team in a mirror dimension and call it a day.

Where are these scans from?